JL Audio Fathom 12" Sub - Page 13 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #361 of 422 Old 01-19-2009, 06:09 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Just thought I would stop in here, every time I see this thread pop up, It brings me a very good feeling inside because it makes me to think about how much joy this little bundle gives me every single day of my life.

The SQ is as remarkable as the output for my small room, it has me truly appreciate the crystal clear and potent nature, but the upper bass it has to offer. I have found that its a very important part of what I love in a sub, it just makes every little nuance of music and movies stand out.

I have been measuring every sub I have bought and been building by it.
Warpdrv is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #362 of 422 Old 01-19-2009, 06:26 PM
Advanced Member
 
scanido's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Toronto Suburbs
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Does anyone know if the current F112's are using the updated drivers from the latest F212?

If not, is this a possibility in the future?

See Profile
scanido is offline  
post #363 of 422 Old 01-19-2009, 07:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by scanido View Post

Does anyone know if the current F112's are using the updated drivers from the latest F212?

If not, is this a possibility in the future?


Yes.... They are....

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1081397
Warpdrv is offline  
post #364 of 422 Old 01-19-2009, 11:51 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Franin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 17,005
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 168
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrzVpr View Post

Would it be safe to say that the Furman SPR-20i is the US Version of the SPR-16Ei?

Whats a better choice for use with our subs, a Furman IT-Reference 15i or SPR-20i? Their is an obvious price difference but just wondering if one would be specifically better for two F112's.

Yes I think it is. Have already has some funny power issues at home and the Furman did it's job, protecting the equipment. But not only that, the Furman able to handle 2 Fathoms and a Denon POA Power Amp at reference, not bad at all.

_________________________

Frank

Franin is online now  
post #365 of 422 Old 01-20-2009, 06:53 AM
Advanced Member
 
scanido's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Toronto Suburbs
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Yes.... They are....

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1081397

I think you misinterpreted my question, but no where in that thread does anyone state that the current F112 drivers have been updated. Though, I may have missed it, can you point it out?

See Profile
scanido is offline  
post #366 of 422 Old 01-20-2009, 08:06 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I didn't misinterpret your question.....

I apologize, I sent you to the wrong thread....
Check post 8 from Manville Smith (JL)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...highlight=f212

The search function is excellent on this forum, I did an advanced search for f212 in titles alone and came up with that info....

Warp
Warpdrv is offline  
post #367 of 422 Old 01-20-2009, 02:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
RMK!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 95608
Posts: 5,657
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Just thought I would stop in here, every time I see this thread pop up, It brings me a very good feeling inside because it makes me to think about how much joy this little bundle gives me every single day of my life.

The SQ is as remarkable as the output for my small room, it has me truly appreciate the crystal clear and potent nature, but the upper bass it has to offer. I have found that its a very important part of what I love in a sub, it just makes every little nuance of music and movies stand out.

I have been measuring every sub I have bought and been building by it.

Well put Warp. I am kicking myself for not keeping one of my F112's for my family room system. I have a nice little Monitor Audio sub there but it is not an F112.
RMK! is offline  
post #368 of 422 Old 02-02-2009, 08:48 PM
Advanced Member
 
Jose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: NYC
Posts: 802
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Finally.....after a month of waiting, my F112 arrived today. I'm sure it's been mentioned before but I'm going to say it again. Everything about this sub is first class. Really impressed about the packing, gloves, suede bag and so on.
Setup is a breeze and I'm sure y'all know how it performs. Really sweet! It replaced a Velo HGS12II, which was no slouch, but this sub is in a different class.
Was planning on using only with HT but now I think I might have to at least try it with music.
LL
LL

Jose.
Jose is offline  
post #369 of 422 Old 02-02-2009, 11:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
hifisponge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 7,516
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Just thought I would stop in here, every time I see this thread pop up, It brings me a very good feeling inside because it makes me to think about how much joy this little bundle gives me every single day of my life.

The SQ is as remarkable as the output for my small room, it has me truly appreciate the crystal clear and potent nature, but the upper bass it has to offer. I have found that its a very important part of what I love in a sub, it just makes every little nuance of music and movies stand out.

I have been measuring every sub I have bought and been building by it.

I think you've become jaded Mr. "I have a half-dozen 18" drivers in my living room".

The F112 is not just great sub for a "bedroom". I have a single F112 in my 19 x 13 x 10 living room and it gave me a pounding while watching Alien vs. Predator: Requiem last night. Certainly a more visceral experience than with my previous Velo DD15. The LFE in that movie scared the crap out of my wife.

I'm pretty sure that F112 is coasting in your bedroom. Now be a good boy and let it out to play every once in a while.
hifisponge is offline  
post #370 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 01:37 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Franin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 17,005
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 168
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose View Post

Finally.....after a month of waiting, my F112 arrived today. I'm sure it's been mentioned before but I'm going to say it again. Everything about this sub is first class. Really impressed about the packing, gloves, suede bag and so on.
Setup is a breeze and I'm sure y'all know how it performs. Really sweet! It replaced a Velo HGS12II, which was no slouch, but this sub is in a different class.
Was planning on using only with HT but now I think I might have to at least try it with music.

Congratulations Jose. I'm glad you enjoy them as much as we all do

_________________________

Frank

Franin is online now  
post #371 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 05:33 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifisponge View Post

I think you've become jaded Mr. "I have a half-dozen 18" drivers in my living room".

The F112 is not just great sub for a "bedroom". I have a single F112 in my 19 x 13 x 10 living room and it gave me a pounding while watching Alien vs. Predator: Requiem last night. Certainly a more visceral experience than with my previous Velo DD15. The LFE in that movie scared the crap out of my wife.

I'm pretty sure that F112 is coasting in your bedroom. Now be a good boy and let it out to play every once in a while.



HAHAHHAHAH thats funny.... I'll be implementing my last 18" driver today or tomorrow, just waiting on one more speakon connector. If that room wasn't so stupid large.....

I love my bass and running that F112 hot in that little room is so visceral, makes laying in bed watching a movie pretty damn fun....
no to` mention the naughty times...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose View Post

Finally.....after a month of waiting, my F112 arrived today. I'm sure it's been mentioned before but I'm going to say it again. Everything about this sub is first class. Really impressed about the packing, gloves, suede bag and so on.
Setup is a breeze and I'm sure y'all know how it performs. Really sweet! It replaced a Velo HGS12II, which was no slouch, but this sub is in a different class.
Was planning on using only with HT but now I think I might have to at least try it with music.

Congrats Jose.... Looks like a nice system you got running there with the Dali's... Now get in line for a second one....
Warpdrv is offline  
post #372 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 10:16 AM
Advanced Member
 
scanido's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Toronto Suburbs
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

I didn't misinterpret your question.....

I apologize, I sent you to the wrong thread....
Check post 8 from Manville Smith (JL)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...highlight=f212

The search function is excellent on this forum, I did an advanced search for f212 in titles alone and came up with that info....

Warp

I really don' think you understand. The question was *Are the F112 drivers being updated to the ones from the F212, and there is no reference to that in post #8.

But i read further and msmith_JL has confirmed that they are not the same but the possibility is there in future.

msmith_JL
"There are no immediate plans to update the f112 with the f212's driver. We will probably not update f112 and f113 for at least another year."

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...3&postcount=88

See Profile
scanido is offline  
post #373 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 01:55 PM
Advanced Member
 
Jose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: NYC
Posts: 802
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Congrats Jose.... Looks like a nice system you got running there with the Dali's... Now get in line for a second one....

Thanks, they do sound very nice. I have no room for a second one without compromising A LOT. The right/opposite side is a hallway and an open area to the dining area. Apartment living in NYC.

BTW, anyone have their fathoms on spikes?

Jose.
Jose is offline  
post #374 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 03:42 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by scanido View Post

I really don' think you understand. The question was *Are the F112 drivers being updated to the ones from the F212, and there is no reference to that in post #8.

But i read further and msmith_JL has confirmed that they are not the same but the possibility is there in future.

msmith_JL
"There are no immediate plans to update the f112 with the f212's driver. We will probably not update f112 and f113 for at least another year."

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...3&postcount=88


Wel for cryin out loud, you are right.... I didn't understand.... sorry you obviously have to spell it out for me like a 2 year old... DOH hehehhehe

I'm glad you found the answer you were looking for though... At any rate, I'll tell you - If you put one or a couple of the F112's in your medium or small room, they will still truly knock your socks off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hifisponge View Post

I think you've become jaded Mr. "I have a half-dozen 18" drivers in my living room".

The F112 is not just great sub for a "bedroom". I have a single F112 in my 19 x 13 x 10 living room and it gave me a pounding while watching Alien vs. Predator: Requiem last night. Certainly a more visceral experience than with my previous Velo DD15. The LFE in that movie scared the crap out of my wife.

I'm pretty sure that F112 is coasting in your bedroom. Now be a good boy and let it out to play every once in a while.

Hehehhe Today was a sad day, I had the day off and finished the box for my last 18" driver, and after installing found it to be a bad driver... I should have bench tested it... I'd probably have a replacement already.... grrrrr Now I have to wait another week...

So sad...

At least I still have a grin on my face from the F112...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose View Post

Thanks, they do sound very nice. I have no room for a second one without compromising A LOT. The right/opposite side is a hallway and an open area to the dining area. Apartment living in NYC.

BTW, anyone have their fathoms on spikes?


I beg to differ.... you can always STACK 'em.... !!!!!!

Warpdrv is offline  
post #375 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 05:15 PM
AVS Special Member
 
hifisponge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 7,516
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Hehehhe Today was a sad day, I had the day off and finished the box for my last 18" driver, and after installing found it to be a bad driver... I should have bench tested it... I'd probably have a replacement already.... grrrrr Now I have to wait another week...

So sad...

At least I still have a grin on my face from the F112...



Too bad, now you only have five 18" drivers to massage the paint off your walls. What ever will you do.

Seriously. The waiting sucks, but at least it's covered under warranty.
hifisponge is offline  
post #376 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 06:30 PM
Advanced Member
 
Jose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: NYC
Posts: 802
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post


I beg to differ.... you can always STACK 'em.... !!!!!!


That's true. I can then have my own version: Fathom F312!

Jose.
Jose is offline  
post #377 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 06:33 PM
Advanced Member
 
scanido's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Toronto Suburbs
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Wel for cryin out loud, you are right.... I didn't understand.... sorry you obviously have to spell it out for me like a 2 year old... DOH hehehhehe

I'm glad you found the answer you were looking for though... At any rate, I'll tell you - If you put one or a couple of the F112's in your medium or small room, they will still truly knock your socks off.

No worries, it's all good! At least you got me a link to that new F212 and that got me thinking!! lol

See Profile
scanido is offline  
post #378 of 422 Old 02-03-2009, 06:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
hifisponge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 7,516
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
hifisponge is offline  
post #379 of 422 Old 02-04-2009, 07:23 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Lookin good with the WB's there Tim... You got a damn nice first rate system there !!
Warpdrv is offline  
post #380 of 422 Old 02-07-2009, 06:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tractng's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Would anybody buy a brand new JL 112 for $1500 without warranty. A guy locally tells me he has one in a unopened box (he bought it from JL working at an Audio shop for a great deal) .

I have bought stuff from ebay, but not this much without warranty. Just curious..

I have the itch to upgrade. Currently using a HSU HO..

tnt
tractng is offline  
post #381 of 422 Old 02-07-2009, 07:25 PM
AVS Special Member
 
RMK!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 95608
Posts: 5,657
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

Would anybody buy a brand new JL 112 for $1500 without warranty. A guy locally tells me he has one in a unopened box (he bought it from JL working at an Audio shop for a great deal) .

I have bought stuff from ebay, but not this much without warranty. Just curious..

I have the itch to upgrade. Currently using a HSU HO..

tnt

That is a very good price for a new F112
RMK! is offline  
post #382 of 422 Old 02-07-2009, 07:37 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
cschang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan Beach, CA
Posts: 14,729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

Would anybody buy a brand new JL 112 for $1500 without warranty. A guy locally tells me he has one in a unopened box (he bought it from JL working at an Audio shop for a great deal) .

I have bought stuff from ebay, but not this much without warranty. Just curious..

I have the itch to upgrade. Currently using a HSU HO..

tnt

That is a great price. It won't reach as low as the Hsu, and not have the output(if you need it), but it will have better sound quality IMO. Much smaller and looks a lot nicer too.

The no warranty would definitely be a concern though.

-curtis

Owner of Wave Crest Audio
Volunteer Mod at the Ascend Acoustics Forum
Like all things on the Internet, do your research, as forums have a good amount of misinformation.
Help beat breast cancer!

cschang is offline  
post #383 of 422 Old 02-07-2009, 07:56 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tractng's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

That is a great price. It won't reach as low as the Hsu, and not have the output(if you need it), but it will have better sound quality IMO. Much smaller and looks a lot nicer too.

The no warranty would definitely be a concern though.


Thinking really hard. I like to reduce the footprint though.

I do 50/50 (music/ht).

tnt
tractng is offline  
post #384 of 422 Old 02-07-2009, 08:02 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
cschang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan Beach, CA
Posts: 14,729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

Thinking really hard. I like to reduce the footprint though.

I do 50/50 (music/ht).

tnt

Of all the subs I have experienced, looking at the aspects of appearance and performance.....it is my favorite. There are others have are possibly as good performance wise and less expensive, but don't have nearly as nice packaging.

-curtis

Owner of Wave Crest Audio
Volunteer Mod at the Ascend Acoustics Forum
Like all things on the Internet, do your research, as forums have a good amount of misinformation.
Help beat breast cancer!

cschang is offline  
post #385 of 422 Old 02-08-2009, 11:29 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Warpdrv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 7,350
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
One of the best Subs you can get, and for that price, I think its a bargain. I would suggest that you are allowed to verify that it is in working order, but I highly doubt JL would put a sub out of their doors in non working order. But with no warranty I would certainly make sure.

There should be no reason if he is local for him open the box for you....
Warpdrv is offline  
post #386 of 422 Old 02-08-2009, 12:37 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tractng's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

One of the best Subs you can get, and for that price, I think its a bargain. I would suggest that you are allowed to verify that it is in working order, but I highly doubt JL would put a sub out of their doors in non working order. But with no warranty I would certainly make sure.

There should be no reason if he is local for him open the box for you....

Good advice.


Tnt
tractng is offline  
post #387 of 422 Old 02-08-2009, 05:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Sharp1080's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Southern Calif
Posts: 1,765
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

Would anybody buy a brand new JL 112 for $1500 without warranty. A guy locally tells me he has one in a unopened box (he bought it from JL working at an Audio shop for a great deal) .

I have bought stuff from ebay, but not this much without warranty. Just curious..

I have the itch to upgrade. Currently using a HSU HO..

tnt

Just be able to verify that the official JL audio taped seal is on the box. If it's broken at all the box has been opened. He personally bought it from JL audio or the shop he works at bought it? Does JL wholesale to non authorized dealers? He wasn't selling out it of the back of a van was he?

"Music is my religion"
Jimi Hendrix

Sharp1080 is offline  
post #388 of 422 Old 02-08-2009, 06:43 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tractng's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharp1080 View Post

Just be able to verify that the official JL audio taped seal is on the box. If it's broken at all the box has been opened. He personally bought it from JL audio or the shop he works at bought it? Does JL wholesale to non authorized dealers? He wasn't selling out it of the back of a van was he?

I was told he bought it from (through) his shop and had to hold it for a period of time before he could sell them.

The van is a probable too .


Is it very easy to verify if the sub is functional? Just hook up the rca cable via lfe ?? Anything I should know ahead to verify.

Tnt
tractng is offline  
post #389 of 422 Old 02-08-2009, 06:53 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Franin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 17,005
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 168
Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

I was told he bought it from (through) his shop and had to hold it for a period of time before he could sell them.

The van is a probable too .


Is it very easy to verify if the sub is functional? Just hook up the rca cable via lfe ?? Anything I should know ahead to verify.

Tnt

There is a member here who is an employee with jl audio IMHO you should PM him he will be the best person to verify it.

_________________________

Frank

Franin is online now  
post #390 of 422 Old 02-09-2009, 12:08 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tractng's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24
What cable do I need to hook up the sub? Currently, I have a hsu ho, with a single rca going to the sub from the receiver -lfe. Can somebody confirm this would work?

http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...t=1#largeimage

I saw the rear of the sub. I can use the "left or mono" input?

Also, does the sub have rubber feet, etc?


tnt
tractng is offline  
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Tags
Jl Audio Fathom F112 12 Inch Powered Subwoofer , Jl Audio Brand , Jl Audio
Gear in this thread

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off