Definitive Technology PF15TL+ Value? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 22 Old 01-07-2007, 04:30 PM - Thread Starter
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I have a chance to buy a Definitive Technology PF15TL+ subwoofer. Unfortunately, I am not able to find a cost/value for this item. Can anyone help me assign a value to this subwoofer?
Thanks.
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post #2 of 22 Old 01-07-2007, 04:36 PM
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The retail was $699US. Used and depening on condition,and considering today's competitive market. I would guess $300 TOPS if in perfect shape,not a dime more.




Keep in mind this sub uses a 15" woofer,however the excursion is very poor and it is not capable of moving much air.Below 25Hz this sub is almost useless.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #3 of 22 Old 01-07-2007, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
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You do not sound like a fan of this sub.
I have a Klipsch RW-8 in another room. How would the PF15TL+ compare in your opinion?
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post #4 of 22 Old 07-04-2007, 11:45 AM
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Hello, I have owned this sub for about 6-7 years now. I purchased it retail for about $650, sold it to a friend of mine 3 years ago for about $450, and just bought it back from him 3 days ago for $375. Let me tell you I would've paid him the full 450 back for this sub that I charged him JUST because I love it soooo much. I've been a fan of audio equipment since I was 13 years of age (now 24). This sub works just as well for movies as it does for music. The low frequency extension is amazing. I just can't understand how somebody can say it's useless "below 25HZ". One of my favorite things to do is to put on a quality recording of the Newberry Memorial Organ in New Haven, (which is also my hometown, so I've heard this organ many times in person) and just CRANK the volume. Even the lowest of pedal tones hit me with clarity, solidity, definition, and for lack of a better description, RAW VISCERAL IMPACT. Back to the 25hz thing... another reason why I can't let go of this thing is just because of it's amazing subsonic ability, it's accuracy, and it's ability to blend in very musically with the rest of the mix. Being a musician myself (guitar for 11 years) I am VERY picky when it comes to sound. Sorry to get off topic a bit.... but, I just paid $375 to get this thing back, and it was the best money I've spent in over 2 years. I would say this sub is in the league of high-end equipment costing hundreds, even thousands of dollars more IMHO. I hope I have helped you out a little!!
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post #5 of 22 Old 07-04-2007, 04:26 PM
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I have also had this sub for 2 years. I second every word The Ear said except I would not pay more than $250 for it used.
A HSU Vtf2 MKIII or any of the SVS subs I have heard (mostly cylinders long ago) would kill this on the bottom end and sound better across the rest of the bass frequencies.

I work in the AV industry and have tried many subs out there, but I could just be another BSer on the net .
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post #6 of 22 Old 07-04-2007, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyV311 View Post

Hello, I have owned this sub for about 6-7 years now. I purchased it retail for about $650, sold it to a friend of mine 3 years ago for about $450, and just bought it back from him 3 days ago for $375. Let me tell you I would've paid him the full 450 back for this sub that I charged him JUST because I love it soooo much. I've been a fan of audio equipment since I was 13 years of age (now 24). This sub works just as well for movies as it does for music. The low frequency extension is amazing. I just can't understand how somebody can say it's useless "below 25HZ". One of my favorite things to do is to put on a quality recording of the Newberry Memorial Organ in New Haven, (which is also my hometown, so I've heard this organ many times in person) and just CRANK the volume. Even the lowest of pedal tones hit me with clarity, solidity, definition, and for lack of a better description, RAW VISCERAL IMPACT. Back to the 25hz thing... another reason why I can't let go of this thing is just because of it's amazing subsonic ability, it's accuracy, and it's ability to blend in very musically with the rest of the mix. Being a musician myself (guitar for 11 years) I am VERY picky when it comes to sound. Sorry to get off topic a bit.... but, I just paid $375 to get this thing back, and it was the best money I've spent in over 2 years. I would say this sub is in the league of high-end equipment costing hundreds, even thousands of dollars more IMHO. I hope I have helped you out a little!!


Keep in mind that TheEar is one of the few of us that have major experience with high end equipment. It might have some output, but to us, 80db at 22hz isn't something to be amazed by.

"The choices we make define our lives, because choice, not chance, determines destiny"

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post #7 of 22 Old 07-04-2007, 08:36 PM
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For what it is worth, I have two of these subs in a 17 x 19 x 9 theater room. I paid $400 each for them on ebay two years ago and I would rate them as average at best. Although they have a 15" driver, as has been mentioned, they just don't move much air at all. They roll off pretty sharply at 30hz and they have little output at 20hz. Infrasonics are slim to none, in my experience. It is not just a placement issue - I have put these subs in at least 10 to 12 different places in my room trying to get some better performance out of them, but with little success.

Honestly, I have never been very happy with these subs and I am planning to replace them in the near future.

- David
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post #8 of 22 Old 07-04-2007, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

For what it is worth, I have two of these subs in a 17 x 19 x 9 theater room. I paid $400 each for them on ebay two years ago and I would rate them as average at best. Although they have a 15" driver, as has been mentioned, they just don't move much air at all. They roll off pretty sharply at 30hz and they have little output at 20hz. Infrasonics are slim to none, in my experience. It is not just a placement issue - I have put these subs in at least 10 to 12 different places in my room trying to get some better performance out of them, but with little success.

Honestly, I have never been very happy with these subs and I am planning to replace them in the near future.

- David

i was selling def tech when this sub came out. i think the whole "TL" line was crap, both subs and towers which is why they dropped the line so quickly.

i already had 1 or 2 of my powerfields when the TL line came out. i took the 18TL home and brought it back the same day and bought the last powerfield we had in stock, i even bought our floor model

i think the TL line was an attempt at using cheaper parts (driver amp etc.) to get the cost to the consumer lower and you can see by how quickly the TL line disappeared that it didn't work out

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post #9 of 22 Old 07-05-2007, 10:31 AM
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Sorry if this tabu--but I have THAT sub available for sale with two years minimal use in as new condition and can ship in original box with manual. I would sell it for a reasonable offer with allowance for shipping. I also have the 80-series (8-inch) and same applies.

I was logging on today to list these in classifieds and stumbled across this thread....

Thanks.
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post #10 of 22 Old 12-22-2007, 09:17 AM
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(All the more reason to start my IB project. Lookin at raw sub choices.)

I have owned a PF15 for about 10 years now and really haven't tried anything else. I guess I need to get out of my 5.0 Mustang and testdrive that Viper.
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post #11 of 22 Old 12-22-2007, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsta View Post

(All the more reason to start my IB project. Lookin at raw sub choices.)

I have owned a PF15 for about 10 years now and really haven't tried anything else. I guess I need to get out of my 5.0 Mustang and testdrive that Viper.

I got the ED A5-350. BIG, BIG difference from the def tech. BIG difference.

NOTE: I blew the amp fairly quickly (I guessed--and was correct). Rather than have me package and send the whole beast back, they shipped out a new amp immediately, without question. I installed it and mailed busted amp back with their return label. Good to go. Great customer service.
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post #12 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 07:37 AM
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I have owned a PF15 for years myself. I just had mine repaired a couple of months ago for over $300.00 and it just gave up the ghost last night. My 2nd amp is now toast. I give this amp a 0 rating on electronics!

Does anyone know where I can order the PF15 amplifier from?

Please PM me.

Thanks
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post #13 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 08:05 AM
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I had a pf 15 for 10 years till about a month ago when i finally upgraded to an svs.
In its day it was the best bang for the buck and it has served me well after all those years. I gave it to my sister along withan old pioneer elite after I upgraded that. Her house rocks now and to 99% of regular people out there that is the best sound they have ever heard

Also mr Ear why do your post sound EARily like CADOBHuK

"There in no W.A.F. in my house. If She dont like it, She can live with her Mother"
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post #14 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyV311 View Post

Hello, I have owned this sub for about 6-7 years now. I purchased it retail for about $650, sold it to a friend of mine 3 years ago for about $450, and just bought it back from him 3 days ago for $375. Let me tell you I would've paid him the full 450 back for this sub that I charged him JUST because I love it soooo much. I've been a fan of audio equipment since I was 13 years of age (now 24). This sub works just as well for movies as it does for music. The low frequency extension is amazing. I just can't understand how somebody can say it's useless "below 25HZ". One of my favorite things to do is to put on a quality recording of the Newberry Memorial Organ in New Haven, (which is also my hometown, so I've heard this organ many times in person) and just CRANK the volume. Even the lowest of pedal tones hit me with clarity, solidity, definition, and for lack of a better description, RAW VISCERAL IMPACT. Back to the 25hz thing... another reason why I can't let go of this thing is just because of it's amazing subsonic ability, it's accuracy, and it's ability to blend in very musically with the rest of the mix. Being a musician myself (guitar for 11 years) I am VERY picky when it comes to sound. Sorry to get off topic a bit.... but, I just paid $375 to get this thing back, and it was the best money I've spent in over 2 years. I would say this sub is in the league of high-end equipment costing hundreds, even thousands of dollars more IMHO. I hope I have helped you out a little!!


This sub has very limited Xmax,being sealed and optimied in the 30-80Hz range it has POOR...VERY POOR output below 25Hz and that is a FACT.

Amazing subsonic ability ! LOL The Fathom f113 being smaller and sealed has amazing subsonic ability for its size,not this Def Tech.

You want to hear what a real sub with amazing subsonic ability is? Listen to Some SVS Ultra ,JL Fathom or an Epik Conquest.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #15 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmountainbiker View Post

I had a pf 15 for 10 years till about a month ago when i finally upgraded to an svs.
In its day it was the best bang for the buck and it has served me well after all those years. I gave it to my sister along withan old pioneer elite after I upgraded that. Her house rocks now and to 99% of regular people out there that is the best sound they have ever heard

Also mr Ear why do your post sound EARily like CADOBHuK

Go mountain bike some more,after a few more falls you may be on topic.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #16 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEAR View Post

This sub has very limited Xmax,being sealed and optimied in the 30-80Hz range it has POOR...VERY POOR output below 25Hz and that is a FACT.

Amazing subsonic ability ! LOL The Fathom f113 being smaller and sealed has amazing subsonic ability for its size,not this Def Tech.

You want to hear what a real sub with amazing subsonic ability is? Listen to Some SVS Ultra ,JL Fathom or an Epik Conquest.

the 15TL+ is not sealed. actually the "TL" stands for
"transmission line" loaded

but you are right, the 15TL+ does not go very low but what do you expect from a $699 brick & mortar sub from 1997

by the way, did your trinity that you ordered ever come in ?

i'm talking about the 2nd time you ordered it

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post #17 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 10:15 AM
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My bad about the TL,still that sub does not perform well below 25Hz. The poster said "I just can't understand how somebody can say it's useless "below 25HZ". It is to me, some people have lesser expectations of what a sub using a 15" driver should do. That is all.

Not going to order a Trinity, the valued space is there for the Gotham and DIY subs that will best the Trinity. Why would I at this point order a Trinity ?

I have ten DIY subs comming. My fun has switched to building DIY subs using very capable drivers,or buying exclusive one of a kind subs like the Gotham.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #18 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEAR View Post

Why would I at this point order a Trinity ?

maybe because twice in the past, you had claimed that you had one ordered already

All this noise about noise.
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post #19 of 22 Old 03-20-2008, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otk View Post

maybe because twice in the past, you had claimed that you had one ordered already


And I have changed my mind... The sales guy was not happy.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #20 of 22 Old 06-03-2009, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyV311 View Post

Hello, I have owned this sub for about 6-7 years now. I purchased it retail for about $650, sold it to a friend of mine 3 years ago for about $450, and just bought it back from him 3 days ago for $375. Let me tell you I would've paid him the full 450 back for this sub that I charged him JUST because I love it soooo much. I've been a fan of audio equipment since I was 13 years of age (now 24). This sub works just as well for movies as it does for music. The low frequency extension is amazing. I just can't understand how somebody can say it's useless "below 25HZ". One of my favorite things to do is to put on a quality recording of the Newberry Memorial Organ in New Haven, (which is also my hometown, so I've heard this organ many times in person) and just CRANK the volume. Even the lowest of pedal tones hit me with clarity, solidity, definition, and for lack of a better description, RAW VISCERAL IMPACT. Back to the 25hz thing... another reason why I can't let go of this thing is just because of it's amazing subsonic ability, it's accuracy, and it's ability to blend in very musically with the rest of the mix. Being a musician myself (guitar for 11 years) I am VERY picky when it comes to sound. Sorry to get off topic a bit.... but, I just paid $375 to get this thing back, and it was the best money I've spent in over 2 years. I would say this sub is in the league of high-end equipment costing hundreds, even thousands of dollars more IMHO. I hope I have helped you out a little!!

I also have a PF-15TL and must say that the low frequency extension is pretty weak. The sub has very little output below 25 Hz because the amplifier has steep filters to protect the woofer from bottoming out. Output from the amp starts falling off at ~33 Hz. The 15" Eminence driver has a small Xmax (only 8mm) and the box is ported so it would be prone to bottoming. I think this woofer may be better suited for a sealed arrangement to control the displacement better. I'm going to modify the amp filter circuits to try to extend to the low end and covert the sub from a vented to a sealed arrangment. Since I do not use the sub very loud, I can afford to make these mods without serious issues. Hopefullly I can get a solid 25 Hz out of this sub......just at lower volume.
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post #21 of 22 Old 08-26-2013, 10:52 AM
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I know this thread is old, but there isn't much info on the PF15TL and PF15TL+ on the internets, so anyone looking to buy one of these vintage models will probably end up here. I felt that many of the comments here were misleading and not entirely accurate, so I'm going to share my view.

Depending on what you're looking for, the PF15TL+ can be a very good choice, rivalling some of the best subs even today. I've owned a PF15TL for 13 years, and recently the amp died. Based on the not-so-glowing reviews on this forum I decided to purchase a new sub instead of repairing the 15TL. I purchased the Epik Legend 12" subwoofer which is generally agreed as one of the top 3 subwoofers at less than $600. Upon setting it up, I discovered that it is, overall, barely superior to the PF15TL. The Epik has much better reproduction of higher, snappier bass, while the PF15TL is better at the lows (<50 Hz) or so. Let me say that again: The 13-year old PF15TL reproduces deep bass better than the one of the top rated brand new subs today! The PFTL bass reproduction falls off quickly at higher than 50 Hz, however, so it isn't very balanced for most music. Basically, if your main purpose is home theatre or hip hop music, go with the PF15TL. If you want balanced bass reproduction and the ability to hit the middle/upper snappy bass, the PF15TL isn't a very good choice.
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post #22 of 22 Old 08-26-2013, 11:02 AM
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