Nemo--Darla Scene--Subwoofer Test - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crackyflipside View Post

I was in physical pain the day after because I wasn't using hearing protection.

I always use hearing protection when conducting measurements and test, I want to be able to enjoy the fruits of my labor.
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post #92 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 04:32 PM
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1. 99db from listening postion
2. xxx-didn't try
3. 3000cu ft
4. a PB12-Plus colocated w/ PB12-ISD
5. Master Volume -12db Sub calibrated to 78db on SPL meter (+3db hot)
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post #93 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 04:40 PM
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ok i redid my tests... C weighting fast Max... didn't see anypoint in going to 0 MV... when all three were scary lol...

1. 106dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 115dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -15 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers at 0 MV

1. 108dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -10 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers

1. 110dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -5 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers
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post #94 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 04:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frockc View Post

ok i redid my tests... C weighting fast Max... didn't see anypoint in going to 0 MV... when all three were scary lol...

1. 106dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 115dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -15 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers at 0 MV

1. 108dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -10 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers

1. 110dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -5 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers


HOLY COW MAN!!

Those numbers are staggering for that "little" sub. First you have a HUGE open space from what you said, and still, at -5db MV you still hit 110db from your LP.

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post #95 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frockc View Post

ok i redid my tests... C weighting fast Max... didn't see anypoint in going to 0 MV... when all three were scary lol...

1. 106dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 115dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -15 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers at 0 MV

1. 108dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -10 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers

1. 110dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -5 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers

I don't understand why it's the same 119db when at -10MV and -5MV.Should'nt it be higher with -5 MV ?

super dirty , super clean , pow
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post #96 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPainMD View Post

I don't understand why it's the same 119db when at -10MV and -5MV.Should'nt it be higher with -5 MV ?

I think the subwoofer had reached its limits.

Looking at JL Audio's max output data (GP @ 1 meter), they were reporting 117.1db at 31.5Hz and 121.2db at 50Hz.

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post #97 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPainMD View Post

I don't understand why it's the same 119db when at -10MV and -5MV.

This is what I was looking for. It appears to me that the f113 is compressing.
frockc,
Can you observe to see if the clip/amp limiter light is coming on?
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post #98 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgillyjcu View Post

HOLY COW MAN!!

Those numbers are staggering for that "little" sub. First you have a HUGE open space from what you said, and still, at -5db MV you still hit 110db from your LP.

With almost half a foot of excursion, I am not surprised at all.
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post #99 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:05 PM - Thread Starter
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My guess.......Reaching his limit......You can only turn it up so loud before it will reach compression and maybe even bottom. I think his BEST volume was the -10db. At -5db as you noted, the data didn't really go up much more at all from the LP and leveled off at 1Meter.

Every sub has a limit!

And hey! Thats a lot of output for a single sub in a 4000cubic foot room!!!

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post #100 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmcomp124 View Post

With almost half a foot of excursion, I am not surprised at all.

LOL


And DAMN you guys are fast to respond....took me 60seconds to type that last one and I come back and there is already 3 responses!

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post #101 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:10 PM
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with my results, when I turn up the MV (ex. 3db) I get roughly the same increase with the spl reading (+3db) for the sub. I'm no expert, so I don't know whats happening.

super dirty , super clean , pow
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post #102 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmcomp124 View Post

This is what I was looking for. It appears to me that the f113 is compressing.
frockc,
Can you observe to see if the clip/amp limiter light is coming on?

I don't think there is a clip / amp limiter light on the JL Audio... I've pushed my Fathom pretty hard to the point where I know its compressing, and have not seen any lights go off.

When I had the AV123 ULW-12, the amp light would turn red everytime the limiter was activated.

Life is good.
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post #103 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:15 PM
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well yea the sub is not bottoming out when i get it to -5MV... one thing is i had the sub in the right side of my living room basically the middle of the first floor and then i shifted it to the left side which at the back has the staircase that goes to the upper 2 levels... did this because a much better FR on the left side since itz a true corner...

i did try the movie pulse at the end where the bass is just crazy and if i go to -5MV in the trueHD track over analogs it bottoms out.... but if i switch over to the coaxial output the bass actually sounds louder at the same -10MV but at -5MV it will bottom out also even though the sound is much louder...

really amazing sub... just brings a smile to my face since i had a NHT 12 before...
understandable the bottoming out at that point though so not really dissappointed...

here are some pics of my room....
LL
LL
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post #104 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:20 PM
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One thing is on pulse i was making my lights flicker lol...

what is the clip/amp limiter light u are talking about jmcomp???
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post #105 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frockc View Post

One thing is on pulse i was making my lights flicker lol...

That just adds to the movie experience LOL

When playing the Darla scene, things in my room started to rattle that never rattled before (windows, pictures on the wall), with my -4db result. (101db @ LP and 110 at 1 meter , 25-31PCi)

super dirty , super clean , pow
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post #106 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frockc View Post

One thing is on pulse i was making my lights flicker lol...

what is the clip/amp limiter light u are talking about jmcomp???

Looks like your sub does not have such an indicator. Your room looks very difficult for a sub. Can you post a better picture of the corner where it is at now? The best way to load this sub would be to place it a corner so it is loaded by 2 walls and the floor.
If you calibrated with Avia, then your processor may have adjusted the LFE offset by 10dB. In TrueHD, I don't know how it works, but it appears that you have to claibrate the processor/receiver differently for TrueHD unlike coaxial input. You probably maybe unintentionally calibrating it 10dB hot with TrueHD. You may want to ask about this in the processor forum.
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post #107 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 05:43 PM
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yea here is a pic it sits now where that tripod is... i calibrated the speakers using the processor itself to have ref 0 at 75db... the analogs i calibrated using the THX optimizer on the Finding nemo dvd and they all seem to be at 75db also... i think the analogs on the HD DVD player XA2 are just lower all around i know i had to boost the sub for 7.1 analogs by 10 db which is common for analogs...
LL
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post #108 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgillyjcu View Post

Master Volume -34 Sub Cal at 75db flat.

did you mean to put master volume of -34?

that doesn't make sense... -34db is low....unless you have the reference level at like -25db or something...

MV on my Yamy says -34db when my SPL reads 75db with pink noise. I run klipsch references all around.

If that makes sense.
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post #109 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
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I wish we could get some people with MULTIPLE subs to do this.

Also I'd like to see some 3.3 with turbo and some HO with turbo.

I'd like to see some more SVS PLUS and ULTRA subs as well.

And how about NON SVS and HSU people.....anyone out there?

Maybe you can message some members and get them to take part in this

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post #110 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 07:05 PM
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Agree. Some 3.3 and HO numbers would be a valuable addition.
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post #111 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgillyjcu View Post

I wish we could get some people with MULTIPLE subs to do this.

Also I'd like to see some 3.3 with turbo and some HO with turbo.

I'd like to see some more SVS PLUS and ULTRA subs as well.

And how about NON SVS and HSU people.....anyone out there?

Maybe you can message some members and get them to take part in this

Triple subs:

Two SB12Plus's hooked up in stereo with the L&R mains and a 2 x 10" TC-1000 6.5 cu ft. ported box, powered by Behringer EP2500, hooked up to LFE.

115 db in Listening area, about 14 ft.
126 db 1 meter from ported sub, Behringer lighting up like a Christmas tree

6120 cu ft. open room.
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post #112 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frockc View Post

yea here is a pic it sits now where that tripod is... i calibrated the speakers using the processor itself to have ref 0 at 75db... the analogs i calibrated using the THX optimizer on the Finding nemo dvd and they all seem to be at 75db also... i think the analogs on the HD DVD player XA2 are just lower all around i know i had to boost the sub for 7.1 analogs by 10 db which is common for analogs...

Do you have a more recent pic with the sub in the pic? Would like to see it in your room layout.

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post #113 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 08:21 PM
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1. 110 db from Listening Position (analog SPL Meter-fast)
2. 115 db from 1 meter (analog SPL Meter-fast)
3. 2300cuft (sealed )
4. A single SVS PB12/plus/2 tuned in the 16 hz tune
5. Master Volume -10db Sub calibrated to 75db on SPL meter. Ref is 0, all speakers are set to 75 db's.

1. 111 db from Listening Position (analog SPL Meter-fast)
2. 116 db from 1 meter (analog SPL Meter-fast)
3. 2300cuft (sealed )
4. A single SVS PB12/plus/2 tuned in the 16 hz tune
5. Master Volume -5 db Sub calibrated to 75db on SPL meter. Ref is 0, all speakers are set to 75 db's.

1. 111 db from Listening Position (analog SPL Meter-fast)
2. 117 db from 1 meter (analog SPL Meter-fast)
3. 2300cuft (sealed )
4. A single SVS PB12/plus/2 tuned in the 16 hz tune
5. Master Volume 0 db Sub calibrated to 75db on SPL meter. Ref is 0, all speakers are set to 75 db's.

My sub in the 25 hz mode will yield at least 6 more db's in my room.
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post #114 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

1. 110 db from Listening Position (analog SPL Meter-fast)
2. 115 db from 1 meter (analog SPL Meter-fast)
3. 2300cuft (sealed )
4. A single SVS PB12/plus/2 tuned in the 16 hz tune
5. Master Volume -10db Sub calibrated to 75db on SPL meter. Ref is 0, all speakers are set to 75 db's.

1. 111 db from Listening Position (analog SPL Meter-fast)
2. 116 db from 1 meter (analog SPL Meter-fast)
3. 2300cuft (sealed )
4. A single SVS PB12/plus/2 tuned in the 16 hz tune
5. Master Volume -5 db Sub calibrated to 75db on SPL meter. Ref is 0, all speakers are set to 75 db's.

1. 111 db from Listening Position (analog SPL Meter-fast)
2. 117 db from 1 meter (analog SPL Meter-fast)
3. 2300cuft (sealed )
4. A single SVS PB12/plus/2 tuned in the 16 hz tune
5. Master Volume 0 db Sub calibrated to 75db on SPL meter. Ref is 0, all speakers are set to 75 db's.

My sub in the 25 hz mode will yield at least 6 more db's in my room.

Hi Mk,
Good to see you here. From you measurements it looks like the Plus/2 is compressing above MV -10. Have you measured the 20Hz mode?
Jai
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post #115 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 08:55 PM
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Hi Jai,
How is the dts-20? Yes I know it is compressing, but the sub never bottoms or sounds bad and I am running it in it's least efficient tune. I will re-run it in its native tune tomorrow, I will even do it in the 20 hz tune. Remember this sub was built for 118 db's in the 16 hz tune, 121 db's in the 20 hz tune, and 124 db's in the 25 hz tune at 1 meter. We will see.
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post #116 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 09:04 PM
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Hi James,
The DTS-20 is awesome!! The problem is completely gone and it rocks. I have to do a lot of listening and testing before I post anything on it. The size is still overwhelming us and in fact I have an interested buyer so I think I will be selling it shortly. Mine is a pretty large effective 7000 cu ft room. I already tried the Darla scene and at 17 ft away I think we saw 110dB uncorrected in a very old analog meter. My friend was holding the meter while I was listening in awe. I think I was at MV +6 calibrated at 75dB running 2dB hot. I Equed it last night but haven't had the opportunity to measure to contribute to the thread it. I get back home pretty late and don't want to bother the neighbors. I will post it over the weekend.
Regards,
-Jai
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post #117 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frockc View Post

ok i redid my tests... C weighting fast Max... didn't see anypoint in going to 0 MV... when all three were scary lol...

1. 106dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 115dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -15 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers at 0 MV

1. 108dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -10 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers

1. 110dB on very old digital meter 11-12ft away...
2. 119dB
3. 4000cf first level of a townhome open stairs to upper two levels and lower level
4. JL fathom 113
5. -5 MV, sub calibrated 75dB flat with speakers

Good show,great showing in fact. I wonder what multiples do in a tiny space.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #118 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 09:14 PM
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here are some more pics...

also i forgot to say i got a marantz 8500 so i dont think there is an easy way to disconnect the speakers so i left them on...
LL
LL
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post #119 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 09:21 PM
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Fun thread!

For the 1 meter measurements, are you guys measuring equal distance from the ports(if you have them) and driver(s)?

-curtis

Owner of Wave Crest Audio
Volunteer Mod at the Ascend Acoustics Forum
Like all things on the Internet, do your research, as forums have a good amount of misinformation.
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post #120 of 274 Old 02-28-2007, 09:26 PM
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Ok Brad. The big boys are coming in now . Your thread this time has attracted some very good attention and you are making up for that other silly thread which got deleted. I for one really appreciate what you came up with. Did I motivate you with my 3 year old post on the PB2Plus and Darla scene? Just curious.
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