JL Audio Facility Field trip, Pembroke Pines, Fl...Enroll here - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 02:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jvgillow View Post

I believe Carl had five front F112 subs and a rear F113 running.

Was this the demo room at JL Audio????

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post #92 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 05:42 AM - Thread Starter
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We will post lots of thoughts/comments, and of course pics. First, I want to thank the crew at JL Audio for going so much out of their way to make this happen and to give us a really nice tour! It was a first class tour, and certainly, a first class operation!!!

Once Ozzy and I get in touch and figure out all the 500 pics taken, we will post some.

Also, thanks to all you guys for showing up and having a good time...you fellas are not 1/2 as bad as you seem online heheheheh.

ps- thanks for the pics Jeremy...good stuff.
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post #93 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 06:58 AM
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I think Carl said it was 6 F112s up front!

Are we going to start a new thread or...?

I have sound equipment.
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post #94 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 07:04 AM
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Dunno about a new thread but I knew some people had subscribed to this one waiting for updates.

Jeremy Gillow
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post #95 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icehawk_OS View Post

I think Carl said it was 6 F112s up front!

Are we going to start a new thread or...?

No way man! This one's stickied, post all here so people dont get lost looking for pics and videos.
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post #96 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 02:11 PM
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I think my favorite shot(s) were where you can see the actual F113 driver next to a real person. Artist drawings just don't do it justice. That's one big mother.

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post #97 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssabripo View Post

We will post lots of thoughts/comments, and of course pics. First, I want to thank the crew at JL Audio for going so much out of their way to make this happen and to give us a really nice tour! It was a first class tour, and certainly, a first class operation!!!

Once Ozzy and I get in touch and figure out all the 500 pics taken, we will post some.

Also, thanks to all you guys for showing up and having a good time...you fellas are not 1/2 as bad as you seem online heheheheh.

ps- thanks for the pics Jeremy...good stuff.

Sherv,

Thanks for taking the time and effort to set up the tour at JL Audio. It was well worth the drive from PB County. All I can say is that JL Audio is a first class company. Worthy of aerospace industry type processing, with very well thought out manufacturing and quality control. Their products are expensive, but they really are building quality into those products.
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post #98 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 07:07 PM
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I'll have pics and written narration of the walk through on my site later this evening. Ended up with more than 400 pictures, but knocked it down to 145. I was hoping to have something up earlier, but it is taking a while to write about the things we were lucky enough to see.

Thanks again for hooking us up Sherv, and I'll post a link once everything is on my site.
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post #99 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 07:36 PM
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Thanks to everyone who helped make this happen. It really was eye-opening for me, and I wish more people had an opportunity to see what we saw. All I can say is that JL is an outfit we can trust -- trust to care about designing an incredible product, trust to manufacture it at a higher level than I previously thought possible, and trust to do right by their customers. I can't wait to see their new home theater products -- I have no doubt that they will be as incredible as the Fathoms.
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post #100 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 08:10 PM
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It's nice to see where my baby was born, and the nice folks taking care them! Sweet trip.


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post #101 of 220 Old 04-21-2007, 09:40 PM
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Pictures are up... www.AudioJunkies.com


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post #102 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 06:15 AM
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Guess who got one of the first driver cutouts from one of the Gotham subs.

ME!!! It may not seem like much, but it a huge chunk of 12 layer fiberglass that is ~2" thick. I got all the head guys including CEO and VP to sign it

-brien

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post #103 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 09:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Great write up Luke!! Awesome stuff....




And thanks for the kind words everyone! I'm very flattered....I hope everyone got something out of this, and hopefully this will be the first of many trips!
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post #104 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 09:17 AM
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My thanks to Shervin, Jeremy, Luke G et al for the pictures and commentary. It is nice to know that the manufacturer of one of my favorite AV components is such a dedicated and well run company. Kudos to Manville Smith and Carl Kennedy for opening their doors to a group of enthusiasts and providing this inside look at their company. They have good reason to be proud of their products.

Nice work guys and thanks for sharing.

HToM

"Well, la di fricken da."!
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post #105 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 10:46 AM
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Wow! Amazing stuff.
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post #106 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poormanq45 View Post

Guess who got one of the first driver cutouts from one of the Gotham subs.

ME!!! It may not seem like much, but it a huge chunk of 12 layer fiberglass that is ~2" thick. I got all the head guys including CEO and VP to sign it

-brien




I can see why the Gotham weights in at more than 400lbs. Sweet!
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post #107 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 10:58 AM
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Luke,

Great job on the write up and the photos of the JL tour. Excellent work!! That Gotham looks mighty impressive. Gezzzzzzzz..

Thank you,
Charles

"Man plans, God laughs"
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post #108 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 11:34 AM
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Brilliant, just brilliant. I haven't enjoyed looking at a bunch of photo's so much in a long time. Huge thanks to JL and Sherv for making it happen and giving us an insight into arguably the most refined and drop dead gorgeous production facility I've seen. It makes ATC's Gloucestershire plant I visted in '05 look like the boy scouts!
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post #109 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssabripo View Post

Also, thanks to all you guys for showing up and having a good time...you fellas are not 1/2 as bad as you seem online heheheheh.

That's the reason Carl gave for not hanging out here. He said that the anonymity makes people behave like animals online. And he's rightpresent company excluded of course. Anyway, thank you again for organizing a wonderful field trip.

Manville, if you see this, thank you and the rest of the JL Audio team for having us. I was going to post my impressions earlier because there are a few interesting details that are probably worth talking about. Before we do that, have we seen anything that we are not allowed to discuss online?
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post #110 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 04:41 PM
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Wow, I'm amazed that the gotham is solid fiberglass!
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post #111 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 04:46 PM
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Yep, I thought it was MDF at first glance because of the layers. That cutout had to weigh 5-10lbs? The gloss finish on the cabinet was stellar too.

Can we talk at all about the stuff we saw in the room with the drum kit?

Perhaps we could get the thread title changed so folks would know we have had the tour?

Oh, did you notice the left sleeve on the shirts? Cool!

I have sound equipment.
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post #112 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 05:03 PM
 
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Thanks to everyone for this GREAT thread and also for the pics on the Audio Junkies web site.

This was nothing short of awesome ...
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post #113 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yuriv View Post

That's the reason Carl gave for not hanging out here. He said that the anonymity makes people behave like animals online. And he's rightpresent company excluded of course. Anyway, thank you again for organizing a wonderful field trip.

Manville, if you see this, thank you and the rest of the JL Audio team for having us. I was going to post my impressions earlier because there are a few interesting details that are probably worth talking about. Before we do that, have we seen anything that we are not allowed to discuss online?

You're very welcome, yuriv... it was great meeting you guys and showing you around. Feel free to discuss anything... we didn't show you any of the secret stuff.
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post #114 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

I think my favorite shot(s) were where you can see the actual F113 driver next to a real person. Artist drawings just don't do it justice. That's one big mother.

Tell me about it,I did peek in my f113 ...the woofer is a monster among monsters. No wonder it weighs close to 70lbs...a 13.5" !!

The Gotham looks to have the stoutest cabinet of all besides the Krell MRS.A true work of art. Impressive

If I repeat myself I am sorry...droolong is allowed...I hope

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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post #115 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 06:05 PM
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Manville:
Thank you very much for the detailed and fascinating tour of your manufacturing facility. I was quite amazed at the organization and the quality control processes that are in place and enforced. A first class operation you have going there! I very much appreciate you and the staff opening the doors up to us for the day.

And sherv...... I have to admit, you did a great job organizing and pulling this tour off. Thank you, my friend.

Chuck

PS - Manville, Carl gave me his email adress, does this mean I can put him on my joke list now?
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post #116 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chasw98 View Post

Manville:
Thank you very much for the detailed and fascinating tour of your manufacturing facility. I was quite amazed at the organization and the quality control processes that are in place and enforced. A first class operation you have going there! I very much appreciate you and the staff opening the doors up to us for the day.

And sherv...... I have to admit, you did a great job organizing and pulling this tour off. Thank you, my friend.

Chuck

PS - Manville, Carl gave me his email adress, does this mean I can put him on my joke list now?

Yeah, I didn't get to make it but those pictures show me that JL is serious about a rigid enclosure! Hopefully I can make it to the next AVS field trip. So can anyone give any opinions on the sound quality of the Gotham and Fathom subs that went on the trip. Especially from Sherv and you who both have some great subs.

It still kills me that my final exam was that same day as the trip... and my class was about 10 minutes away in Pembroke Pines....

PS:Chuck, check your pm
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post #117 of 220 Old 04-22-2007, 09:03 PM
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OK, did anyone take a pic of that weird hexagonal sub thingie? Manville cranked that thing up and it was just ridiculous. It was almost painful how loud it was. I can imagine going to one of the clubs on SoBe and having this thing out on the dance floor

The F series cabinet was pretty darn sturdy looking with ample bracing and wall thickness. It's really surprising how little interior volume the F113 has once the amp is in place and the driver mounted, that sucker is HUGE.

I have sound equipment.
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post #118 of 220 Old 04-23-2007, 05:16 AM
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If you guys know anything about fiberglass you know that the gotham is retardedly(new word ) thick.

Fiberglass gets its strength from curves. The only flat surfaces are the baffle and the amp mount.

Take a look at the baffle cutout a few posts above. An enclosure only as thick as the Gel coat(black) would be more then adequate.

The problem is that they needed mass to keep the box inert.

I asked Manville, "Why not mount the drivers opposing each other to cancel any vibrations?"

His response, "It wouldn't look as cool."

I understand they're going for that "wow" factor, but doing so increased the price of the sub by at least a thousand dollars. That driver cutout alone has about $50(retail) of fiberglass in it.

Also, the internal bracing does absolutely nothing. Like I said, it's all in the curves. With fiberglass you brace the flat spots, bot the curves!

-brien
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post #119 of 220 Old 04-23-2007, 05:56 AM
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poorman...

My response about "not looking as cool" was partially in jest. There are a couple of other reasons behind the configuration as well... although looks were a big factor.

We've probably built more fiberglass subwoofer enclosures than anyone on earth, and we've learned a few things along the way. To effectively damp cabinet vibration, the ribs are quite necessary. The curve by itself imparts rigidity only on one axis. The large curved wall rings if you don't do bracing (trust me, we tried it.)

Icehawk...

That big subwoofer is actually an octagon with eight 15-inch drivers. It was a fun experiment which might bear fruit for future pro audio products.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.
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post #120 of 220 Old 04-23-2007, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok, still waiting on Ozzy for the pictures, as he is a bit tied up apparently, but as soon as those are done, I will post more pics for sure...for now, I'll borrow some of Luke's stuff.


First, thanks to those who showed up, and more importantly, thanks to Carl, Amy, Manville, and gang, for such 1st class tour in a 1st operation! Those of you considering commercial offerings, you will be hard pressed to find a better quality subwoofer on the market, period! Also, I would like to ask Manville to please send our regards to Lucho and Andy and the rest of senior management for finding some time to spend with a few online enthusiasts...shows how down to earth the company leaders are, and it all trickles downward!! great personnel, world class operation, and class leading products.


The tour started on the right foot, when we noticed that Chuck and I arrived at the facility and as we looked for parking, they had roped off a section right in front of the office for us:

Talk about VIP! Once inside, Amy greeted us and took us to the lunch room/kitchen area, where there were bagels and drinks and fruits there for us. As folks started to arrive, Manville and Carl talked to us and gave us some preliminary information of the company, the tour and logistics, and general Q&A.

we introduced each member and their background, and from there we went on the tour....you can read the details of the tour on Luke's site, as he did a marvelous job keeping it short and to the point:
http://www.audiojunkies.com/
You can read through all the details there, so I wont bore you with that.

I will just comment on a couple of things that surprised me:

* As mentioned before, the gotham's are made entirely of fiberglass, and it is an engineering marvel how JL was able to adjust the process of molding with Fiberglass to accomodate for such a huge enclosure with all it's challenges!!

Additionally, each single enclosure is paint treated, buffed, and sanded, and finished, BY HAND! that's right folks, By hand!!

As you saw on the audiojunkies website, they buff and wax it to a beautiful piano-gloss like finish by hand!!! This is "ferrari" like territory my friends.

Case in point, when they are cutting out the holes for it with the CNC mill, a special router bit was used to be able to cut through such a thick fiberglass, and even then, after each enclosure a new bit had to be used.......cost of each bit: $289 !!! Just one of the many things that go into the gotham.

And yes, for those wondering, the rumors have been confirmed by JL themselves: a Gotham DOES have better performance than two single Fathoms.

* As expected, the bread and butter of the company is still car audio, and they move a TON of product: in the magnitude of 1600 sheets of MDF per month:

Very efficient, excellent build quality, outstanding drivers, and competitive prices, and you can see why JL is still the class of the car audio driver market, eventhough there are a million competitors out there............this has only translated into the home audio world, which is a great thing for us consumers.

* The fathom is truly a huge performer in a tiny package. Having seen the insides of the velo DD18, Paradigm Servo 15 v2, and others, as well as a gazillion different DIY parts (drivers, amps, etc), the parts of these fathoms are no slouches:

There is almost no volume left on those enclosures once driver and amp are put in place, and thus, as physics laws come in effect, you need LOTS of power to drive them.......and this is why you have such hefty torroidal amps on them. Superb looking.

*If anyone has not mentioned it yet, the biggest thing I got from the facility tour was their Quality Control!! 100% QC on parts and finished enclosures. Massive amounts of temperature, noise, environment, and driver limit testing! Kippel machines to get detailed driver performance, solidworks modeling to see how different materials and shapes affect the cone surrounds, motor gaps and their effects of cooling, etc, etc, etc.........this ain't your flea market slap-em-together shop.


* For us DIYers, it was great to see lots of scanspeak, Seas Excel, and many other drivers out there which Carl and Company were using to test different driver layouts and what not.

THE ABSOLUTE BIGGEST thing I personally got out of the tour is that they are in for war!! Their venture into speakers is gonna come out with a huge bang! The clarity, soundstaging, and imaging that the satellites showed during the theater room demo was flawless. As nice as it was to hear 7 fathoms (6 f112s and 1 f113 in the back), the real killer were the front LCRs.....Can't wait to hear the final product.




I will post more insights once the rest of the pics are out, but for now, I want to once again give a HUGE thanks to JL audio and gang, for providing us with a 1st class tour! We are hoping that these will become an anual thing with participation from members from ALL over the country hopefully, and see it grow from there.

Kindest regards,

-Shervin

ps- thanks again for the kind words guys...hope you all enjoyed it as much as I did.
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