Official Outlaw Owners thread - Page 189 - AVS Forum
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post #5641 of 7214 Old 03-11-2012, 03:54 PM
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Well, I had a three paragraph reply written, thought I could finally be of some use here, hit 'Send' and it told me I wasn't logged on, so that info is gone.

So now the short version, I put MBM-12 in front close to tiny Mains per Pete at HSU so as not to localize it in rear of LP near seating positions. He was right, I have had to put my ear up to the small Orb Fronts and Center to reassure myself that so much thump and pound wasn't coming out of those tiny little things, followed by a puff of blue smoke.
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post #5642 of 7214 Old 03-11-2012, 04:42 PM
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So now it is posting here, I finally set the rear panel dials/knobs on both EX and MBM this morning so as to finally run an Audyssey Auto-cal that set the Subs at '0'. This so far has produced the best yet. I thought I would raise AVR Sub Channel a few Db's, but find no need to. A car crash in "Unknown" sounded and FELT like it was in the middle of our living room. Pictures are vibrating on walls in other rooms, both first and second floors. I know it sounds ridiculous, but my MBM-12 Gain is only about 1.5 and Outlaw is same, perhaps less! I can't really see the dial clearly and do not want to move anything to re-check. A note: this morning the calibration was done before ambient noise came into play, I believe this made quite a difference with Audyssey. Thanks.
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post #5643 of 7214 Old 03-12-2012, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grizimes View Post

A little more than 4000 sq ft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mannoiaj View Post

That's bigger than my entire house... and I have 8 subwoofers in my home all 12 inch or larger. I have a 700 sq ft rec room in my basement with 2 15" SUBs and a 12... You need more

Maybe he meant 4000 cubic ft?

I'd think someone with a 4000 sq ft living room wouldn't have any qualms about a couple hundred $$ for calibration or a second sub. Just a guess.

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post #5644 of 7214 Old 03-12-2012, 07:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unavol View Post


Maybe he meant 4000 cubic ft?

I'd think someone with a 4000 sq ft living room wouldn't have any qualms about a couple hundred $$ for calibration or a second sub. Just a guess.

4000 cubic feet. My bad.

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post #5645 of 7214 Old 03-12-2012, 08:00 PM
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So does Outlaw have distribution centers all over the US? Or is it just a strange coincidence that it shipped from the Portland Oregon area, about 3 hours north of me. Either way I think it's cool it's assembled (manufactured?) in Oregon. Just think i was up there last weekend. Wonder if picking it up directly is an option? Well I'm overly excited and hope it comes tomorrow being so close. Won't get my Subdude till Wednesday but I'll have time to do some before and after comparisons this way. Anything special I should do to break it in? Or will that not be a concern with it being "B" stock?
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post #5646 of 7214 Old 03-12-2012, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Durzil View Post

So does Outlaw have distribution centers all over the US? Or is it just a strange coincidence that it shipped from the Portland Oregon area, about 3 hours north of me. Either way I think it's cool it's assembled (manufactured?) in Oregon. Just think i was up there last weekend. Wonder if picking it up directly is an option? Well I'm overly excited and hope it comes tomorrow being so close. Won't get my Subdude till Wednesday but I'll have time to do some before and after comparisons this way. Anything special I should do to break it in? Or will that not be a concern with it being "B" stock?

Probably. Mine came from neveda I think

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5647 of 7214 Old 03-13-2012, 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Durzil View Post

So does Outlaw have distribution centers all over the US? Or is it just a strange coincidence that it shipped from the Portland Oregon area, about 3 hours north of me. Either way I think it's cool it's assembled (manufactured?) in Oregon. Just think i was up there last weekend. Wonder if picking it up directly is an option? Well I'm overly excited and hope it comes tomorrow being so close. Won't get my Subdude till Wednesday but I'll have time to do some before and after comparisons this way. Anything special I should do to break it in? Or will that not be a concern with it being "B" stock?

Mine also came from there. As far as break in I am not sure. I plugged mine in and played. There is nothing in the manual about break in either.

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post #5648 of 7214 Old 03-13-2012, 05:59 PM
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Well it's here! Wife is out of town so I have the perfect chance to set it up fully before she's back. Unfortunately she has the camera with her so the pics are not the best. I'm glad i went with the Plus as the EX wouldn't have fit nearly as well. The wife will like it more this way.





A little new sub / old sub size comparison. The LFM -1 Plus feels twice the size of the Polk and definitely weighs double. I have a hard time believing this sub has been demo'd at all. If it was their wife made them send it back without opening it. The sub is flawless and the power cord hadn't even been removed from the sealed plastic bag.

I left the sub how it came in ME mode. Gain at 2.5, xover disabled at 180 etc and ran YPAO. Got -3 on the first go. Manually bumped it up (+3) to 0. And streamed some music I'm familiar with for a test run. I feel like the sub needs to be bumped higher yet to match my tastes but am concerned about possibly hurting something. We never listen even close to reference volume. Our movie range is -25 to -28 on the A3000. Music is at most -20 (normally -30 to -35 with kids around) and TV and movies for the kids are -35 to -40. I like how it sounded +6 db's for music and being one who likes lots of bass I'm sure movies will be the same thing. Is there any concern with running the sub at these volumes 6 db's hot?

Do you guys have the subs clear up against the wall or a few inches off? I thought you wanted to have it 3 inches at a min? But this might of been cause of a port. Thanks for the help guys I'm already impressed with this thing and it's not fully dialed in.

Edit: I also think I'll get more usable output and less energy being absorbed by my floor once my subdude gets here. You can feel the floor vibrating significantly currently.
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post #5649 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Durzil View Post

Well it's here! Wife is out of town so I have the perfect chance to set it up fully before she's back. Unfortunately she has the camera with her so the pics are not the best. I'm glad i went with the Plus as the EX wouldn't have fit nearly as well. The wife will like it more this way.





A little new sub / old sub size comparison. The LFM -1 Plus feels twice the size of the Polk and definitely weighs double. I have a hard time believing this sub has been demo'd at all. If it was their wife made them send it back without opening it. The sub is flawless and the power cord hadn't even been removed from the sealed plastic bag.

I left the sub how it came in ME mode. Gain at 2.5, xover disabled at 180 etc and ran YPAO. Got -3 on the first go. Manually bumped it up (+3) to 0. And streamed some music I'm familiar with for a test run. I feel like the sub needs to be bumped higher yet to match my tastes but am concerned about possibly hurting something. We never listen even close to reference volume. Our movie range is -25 to -28 on the A3000. Music is at most -20 (normally -30 to -35 with kids around) and TV and movies for the kids are -35 to -40. I like how it sounded +6 db's for music and being one who likes lots of bass I'm sure movies will be the same thing. Is there any concern with running the sub at these volumes 6 db's hot?

Do you guys have the subs clear up against the wall or a few inches off? I thought you wanted to have it 3 inches at a min? But this might of been cause of a port. Thanks for the help guys I'm already impressed with this thing and it's not fully dialed in.

Edit: I also think I'll get more usable output and less energy being absorbed by my floor once my subdude gets here. You can feel the floor vibrating significantly currently.

You shouldn't hurt anything running your sub 6db hot when listening at that low of levels. You will know if something bad is happening, cuz you will hear it.

I have dual pluses, 1 up front with 6" of space behind the sub to the wall and 12" from the side to the wall and 6" from side to Front Right speaker and open to the front, 1 as an end table with 3" of space behind it, 1" from front to one couch, and 1" from side to another couch and 1" from side to pack-n-play. The one up front with more room to breathe sounds much better. Give your sub as much room as you can to breath.

Shawn
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post #5650 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 09:00 AM
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I have my gain at 5 and my avr at +7.5 when listening to music. I am running wireless with a RS wireless transmitter so I'm sure I lose some signal there. I just listened for any signs of stress to the driver. I too like lots of bass as you can see. I have a very large room to fill also.

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post #5651 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 12:35 PM
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I have my gain between 5 and 6, my receiver is set at +2 and listen to music pretty loud. I was worried about harming the thing too until I spoke to Scott from Outlaw. He assured me that gain level is good and it won't become an issue until you hit about 7.

I also just got a y splitter and hooked up my older Onkyo HTiB sub and I am definitely happy with the outcome. Music has never sounded so good.

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post #5652 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 01:49 PM
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My gain is at like 3 lol you crazy bassheads

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5653 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 06:18 PM
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I guess I am an oddball, I matched my sub's output level to the speakers as close as I could and it works beautifully for music and movies.
Each to their own though, if bass x10 makes you happy go for it.

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post #5654 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 08:34 PM
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Also getting a sub positioned is part of that. My gains around 3 and delivers the low-down, but sub was carefully placed in a spot that performs. This, after having made sure I got the model that Outlaw recommended for my cubic footage.
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post #5655 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 08:36 PM
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I do run my subs 2db hot. Might reconsider putting the ex's in front of the room

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5656 of 7214 Old 03-14-2012, 09:36 PM
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I'm use to the bass output I have in my truck with a 12" Alpine type R directly behind my seat and 350+ watts RMS going to it. So I do like lots of bass. And I have realistic expectations of my LFM-1+ not being able to pressurize my space. The Outlaw goes much deeper and is far tighter with more detail and doesn't just go boom boom boom like car speakers tend to. So it is a different sound that I will need to adjust some to but am really liking it. With that said I'm really looking forward to getting it fully setup once my subdude finally gets here. (It's 2 days late, but the credit I just received sure made for a sweet price) Some guys like myself just like there bass hot. My only concern was possibly damaging my equipment but I'm no longer concerned as I'm not that hot and during Transformers 3 last night I didn't have any issues. When I rerun YPAO I going to move the gain up to 3 to be able to add less in the AVR. Does YPAO lower the LFE channel like Audessey has been known too?

I know on the EX MO mode was recommended is that true for the plus as well?
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post #5657 of 7214 Old 03-15-2012, 06:19 AM
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I highly recommend only changing the lfe trim in the avr after you run audy or other room correction software

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5658 of 7214 Old 03-15-2012, 06:40 AM
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If your room is really big then MO mode is what you will want to use. My room is huge and I had no choice but to use MO mode. I tried ME mode just to see the comparison and it just wasnt loud enough for my room.

MY THEATER......The Thompson Theater 11.9 channels

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post #5659 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 11:37 AM
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Need a little help here gents, Xmen first class scene where magneto moves the comms array my sub makes 2 not to loud thumps. Definitely they arent as loud as the ones I heard from Immortals (definitely bottomed out). I can;t tell if the sub is bottoming out on this scene. Running ME but probably will have to switch to Max Output since I only get port chuffing with it instead of thumps

I don't get the thumps from 5 stars like cloverfield,tron, or fotp

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Need a little help here gents, Xmen first class scene where magneto moves the comms array my sub makes 2 not to loud thumps. Definitely they arent as loud as the ones I heard from Immortals (definitely bottomed out). I can;t tell if the sub is bottoming out on this scene. Running ME but probably will have to switch to Max Output since I only get port chuffing with it instead of thumps

I don't get the thumps from 5 stars like cloverfield,tron, or fotp

Pokekevin your PM box is full.
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post #5661 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Durzil View Post


Pokekevin your PM box is full.

One sec

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5662 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 03:34 PM
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Ok good

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5663 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Durzil View Post

I'm use to the bass output I have in my truck with a 12" Alpine type R directly behind my seat and 350+ watts RMS going to it. So I do like lots of bass. And I have realistic expectations of my LFM-1+ not being able to pressurize my space. The Outlaw goes much deeper and is far tighter with more detail and doesn't just go boom boom boom like car speakers tend to. So it is a different sound that I will need to adjust some to but am really liking it. With that said I'm really looking forward to getting it fully setup once my subdude finally gets here. (It's 2 days late, but the credit I just received sure made for a sweet price) Some guys like myself just like there bass hot. My only concern was possibly damaging my equipment but I'm no longer concerned as I'm not that hot and during Transformers 3 last night I didn't have any issues. When I rerun YPAO I going to move the gain up to 3 to be able to add less in the AVR. Does YPAO lower the LFE channel like Audessey has been known too?

I know on the EX MO mode was recommended is that true for the plus as well?

YPAO is completely unreliable when it comes to subwoofers. You'll need to use an SPL meter and Yamaha's built in PEQ (if your model has it) to get your lfe where you want it.
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post #5664 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 08:18 PM
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YPAO is completely unreliable when it comes to subwoofers. You'll need to use an SPL meter and Yamaha's built in PEQ (if your model has it) to get your lfe where you want it.

Even the newest versions? The only thing it did (4+ times now) is drop it -1 db at 62.5hz with a Q of 0.5 which I reset back to flat. I do agree I need to get a SPL meter but it won't be happening anytime soon after this purchase. I have the Yamaha A3000 if it matters.
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post #5665 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Need a little help here gents, Xmen first class scene where magneto moves the comms array my sub makes 2 not to loud thumps. Definitely they arent as loud as the ones I heard from Immortals (definitely bottomed out). I can;t tell if the sub is bottoming out on this scene. Running ME but probably will have to switch to Max Output since I only get port chuffing with it instead of thumps

I don't get the thumps from 5 stars like cloverfield,tron, or fotp

Hi pokekevin, aren't your running dual subs but with two different subs? Did you level match or gain match the subs? If you level match, try gain matching them instead, especially if the subs are different.
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post #5666 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
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Hi pokekevin, aren't your running dual subs but with two different subs? Did you level match or gain match the subs? If you level match, try gain matching them instead, especially if the subs are different.

3 subs . 2 ex's and a pdr 10 as a mbm. Gonna try to gain match it later tonight. The sub that's bottoming is the ex that's in the more open part of the room(opens to the dining area so in a way its in the middle of a room that's wayyyy bigger than I think it can handle.

If I remember correctly to gain match you would place the subs in the same spot (taking turns that is) and set them both to 75dB using the AVR's test tones right? Only issue I think is i have my surrounds XOed at 110hz

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5667 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 09:43 PM
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Anyone ever go from a VTF-1 MK2 to a LFM-1 EX? Thinking of doing this upgrade since the VTF-1 isn't cutting it in this room, lots of port farting with Avatar. Room is around 3700 cu ft.
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post #5668 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

If I remember correctly to gain match you would place the subs in the same spot (taking turns that is) and set them both to 75dB using the AVR's test tones right?

Correct, move each sub to the middle of the room with the mic placed very close to the driver (keeping the mic at same location and measure each sub with same distance from driver).
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post #5669 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 10:05 PM
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Correct, move each sub to the middle of the room with the mic placed very close to the driver (keeping the mic at same location and measure each sub with same distance from driver).

How close isclose. Having a hard time moving the ex by myself lol

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #5670 of 7214 Old 03-16-2012, 10:16 PM
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How close isclose. Having a hard time moving the ex by myself lol

3", use a blanket to slide the sub to the middle of the room.
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