Official Outlaw Owners thread - Page 37 - AVS Forum
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Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers > Official Outlaw Owners thread
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 08:10 PM 10-09-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by PannyMann View Post

Mid 70's here in NJ tomorrow and on through Monday. My back is getting sore already.

Hit'em straight, PannyMann, the EX can wait...

videoaddikt's Avatar videoaddikt 09:01 PM 10-09-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

Wow! The 8033 got there before the EX. Now that's fast shipping from Finland.

I ordered the AM only 1 day earlier, so effectively they both shipped in the same time span. That was amazing!
No doubt the additional cost for expediting the shipment is included in the price. I sure can't complain.
videoaddikt's Avatar videoaddikt 09:54 AM 10-10-2008
I am all setup on the Auralex Gramma..this sub is amazing!
One small detail I am miffed about, the RCA input connector. The opening for the outer shell of the male connector is very restrictive.
In fact, with Outlaw's own locking cables, you need to totally remove the locking shell for the connector to fully seat. Other brands are not perfect either. Seems I'm the only one noticing this.
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 11:12 AM 10-10-2008
Hi videoaddikt,

Man, you're set with a Gramma, AM8033 & the EX...

As far as the RCA input is concerned, I haven't noticed a problem with the sub cables I purchased from monoprice.com. I'll go and double check my EX to make sure that the connector is fully seated.

Larry
videoaddikt's Avatar videoaddikt 11:41 AM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

Hi videoaddikt,

Man, you're set with a Gramma, AM8033 & the EX...

As far as the RCA input is concerned, I haven't noticed a problem with the sub cables I purchased from monoprice.com. I'll go and double check my EX to make sure that the connector is fully seated.

Larry

It's a quibble, Larry. I'm sure many cables would fit just fine. But something I would have thought OA would have checked out with their own connectors.
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 12:05 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by videoaddikt View Post

But something I would have thought OA would have checked out with their own connectors.

No doubt!
weverb's Avatar weverb 01:53 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by videoaddikt View Post

I am all setup on the Auralex Gramma..this sub is amazing!
One small detail I am miffed about, the RCA input connector. The opening for the outer shell of the male connector is very restrictive.
In fact, with Outlaw's own locking cables, you need to totally remove the locking shell for the connector to fully seat. Other brands are not perfect either. Seems I'm the only one noticing this.

You are not officially set-up unit we see pictures!
videoaddikt's Avatar videoaddikt 03:31 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

You are not officially set-up unit we see pictures!

That will be coming soon..I have a relatively modest sized room.. more like medium as it is opened up mostly on one side wall.
I can see how this sub could be over-powering for an truly small room.
On the scale of 10 for the input level on the sub, I have it set to '3'.
If I set it up to 4 or 5, the receiver output level will start to bottom out at -10db, I can not lower it more.
With the sub at 3 I can used -5 on my receiver comfortable to meet the 75 db ref level. The AM helps I think..evens out the response... have yet to do an REM for eval.
Ran King Kong (HD-DVD DTS 5.1) and the bass at normal listening levels was fantastic.
Bass I could really feel.
Amazing, the Velodyne is slot-loaded with a 600 watt amp (1KW) and I had it cranked up much more for the same volume. And then there's the extension, no comparison! And I have not even done the bung/16Hz mode yet.
weverb's Avatar weverb 07:05 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by videoaddikt View Post

That will be coming soon..I have a relatively modest sized room.. more like medium as it is opened up mostly on one side wall.
I can see how this sub could be over-powering for an truly small room.
On the scale of 10 for the input level on the sub, I have it set to '3'.
If I set it up to 4 or 5, the receiver output level will start to bottom out at -10db, I can not lower it more.
With the sub at 3 I can used -5 on my receiver comfortable to meet the 75 db ref level. The AM helps I think..evens out the response... have yet to do an REM for eval.
Ran King Kong (HD-DVD DTS 5.1) and the bass at normal listening levels was fantastic.
Bass I could really feel.
Amazing, the Velodyne is slot-loaded with a 600 watt amp (1KW) and I had it cranked up much more for the same volume. And then there's the extension, no comparison! And I have not even done the bung/16Hz mode yet.

You may be able to do the max extension mode and utilize the Anti-Mode's 25-35Hz lift to boost that region. More than likely the region is going to suffer.

Have you done any listening comparisons of the Ant-Mode bypassed versus active? That should give you an idea if it is helping at all.
weverb's Avatar weverb 07:06 PM 10-10-2008
Does anyone want to see what the inside of the EX looks like? I took a few today!
Ironmike86's Avatar Ironmike86 07:15 PM 10-10-2008
why ask just pic me
ajstan99's Avatar ajstan99 07:35 PM 10-10-2008
OK guys, I resisted for a long time, but picked up a BFD after having little luck trying a quick fix with the eD EQ.2. The BFD has worked out great and sending the filter settings via MIDI was very quick. Thanks for sharing your experiences, it was the push I needed - now cut it out so I don't spend any more money. (must keep repeating...one sub is enough...one sub is enough...)

I was able to find a spot along the front wall that minimized the 50Hz dip. The only weird thing was that there was little difference in extension under 20Hz for MO vs. ME mode. Rolled off at 18Hz for both settings (wish I would have saved the ME graph), so I'm sticking with MO for now.

Here are the graphs:

Original measurement (no smoothing)
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/m...osmoothing.jpg

Corrected (no smoothing)
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/m...osmoothing.jpg
PannyMann's Avatar PannyMann 07:53 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

Hi PannyMann, odds are a BFD will be needed...more toys to play with while the golf clubs relax for the Winter.

We really are a bad influence around here.

So run the BFD AND Anti Mode back to back ? HHMMMMmmm

Sounds like an interesting cold weather pursuit to find out the optimal set up. BFD, Anti mode, BFD+Anto MOde, different ME and MO set ups, different lift modes on the Anti Mode. AND of course I'd have to run REW after each tweek to check results. THIS COULD TAKE UNTIL NEXT APRIL !!!! LOL !!
weverb's Avatar weverb 07:56 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajstan99 View Post

OK guys, I resisted for a long time, but picked up a BFD after having little luck trying a quick fix with the eD EQ.2. The BFD has worked out great and sending the filter settings via MIDI was very quick. Thanks for sharing your experiences, it was the push I needed - now cut it out so I don't spend any more money. (must keep repeating...one sub is enough...one sub is enough...)

I was able to find a spot along the front wall that minimized the 50Hz dip. The only weird thing was that there was little difference in extension under 20Hz for MO vs. ME mode. Rolled off at 18Hz for both settings (wish I would have saved the ME graph), so I'm sticking with MO for now.

How many filters did you use? I hope not too many! Two filters would be plenty.

Read the whole thread, but pay close attention to this post:

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...html#post55656


ajstan99's Avatar ajstan99 09:42 PM 10-10-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

How many filters did you use? I hope not too many! Two filters would be plenty.

Read the whole thread, but pay close attention to this post:

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...html#post55656


Thanks for the link, weverb. As you might have guessed, I used quite a few (9) filters on this one, just to see how close I could hug the line. Next step will be to try various house curves along with minimal filters. It's great to have 10 presets to store and compare.

EDIT: Couldn't wait to try it out. Thanks again. Looks like I was able to get relatively close with just two filters (on screen at least) and got it loaded to a preset. When I get a chance to measure, I'll post a follow-up graph.
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 06:38 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by PannyMann View Post

So run the BFD AND Anti Mode back to back ? HHMMMMmmm

oops, forgot you have an AM8033. I think what I wanted to say was to use the REW software and see what the AM8033 is doing in your room.
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 08:49 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

Does anyone want to see what the inside of the EX looks like? I took a few today!

Count me in....
PannyMann's Avatar PannyMann 10:08 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

oops, forgot you have an AM8033. I think what I wanted to say was to use the REW software and see what the AM8033 is doing in your room.

Yep. It's going to be an interesting winter doing my gadget tweeking.
weverb's Avatar weverb 10:17 AM 10-11-2008
Well, since a few of you seem interested....
LL
LL
LL
weverb's Avatar weverb 10:23 AM 10-11-2008
Here is a new option instead of the BFD, SMS-1, or Anti-Mode....

It is a Sabine GRQ-3102S graphic/parametric equalizer (plus more) that you control by computer. There are no flashing lights or anything distracting. You still use REW to help develop your filters and then you just plug them in. I will be doing a full write up on Home Theater Shack once I get to plug it into my set-up. So far I have updated its firmware and been able to do programing no problem. I have attached a picture of the program screen.
LL
LL
LL
videoaddikt's Avatar videoaddikt 10:58 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

You may be able to do the max extension mode and utilize the Anti-Mode's 25-35Hz lift to boost that region. More than likely the region is going to suffer.

Have you done any listening comparisons of the Ant-Mode bypassed versus active? That should give you an idea if it is helping at all.


That region does not seem to suffer in the extension mode..of course, as needed, the lift no doubt will add more. I need to run some test signals to get more consistency in what I perceive I hear, as well as average SPL readings with different modes.
Naturally, an REM is the best way, but would like to validate what I am hearing for now.
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 10:58 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

Well, since a few of you seem interested....

Thanks for the peak under the hood weverb!

Are you having problems with your EX? I have to admit I have wanted to look inside as well...
weverb's Avatar weverb 11:02 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

Thanks for the peak under the hood weverb!

Are you having problems with your EX? I have to admit I have wanted to look inside as well...

Had a rattle to take care of. Talking with Scott, we figured out it was the wire connecting the amp to the driver was hitting one of the ports during very low (<25Hz) notes at high volumes.
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 11:04 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by weverb View Post

Here is a new option instead of the BFD, SMS-1, or Anti-Mode....

Gentlemen. weverb is now going by the name: "EQ R US"

BTW, this really looks interesting...
weverb's Avatar weverb 11:12 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

Gentlemen. weverb is now going by the name: "EQ R US"

ROLF!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now that's funny!
weverb's Avatar weverb 11:14 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

BTW, this really looks interesting...

Here is where I will be updating with more info.......

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...e-sms-1-a.html


laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 11:40 AM 10-11-2008
ajstan99 & weverb have a good dialog going and I'm going to toss some graphs and comments as well...

When I first put the BFD in the chain, I was going to use all 12 filters on both channels. I was going to light up the BFD like a Christmas Tree.

After reading the same article that weverb just posted on EQ, I went the other way searching for the "Two Filter" holy grail of EQ. Back and forth for months on end searching for the sound I want.

Right now, I'm interested in sonic punch during movies like Iron Man, Cloverfield, Master & Commander and WOTW. I want people to jump and in the case of my wife, let fly a yell like she does on a roller coaster

Here are my recent graphs and I have 9 filters set in the BFD between 20Hz - 80Hz and this sounds amazing with the above movies. Audyssey seems to hurt more than it helps in my room and is set to OFF. The 4 subs produce 85dB combined and I have a "Hard Knee" house curve set in REW.
LL
LL
weverb's Avatar weverb 11:46 AM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

ajstan99 & weverb have a good dialog going and I'm going to toss some graphs and comments as well...

When I first put the BFD in the chain, I was going to use all 12 filters on both channels. I was going to light up the BFD like a Christmas Tree.

After reading the same article that weverb just posted on EQ, I went the other way searching for the "Two Filter" holy grail of EQ. Back and forth for months on end searching for the sound I want.

Right now, I'm interested in sonic punch during movies like Iron Man, Cloverfield, Master & Commander and WOTW. I want people to jump and in the case of my wife, let fly a yell like she does on a roller coaster

Here are my recent graphs and I have 9 filters set in the BFD between 20Hz - 80Hz and this sounds amazing with the above movies. Audyssey seems to hurt more than it helps in my room and is set to OFF. The 4 subs produce 85dB combined and I have a "Hard Knee" house curve set in REW.

Mr. Outlaw (Larry)....

9 filters! Care to share their settings? Do you also have a graph of everything together?

Looking at that incredible boost you have after 20Hz., at high pass filter at 20Hz would help level that off, but will kill that 10Hz response. Are you actually getting down to 10Hz.?
laugsbach's Avatar laugsbach 12:13 PM 10-11-2008
I am not sure on 10Hz...I really don't think so. I think the sound card is inaccurate at 10Hz.

This room really vibrates starting at 20Hz. I think that is what giving me that hugh boost at 16Hz. I'll post my filters later today. My parents are celebrating their 59th wedding anniversary today!
weverb's Avatar weverb 12:16 PM 10-11-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

My parents are celebrating their 59th wedding anniversary today!

Major cudos to them!
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