Official Epik Subwoofer Thread - Page 122 - AVS Forum
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post #3631 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by SRR View Post

You do not need 2 1/2 feet of bass trapping for 100Hz, most 4 inch traps will absorb to 100Hz if straddling a corner. GIK's tri traps are not that thick and I think they go to 80Hz or lower?

"...The Tri-Trap has been effectively designed to absorb more low end, but also does an excellent job of absorbing the high end, creating smooth sound absorption from 50 Hz to 5000 Hz. Installing our Tri-Traps will result in a beautifully balanced room that will suit even the most critical listener."

John
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post #3632 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by John H View Post

"...The Tri-Trap has been effectively designed to absorb more low end, but also does an excellent job of absorbing the high end, creating smooth sound absorption from 50 Hz to 5000 Hz. Installing our Tri-Traps will result in a beautifully balanced room that will suit even the most critical listener."

John

i made my own traps 4" for corners, 2" first reflections.
the difference it made was night and day
with my twin towers in 2400 cu ft room i dont think i could handle much more
sounds beautiful, clean, with power to spare
do i have modes?
we all do, but i couldnt ask for more, or be happier
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post #3633 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warlord260 View Post

i made my own traps 4" for corners, 2" first reflections.
the difference it made was night and day
with my twin towers in 2400 cu ft room i dont think i could handle much more
sounds beautiful, clean, with power to spare
do i have modes?
we all do, but i couldnt ask for more, or be happier

What did you make your traps out of? OC705 or some other material. It seems OC705 is hard to come by.

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post #3634 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by stepyourgameup View Post

What did you make your traps out of? OC705 or some other material. It seems OC705 is hard to come by.

i used oc703. i wrapped in black speaker cloth. made wood frames, stained and varnished them, then push the covered 703 in
they look beautiful.
besides changing the sound for the better, they really took the look of my room to a new level
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post #3635 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 10:50 AM
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Got my castle in my house today. This is a very large box! Here is a quick pic of it beside my Paradigm Studio 60. The output that it is capable of is scary to say the least.
LL
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post #3636 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by N.REED View Post

Got my castle in my house today. This is a very large box! Here is a quick pic of it beside my Paradigm Studio 60. The output that it is capable of is scary to say the least.

That is a thing of beauty! I might have to give Epik a try sometime. BTW, what happened to your Paradigm's grill?
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post #3637 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 11:12 AM
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Must be a spot on the camera lens or something as I cant see that spot with my naked eye.
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post #3638 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by N.REED View Post

Got my castle in my house today. This is a very large box! Here is a quick pic of it beside my Paradigm Studio 60. The output that it is capable of is scary to say the least.

time to play!!
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post #3639 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 12:14 PM
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time to play!!

Master and Commander has been a real eye opener.
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post #3640 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by N.REED View Post

Must be a spot on the camera lens or something as I cant see that spot with my naked eye.

Whew, that's good to hear. It looked like there was a big stain on the grill. Anyway, that Castle looks sweet!
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post #3641 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by stepyourgameup View Post

Wanting a house curve or a completely flat response is a personal preference but for those that want a house curve a BFD is a must.

That's right, it is a preference. So why are you telling someone else what they want?
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post #3642 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by xcjago View Post

That's right, it is a preference. So why are you telling someone else what they want?

because 9.9 out of 10 will want a house curve. A totally flat sub sounds bad, but we don't need to get into an argument. You can recommend a flat curve and I can recommend a house curve.

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post #3643 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by stepyourgameup View Post

because 9.9 out of 10 will want a house curve. A totally flat sub sounds bad,

Huh ??? The rest of your post was fine. It is a preference, but it's more like 50/50 on the flat vs curve. Music first guys are more likely to prefer flat.

I don't lurk as much as I used to and I NEVER listen. Comes from being old and cynical.

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post #3644 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warlord260 View Post

i made my own traps 4" for corners, 2" first reflections.
the difference it made was night and day
with my twin towers in 2400 cu ft room i dont think i could handle much more
sounds beautiful, clean, with power to spare
do i have modes?
we all do, but i couldnt ask for more, or be happier

Do you have any pictures, how to's, or places where you bought your items? I'd be curious on how to do some sound treatments on my own rather than buying.
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post #3645 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 04:45 PM
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Well I have done some listening for a few hours and figured I would share my thoughts on this sub and my overall experience with Epik in general, but first I will tell how I've arrived here.

A couple of months ago I decided to upgrade my Paradigm PW2200 to something that had the ability to play a little lower and a little louder. I looked around locally because I have good friend who owns a Home theater shop where I can get a really good deal (me paying 60% of retail cost) . They carry Paradigm, Deftech, and Klipsch. Really, only the Servo 15 interested me, but even with a great discount it was still alot of money. Another option was to add another PW, but I have had 2 of them before, and while they are pretty potent stacked, they are usually finished in my room around 27hz, so that was out.

That brought me to ID companies. To be honest I originally went with another company before Epik because I was unsure of such a new company. I ordered from a company that some of my friends had had a good experience with. That sub was ordered on or around the 24th of June and I was given a 2 to 3 week delivery timeframe. That did not happen, and to make a long story short I waited about 5 weeks or so before requesting a refund. A couple of days later I had my money back.

That brought me to Epik, so I called up and spoke with Chad. He is a great guy to talk to on the phone, very informative and never trying to hurry the conversation along. After hearing my options I ordered a Knight, but a few days later called and changed my order to a Castle instead figuring a little extra headroom would be worth it. The time until delivery was given as two to three weeks again. The actual delivery time was 3 weeks exactly. Not bad! Shipping was quoted at around 140 I believe, but i was able to schedule a pickup with UPS through my work (we get a good negotiated rate with UPS) for 35 bucks. Again, the crew at Epik was wonderful enough to allow this, even though it had to cause them a headache.

So that brings me to today. I received the sub this morning and brought it home on lunch. I was by myself but determined to get it in the house and positioned. After getting it in place I reran the auto EQ on my H&K receiver and checked the levels with my Radio Shack analog meter and was ready for some listening, but first I ran a few test tones to see what type of extension I was getting. With the Castle in my front right corner I have usable output to around 16-17hz. From about 19hz up it's unbelievably potent. I mean really, really potent, but i'm gettin ahead of myself.

After that I decide to go strait for some movie footage and I start with Master and Commander and then try some Jurassic Park III, finishing up with Titan A.E. The cannons in M&C are powerful but realistic. I have heard this scene demoed may times on subs varying from a single AV123 rocket 10 UFW, an infinite baffle at my brothers house, a servo 15 in a 10 by 10 room (don't ask) , an SVS 20/29pc, 2 Pw2200s (previously mentioned) ,and even the JL audio demonstration at Cedia a few years ago that featured 2 g213s and 2 f113s and I have never heard it reproduced any better or with any more realism. I'm still shaking my head in disbelief.

Next I put on some tunes to see how the Castle handled music. I usually run my sub a few db hot but not with this one. Everything music wise I threw at it was reproduced with a tight tuneful sound that i had always heard with sealed subs, but with more power.

Overall I'm so far thrilled with the Product and service from Epik!

Also I would like to note that had I not cancelled my previous order with the other company I would still not have received my sub yet!
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post #3646 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 07:55 PM
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Thanks for sharing your story. I also talked to Chad before purchasing the Valor. Cool guy by the way, he took the time to anwser all of my questions. Chad said the Valor would be more than enough for my 2300 cu ft room and he was right. The bass is just so clean and powerful. The mid-bass ouput is truly amazing. I am a very happy epik subwoofer owner.
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post #3647 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N.REED View Post

Well I have done some listening for a few hours and figured I would share my thoughts on this sub and my overall experience with Epik in general, but first I will tell how I've arrived here.

A couple of months ago I decided to upgrade my Paradigm PW2200 to something that had the ability to play a little lower and a little louder. I looked around locally because I have good friend who owns a Home theater shop where I can get a really good deal (me paying 60% of retail cost) . They carry Paradigm, Deftech, and Klipsch. Really, only the Servo 15 interested me, but even with a great discount it was still alot of money. Another option was to add another PW, but I have had 2 of them before, and while they are pretty potent stacked, they are usually finished in my room around 27hz, so that was out.

That brought me to ID companies. To be honest I originally went with another company before Epik because I was unsure of such a new company. I ordered from a company that some of my friends had had a good experience with. That sub was ordered on or around the 24th of June and I was given a 2 to 3 week delivery timeframe. That did not happen, and to make a long story short I waited about 5 weeks or so before requesting a refund. A couple of days later I had my money back.

That brought me to Epik, so I called up and spoke with Chad. He is a great guy to talk to on the phone, very informative and never trying to hurry the conversation along. After hearing my options I ordered a Knight, but a few days later called and changed my order to a Castle instead figuring a little extra headroom would be worth it. The time until delivery was given as two to three weeks again. The actual delivery time was 3 weeks exactly. Not bad! Shipping was quoted at around 140 I believe, but i was able to schedule a pickup with UPS through my work (we get a good negotiated rate with UPS) for 35 bucks. Again, the crew at Epik was wonderful enough to allow this, even though it had to cause them a headache.

So that brings me to today. I received the sub this morning and brought it home on lunch. I was by myself but determined to get it in the house and positioned. After getting it in place I reran the auto EQ on my H&K receiver and checked the levels with my Radio Shack analog meter and was ready for some listening, but first I ran a few test tones to see what type of extension I was getting. With the Castle in my front right corner I have usable output to around 16-17hz. From about 19hz up it's unbelievably potent. I mean really, really potent, but i'm gettin ahead of myself.

After that I decide to go strait for some movie footage and I start with Master and Commander and then try some Jurassic Park III, finishing up with Titan A.E. The cannons in M&C are powerful but realistic. I have heard this scene demoed may times on subs varying from a single AV123 rocket 10 UFW, an infinite baffle at my brothers house, a servo 15 in a 10 by 10 room (don't ask) , an SVS 20/29pc, 2 Pw2200s (previously mentioned) ,and even the JL audio demonstration at Cedia a few years ago that featured 2 g113s and 2 f113s and I have never heard it reproduced any better or with any more realism. I'm still shaking my head in disbelief.

Next I put on some tunes to see how the Castle handled music. I usually run my sub a few db hot but not with this one. Everything music wise I threw at it was reproduced with a tight tuneful sound that i had always heard with sealed subs, but with more power.

Overall I'm so far thrilled with the Product and service from Epik!

Also I would like to note that had I not cancelled my previous order with the other company I would still not have received my sub yet!

Damn, how much time do you get for lunch? Nice to hear you are happy with your sub.

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post #3648 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdeye11 View Post

Do you have any pictures, how to's, or places where you bought your items? I'd be curious on how to do some sound treatments on my own rather than buying.

pm me. i could e-mail you some photos,
everything was local, kent wa.
but im sure you could get local too.
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post #3649 of 20458 Old 08-27-2008, 11:50 PM
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I just wanted to mention that I did make an error by saying that many feet of absorptive material are required to see any low end absorption results. You do not need multiple feet of thickness to absorb low frequencies, and you don't necessarily need a super thick panel to have some degree of low frequency absorption. However, it is still true that there is a physical limitation of how well a certain thickness of absorptive material can absorb low frequencies. The Auralex FAQ offers an explanation with the answer to "What is NRC?", found at the bottom of the linked page; low frequency cut-off (f) is a function of the thickness (t) versus the ¼-wavelength of the lowest frequency affected by the material. With (c) being the speed of sound in air, the function is f=c/4t. Thus a thicker panel with have a greater low frequency performance. This is a physical property, but to understand real life performance you should recognize a few things about how room treatments and sound waves work to achieve absorption of low frequencies.

In real-life application, 4" panels will be effective to some degree absorbing long wavelengths. The effectiveness varies on how the panels are used, however. First, a mounted panel will absorb a soundwave multiple times—initially when the wave first passes through, then again when it reflects off the wall and passes back out. Second, air gaps have a significant effect on low end absorption. Spacing panels out even an inch or two from the wall will increase low frequency NRC coefficients. Third, that function for low frequency cut-off works only if a soundwave is passive through directly perpendicular (at a normal incidence of 0 degress) to the panel. In reality, sound waves enter at all angles of incidence, and greater angles increase the effective depth. Auralex offers this illustration.
Fourth, keep in mind that measuring the performance of panels is done in an environment with multiple panels set up in a room. For example, GIK's test report for the measurement of the Tri-Traps (here) has a set up of eight traps placed strategically in a room of certain dimensions. The performance measured is partly dependent on placement. In all acoustic treatment environments, sound waves will bounce back and forth off walls, passing through panels multiple times and being absorbed to some degree each time, and so they really will be affected by multiple feet of absorptive material. For another reference, Auralex's test report for it's LENRD bass traps (here) has a setup of a whopping 48 units stacked along the four corners of the test room, and shows exactly how the room treatment affects the frequency response of the room.

In the end, an acoustic treatment aimed at smoothing or flattening low end response will be very expensive, probably intrusive, and likely ineffective. While a bass trap or panel will absorb below 100Hz, you'll have a hard time flattening peaks or raising valleys in the response significantly using a room treatment. By examining the Auralex report for its LENRDS, you see that even 48 of them in a room can do little for the frequency response below 125Hz. However, bass traps are a good option when you're looking to reduce room boom and gain some low end clarity. The first step in getting even bass response is finding the best location for your subwoofer. After that, proper equalization is cheap and effective. You can obtain a BFD, mic, preamp, and cabling to EQ your sub for less than the cost of a few GIK panels.

For anyone who's looking to get the best performance from their Epik sub, I recommend combing room treatments, a sub isolation platform or spikes (depending on your floor), and an EQ for a complete package.
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post #3650 of 20458 Old 08-28-2008, 02:42 AM
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i made 4 bass traps, and 4 absorbtion panels for under $300. this helped not only bass response, but upper freq. reflections.the room, the sound took on entirely new meaning to the listening experience. now the bass seems more defined, less boomy. also the mids, and the highs seem less harsh. this combined with audyessy multi eq,has taken my system to another level
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post #3651 of 20458 Old 08-28-2008, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrostyMMB View Post

low frequency cut-off (f) is a function of the thickness (t) versus the ¼-wavelength of the lowest frequency affected by the material. With (c) being the speed of sound in air, the function is f=c/4t.

For a porous absorber, this is true, as a porous material has the best performance when the material is placed at maximum wave velocity. However, a membrane absorber works better when placed at maximum wave pressure, which is near the wall. Membrane absorbers do not follow the same rules as porous absorbers.
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post #3652 of 20458 Old 08-29-2008, 03:10 PM
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Well, it's been 18 days since I've ordered. Every time a delivery truck passes by or stops at my house, I jump up and hope it is delivering the Caliber. I wish my order said something more detailed than "Processing" and "This order is in its final stages and cannot be changed at this time". Maybe I should email Epik to satisfy my curiosity? And to at least get a ballpark estimate so I don't have to hope every Fedex truck passing by stops
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post #3653 of 20458 Old 08-29-2008, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nzk View Post

Well, it's been 18 days since I've ordered. Every time a delivery truck passes by or stops at my house, I jump up and hope it is delivering the Caliber. I wish my order said something more detailed than "Processing" and "This order is in its final stages and cannot be changed at this time". Maybe I should email Epik to satisfy my curiosity? And to at least get a ballpark estimate so I don't have to hope every Fedex truck passing by stops

Once it has actually shipped it will say so in the cart, and provide you with a tracking number in there too. It hasn't shipped yet if it is sitting in the status you've described so you can stop worrying about every truck that drives by your house.

Not to mention Epik doesn't respond to emails ever. They rarely answer phone calls, but your mileage may vary. Different people report different results. Mine were mostly poor in terms of communication. The product itself is phenomenal though.
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post #3654 of 20458 Old 08-29-2008, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdeye11 View Post

Once it has actually shipped it will say so in the cart, and provide you with a tracking number in there too. It hasn't shipped yet if it is sitting in the status you've described so you can stop worrying about every truck that drives by your house.

Not to mention Epik doesn't respond to emails ever. They rarely answer phone calls, but your mileage may vary. Different people report different results. Mine were mostly poor in terms of communication. The product itself is phenomenal though.

I have probably tried their phone # 15 times in the past 2 days and NADA.

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post #3655 of 20458 Old 08-30-2008, 08:24 AM
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I know those of you that placed orders are anxious to get your subs.

However, what would you rather have Chad and his tem doing - working to build your sub so you can get it as quickly as possible or have him answering emails for a status update?

Look, Epik updates your status on site - just check there.

To Chad it must seem like the donkey from the Shrek movie - "is it done yet, is it done yet, is it none yet, ........... is it done yet, is it done yet" a broken record

Please grow up and let the man work. If your sub shipped, the status will be updated on site.

So patience. It is worth the wait. I have been in bass heaven with my Conquest since last December.

p.s. it is also tiring seeing all the chatter about delivery rather than the subs themselves. Please focus on discussing the products rather than delivery.
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post #3656 of 20458 Old 08-30-2008, 12:12 PM
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I would like to see actual customer support. He could charge abit more and hire a customer rep. It's not that hard. That's what I would like to see. Yeah patience to get the sub. How about when something goes wrong? I bet he would double his business with better support. Hire ppl make more subs make more $$ that's what good business does. JMO
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post #3657 of 20458 Old 09-01-2008, 09:12 AM
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Can anyone tell me if Epik actually makes their subs in the rosenut? I only see one picture on the front page in rosenut. I have tried to contact them, but they don't respond. I am trying to get a quote on either the Castle, or the Tower in the rosenut, and also I am in Canada so I want a quote on shipping. If you try to go through the online order page there is no where to select the rosenut?

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post #3658 of 20458 Old 09-01-2008, 09:28 AM
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anyone know how long the wait is roughly for, say, a Castle?

tried contacting Epik but no response
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post #3659 of 20458 Old 09-01-2008, 09:42 AM
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Steve Young,

I've tried to get my Tower in Rosenut, but Chad (Epik's founder and owner) say that option will not be avaiable for quite a while (asked since Janurary 08). Due to they trying to keep up with their current orders/demand on time.

Union1411, according to feedback from this thread, a Castle/Tower took 3-4 weeks. My Tower took about 4 weeks (May 21st - June 23rd).

You'll rarely hear anyone say, "I wish I'd gotten less Sub."

$ubwoofer$ and premium mango tree cultivar$

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post #3660 of 20458 Old 09-01-2008, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by union1411 View Post

anyone know how long the wait is roughly for, say, a Castle?

tried contacting Epik but no response

Did you look at the website? According to it:

"Usually Ships in 3 Weeks"

~kyle
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