Official Epik Subwoofer Thread - Page 326 - AVS Forum
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post #9751 of 20378 Old 11-08-2009, 05:44 PM
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could you guys help me out? I'm going to get Audyssey with a new processor/preamp and I have an epik Tower and an HSU MBM-12.....Look on the main subwoofer thread page and you will see my questions on how to hook these up. Thanks guys!

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post #9752 of 20378 Old 11-09-2009, 01:35 AM
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Order for 2nd Phoenix just went in. I will be crossing my fingers so that I will get it as fast as possible since Epik announced the back order so I guess typing will be tough lol. I am so excited I hope this cures my hunger for bass...... naw who am I kidding...the windows will fall out before I am cured lol.

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post #9753 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 04:53 AM
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My Sentinel is on its way! =)

Ordered 10/23. Should be here on Thursday! Suh-weet!

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post #9754 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 02:37 PM
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Well, got the Dynasty in today. Ordered 10-20 and it arived 11-10. I can definitely say it's well worh the wait. Watched WOTW with the AVR at -15 and the sub level at +5 DB. I set the Dynasty volume to 11 o'clock, that seems to be as much bass as I can handle, and it's still not pushing the sub to its limits. House shaking bass is an understatement...

This thing is huge, it makes my Klipsch RSW-15 look and sound like a toy. I'll have to get pics tomorrow.

- Another satisfied Epik customer!
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post #9755 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4dodge View Post

Watched WOTW with the AVR at -15 and the sub level at +5 DB. I set the Dynasty volume to 11 o'clock

The general consensus, to avoid clipping the signal from the AVR, is to keep the sub level from the AVR at 0 or below (say -3) and turn up the gain on the Epik sub's gain control, say up to 12 o'clock, to get back to the level you desire.

Just a suggestion.

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post #9756 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 04:58 PM
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I am looking for new sub(s) and believe it will be an Epik after reading all the reviews in here...what would you all suggest for me?

Room is large - 23 x 18 x 15 or so (almost two story family room) - this opens up to the kitchen area - I am guessing the room alone is over 6000 cubic feet

Current system is NAD separates, Von Schweikert Towers, Center, and Surrounds. Sub 1 location will be next to the right front tower, netween the speaker and a 75G fish tank (6 feet from the side wall). I do have 1 other locations wired for subs in the room as well...behind my main listening chair (very much near field)

This is the main family room, and as such 80% will be used for TV and movie watching. I tend to listen to movies at reference levels (when the 2 year old is not sleeping upstairs) When I do listen to music, I listen to all types but primarily rock

I like a lot of slam and punch. I had a Paradigm Servo 15 and it was good, but I needed more imo - I sold it awhile back and am just now getting around to looking for a replacement. I really do not want a monster sub (wife hates the look of the VS Towers as it is). I am considering one Phoenix or possibly 2 Sentinels...I have never ran 2 subs before...do you think the 2 Sent's would work better? Thanks for any advice!
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post #9757 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtsum View Post

I am looking for new sub(s) and believe it will be an Epik after reading all the reviews in here...what would you all suggest for me?

Room is large - 23 x 18 x 15 or so (almost two story family room) - this opens up to the kitchen area - I am guessing the room alone is over 6000 cubic feet

Current system is NAD separates, Von Schweikert Towers, Center, and Surrounds. Sub 1 location will be next to the right front tower, netween the speaker and a 75G fish tank (6 feet from the side wall). I do have 1 other locations wired for subs in the room as well...behind my main listening chair (very much near field)

This is the main family room, and as such 80% will be used for TV and movie watching. I tend to listen to movies at reference levels (when the 2 year old is not sleeping upstairs) When I do listen to music, I listen to all types but primarily rock

I like a lot of slam and punch. I had a Paradigm Servo 15 and it was good, but I needed more imo - I sold it awhile back and am just now getting around to looking for a replacement. I really do not want a monster sub (wife hates the look of the VS Towers as it is). I am considering one Phoenix or possibly 2 Sentinels...I have never ran 2 subs before...do you think the 2 Sent's would work better? Thanks for any advice!

I would get duals all the way.

"Using pairs of Sentinels is a very high output option for anybody with size constraints. For many, it is easier to slip a smaller pair of subwoofers into a room instead of one larger subwoofer. There are very few subwoofers that can't be trumped by a pair of these Sentinels. A pair of them will even outperform the Dynasty above 16-17 Hz."
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post #9758 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 07:12 PM
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I haven't been able to find the answer to my question, with the size difference between the Sentinel and the Phoenix how much more do you get? I know this question may seem odd but I've never heard both and never owned a subwoofer. Best bang for the buck in my opinion is Epik but I can't decide which one to get, I have a sub thread going here if anyone could help http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...php?p=17510896.
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post #9759 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

I haven't been able to find the answer to my question, with the size difference between the Sentinel and the Phoenix how much more do you get? I know this question may seem odd but I've never heard both and never owned a subwoofer. Best bang for the buck in my opinion is Epik but I can't decide which one to get, I have a sub thread going here if anyone could help http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...php?p=17510896.

The 18" driver will give you more output and extension over the 12". Also, it will give you bass that is fuller and effortless.
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post #9760 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 09:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

The 18" driver will give you more output and extension over the 12". Also, it will give you bass that is fuller and effortless.

From reading more I'm gathering that 2 Sentinels will out perform 1 Phoenix and they are on sale I don't forsee myself ever having 2 Phoenix subs, that's alot of real estate to take up. Maybe the dual Sentinels are the ticket for about the same money as a Phoenix

Hksvr4 - You should post what exactly you have on your set-up page
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post #9761 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robobob View Post

The general consensus, to avoid clipping the signal from the AVR, is to keep the sub level from the AVR at 0 or below (say -3) and turn up the gain on the Epik sub's gain control, say up to 12 o'clock, to get back to the level you desire.

Just a suggestion.

Thanks, I'll do that. I had it bumped up for my last sub. It wasn't kicking on at mid volume when it was set to auto. Having it at 0 probably won't be an issue for the Dynasty.
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post #9762 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

From reading more I'm gathering that 2 Sentinels will out perform 1 Phoenix and they are on sale I don't forsee myself ever having 2 Phoenix subs, that's alot of real estate to take up. Maybe the dual Sentinels are the ticket for about the same money as a Phoenix

Hksvr4 - You should post what exactly you have on your set-up page

I have the Epik Dragon and Ascend Audio speakers. Duals are always better than one. This will fix any room nulls.
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post #9763 of 20378 Old 11-10-2009, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

I have the Epik Dragon and Ascend Audio speakers. Duals are always better than one. This will fix any room nulls.

Hksvr4 - Thank you for all your help thus far on multiple threads, it is appreciated. Never had a sub so room nulls is kind of lost on me... I'm guessing spots where bass is less than ideal. I'm assuming this is the reason for the "sub crawl"? For a new AV/HT guy would setting up dual subs be a monumental task or not much more complicated than a single?
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post #9764 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 01:08 AM
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With the wife liking 2 smaller Sentinels, rather than the big Phoenix, and them being on sale, I went ahead and punched the button before the sale ends at an unknown date.

Quote:


CodeItemQtyPriceTotal
130Sentinel Subwoofer
2$799.00$1,598.00
DSC-7Dual Sentinel Sale Pricing [130]
2-$200.00-$400.00

Sub Total: $1,198.00
Tax: $0.00
Shipping: $171.26
Grand Total: $1,369.26

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post #9765 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 04:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

With the wife liking 2 smaller Sentinels, rather than the big Phoenix, and them being on sale, I went ahead and punched the button before the sale ends at an unknown date.

Congratulations. I'm sure you will be pleased when they arrive.

John
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post #9766 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

With the wife liking 2 smaller Sentinels, rather than the big Phoenix, and them being on sale, I went ahead and punched the button before the sale ends at an unknown date.

Thats what I ended up getting. Two Sentinels. I should be getting the coveted email this week!
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post #9767 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 06:30 AM
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For some reason I want to put a sentinel on top of my dynasty like a little brother riding piggyback, I know there is NOOOO need and I don't have the money but it will make me laugh on some level
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post #9768 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by lilmike2069 View Post

Thats what I ended up getting. Two Sentinels. I should be getting the coveted email this week!

Congrats! Remember to take pictures and post your thoughts on their performance. Personally I'm going to try 1 for a day or 2 and then kick in the 2nd to see how great they'll sound together as opposed to just the single. I may be bugging you when the times comes on how to set these up... first HT system ever
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post #9769 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 10:52 AM
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Nice buy irish, you should be happy.

I'm playing Call of Duty MW2 and this game has really good punch bass. I'm playing at at -25db's it sounds amazing.
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post #9770 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

With the wife liking 2 smaller Sentinels, rather than the big Phoenix, and them being on sale, I went ahead and punched the button before the sale ends at an unknown date.

two sentinels and a happy wife. can't beat that
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post #9771 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

Nice buy irish, you should be happy.

I'm playing Call of Duty MW2 and this game has really good punch bass. I'm playing at at -25db's it sounds amazing.

Thanks! I'd gotten bored with video games on TV speakers and the PS2... after I get all my speakers I may have to reevaluate getting a new game system

Quote:


two sentinels and a happy wife. can't beat that

She's awesome
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post #9772 of 20378 Old 11-11-2009, 06:58 PM
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well, the 2 sentinels seems to be the popular thing...I believe I better go ahead and order the dual sentinels and call it good...thanks for the help!
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post #9773 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 11:46 AM
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With all this dual Sentinel love, my single Sentinel is gettting lonely.

Anyone in the Chicagoland area want to gift me a new Sentinel, which I will pay for, but I can tell my wife it's a gift, so she won't want to send it back.

On a serious note, I'll have to keep working on her to get that second Sentinel in here. Of course the sale will be over by then.

To all those dual wielding your Sentinels, please post with your setups and comments.
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post #9774 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SharpOne View Post

With all this dual Sentinel love, my single Sentinel is gettting lonely.

Anyone in the Chicagoland area want to gift me a new Sentinel, which I will pay for, but I can tell my wife it's a gift, so she won't want to send it back.

On a serious note, I'll have to keep working on her to get that second Sentinel in here. Of course the sale will be over by then.

To all those dual wielding your Sentinels, please post with your setups and comments.

mine is lonely too.

i really don't feel i need a 2nd though. one is getting me by just fine. on the rare occasion that i actually get to let it rip, it still impresses me.

Nearfield rig: Laptop -> JDS Labs ODAC -> Emotiva Mini-X -> Pioneer SP-BS22-LR & SW8-mk2Headphone rig: laptop -> JDS Labs ODAC -> Emotiva Mini-X speaker taps -> modded AKG Q701H.T.: PS3 - Yamaha RX-V2500 - Infinity Alpha 50's - Alpha center - Harmon Kardon HKB6 rears, Epik SentinelMy last.fm profile
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post #9775 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 12:49 PM
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I'll post pics/review when I get mine. If I like them I may get a third if the sale is still on. One Sentinel under each LCR.
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post #9776 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 02:22 PM
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Right now, I'm thinking of either putting the two sentinels between the towers and component stand OR corner load one sentinel crossed at about 60-80Hz and the put the other sentinel on the right side of the component stand and to the left of the right tower crossed at ~120Hz.

Should I also order a Dynasty to accompany my two new Sentinels?? I'm thinking maybe I will put the two sentinels between the towers and component stand on both sides... Cross them at like 120 Hz... then corner load the Dynasty (the corner at left in pic) and then cross it at like 60Hz perhaps?




Its a 50" screen for reference... and yes... that wall is looking PRIME for a projection screen. BUT it is the main living room so I doubt I'll do it

The only reason I'm really considering it, is because I'm just slightly worried about the in room low end extension for movies. I know these will dig a lot deeper than my current beginner sub. I tested last night my current beginner sub that was supposed to be good at 24Hz and it was pretty close to silent at this frequency, I even placed my hand in front of the moving driver and barely felt any pressure (possibly due to large room). On my current sub, there is only in-room "useable" output, at least in my opinion, down to maaybe 28Hz and more like 30 Hz. Now the sentinel is supposedly good for "16-17Hz useable output" in room and excellent output "moreso than the dynasty' at 20Hz. If I do in fact get a true 16-17Hz useable output out of these things then I dont think there will be any need to go deeper and get a dynasty, but I havn't heard them in my room yet, so to me its all speculation until I hear them for myself. If anyone with a sentinel and a tone generator could comment on the true in-room low frequency extension I'd love to hear about this.
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post #9777 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilmike2069 View Post

Right now, I'm thinking of either putting the two sentinels between the towers and component stand OR corner load one sentinel crossed at about 60-80Hz and the put the other sentinel on the right side of the component stand and to the left of the right tower crossed at ~120Hz.

Should I also order a Dynasty to accompany my two new Sentinels?? I'm thinking maybe I will put the two sentinels between the towers and component stand on both sides... Cross them at like 120 Hz... then corner load the Dynasty (the corner at left in pic) and then cross it at like 60Hz perhaps?

Its a 50" screen for reference... and yes... that wall is looking PRIME for a projection screen. BUT it is the main living room so I doubt I'll do it

The only reason I'm really considering it, is because I'm just slightly worried about the in room low end extension for movies. I know these will dig a lot deeper than my current beginner sub. I tested last night my current beginner sub that was supposed to be good at 24Hz and it was pretty close to silent at this frequency, I even placed my hand in front of the moving driver and barely felt any pressure (possibly due to large room). On my current sub, there is only in-room "useable" output, at least in my opinion, down to maaybe 28Hz and more like 30 Hz. Now the sentinel is supposedly good for "16-17Hz useable output" in room and excellent output "moreso than the dynasty' at 20Hz. If I do in fact get a true 16-17Hz useable output out of these things then I dont think there will be any need to go deeper and get a dynasty, but I havn't heard them in my room yet, so to me its all speculation until I hear them for myself. If anyone with a sentinel and a tone generator could comment on the true in-room low frequency extension I'd love to hear about this.

That's appears to be a good size room and while I have no doubt that dual Sentinels would put a smile on your face if you like to listen at or close to reference levels I would opt for a dual Phoneix setup.
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post #9778 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilmike2069 View Post

Right now, I'm thinking of either putting the two sentinels between the towers and component stand OR corner load one sentinel crossed at about 60-80Hz and the put the other sentinel on the right side of the component stand and to the left of the right tower crossed at ~120Hz.

Should I also order a Dynasty to accompany my two new Sentinels?? I'm thinking maybe I will put the two sentinels between the towers and component stand on both sides... Cross them at like 120 Hz... then corner load the Dynasty (the corner at left in pic) and then cross it at like 60Hz perhaps?




Its a 50" screen for reference... and yes... that wall is looking PRIME for a projection screen. BUT it is the main living room so I doubt I'll do it

The only reason I'm really considering it, is because I'm just slightly worried about the in room low end extension for movies. I know these will dig a lot deeper than my current beginner sub. I tested last night my current beginner sub that was supposed to be good at 24Hz and it was pretty close to silent at this frequency, I even placed my hand in front of the moving driver and barely felt any pressure (possibly due to large room). On my current sub, there is only in-room "useable" output, at least in my opinion, down to maaybe 28Hz and more like 30 Hz. Now the sentinel is supposedly good for "16-17Hz useable output" in room and excellent output "moreso than the dynasty' at 20Hz. If I do in fact get a true 16-17Hz useable output out of these things then I dont think there will be any need to go deeper and get a dynasty, but I havn't heard them in my room yet, so to me its all speculation until I hear them for myself. If anyone with a sentinel and a tone generator could comment on the true in-room low frequency extension I'd love to hear about this.

I think you should just wait until you get what you ordered, you may be surprised. Every room is different as well as placement of the subwoofer within that room. So, I don't think it's going to do you any good to have someone post true in-room extension because it's not your room.
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post #9779 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilmike2069 View Post

Right now, I'm thinking of either putting the two sentinels between the towers and component stand OR corner load one sentinel crossed at about 60-80Hz and the put the other sentinel on the right side of the component stand and to the left of the right tower crossed at ~120Hz.

Should I also order a Dynasty to accompany my two new Sentinels?? I'm thinking maybe I will put the two sentinels between the towers and component stand on both sides... Cross them at like 120 Hz... then corner load the Dynasty (the corner at left in pic) and then cross it at like 60Hz perhaps?

Time for "educate the new guy" Everything I've read thus far recommends crossing the sub at 80hz, why would you do that with 1 and then have the other at 120hz? Why not have both of them at 80hz? Also, would having one sub front in front and the other in back be optimal or would that be a poor set up? I've read about the sub crawl for 1 but how would you go about doing it for 2?
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post #9780 of 20378 Old 11-12-2009, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt34 View Post

That's appears to be a good size room and while I have no doubt that dual Sentinels would put a smile on your face if you like to listen at or close to reference levels I would opt for a dual Phoneix setup.

It is a good sized room, And I'm pretty confident that the Dual Sentinels will provide the high audible output levels that i'll require since the H100 I already have does a better job than I thought it would (room acoustics). The only concern I have as of now is low end extension. If I get in-room the advertised 16-17Hz useable, then I'll be completely happy no question. I wouldnt even consider another sub at that point because I'm only going to get maybe a few Hz lower... I'm just skeptical right now about how a 12" driver can achieve such flat response to 20Hz and only be down a few dB at 17Hz! We shall see... I've got REW and SPL meter awaiting their arrival!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Bley View Post

I think you should just wait until you get what you ordered, you may be surprised. Every room is different as well as placement of the subwoofer within that room. So, I don't think it's going to do you any good to have someone post true in-room extension because it's not your room.

Thanks, I agree... I plan to wait to see how well they perform. I understand that in-room response is going to vary wildly from room to room, but I was just trying to get an idea of whether or not its even truly possible to get such low extension from these 12's in ANY room lol. Its an amazing feat if they are really capable of achieving this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

Time for "educate the new guy" Everything I've read thus far recommends crossing the sub at 80hz, why would you do that with 1 and then have the other at 120hz? Why not have both of them at 80hz? Also, would having one sub front in front and the other in back be optimal or would that be a poor set up? I've read about the sub crawl for 1 but how would you go about doing it for 2?

The main reason why people suggest crossing over around 80Hz is to prevent the sub from becoming 'localizable'. If I corner load one, it will be somewhat far off to the side and away from the screen (where the action is). I would cross this one around 80Hz to prevent it from being localizable. If I place the other sub between the center speaker and the right tower, then I dont care as much if it is localizable because it is front and center where the action is anyway. Even though it is crossed higher, it should still blend quite well with the mains. But only experimentation will tell the real story, which I will take plenty of pictures and document here! Should be getting them next week.

Also, setting up two subs can be very tricky. You really have to worry about waves canceling each other out. To get an idea of what problems this can cause, when you get your two subs (I noticed you ordered dual sentinels also) place them side by side.... turn one on. Then listen. Then turn the other one on only out of phase (180deg)... the output will actually diminish considerably and sound terrible. This is why most people end up co-locating or spending a LOT of time experimenting. You can get nulls that never existed (because of cancelations, out of phase) and HUGE peaks where the waves are fully in phase.
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