Official SVS Ultra 13 thread - Page 7 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews

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Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

craigsub's Avatar craigsub
11:02 AM Liked: 11
post #181 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 11,328
Joined: Jan 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by ransac View Post

You have to remember, the new Ultra is just that, a totally new sub. It is not a simple upgrade to an existing, tried and true sub. As with the HO, early adopters are going to expose weaknesses the OEM didn't find. You will do things with your sub the testers didn't try. Look at Craig's problem. He went on a business trip and when he came back a couple days later, the Ultra wouldn't work. I'm pretty sure SVS didn't run this test. Now we know the new Ultra won't be ignored. Looks like it has a fatal attraction for Craig. Wonder what it will do when it sees him playing with other subs. Hope you don't have a rabbit, Craig.

That was funny enough to warrant a quote.

GREAT stuff, Randy.
Ron Temple's Avatar Ron Temple
06:36 PM Liked: 36
post #182 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 8,489
Joined: Feb 2005
Well it's official...the PB13Ultra arrived on Friday, on Saturday I sold both my DIY Plus and today my 20-39+. It took all of about 40 seconds to make that decision. Simlar output, but as the early guys expressed, no thud, sharp attack, I can't detect any overhang, and fit and finish are superb. I wasn't sure about the Rosenut. My floors and furniture are dark oak (the floors red oak). I though Natural Oak was the way to go, but the Rosenut actually works better. I haven't had to deal with the size and weight issue before (other than the DIY), but I'll put up with the challenge.

Dual Pluses were awe inspiring in my setup and I wasn't sure if the Ultra would be worth the upgrade...I was totally wrong. I listen to a lot of music, the Pluses were good, but can't touch the Ultra13. It reminds me of the DD15 I had here briefly, but on steroids.

The only drawback is my room limitations. My wife was gone over the weekend, so I just dropped it into my preferred spot between my display and my FR. This is optimum for my room with every sub I've tried. I couldn't keep it there, just too big, so I put it back in the left corner behind the display with the help of my son yesterday. Corner gain decreased the SQ a bit(20dbs up from 15-40hz, it then slopes down gradually, thankfully, to 80dbs from 40-100hz) which I hope PEQ and room correction will fix. I'll experiment, but the damn thing is so heavy and stuck in an awkward postition to adjust...difficult to do by myself. Anyway, I'll get it done...even the corner position is far superior to my fairly flat duals.

Craig was correct in his comments on an another thread. For HT and if your particular taste lends you to prefer the low level impact that translates to rumble and sometimes thud of the Plus/2 or dual Pluses, there's no need to upgrade. If you want to hear and feel the sting of the explosion or bass note as a sharp attack with consequent punch the Ultra is what you should aim for. I prefer it...finish on the Rosenut is amazing.
getech's Avatar getech
06:57 PM Liked: 10
post #183 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 453
Joined: Feb 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Temple View Post

Well it's official...the PB13Ultra arrived on Friday, on Saturday I sold both my DIY Plus and today my 20-39+. It took all of about 40 seconds to make that decision. Simlar output, but as the early guys expressed, no thud, sharp attack, I can't detect any overhang, and fit and finish are superb. I wasn't sure about the Rosenut. My floors and furniture are dark oak (the floors red oak). I though Natural Oak was the way to go, but the Rosenut actually works better. I haven't had to deal with the size and weight issue before (other than the DIY), but I'll put up with the challenge.

Dual Pluses were awe inspiring in my setup and I wasn't sure if the Ultra would be worth the upgrade...I'm was totally wrong. I listen to a lot of music, the Pluses were good, but can't touch the Ultra13. It reminds me of the DD15 I had here briefly, but on steroids.

The only drawback is my room limitations. My wife was gone over the weekend, so I just dropped it into my preferred spot between my display and my FR. This is optimum for my room with every sub I've tried. I couldn't keep it there, just to big, so I put it back in the left corner behind the display with the help of my son yesterday. Corner gain decreased the SQ a bit(20dbs up from 15-40hz, it then slopes down gradually, thankfully, to 80dbs from 40-100hz) which I hope PEQ and room correction will fix. I'll experiment, but the damn thing is so heavy and stuck in an awkward postition to adjust...difficult to do by myself. Anyway, I'll get it done...even the corner position is far superior to my fairly flat duals.

Craig was correct in his comments on an another thread. For HT and if your particular taste lends you to prefer the low level impact that translates to rumble and sometimes thud of the Plus/2 or dual Pluses, there's no need to upgrade. If you want to hear and feel the sting of the explosion or bass note as a sharp attack with consequent punch the Ultra is what you should aim for. I prefer it...finish on the Rosenut is amazing.

Can't wait for my Ultra13 to be delivered sometime late this week. I have one coming in and hopefully another to follow depending on potential need.

Very good feedback regarding your initial reaction to your new Ultra....thanks and enjoy it!!
getech's Avatar getech
06:59 PM Liked: 10
post #184 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 453
Joined: Feb 2005
By the way, if anyone needs an Velodyne SMS-1, I can get you one for $539 delivered...brand new, and factory sealed. Great addition for your HT and correctly dialing in your sub & speakers.
AnthemAVM's Avatar AnthemAVM
07:38 PM Liked: 10
post #185 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 1,915
Joined: Oct 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Temple View Post

Craig was correct in his comments on an another thread. For HT and if your particular taste lends you to prefer the low level impact that translates to rumble and sometimes thud of the Plus/2 or dual Pluses, there's no need to upgrade. If you want to hear and feel the sting of the explosion or bass note as a sharp attack with consequent punch the Ultra is what you should aim for. I prefer it...finish on the Rosenut is amazing.


So I need Dual 13's and Dual Plus/2 as I like both sounds? How hard would it be to make that work?
Warpdrv's Avatar Warpdrv
10:07 PM Liked: 15
post #186 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 7,350
Joined: Oct 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by getech View Post

By the way, if anyone needs an Velodyne SMS-1, I can get you one for $539 delivered...brand new, and factory sealed. Great addition for your HT and correctly dialing in your sub & speakers.



With the SMS you are surely limiting your low end responce as it has such a really drastic rolloff under 20hz... which is a serious reason people are shooting for in HT..... I have one, and it makes for great protection for these low tuned DIY and what the new Ultra aiming for...

I have one, and I got a much better price on it then that...
But they are great units... but you could do better with Laptop and REW and a BFD....

I really would like a pair of the Ultras... contemplating very hard...
otk's Avatar otk
10:39 PM Liked: 16
post #187 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 7,496
Joined: Jul 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post


I really would like a pair of the Ultras... contemplating very hard...

just do it

get out that credit card and do it, you only live once
rossandwendy's Avatar rossandwendy
11:28 PM Liked: 22
post #188 of 10581
09-03-2007 | Posts: 547
Joined: Aug 2006
Ron, great first impressions!
How big is your room, and is it sealed or open?

Cheers,
Ross
Ron Temple's Avatar Ron Temple
01:14 AM Liked: 36
post #189 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 8,489
Joined: Feb 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by rossandwendy View Post

Ron, great first impressions!
How big is your room, and is it sealed or open?

Cheers,
Ross

My family room is 18x14x8 with a 5' opening into the rest of the front of my house, about 5500 more cube. It's never really been a tremendous problem to pressurize the room as the rig is oriented away from the opening. The LP get's the first blush, the rest of the house gets the reflection. I don't have too many issues except room gain, no deep nulls near our LP. My wife wants me to move everything to our living room in the while she's at her moms. I been planning on it for a long time, just need to wire it (and I'm to tall to fit under the house).
Tweakophyte's Avatar Tweakophyte
07:20 AM Liked: 10
post #190 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 3,361
Joined: Jan 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by ransac View Post

....
You will do things with your sub the testers didn't try. Look at Craig's problem. He went on a business trip and when he came back a couple days later, the Ultra wouldn't work. I'm pretty sure SVS didn't run this test.
...

This wouldn't be the dad-went-out-of-town-let's-pwn-his-HT test... would it?

movies2090's Avatar movies2090
04:28 PM Liked: 10
post #191 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 157
Joined: Sep 2002
Here are my newer numbers. I moved up my chair a few feet forward. All these numbers are uncorrected. My test CD was calibrated to 80db at -17Master Volume. How do these look now? any better?


15hz-68.5
20hz-80
25hz-90.5
30hz-93.5
35hz-92.5
40-94
45-95
50-100
55-102
60-98
65-91
70-87.5
75-91
80-94
85-93
90-86
95-77
mojomike's Avatar mojomike
04:45 PM Liked: 28
post #192 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 6,966
Joined: Dec 2005
Those numbers look better. How does it sound now?

You can use the PEQ to bring down the peak from 50 - 60 hz and they will look even better.
MusicFirst's Avatar MusicFirst
05:56 PM Liked: 10
post #193 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 839
Joined: Feb 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

With the SMS you are surely limiting your low end responce as it has such a really drastic rolloff under 20hz... which is a serious reason people are shooting for in HT.....

Is this true even after the latest update that has the lowest filter to adjust going down to 5Hz? Doesn't seem to make much sense that you could adjust down at the 5Hz area if there is no signal to really adjust.

Thanks,
MF
peyton18's Avatar peyton18
08:29 PM Liked: 10
post #194 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 22
Joined: Jun 2006
Sorry, to jump in at this point guys but want to be sure on this. Does the Ultra come with PEQ, I have read SVS's advertising and it claims additional controls for "room compensation". Your thoughts? Also, as an earlier poster mentioned. For 80%HT/20% Music would I be better off with the plus 2's?

Thanks.
mojomike's Avatar mojomike
08:37 PM Liked: 28
post #195 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 6,966
Joined: Dec 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by peyton18 View Post

Sorry, to jump in at this point guys but want to be sure on this. Does the Ultra come with PEQ, I have read SVS's advertising and it claims additional controls for "room compensation". Your thoughts? Also, as an earlier poster mentioned. For 80%HT/20% Music would I be better off with the plus 2's?

Thanks.

Peyton, the Ultra has a single band PEQ as well as a Room Compensation control.

The Plus/2 will get you slightly more overall output above 25hz, but the Ultra will play deeper and should have better sound quality.
Willd's Avatar Willd
08:43 PM Liked: 10
post #196 of 10581
09-04-2007 | Posts: 5,647
Joined: Jan 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by MusicFirst View Post

Is this true even after the latest update that has the lowest filter to adjust going down to 5Hz? Doesn't seem to make much sense that you could adjust down at the 5Hz area if there is no signal to really adjust.

Thanks,
MF

Yes, its still true, even with the latest update. Crazy, I know.
Warpdrv's Avatar Warpdrv
06:45 AM Liked: 15
post #197 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 7,350
Joined: Oct 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by MusicFirst View Post

Is this true even after the latest update that has the lowest filter to adjust going down to 5Hz? Doesn't seem to make much sense that you could adjust down at the 5Hz area if there is no signal to really adjust.

Thanks,
MF

That fix was found to be ineffective..... the heavy roll off still exists...
kweezr's Avatar kweezr
07:19 AM Liked: 10
post #198 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 998
Joined: Apr 2003
Frequency response comparing dual PB13s vs. PB12-ultra/2 at 20Hz tuning


MusicFirst's Avatar MusicFirst
11:15 AM Liked: 10
post #199 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 839
Joined: Feb 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Willd View Post

Yes, its still true, even with the latest update. Crazy, I know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

That fix was found to be ineffective..... the heavy roll off still exists...

That really sucks! I have not used mine in a couple of months due to moving, not sure if I want to use it now. If I use the bypass mode will it still roll-off like that? I'm thinking I can use the 1-band auto-PEQ in my f113 to tame the worst freq. problem in my room and hopefully that will be good enough for movies, and use a preset on the SMS-1 for music listening. That or maybe I should just get a PB-Ultra 13 for movies (the future wife might kill me though (she thinks the f113 is too big already)

MF
AnthemAVM's Avatar AnthemAVM
01:02 PM Liked: 10
post #200 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 1,915
Joined: Oct 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

That fix was found to be ineffective..... the heavy roll off still exists...

Has Velodyne recognized the problem, and are they working on it? I have been very spoiled that the one company I have worked with (Anthem) has been great about fixing bugs.

Michael
Heinrich S's Avatar Heinrich S
01:44 PM Liked: 30
post #201 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 974
Joined: Aug 2007
It has been announced that a firmware update will disable the subsonic filter outright (if you choose to do so). I think the update is downloadable now.

Cheers !
Warpdrv's Avatar Warpdrv
01:52 PM Liked: 15
post #202 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 7,350
Joined: Oct 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heinrich S View Post

It has been announced that a firmware update will disable the subsonic filter outright (if you choose to do so). I think the update is downloadable now.

Cheers !


Do you possibly have a link to that information Heinrich....

Interesting, I haven't heard anything about that fix... I have the SMS and I like it... but the steep rolloff will have limitations for my system when I complete my Dual 15" DIY subs.
Heinrich S's Avatar Heinrich S
02:00 PM Liked: 30
post #203 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 974
Joined: Aug 2007
I spoke to Curt and he revealed to me that there would be a firmware update to disable the subsonic limiter. If you go to the Velodyne support thread, go back 2 pages or so.
Mozvz's Avatar Mozvz
02:23 PM Liked: 10
post #204 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 1,735
Joined: May 2002
Is this the version you are referring:

This is NOT the latest software version for the SMS. The new firmware is NOT posted yet on Velo's web site.

Version 2.12
This is a special version of the SMS-1 software that permits setting the subsonic filter down to 5 Hz. This should only be used for subwoofers capable of reproducing frequencies this low (not common). All other functions of the SMS-1 perform identically to the 2.1 version.

http://www.velodyne.com/velodyne/sup...x?sid=208d786c
Richard Mayer's Avatar Richard Mayer
02:25 PM Liked: 10
post #205 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 863
Joined: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mozvz View Post

Is this the version you are referring:

Version 2.12
This is a special version of the SMS-1 software that permits setting the subsonic filter down to 5 Hz. This should only be used for subwoofers capable of reproducing frequencies this low (not common). All other functions of the SMS-1 perform identically to the 2.1 version.

http://www.velodyne.com/velodyne/sup...x?sid=208d786c

No. The new firmware is not yet available.
Mozvz's Avatar Mozvz
02:29 PM Liked: 10
post #206 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 1,735
Joined: May 2002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Mayer View Post

No. The new firmware is not yet available.

Richard,

Thanks for the clarification!! I just wanted to post that version in case someone thought it was the new version. It's obvious the 2.12 version is not the fix the previous poster was referring to in his post. I'll edit my previous post to bring it to anyone's attention it's not the latest version that will be available ??.
Heinrich S's Avatar Heinrich S
02:37 PM Liked: 30
post #207 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 974
Joined: Aug 2007
Perhaps Bruce can chime in. It has been confirmed by both Bruce and Curt that the subsonic filter will be able to be bypassed completely. I am getting my own SMS-1 hopefully tommorrow so this is good news indeed.
Warpdrv's Avatar Warpdrv
03:23 PM Liked: 15
post #208 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 7,350
Joined: Oct 2005
All this discussion is off topic from the SVS, lets take it to the Velodyne Thread...
Including myself...
Richard Mayer's Avatar Richard Mayer
03:26 PM Liked: 10
post #209 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 863
Joined: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heinrich S View Post

Perhaps Bruce can chime in. It has been confirmed by both Bruce and Curt that the subsonic filter will be able to be bypassed completely. I am getting my own SMS-1 hopefully tommorrow so this is good news indeed.

Yes, it will be available (did someone say by the end of September?). But it's not the v2.12, which has been available for many months already. v2.12 doesn't bypass the subsonic filter, or even set it down to 5 Hz (even though they say so). Let's hope the new firmware will offer a relatively flat response down to ~DC.
ggunnell's Avatar ggunnell
05:52 PM Liked: 10
post #210 of 10581
09-05-2007 | Posts: 1,018
Joined: Apr 2006
I know a lot of folks worked hard on the new Ultras, but I want to direct a compliment to Mr. Stephen Ponte the Ultra13 driver designer, for coming up with a driver that will put out an enormous amount of subsonic energy and will still play small ensemble bass at low listening levels. It's very difficult to design a transducer that responds linearly in both small signal conditions and large signal conditions. Thanks, Stephen, and everyone at SVS, for making this available. IMO, YMMV, etc.
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