OFFICIAL T2: Extreme WM9 HD-DVD Review Thread - AVS Forum
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Old 05-22-2003, 10:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi,

Thanks for all the help. I can play it now.

Check a few scenes only, overall the picture is better than the D-Theater version IMO. The playback interface (Windows Media Player 9 or InterActual Player) sucks though. More later.

regards,

Li On
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Old 05-22-2003, 11:28 PM
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Wow.. that says a lot, better than the DTheater version. When I get T2Ex, I'll have to compare it vs. Dtheater & Holo3DII+HDAux .
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Old 05-22-2003, 11:28 PM
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Whoo Hoo... So that list I sent helped huh ???

Please see the PM I sent ya...

EDIT :: Just noticed... Your PM Box is full... Drop me a mail will you..
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Old 05-23-2003, 12:01 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Li On
Check a few scenes only, overall the picture is better than the D-Theater version IMO. The playback interface (Windows Media Player 9 or InterActual Player) sucks though. More later.

Wow! That is different than what I've heard from more than one person who has tried it out. One said it was a little bit below average HBO-HD quality in the one chapter they had tried.

I don't have this disk, but "The Living Sea" from my Athlon 2600+ and Radeon 9500 through RGB to my HT1000 seemed to have better colors, more blockiness but less mosquito noise, and more smearing (bad thing) in one scene, compared to my DVD of the same thing playing from my DVI DVD player to the HT1000. That one didn't give me high hopes for WM9. Definitely not what I'm used to with HD.

Are you watching this on the AE100 or have you gotten a D-ILA yet?

--Darin
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Old 05-23-2003, 12:11 AM
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I do believe Li On has commented a few times that he thinks the T2 DVHS is poorer than many DVHS titles and most broadcast... Perhaps that is the basis on this discrepancy...
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Old 05-23-2003, 12:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi,

Why IMO WM9 T2 looks better than D-Theater T2? Because D-Theater T2 simply looks VERY poor. Now I guess it's due to the source material issue. Looks like T2 can NEVER look good no matter what. Yes, TONS of HBO-HD looks WAY better than the WM9 T2.

Tonight will test more. I got the disc plays at 4am this morning (my time) so it's just my first impression.

regards,

Li On
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Old 05-23-2003, 01:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi,

Thanks to DryKid and others hints, this is how I got the WM9 DRM works.

- install Windows Media Player 9
- in WMP9 Option -> Network, select Use Browser Proxy
- in Internet Explorer Tools -> Internet Option -> Connections -> Settings, select Proxy Server and input the address and port number. You can find some US based open proxy servers at http://www.publicproxyservers.com/page1.html

- install the stupid InterActual Player on the T2EX DVD disc2
- use DVD Region Killer or DVDIdle to fix any DVD region issue if the InterAcutal Player won't play the DVD
- select High-Definition T2 in the InterActual Player
- the DRM license box will popup and if everything is fine it will say the license is install ok, if it say region issue for NOT in the Canada or US, try another proxy server from that URL
- then the WM9 T2 should plays in InterActual Player
- quite InterActual Player and use WMP9 to play by directly open the file on the DVD
- I guess you can even copy the WM9 file to HD to play
- once it get the license, you can remove the proxy setting in IE and WMP9

I tried around 10 hours before I got it working. First I stuck on the NOT Canada or US region issue and don't know which open proxy server to use. Then I finally discover I MUST use the InterActual Player to get the license instead of the WMP9...

Anyway, enjoy!

Btw, the license say it will expire on May 27 too. Does the Motown WM9 has a expiration date?

regards,

Li On
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Old 05-23-2003, 01:25 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Li On
Hi,

I tried around 10 hours before I got it working. First I stuck on the NOT Canada or US region issue and don't know which open proxy server to use. Then I finally discover I MUST use the InterActual Player to get the license instead of the WMP9...

Li On

FWIW acquiring the licence using WMP9 worked here (in fact I watched T2 that way too - couldn't get the stupid Interactual Player to work at all, and I spent enough time trying...)
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Old 05-23-2003, 01:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi DryKid,

So we're slightly difference. Before I try the InterActual Player, I tried too many times to get license in WMP9. WMP9 always ask me to insert the DVD. But the DVD is already in the drive. In fact I'm opening the WM9 file on the DVD. I've no idea what and why WMP9 said that stupid thing!

regards,

Li On
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Old 05-23-2003, 01:44 AM
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Where was 'here' ???
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Old 05-23-2003, 02:17 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Li On
WMP9 always ask me to insert the DVD. But the DVD is already in the drive.

I don't have T2 yet, but when Motown did this to me, I just ejected the disc and put it back in again. Then it went and got the license and started playing!

I gotta say that I have wondered what percentage of people will actually get these WMV9 videos to play properly. Certainly not a plug and play experience, not to mention the PC spec required for glitch free playback!

Greg
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Old 05-23-2003, 02:45 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Li On
Btw, the license say it will expire on May 27 too. Does the Motown WM9 has a expiration date?

This is a very important issue... it is specified nowhere that this disc could be limited in time... do they even have the right to do that ??

PS: thx a lot Li On for this "How to use T2"

Don't piss in my pocket and tell me it's raining !
Come and visit our French speaking forum : www.cinetson.org
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Old 05-23-2003, 04:18 AM
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These licence terms clearly need to be spelt out...

And it must do so on the BOX itself and each internet vendor will need to specify the terms before purchase...

So I buy this disc...
Can I play it in my region...
Can I play it X amount of times...
Can I play it on multiple PC's...
Can I play it next year...

What happens if the license issueing company goes out of biz ??

What happens if my net connection is down when I want to watch it ?? (I am on a weird 2 way Sat connection with uplink... This happens during monsoon season)..

What happens to rental versions...

What happens etc...

Amir ???
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Old 05-23-2003, 07:52 AM
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Quote:


I don't have this disk, but "The Living Sea" from my Athlon 2600+ and Radeon 9500 through RGB to my HT1000 seemed to have better colors, more blockiness but less mosquito noise, and more smearing (bad thing) in one scene, compared to my DVD of the same thing playing from my DVI DVD player to the HT1000. That one didn't give me high hopes for WM9. Definitely not what I'm used to with HD.

Darin,

"The Living Seas" is not HD. It even plays back on my 600mhz HP computer. The video stream rate is only about 1000 kb/sec, whereas the high def stuff (BMW clips) is 6000 to 8000kb/sec.

I think the intent of the "Do Amazing Things" disk is more to show off WM9 across a range of old (slow) and new computers.

Ray
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Old 05-23-2003, 08:17 AM
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Li On, what display device were you using?

Paul Seng
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Old 05-23-2003, 08:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi Paul,

My dying AE100 and the Mit. 87TXM PC Mon. Will give more comment after tonight viewing...

Will try to try it on a G70 in the weekend.

I'm NOT saying the WM9 T2 looks great for a HDTV picture. Just better than the D-Theater T2 IMO. If anyone thinks the D-Theater T2 looks great, oh well...

regards,

Li On
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Old 05-23-2003, 09:17 AM
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I thought this has a release date of June 3rd...?

- Rick
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Old 05-23-2003, 09:26 AM
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Krynos....many stores sell DVDs early. I am trying to find this! Someone PM me where they have seen it.
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Old 05-23-2003, 09:27 AM
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How are you guys getting T2??? PLease advise???
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Old 05-23-2003, 09:49 AM
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Just got it today, I used the proxy trick with succes..... I have to say, on my system it simply looks INCREDIBLE IMO, dare I say even better than any transport stream I've seen (that includes those The Fifth Element, Final Fantasy, Titanic and Toy Story 2 clips)... It was completely filmlike, without any compression artefacts, chroma noise, Low level filtering or Edge enhancement..

CPU usage peaked at 70%... not bad at all.
The sound was exactly like on the dvd, no problem there.
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Old 05-23-2003, 12:28 PM
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Where can this be purchased online? I've checked Amazon, eBay and a few other places I Googled but all saying coming June 3rd.
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Old 05-23-2003, 03:40 PM
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Didn't know folks could buy T2 already and hence the lateness of reply here .

At any rate, the time-based license is there to keep folks from borrowing a disc, getting their own permanent copy on HD and then returning it. The current license is for 5 days. But before you panic, let me say that you can get as many licenses as you want as long as you have the disc. So yes, you do need network access but you can keep playing the disc.

We are trying to see if we can get the time extended beyond 5 days but it is ultimately up to Artisan to make that decision.

Finally, let me say that there are some growing pains wrt to this disc. We are learning a lot and have plans for improvements in the future. So keep the comments coming so that we know what to fix.

Thanks,
Amir
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Old 05-23-2003, 03:51 PM
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Amir, is the Amazing Things DVD working the same way? The verbiage in it talks about a 60 day license, but doesn't say anything about what happens after the initial 60 days...

Thanks
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Old 05-23-2003, 03:58 PM
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No it doesn't. In the case of "AWE" (Amazing Windows Experience) DVD, we only got the rights for the the HD BMW clip for 60 days (for free) and that is what we are conveying.

Amir
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Old 05-23-2003, 05:23 PM
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where is T2 in BLUE RAY ???
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Old 05-23-2003, 05:26 PM
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Thanks for your interest in T2: Extreme DVD and the Windows Media 9 Series High Definition version it contains. It appears some of the discs got out earlier than the June 3rd release date so I wanted to answer some of the questions that have been brought up on this thread.

Disc #1 of this set is a region 1 disc (Canada and the US). The second disc (disc #2) containing the HD Windows Media content will use the user's IP address to determine his/her location and only issue a license to people who reside in the US or Canada. Currently, the content owner has decided to issue a 5 day timeout license. After the 5 days is up, when the user plays the content a license is automatically renewed as long as disc #2 is in the drive.

The T2 DVD requires the user to have the Interactual player (which hosts the Windows Media Player 9 Series ocx) in the drive before a license will be issued. A user may take disc #2 from one PC to another PC (e.g. home network scenario), but the license will only be issued to PC's that have disc #2 in the drive.

Please note the minimum CPU requirements and graphics card requirements on the box. Due to the high resolution of the content this DVD will work best on a PC with a 3GHz processor with a 128MB/3D video card. To get a surround sound experience Windows XP (Pro or Home), a 5.1 capable sound card and Windows Media Player 9 Series are required.
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Old 05-23-2003, 06:23 PM
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LiOn,

Nice review.

Regarding the 3 GHz CPU for playback, could you check your CPU usage and report please?

WM9 audio conversion to SPDIF DD 5.1 by the nforce boards is working properly now using the latest nforce drivers.


Joe
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Old 05-23-2003, 06:25 PM
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Li ON, JaM and others:

Could you post your PC system specs please? And how T2 WMP9 HD performed on your system?
TIA!
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Old 05-23-2003, 09:13 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Karnis
Li ON, JaM and others:

Could you post your PC system specs please? And how T2 WMP9 HD performed on your system?
TIA!


You can see system specs in my profile..

It ran perfectly on mine, with CPU usage peaking at 70%
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Old 05-23-2003, 10:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi,

Watched most of the WM9 T2 last night till 5am so sorry for the late respond!

The HD T2 actually looks like a decent HD picture! Many bright scenes (desert) cleanly has higher resolution than the D-Theater version. I guess it's both WM9 power and the poor master condition that D-Theater got.

Compression artifacts are very few and far between. Color balance is spot on I guess. Resolution can be better especially in dark scene but I guess it's due to the source master limit. Compared to ALL film source HD shows, this WM9 T2 score OK IMO. Not great but decent.

Tonight will try it on a G70.

Consider the HD T2 total size is only 6.53G as it needs to share room with bonus material on the disc 2. And the encoding is ONLY at 6Mbps and in CBR mode due to the playback power of a slower CPU. If this is the WORSE that WM9 offer on DVD9, maybe the best treated WM9 HD on DVD9 can actually match the best film source D-Theater at 25Mbps MPEG2.

Besides, as the WM9 content is progressive in the source, deinterlace issue is out of the Windows!

The 5 days need to renew license is a pain in everyone opinion I guess. Is there any way that can be patched to NOT need a Internet connection after the first live license install? I mean please try to make the license renewal to work with the DVD disc 2 only.

Amir, I'm a believer, My question - what's NEXT?

regards,

Li On

PS: my system, P4PE, 2.4B at 2.7G (150x18), 512M DDR333@375, Radeon original 8500 64M, WinXPProSP1, DX9. CPU usage around 60-7x%.
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