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post #61 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR1
Amir,

What is Intel's part in all of this? So far I've not seen them actively involved and simply on a few press releases where their name is on the support list.
They are more active behind the scenes. Although it is fair to say that they are not as active as we are.

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post #62 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Zimmer
Since Intel is an HD DVD backer, why can't they do another run of a couple hundred thousand of the old P4 chips that the A1 and XA1 use?
We could, if the money was there, dig out the reticles and reorder more packages. But it's overhead that would drive up the price of the processor. It would be an exaggeration to imply that it would be as difficult as Chrysler tooling up to make a limited run of "vintage" (God, I'm old) Dodge Stealth, but that's kind of where it sits.

It's cheaper for all concerned if we go with a newer, better processor, though it makes Toshiba's debug work on 1.5G a little less trivial.

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post #63 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:10 AM
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http://www.dvdreview.com/news/

Amir,

Now that Paramount has announced their releases, can you tell us if they'll use VC1 and can we expect high quality from these titles? (CoR/Serenity worthy)
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post #64 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR1
Amir,

What is Intel's part in all of this? So far I've not seen them actively involved and simply on a few press releases where their name is on the support list.
Frankly, I was surprised to see our name on the joint press release with MS back when it came out. But then, so were a number of people in the Consumer Electronics Group, who presumably should/could have been informed of our forthcoming position on this while they were trying to sell chipsets and CPUs to Blu-ray manufacturers. :rolleyes: Sometimes the right hand doth not know what the left hand is doing; hopefully the current restructuring efforts will assist this.

We're supplying parts, and typically we're pretty agnostic over who buys them and for what purpose, and don't take sides unless we have a vested interest. In this case, for various reasons I confess I am not privy to, that was not done. People who claim it was Toshiba's order for our chips in their solution are a little misled, as the numbers of chips involved were nice but not significant.

I suspect, but cannot prove, that BD+'s possible mucking with MMC played a significant role, as our stated goals with VIIV are to be the end-all solution for media and barriers to any part of that would raise red flags.

This is all my opinion, of course. I left that org to work in manufacturing research and only get juicy tidbits from former coworkers anymore.

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post #65 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:20 AM
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Amir, now that Paramount has announced title releases, would you care to give your assessment/background of Paramount's silence?

Have you personally seen the titles announced? Thanks in advance.


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post #66 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:27 AM
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Thanks Archi,

Seems as if Intel's backing was reactionary to BD+ and their actual involvement is still unknown. Perhaps they're working with MS behind the scenes to make sure that iHD/MMC/VIIV play nice?

If possible, hassle free software is plenty of contribution in my book.
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post #67 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Q of BanditZ
LOL
Well, hacking the software for our chip will likely turn the player into a paperweight. Better that happening to hackers than us having to deal with AACS and/or BD+. :)

Quote:
What do you think would/could happen if someone upgraded that RAM and that existing Pentium chip in those players?
I don't see more or faster RAM making a difference. The last I knew, a good chunk of that 1GB is not being used.

Going to a faster CPU speed might speed up the things you mentioned, although load times may be more dictacted by the drive speed. It all depends on how they wrote the software, what hardware acceleration for stuff is available, what things if any are timestamped to ensure timing and user consistency, etc.

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post #68 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR1
Thanks Archi,

Seems as if Intel's backing was reactionary to BD+ and their actual involvement is still unknown. Perhaps they're working with MS behind the scenes to make sure that iHD/MMC/VIIV play nice?
If possible, hassle free software is plenty of contribution in my book.
I'm sure iHD is being built into VIIV x.0. I saw some of the VIIV demo software back in the day, and they've had a year since then to improve things. What I don't know is if they hired any Java programmers after I left... ;)

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post #69 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by archibael
I suspect, but cannot prove, that BD+'s possible mucking with MMC played a significant role,

That's my guess too. BD+ gave the last push for MS to support HD DVD.
MS doesn't have to choose sides unless the big picture is affected.

HDPLEX
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post #70 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 01:14 PM
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It was alluded to, but not asked directly-

What are the barriers to a 45GB triple layer HD DVdisk? Since there is really only 1 player out, and it is rumored to be firmware capable of reading a triple layer disk, is this *really* something anyone should get worked up about or is the politics of the spec something that would hold back adoption anyway?
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post #71 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 01:18 PM
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HD DVD Xbox360 questions-

Will upsampling regular DVD be supported over component, or still restricted to VGA output (as it stands now)? Will there be anything in the playback software that allows fiddling with the software processing of the image (like ffdshow filters or what can be done with dscaler)? What audio codecs will be supported on the 360?

Any word on if a calibration routine will be included with the 360 with or without the HD DVD add-on?

To anyone-

ETA to a commercial HD calibration disk??
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post #72 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Head Shot
Amir, now that Paramount has announced title releases, would you care to give your assessment/background of Paramount's silence?

Have you personally seen the titles announced? Thanks in advance.
I have not seen the titles myself but my staff has as they were encoded a while ago and waiting to be released. I have seen Italian Job in WMV-HD and even at red laser data rates and old encoding tools, it looked really good!

As to cause of the delay, I can only mention one of them. And that is, they had entirely new management and they had to get "grounded" first in the business before giving the go ahead. The second one, the so called logistical issue, unfortunately remains confidential. Someone else needs to disclose it before I can comment on it. Suffice it to say, it is no longer an issue and at any rate, would be an uninteresting factoid in these discussions.

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post #73 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amirm
...would be an uninteresting factoid in these discussions.
And here I thought you knew this crowd by now. :)

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post #74 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 02:11 PM
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http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=697475

Subject: Xbox 360
Quote:
The current XBox 360 WILL NOT be getting a new "built-in" HD-DVD player, however the new XBox "360" AV will.

No source.

No source forthcoming, as admitted by the author of that thread. :rolleyes:


It's amazing how many times in the past few days I've seen rumor threads like these with that absolutely horrible and worthless picture in them.

This sort of thing is going to keep popping up over and over again until we can get something definitive, concrete, and authoritative one way or the other.

We need something. ;)

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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post #75 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Q of BanditZ
That looks interesting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Q of BanditZ
This sort of thing is going to keep popping up over and over again until we can get something definitive, concrete, and authoritative one way or the other.

We need something. ;)
I suspect there is no definitive, concrete, and authoritative on this to be had. If MS is being smart they are doing things in such a way as to keep their options open. That includes prototyping possible configurations.

Those prototypes exist, and have been seen or talked about to friends by insiders. If people are assuming the existence of a prototype implies anything more than a prototype exists, there be the source of rumours.

How could anyone give a definitive statement on whether something being merely considered is going to happen or not?

Gary


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post #76 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penton-Man
So, Amir, -via P.M. if you prefer.
Received it. :)

Haven't read it yet as I've got a slew of complicated PM's to go thru and I just got back into town. :eek:

I'll get to yours in due course. :)
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post #77 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penton-Man
Received it. :)

Haven't read it yet as I've got a slew of complicated PM's to go thru and I just got back into town. :eek:

I'll get to yours in due course. :)
Welcome back PM! :)

Great thread too guys, keep it up.


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post #78 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Actually, max rate does come down with advanced codecs. For a given scene, we can achieve better efficiency in both average and peak rate. Of course, the ratio is not predictable or always proportional between the two. To give you a sense, the peak rate for some HD DVD titles is less than 20 Mbit/sec. This is just shy of the average rate of MPEG-2 in BD titles! Needless to say, the peak rate in BD titles is well in excess of this rate.
Amir, not between codecs, within codecs but improvement in encoders. That is why I wanted to differentiate between the two in the first place.
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post #79 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dialog_gvf
How could anyone give a definitive statement on whether something being merely considered is going to happen or not?

Gary
Who knows? Maybe a stray tidbit could land in our laps. ;)

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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post #80 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 04:52 PM
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Not to be too nitpicky, but the terminology is a bit confusing...

"codec" is a word coming from "coder" and "decoder". Most people refer to "coder" as "encoder".

The bitstream of a codec is usually fixed for a version, which means the decoder that interprets the bitstream is also fixed. The encoder which builds the bitstream can improve to build a better/more efficient bitstream that can be understood by the decoder.

Hong.

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post #81 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 05:03 PM
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My question is this.

Is there really language in the licensing terms of HD DVD and Blu-Ray that prohibits the inclusion of the competitors product for the creation of a Universal Player?
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post #82 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 05:08 PM
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Hong. thanks, I definitely know all that. The question was not as much for my own knowledge but someone (OK more then one) were saying max rate can decrease it is now at 18mbps and can go down to 12 mbps easily. I tried explaining but the response was Amir said so. That is why I wanted Amir to give a response that he talks about ABR and a codec is fixed for life while the encoder can get better. This means that one cannot take it for granted that the max rate can decrease on a given movie because the encoder is more efficient. The issue is some decide to dismiss what I say just because I prefer BD.

I asked Amir the question and he asked why after the answer and I felt he deserved an explanation if he wanted it. I am guessing though that he misinterpreted what I wrote because MPEG-2 was not in the discussion.
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post #83 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin
Welcome back PM! :)
Thanks :) , this seems to be a bash-free zone where people can discuss things.

If anyone squishes stuff for New Line Cinema, please, Please, PLEASE do the absolute worst authoring job imaginable with lots of grain, artifacts, etc. as personally when this film eventually debuts for home theater on a Hi-Def disc – I would prefer it to be - of the worst PQ possible………so that if I ever do decide to rent it, I can at least get a decent night’s sleep.

Snakes on A Plane :eek:

Or as Samuel L Jackson says,

Snakes on a Motherf***ing Plane ! :eek: :eek:

Cjplay – If somehow you even indirectly get involved in this project and can give the desired effect as described above, the next time I’m in your neck of the woods---a free dinner at Taps on me.(the best thing on the menu, according to the chef, is his specialty, the San Francisco Cioppino)
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post #84 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 06:24 PM
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This thread is great, I wonder if it will ever surpass those mega latest HiDef news threads... I for one wouldn't mind in the least if it did. Industry insider friendly zones are most beneficial.

@AnthonyP

Not sure if I am following what you mean with ABR and MBR, but if an encoder can reduce the ABR, then it stands to reason that some of that improvement may have been due to reductions in the MBR, as that is where there is the most to shave.

Cheers...
Duy-Khang Hoang
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post #85 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 07:35 PM
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Can any of the other insiders confirm that 30.24 Mbps is the maximum data rate for the HD DVD-Video format? Cjplay mentioned this a few weeks ago and I have found a few documents which seem to confirm it.
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post #86 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 07:41 PM
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Well they shut down the Pub... What's cooking over here.... http://www.avforums.com/forums/image.../diablotin.gif

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post #87 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 07:48 PM
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Quote:
Not sure if I am following what you mean with ABR and MBR, but if an encoder can reduce the ABR, then it stands to reason that some of that improvement may have been due to reductions in the MBR, as that is where there is the most to shave.

I should not (this thread is for questions to the experts). But one last post can't hurt :)

the discussion was about MBR and someone said we should not look at the MBR today because newer encoders will mean less MBR.

Now here is why MBR can't be assumed to go lower

scenario 1) The tech enters X mbps the movie only needs Y<X in this scenario if the encoder Y'<Y<X then the real MBR shrinks. If Y is entered in MBR nothing gets worst, if Y' is entered in the newer encode the PQ is not hurt.

scenario 2) The tech enters X mbps there are 4 parts that reach X mbps and in those 10 instances there are some artefacts. Let's say encoder #2 is better and 1 of those has no artefacts at <X, 1 has the same artefacts <X but nothing is gained going at X, 1 has the same artefacts <X but looks better at X and the last one can't be reduced from X and going lower introduces some.


The point is you cannot assume that it will decrease. It might in some cases and not in others. IF you decrease MBR you risk introducing artefacts.
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post #88 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 07:54 PM
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OK.. Got it... http://www.avforums.com/forums/images/smilies/sleep.gif

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post #89 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 07:58 PM
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Well they shut down the Pub... What's cooking over here.... http://www.avforums.com/forums/image.../diablotin.gif

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post #90 of 4623 Old 07-10-2006, 08:00 PM
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First of all, I just want to thank all of you insiders who take the time to post on these forums, as you have me getting through work by checking the forums all the time to see if any new information is available....

I was just wondering if anyone could shed some light, even the tiniest bit, on whether or not we could expect some support for HD-DVD from studios who have not yet announced support, or are Blu-Ray only at this time this year?? I know that you probably can't say which companies for sure, but some sort of hint would be great!!

Also I was just wanting to get you folks' opinion on the chances of both formats coexisting if somehow it ends up that most studios support both formats, with the exceptions that Sony would continue to exclusively support Blu-Ray and Universal HD-DVD??? I am nervous about the whole idea of a format war, but of course I own and HD-DVD player right now, mainly because of price, as I haven't seen Blu-Ray in person and can't afford a $1000 player right now, but am seriously considering a ps3 whenever it releases, especially if it turns out to be true that both versions of the ps3 can play blu-ray discs.....

so if I could get some answers, even if they are a bit vague (any info and shred of hope is better than nothing to me!!) I'd greatly appreciate it!! Thanks in advance for the help and keep up the great work!!
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