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post #61 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 11:47 AM
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i disagree, for that price, the PQ should be SIGNIFICANTLY better!!

g55555sim : for most it is, the only comparison is to DVD on an HD DVD player
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post #62 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 11:51 AM
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By January 1, 2007? I might go for Hd DVD, or a tie. Which is a win for HD DVD. Sony can't stand HD DVD being there. Royalties are halved.

not sure what you mean, are you saying Jan1 2007 # devices that can play HD DVD=# devices that can play BD? care to make the brakedown, I am curious to see what numbers you are thinking of
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post #63 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post

By January 1, 2007? I might go for Hd DVD, or a tie. Which is a win for HD DVD. Sony can't stand HD DVD being there. Royalties are halved.

I don't think that Toshiba even has access to a supply of 1,000,000 blue lasers to build that many products. Even if they did, they don't have a product (HD-DVD) that will support that kind of purchases by the public. DVD only sold 315,136 units sold in its first year (CEA info).

If you are going to claim that HD-DVD numbers are going to be better than DVD, then join the club at Warner and Toshiba and seek help while there is still time...

This is what DVD did back in 1997.. DVD FAQ info..
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Here's reality:

* 1997
o 349,000 DVD-Video players shipped in the U.S. (About 200,000 sold into homes.)
o 900 DVD-Video titles available in the U.S. Over 5 million copies shipped; about 2 million sold.
o Over 500,000 DVD-Video players shipped worldwide.
o Around 330,000 DVD-ROM drives shipped worldwide with about 1 million bundled DVD-ROM titles.
o 60 DVD-ROM titles (mostly bundled).

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post #64 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by AnthonyP View Post

did you see it? did you compare DVD , BD and HD DVD version of it (sorry forgot HD DVD version= DVD) ....have you tried it and made a DVD/BD comparison? That is the difference between rabid HD DVD fan and not. Jumping to asinine conclusions and not


This is intellectual honesty? That's like me asking you to compare the HD DVD copy of Serenity to the the BD version of the The Fifth Element.


I'll tell you this though, I trust the Highdefdigest review quoted here by b2b.
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Fleshtones appear accurate, if a bit waxy.

Unfortunately, what 'Talladega Nights' suffers from is really awful contrast. I have no idea why it looks this way (and I didn't see it theatrically), [B]but it is as if the entire image has been completely flattened out and darkened. There is zero "pop" to the presentation -- it's like watching the video through a pair of polarized sunglasses.[/b] As a result, depth and detail appear surreal and washed out, and colors are nowhere near as vibrant as they could have been. There is certainly none of the three-dimensionality I'm accustomed to with great high-def. It's hard to describe until you see it, but it is telling that the deleted scenes on this disc, which are also presented in full 1080p and 2.35:1 widescreen, look much better. It is doubly a shame, as Sony is bundling 'Talladega Nights' with the launch of its PlayStation 3 next-gen game console -- I can only hope there is just something wrong with my eyes and I'm the only one who finds 'Talladega Nights' this unwatchable.

And just to note, this review was from BD 50 release and the version that's included with the PS3 is on a BD 25 disc so I can only imagine how the quality turned out on that one. Unfortunately I couldn't find a review of the PS3 playing it's included copy of the disc.
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post #65 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by smithfarmer View Post

This is intellectual honesty? That's like me asking you to compare the HD DVD copy of Serenity to the the BD version of the The Fifth Element.


I'll tell you this though, I trust the Highdefdigest review quoted here by b2b.


And just to note, this review was from BD 50 release and the version that's included with the PS3 is on a BD 25 disc so I can only imagine how the quality turned out on that one. Unfortunately I couldn't find a review of the PS3 playing it's included copy of the disc.

Well if you are going to "quote" my "quote" at least put all of it in... That might be considered "intellectual honesty"
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It doesn't seem like there is anything wrong with the source material, which looks as clean as a whistle. Grain is almost absent from the transfer, with solid blacks and consistent color saturation. I also noticed no chroma noise, compression artifacts or posterization. The film's color palette is quite bright and lively, with sun-drenched exteriors and a fine use of primary colors, in particular blues, reds and yellows. Fleshtones appear accurate, if a bit waxy.

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post #66 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by b2bonez View Post

Well if you are going to "quote" my "quote" at least put all of it in... That might be considered "intellectual honesty"


b2b

It wasn't pertinent as I had no disagreement with Anthony on that.
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post #67 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

I agree. As long as BD is priced higher than HD-DVD, then it MUST look significantly better than HD-DVD.

Huh? Blu-ray discs basically cost exactly the same as HD-DVDs.
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post #68 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Eternal_Sunshine View Post

Huh? Blu-ray discs basically cost exactly the same as HD-DVDs.

I think he was highlighting the player cost

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post #69 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 01:53 PM - Thread Starter
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In what looks like a strange twist these are the numbers I see in two owner head count polls.

PS3 Owners : 59

HD DVD Add-on Owners : 484
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post #70 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 02:28 PM
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This is intellectual honesty?

smithfarmer: what is? comparing things that don't exist to things that do?

Quote:


That's like me asking you to compare the HD DVD copy of Serenity to the the BD version of the The Fifth Element.

no I asked you to do what J6P will do, he will compare DVD to BD. If a reviewer does not think it is the best BD he saw who the hell cares. J6P did not see the best BD titles, and if he buys them and decides that it was a bad version and BD is much better then what Sony included then

a) it worked and got them to buy more BDs

b) they will think BD looks much better then what I thought.

Quote:


I'll tell you this though, I trust the Highdefdigest review quoted here by b2b.

Obviously you don't need to see the movie. Like all fanboys, find the worst review highlight the worst parts and pretend the movie is much worst.
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post #71 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 02:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

In what looks like a strange twist these are the numbers I see in two owner head count polls.

PS3 Owners : 59

HD DVD Add-on Owners : 484


OI!!!! the PS3 head count thread was created on the 17th. the XBox 360 head count has a week head start (HD DVD seems to have a head start on everything nowadays )

.. anyhow i dont agree to the move of the PS3 head count to the PS3 thread. i want the votes to be relevant to BD, that was why i created it in the BD player thread. hope mods can do something about that ...
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post #72 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by smithfarmer View Post

It wasn't pertinent as I had no disagreement with Anthony on that.


come on b2b the discussion was intelectual honesty and why would someone that will watch a movie that
Quote:


doesn't seem like there is anything wrong with the source material, which looks as clean as a whistle. Grain is almost absent from the transfer, with solid blacks and consistent color saturation. I also noticed no chroma noise, compression artifacts or posterization. The film's color palette is quite bright and lively, with sun-drenched exteriors and a fine use of primary colors, in particular blues, reds and yellows. Fleshtones appear accurate, if a bit waxy.

compared to an artifact full bad transfer DVD

we all know thanks to smithfarmer is that the only thing J6P cares about is
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There is certainly none of the three-dimensionality I'm accustomed to with great high-def

and so they won't buy into BD
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post #73 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

In what looks like a strange twist these are the numbers I see in two owner head count polls.

PS3 Owners : 59

HD DVD Add-on Owners : 484

Addendum to your data..

Toshiba A2 Owners : 0



b2b

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post #74 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 04:07 PM
 
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Originally Posted by b2bonez View Post

Addendum to your data..

Toshiba A2 Owners : 0



b2b

Addendum to your addendum:

Pioneer BDP-HD1 Owners: 0

Sony BDP-S1 Owners: 0

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post #75 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post

Sony can't stand HD DVD being there. Royalties are halved.

Royalties on a format remain the same whether you are talking about a Blu-ray/HD DVD player or a universal player. The only difference is that you get two sets of royalties for two HD formats with a universal player. One of the reasons I would prefer to have a clear victor in this format war.


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Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

In what looks like a strange twist these are the numbers I see in two owner head count polls.

PS3 Owners : 59

HD DVD Add-on Owners : 484

Interesting, but rather meaningless until we know how many HD DVD add-ons were released. In fact it is somewhat curious that Microsoft didn't bother to announce that number. Of course what would even be more useful is knowing how many HD DVD add-ons were sold.
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post #76 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 06:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post

Interesting, but rather meaningless until we know how many HD DVD add-ons were released. In fact it is somewhat curious that Microsoft didn't bother to announce that number. Of course what would even be more useful is knowing how many HD DVD add-ons were sold.

The HD-DVD Addon is collecting dust at stores all across So Cal. Theres 0 intrest in it. I'd also do a poll of how many of those Addon owners own A1's, if they answer honestly, it should be over 70% of them. Everytime i read a post about the Addon, it has "Unlike my A1" in it. Pretty funny.
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post #77 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by blitz6speed View Post

The HD-DVD Addon is collecting dust at stores all across So Cal. Theres 0 intrest in it. I'd also do a poll of how many of those Addon owners own A1's, if they answer honestly, it should be over 70% of them. Everytime i read a post about the Addon, it has "Unlike my A1" in it. Pretty funny.

Please oh please tell me you did not base your stats of the HD DVD add-on sell thru by measuring the dust level on its boxes......in south california no less.......
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post #78 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by blitz6speed View Post

The HD-DVD Addon is collecting dust at stores all across So Cal. Theres 0 intrest in it.

So Cal must be a very dusty place indeed

edit1 : Quite a few CCs are showing out of stock. Not sure exactly what is collecting dust

edit2 : Looks like most best buys are out of stock too. What is your zip code ... let me check what the websites say. At this point looks like your credibility is at 0.
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post #79 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post

Interesting, but rather meaningless until we know how many HD DVD add-ons were released.

Why ?

The poll shows many more avs people have the hd dvd add-on compared to ps3. What has that got to do with the release numbers ?

Quote:


In fact it is somewhat curious that Microsoft didn't bother to announce that number.

Why. How many such accessories have you seen numbers of ?
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post #80 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:09 PM
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No less valid than an AVS poll.
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post #81 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

Why ?

The poll shows many more avs people have the hd dvd add-on compared to ps3. What has that got to do with the release numbers ?

Because the release numbers would be more useful than a poll of people who own one on AVS Forum.


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Why. How many such accessories have you seen numbers of ?

Well a external HD DVD drive is slightly different than a controller so if a lot of them were going to be released I think Microsoft would have promoted that fact. After all Microsoft basically made the external HD DVD drive because of their involvement in the format war. As such I expected more press releases from them concerning the sales rate of the HD DVD drive.
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post #82 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post

Because the release numbers would be more useful than a poll of people who own one on AVS Forum.

Why ? If I want to know the level of interest in AVS, this is the right poll.

This is clearly a case of sour grapes


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Well a external HD DVD drive is slightly different than a controller so if a lot of them were going to be released I think Microsoft would have promoted that fact.

So is the wheel or the camera or ....
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post #83 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

Why ? If I want to know the level of interest in AVS, this is the right poll.

This is clearly a case of sour grapes

So is the wheel or the camera or ....

Considering there aren't any other HD-DVD players around (other than a few discontinued ones) it's more a case of no grapes rather than sour...

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post #84 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

I agree. As long as BD is priced higher than HD-DVD, then it MUST look significantly better than HD-DVD. Furthermore, it should CONSITENTLY be significantly better than HD-DVD. Especially when the BD camp have been claiming that BD is better than HD-DVD.

If you're stuck in October then perhaps. There is now a decent value Blu-ray player that does much more than the Toshibas. Hence my proposal that BD does not need to look any better than HD DVD (and again, it should look no worse because of the limited i.e. three codecs that they share, fundamentally).

Now, can BD look and sound better than HD DVD simply with its higher capacity and bandwidth? Definitely yes - logic dictates it.
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post #85 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 07:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

Why ? If I want to know the level of interest in AVS, this is the right poll.

This is clearly a case of sour grapes

Let's get it on

"HD-DVD is better; More videophiles think so (proof: AVS forum polls). J6P, you should realize this and buy it also. Marketing prowess, manufacturer choice, branding and content are irrelevant (Irrelevant, I tell you! What?! You don't agree with that? Umm, ok..) when price is less."


I am hopeful that this is Not how strategy is decided in HD-DVD corps. If it is, I think HD-DVD won't survive into 2008. As of now, I personally think HD-DVD will survive the long term (and I will buy a PS3).

Congrats to MS for selling more add-ons to AVS folk than sony sold PS3s. Now, lets wait for the market verdict in 2007
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post #86 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 08:15 PM
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Well a external HD DVD drive is slightly different than a controller so if a lot of them were going to be released I think Microsoft would have promoted that fact. After all Microsoft basically made the external HD DVD drive because of their involvement in the format war. As such I expected more press releases from them concerning the sales rate of the HD DVD drive.

Well, then again, let's see Sony's release numbers for the PS3. Exactly.

I would think no one is going to post numbers about an item they want to sell through the holiday until after the holiday is over. If you're going to see 360 add-on sales numbers, I'm thinking you'll see them in January. Much like I'm sure that's when you'll see Sony numbers.
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post #87 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

Why ? If I want to know the level of interest in AVS, this is the right poll.

This is clearly a case of sour grapes




So is the wheel or the camera or ....

Do you mean we can also do a poll on a PS3 fan site, and it will win the war for Sony? WOW!

Likewise, a poll on this forum would only tell us about the demographic of this forum. I also can't say for sure that this demographic hasn't been affected by the hostile presence of certain individuals here.

I will anticipate further comments by saying that while moderation on this forums have been very appropriate, there is just enough laxity that it has become a free-for-all match everyday.
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post #88 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Michael Mullis View Post

Well, then again, let's see Sony's release numbers for the PS3. Exactly.

I would think no one is going to post numbers about an item they want to sell through the holiday until after the holiday is over. If you're going to see 360 add-on sales numbers, I'm thinking you'll see them in January. Much like I'm sure that's when you'll see Sony numbers.

Sony doesn't seem to have a problem with quoting shipping numbers..
Quote:


Forbes.com: So how many PS3 units have actually made it from overseas as of Thursday?

Dille: In terms of putting location tracking devices on each unit and having them report back to us--well that's a little difficult. But we've shipped the units and are doing everything we can to get them to retail stores by midnight and tomorrow. Boats are out of the equation completely. That's not happening. We're taking every unit onto an airplane, and those planes are taking off regularly--it's a considerable expense, and we don't want to do that forever. We're comfortable we'll have the 400,000 within a week. Then we want a steady flow for the rest of the year--all planes. The cavalry is coming.

I would think that Microsoft should know how many addons they are having built and when they might ship a quantity of them.

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post #89 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 08:32 PM
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Come on b2b. The guy even said "In terms of putting location tracking devices on each unit and having them report back to us--well that's a little difficult." So they don't know either. And we both know Sony didn't launch the number of units that they said they would, and some estimates have been half that.

"We're comfortable we'll have the 400,000 within a week." isn't the same as "We've currently shipped 400,000 this week." and you know it.

So maybe there is the answer everyone's looking for. Maybe Microsoft isn't going to try and speculate how many add-on's they've sold. Maybe they're waiting to get concrete numbers together.

Yeah, Sony hasn't had a problem quoting shipping numbers. They also haven't been right yet.
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post #90 of 3949 Old 11-19-2006, 08:34 PM
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regarding the lack of HDMI on XBox add-on. From my POV, it's a non issue. By the time ICT is switched on (approx 2010 or later), you're already buying new players anyway....

You are confusing ICT with DOT (digital only token), which will become effective in 2010. Studios can turn on ICT anytime they want, or they can do it title by title. Even though I am happy with my Xbox HD DVD addon, I might still retunr it and wait for a sku with built-in HD DVD and HDMI.
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