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post #1471 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by stevenmh View Post

Why would WB be leaning blu when blu-exclusive studios are barely leaning blu? Saw an ad yesterday for one of the classic Disney animations, don't remember which one, being released in October. No mention of BR, just DVD. And then there's Fox. And I won't bring up hardware/profile issues.

My opinion is that WB is going to do the same thing Paramount did... take the path of least resistance to bring their HDM to the non-PS3 owning masses.

Masses? Masses of 200k HD-DVD onwers?
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post #1472 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by webphilosopher View Post

Rob,

You are way off the mark. Sony is going HD VMD exclusive. I know this for sure since I saw both Sony and HD VMD mentioned on the same web page somewhere. I will find the link as soon as I put out the fire in my laptop. Do you suppose there is something wrong with the battery?

I have to admit, that was quite funny!
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post #1473 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by wipron View Post

Times, they are-a-changin'.


little different quote,(i changed the bold) but close.

So you think ;-)

Blurays: 115
HD-DVD: 12- YES I will be keeping them so I can own a piece of history
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post #1474 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 08:00 PM
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Why would Sony go HD VMD? They like to use their own formats... and in this case it's UMD.

Look for Spider-Man 3 in H.264 on UMD come Xmas. It's going to be a 5 disc set. You heard it here first folks. Mark my words!

---

In any case... I see a lot of posts here claiming that they have contacts within companies like Warner. I do not doubt this, but it's interesting to see the different takes on info from those contacts. Some seem to think WB is leaning blue, while others seem to think WB is leaning red.

Without any insider info myself, I get the impression that the leaning may not be from the brass itself, but from these specific contacts. I'm sure that with a format neutral company like Warner, there are going to be differing opinions about this format war from their employees.
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post #1475 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 08:11 PM
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Right now it looks like Warner is going to be dual format exclusive. I am sure they are enjoying the banter and rumors here at AVS.
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post #1476 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddelrio View Post

Well, it's a common misconception that businesses only look at sales. They also look at things like manufacturing cost, yields, margins, and trends. Blu-Ray's lead has been decreasing--not increasing. Furthermore, the Blu-Ray profile debacle is likely to lead to consumer confusion in the future--potentially angering some consumers if advanced interactive features are added to future titles. Unfortunately for Blu-Ray fans, things aren't actually looking very good for Blu-Ray at the moment--regardless of sales numbers.

Blu Ray fans are feeling fine. HD DVD has trailed in media sales every week this year, trailed in standalone sales over the summer, and there's a fine selection of blockbusters on Blu Ray ahead on BD50's. Fox is now releasing again on Blu Ray, Warners has afirmed their dual format support, and we'll catch Transformers and Bourne on HD movie/vod channels - no loss.

HD DVD meanwhile is still waiting for that elusive magic bullet. Best of luck to you.
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post #1477 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by webphilosopher View Post

Right now it looks like Warner is going to be dual format exclusive. I am sure they are enjoying the banter and rumors here at AVS.

If I actually worked in "the biz," I think coming here would be the last thing on my list.
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post #1478 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by webphilosopher View Post

Rob,

You are way off the mark. Sony is going HD VMD exclusive. I know this for sure since I saw both Sony and HD VMD mentioned on the same web page somewhere. I will find the link as soon as I put out the fire in my laptop. Do you suppose there is something wrong with the battery?

ROFLMAO

I think this is the funniest post I've ever read on AVS.
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post #1479 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by brian1212 View Post

Blu Ray fans are feeling fine. HD DVD has trailed in media sales every week this year, trailed in standalone sales over the summer, and there's a fine selection of blockbusters on Blu Ray ahead on BD50's. Fox is now releasing again on Blu Ray, Warners has afirmed their dual format support, and we'll catch Transformers and Bourne on HD movie/vod channels - no loss.

HD DVD meanwhile is still waiting for that elusive magic bullet. Best of luck to you.

Still in denial I see. The fact is that it is Blu-ray that is still waiting for that 'elusive magic bullet' to kill HD DVD, but that bullet is nothing more than a figment of one's imagination. Keep in mind:

Blu-ray has lost major studio support since inception
Blu-ray has lost exclusive CE support since inception with LG/Samsung
Blu-ray attach rates are still abysmal overall
Blu-ray is incapable of killing HD DVD, and is in fact taking a huge beating
Blu-ray's software sales lead is diminishing
Blu-ray still trails behind HD DVD standalone sales
Blu-ray's entry price is still roughly twice the price of HD DVD
Blu-ray profile issues are still a mess
Blu-ray has failed to demonstrate superior PQ and AQ over HD DVD

HD DVD has gained exclusive studio support since inception
HD DVD has gained exclusive CE support with Onkyo/Integra/Venturer
HD DVD attach rates are up to 7 times better than BD
HD DVD has gained tremendous momentum since inception while BD has faltered
HD DVD software sales are steadily increasing and is closing the gap with BD
HD DVD's entry price is still about half that of BD
HD DVD has been a feature complete spec since day one
HD DVD produces top-rated PQ and AQ that at times exceeds the BD counterpart

Etc., etc., etc., ...

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post #1480 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddelrio View Post

Well, it's a common misconception that businesses only look at sales. They also look at things like manufacturing cost, yields, margins, and trends. Blu-Ray's lead has been decreasing--not increasing. Furthermore, the Blu-Ray profile debacle is likely to lead to consumer confusion in the future--potentially angering some consumers if advanced interactive features are added to future titles. Unfortunately for Blu-Ray fans, things aren't actually looking very good for Blu-Ray at the moment--regardless of sales numbers.

If I were a studio who was serious about future revenue, I'd trying hard evaluate why HDM is taking off like a lead balloon, if it's viable at all, and what I could do to turn things around. Warner, is probably the only studio in a place not only to evaluate the worth of HDM, but make a choice that dictates what way it will go. If they wait too long they will probably forfeit that choice, and I highly doubt they will let this opportunity pass them by.

Sales up to this point have to be almost dam-near meaningless, when you weigh them against having an opportunity to call out which of the two formats survive, regardless of past performance. If they think one is in their best interest for the future, that's the one they're going to pick, because they know their choice will succeed the other. If they want to take the ball and run, IMO they're going red because the price is right and the product is ready to roll. Barring of course the lure of up-front incentives (which they would get from either camp).

This I honestly believe, though six weeks ago I would never have predicted the Paramount move. It won't hurt me to be wrong, it just prolongs my own wait.
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post #1481 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:34 PM
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I think if HD DVD has a great Q4 and closes the gap even further, and the Profile thing still isn't finalized, Warner Bros. will most definitely go HD DVD exclusive. Just my opinion.
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post #1482 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:36 PM
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While we were all busy with the hoax................

FCC filing reveals new PlayStation 3 model
http://www.pocket-lint.co.uk/news/ne...S3-Model.phtml

Quote:


25 September 2007 22:54 GMT - Despite Sony's recent semi-denial of a 40GB PlayStation 3, first reported on Pocket-lint, the cheaper model, rumoured to be coming soon, just got a little bit more real thanks to a PS3 with a new model number making its way through the Federal Communications Commission testing process.

Most of the pertinent information, and all photographs of the product, have been withheld in order to "avoid premature release of sensitive information prior to marketing or release of the product to the public" and are not available for public view for 45 days from September 4th.

The test diagram submitted reveals that our predictions of a less-specced, or paired down model, appear to be true, with the new PS3, dubbed the "PS3 Lite" by the blogosphere, featuring only two USB ports and no memory card slots.

The main "Points of Difference" between this model and the "original" model have also been kept as confidential which means a direct comparison is not yet possible.

Obviously this is not conclusive evidence that the cheaper model is definitely on its way, but it could certainly be seen to suggest that we can expect a new model of PS3, likely an entry-level version, within the next 24 days...

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post #1483 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezra View Post

And just who are these "culprits"? A rumor is posted at blu-ray.com and you come over HERE demanding that heads should roll? Lee CLEARLY stated that he got the information from someone and he posted letting everyone know that it was a hoax.

If you want to go demanding suspensions I suggest you try the other site.

This thing came from a couple of people over here...it was discussed through P.M.s over here. I would say the request was justified. I would say it is relative to this forum.

You're entitled to your opinion but I am as well.

I didn't just "come over here" ,we've been here the same amount of time my friend.

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post #1484 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 10:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ddelrio View Post

Well, it's a common misconception that businesses only look at sales. They also look at things like manufacturing cost, yields, margins, and trends. Blu-Ray's lead has been decreasing--not increasing. Furthermore, the Blu-Ray profile debacle is likely to lead to consumer confusion in the future--potentially angering some consumers if advanced interactive features are added to future titles. Unfortunately for Blu-Ray fans, things aren't actually looking very good for Blu-Ray at the moment--regardless of sales numbers.

That's about as ridiculous a summation of events as I have ever heard. Truly an ostrich with his head in the sand comment.
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post #1485 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Fergy View Post

That's about as ridiculous a summation of events as I have ever heard. Truly an ostrich with his head in the sand comment.

Wow, what a rebuttal. I wonder who really has their head in the sand?

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post #1486 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Fergy View Post

That's about as ridiculous a summation of events as I have ever heard. Truly an ostrich with his head in the sand comment.

Since your location says Japan, you may have a different perspective from those of us in North America. In your market the PS3 is doing relatively well and BD is dominant. In North America, things are not going as well for the PS3, and while BD is doing ok, it's by no means dominant.

http://www.vgchartz.com/hwcomps.php?...merica&align=1
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post #1487 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by edgebsl View Post

This thing came from a couple of people over here...it was discussed through P.M.s over here. I would say the request was justified. I would say it is relative to this forum.

You're entitled to your opinion but I am as well.

You're entitled to an opinion, but it has not relationship with the facts.

a) The PM's happened after the post at Blu-ray.com
b) Lee said he was not consulted before the post
c) If you have any additional facts, let's hear them
d) In what country are you guilty by association when you had no knowledge of and did not find out about an act until after it happened?
e) If people are to banned at AVS for posting false or banning-level inflammatory posts at Blu-ray.com, then just about every blu-ray proponent who post both here and there should be banned by that measurement.
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post #1488 of 1560 Old 09-27-2007, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by johnu View Post

You're entitled to an opinion, but it has not relationship with the facts.

a) The PM's happened after the post at Blu-ray.com
b) Lee said he was not consulted before the post
c) If you have any additional facts, let's hear them
d) In what country are you guilty by association when you had no knowledge of and did not find out about an act until after it happened?
e) If people are to banned at AVS for posting false or banning-level inflammatory posts at Blu-ray.com, then just about every blu-ray proponent who post both here and there should be banned by that measurement.

If someone tells you they murdered someone, shows you the body, and you don't immediately inform the authorities, do ya think they might take a dim view of that? We're not talking about a capital offense in this case, but the principle is the same. AVS suffered some damage to its' reputation, based upon the actions of one of its' members. The Admins. have every right to hold anyone ( even someone indirectly ) involved at arms length and distance themselves from any appearance of condoning their actions. A temporary suspension is a fairly moderate sanction. Of course, on the flip side, even cops don't respect a rat. "Whoever" should have just kept his bloody mouth shut, because Lee was unfairly ensnared in a catch22 as soon as he blabbed about it.
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post #1489 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 12:12 AM
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I wonder if that new PS3 is the non-bluray model? A DVD-only version of the PS3 could certainly be launched, since game titles can mostly be published on DVD also - very few of them exceed 9 gigs. And a non-bluray PS3 would be able to save the Playstation franchise.

IMO, Warner has definitely put off an HD DVD decision, in order to give Bluray a last-chance. I am sure the BD folks begged/threatened Warner (yes, I think it was a combination of both) to give them more time.

But I don't see how even the most dedicated BD followers think that the picture will get any better for Bluray in the next 2 or 3 months. HD DVD is drawing closer in disc sales, the last true advantage that BD actually really has.

January will likely see a vastly different landscape for the format "war"...
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post #1490 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

I wonder if that new PS3 is the non-bluray model? A DVD-only version of the PS3 could certainly be launched, since game titles can mostly be published on DVD also - very few of them exceed 9 gigs. And a non-bluray PS3 would be able to save the Playstation franchise.

IMO, Warner has definitely put off an HD DVD decision, in order to give Bluray a last-chance. I am sure the BD folks begged/threatened Warner (yes, I think it was a combination of both) to give them more time.

But I don't see how even the most dedicated BD followers think that the picture will get any better for Bluray in the next 2 or 3 months. HD DVD is drawing closer in disc sales, the last true advantage that BD actually really has.

January will likely see a vastly different landscape for the format "war"...

Extremely unlikely. PS3 for all intents and purposes IS the incarnation of BD at this point in time.
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post #1491 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 12:29 AM
 
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Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

I wonder if that new PS3 is the non-bluray model? A DVD-only version of the PS3 could certainly be launched, since game titles can mostly be published on DVD also - very few of them exceed 9 gigs. And a non-bluray PS3 would be able to save the Playstation franchise.

IMO, Warner has definitely put off an HD DVD decision, in order to give Bluray a last-chance. I am sure the BD folks begged/threatened Warner (yes, I think it was a combination of both) to give them more time.

But I don't see how even the most dedicated BD followers think that the picture will get any better for Bluray in the next 2 or 3 months. HD DVD is drawing closer in disc sales, the last true advantage that BD actually really has.

January will likely see a vastly different landscape for the format "war"...

Just imagine how much more furious this would make the PS3 developers who already have a hard enough time as it is....I'm with jmpage2, not gonna' happen.
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post #1492 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

Extremely unlikely. PS3 for all intents and purposes IS the incarnation of BD at this point in time.

Totally agree there. I think it is more of a case of Blu-ray having a bad effect on PS3 sales myself. Well that and the complete lack of games.
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post #1493 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 01:09 AM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

Just imagine how much more furious this would make the PS3 developers who already have a hard enough time as it is....I'm with jmpage2, not gonna' happen.

Yup, as a PS3 developer myself, I can safely say there is no way this would ever happen. Truth be told, at this point the cost of the blu-ray drive is negligable. It wasn't so much the cost of the drive as the scarcity of certain components that made things a mess in the first place. Those problems have long since been sorted out.

The bulk of the cost of a blu-ray player is not in the actual disc-reading mechanism, but in all the other components that have to go along with it. Chips powerful enough to process high-bandwidth compressed signals and such cost a lot of money. In the case of the PS3, it has all this processing power anyways, so the incremental cost of installing a blu-ray enabled disc reader isn't that prohibitive.

Didn't you guys ever wonder why it was so easy for both blu-ray and HD-DVD to include players as computer components without significantly changing the cost of the computer (especially laptops)? It's because the cost of the drive itself isn't a big deal, and the computers already have the associated processing power and high bandwidth video circuitry.
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post #1494 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 02:27 AM
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Originally Posted by brian1212 View Post

Blu Ray fans are feeling fine. HD DVD has trailed in media sales every week this year, trailed in standalone sales over the summer, and there's a fine selection of blockbusters on Blu Ray ahead on BD50's. Fox is now releasing again on Blu Ray, Warners has afirmed their dual format support, and we'll catch Transformers and Bourne on HD movie/vod channels - no loss.

HD DVD meanwhile is still waiting for that elusive magic bullet. Best of luck to you.

You mean besides loss of PQ/SQ?

So you do know that the exact same argument could be made for HD DVD fans as well with the exclusive BD titles too right? Only difference is there are quite a few "so-called BD "exclusives" that can be imported for HD DVD since they are region free.

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post #1495 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 02:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Fergy View Post

That's about as ridiculous a summation of events as I have ever heard. Truly an ostrich with his head in the sand comment.

Have you ever taken business management classes? If you did, you would know that sales mean NOTHING if you are not making a profit off of those sales. If you lose money on every sale, then you might as well just stay in bed and watch a movie (on HD DVD of course ).

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post #1496 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 02:52 AM
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Originally Posted by MidnightWatcher View Post

Still in denial I see. The fact is that it is Blu-ray that is still waiting for that 'elusive magic bullet' to kill HD DVD, but that bullet is nothing more than a figment of one's imagination. Keep in mind:

Blu-ray has lost major studio support since inception
Blu-ray has lost exclusive CE support since inception with LG/Samsung
Blu-ray attach rates are still abysmal overall
Blu-ray is incapable of killing HD DVD, and is in fact taking a huge beating
Blu-ray's software sales lead is diminishing
Blu-ray still trails behind HD DVD standalone sales
Blu-ray's entry price is still roughly twice the price of HD DVD
Blu-ray profile issues are still a mess
Blu-ray has failed to demonstrate superior PQ and AQ over HD DVD

HD DVD has gained exclusive studio support since inception
HD DVD has gained exclusive CE support with Onkyo/Integra/Venturer
HD DVD attach rates are up to 7 times better than BD
HD DVD has gained tremendous momentum since inception while BD has faltered
HD DVD software sales are steadily increasing and is closing the gap with BD
HD DVD's entry price is still about half that of BD
HD DVD has been a feature complete spec since day one
HD DVD produces top-rated PQ and AQ that at times exceeds the BD counterpart

Etc., etc., etc., ...

never have I seen a post with so many factual information in one post bravo !!
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post #1497 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 03:00 AM
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Originally Posted by MidnightWatcher View Post


Blu-ray's entry price is still roughly twice the price of HD DVD

[...]

HD DVD's entry price is still about half that of BD

No kidding. If A = 2 * B, then usually B = 0.5 * A

Nice attempt at multiplying talking points.

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post #1498 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 03:28 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Grubert View Post

No kidding. If A = 2 * B, then usually B = 0.5 * A

Nice attempt at multiplying talking points.

No kidding. Here is what Pricegrabber.com returns for me

http://electronics.pricegrabber.com/...ay+player/rd=1

Appox. 50% seems about right for current gen players....excluding the xbox add on drive.
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post #1499 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 03:32 AM
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Originally Posted by plazman View Post

No kidding. Here is what Pricegrabber.com returns for me

http://electronics.pricegrabber.com/...ay+player/rd=1

Appox. 50% seems about right for current gen players....excluding the xbox add on drive.

I wasn't disputing the factual claim.

I was objecting to the presentation of the same claim twice with different (though equivalent) phrasing just to have an additional marketing bullet point - but I'm not teaching you anything new there, am I? .

Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
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post #1500 of 1560 Old 09-28-2007, 04:26 AM
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Oh dear!

I have just received some troubling news in regards to Warner Bros and the format war.

All I can say is that something has happened in the last 24hrs hours which may change a lot of things.

More to come soon!

Media Production (Film & TV) & Media Education Since 1984
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