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post #451 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Are the 3D tvs selling like hot cakes in your country Gary?

I've no idea to be honest, but there are lots of people advertising them in mags and on tv etc and I see them in the shops, whereas I only see 2.35 stuff being mentioned on forums, so it seems that the industry is for making and promoting 3D and doing very little for 235. That's what makes me think we've little chance of getting anamorphic disks. Both BD and HDMI are already 3D ready, whereas nothing has happenned for scope.

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Who says Cameron is "right" and why do we care about him so much - lol!

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post #452 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 04:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Gary Lightfoot View Post

I've no idea to be honest, but there are lots of people advertising them in mags and on tv etc and I see them in the shops, whereas I only see 2.35 stuff being mentioned on forums, so it seems that the industry is for making and promoting 3D and doing very little for 235. That's what makes me think we've little chance of getting anamorphic disks. Both BD and HDMI are already 3D ready, whereas nothing has happenned for scope.

Gary

Scope is definitely used by a minority group. Though once you show someone scope especially moving the lens into place once the movie begins then you get the uninterested interested.

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post #453 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 04:20 AM
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Very true - pity we can't get the industry as interested though!

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Originally Posted by elmalloc
Who says Cameron is "right" and why do we care about him so much - lol!

I trust Gary Lightfoot more than James Cameron.
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post #454 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Scope is definitely used by a minority group. Though once you show someone scope especially moving the lens into place once the movie begins then you get the uninterested interested.

That without a doubt is a cool effect.

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post #455 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 03:14 PM
 
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I'm wondering whether a $500 device can do conversions like PAL <-> NTSC with really good quality, though. I mean, for a "perfect" conversion you first have to deinterlace as good as possible (motion compensation etc), then you need great scaling algorithms and finally for perfect framerate conversion you would probably need to do some kind of clever intermediate frame interpolation. I don't think a $500 box could do any of the above in satisfactory quality.

The gear I'm referring to is amazingly good. It's been tested by the BBC, Fox, Warner Bros. NBC and many others. I spent an hour on the phone with their BBC World Chief Engineer - he's responsible for 47 television studios around the world - and he was begging me to send him shipments (we were experiencing a parts shortage at the time). He raved about it.

The gear uses absolutely cutting edge programmable logic - either Xilinx, Altera or Lattice depending on application - and works wonderfully well. It's all programmed in Verilog (not graphical input), and one of the more complicated devices runs the equivalent of 30 microprocessors simultaneously (not "module" processors you buy as macros from the manufacturer, but processors of his own design), in real time at 3.5 gig. clock speed (that's more than $500 though, about $1000 I recall). The guy who does the design is your original "brain in a bottle" - he eats, lives and breathes high definition. I haven't seen any professional video engineer ever object to the quality.

I left because we had an unresolvable disagreement, but I can't disagree with the quality of the gear. The gear is standard equipment for every Steadicam cameraman in the world (just about). One of the big camera companies (grudgingly) uses his gear because he does a better job with their RAW output signal than they do.

Can't say anymore due to an extant NDA, but PM me if you want contact details.
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post #456 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Gary Lightfoot View Post

Very true - pity we can't get the industry as interested though!

Gary

Over here the smaller hifi retailers are contemplating wether to do it but your right it's 3D that's taking over.

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post #457 of 623 Old 10-16-2010, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post


That without a doubt is a cool effect.

Well it has a few enquiring about it and they like the idea of removing the black bars and I mention about the cheaper lens available but after a week or so asking them wether there perusing it or not there not interested. Unfortunately this economy has put a lot of things on hold for many.

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post #458 of 623 Old 10-17-2010, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post

The gear I'm referring to is amazingly good. It's been tested by the BBC, Fox, Warner Bros. NBC and many others. I spent an hour on the phone with their BBC World Chief Engineer - he's responsible for 47 television studios around the world - and he was begging me to send him shipments (we were experiencing a parts shortage at the time). He raved about it.

The gear uses absolutely cutting edge programmable logic - either Xilinx, Altera or Lattice depending on application - and works wonderfully well. It's all programmed in Verilog (not graphical input), and one of the more complicated devices runs the equivalent of 30 microprocessors simultaneously (not "module" processors you buy as macros from the manufacturer, but processors of his own design), in real time at 3.5 gig. clock speed (that's more than $500 though, about $1000 I recall). The guy who does the design is your original "brain in a bottle" - he eats, lives and breathes high definition. I haven't seen any professional video engineer ever object to the quality.

I left because we had an unresolvable disagreement, but I can't disagree with the quality of the gear. The gear is standard equipment for every Steadicam cameraman in the world (just about). One of the big camera companies (grudgingly) uses his gear because he does a better job with their RAW output signal than they do.

Can't say anymore due to an extant NDA, but PM me if you want contact details.

I'm surprised that a $500/1000$ hardware can do this in good quality. But I'm still doubtfull that it's near "perfect quality" (meaning: maximum theoretically achievable quality, by using best algorithms known today). Ok, probably perfect quality doesn't exist today because the best algorithms don't run in realtime today. Anyway, from what I've seen, upscaled Blu-Rays, upscaled HD broadcasts and NTSC -> PAL conversions have all been pretty bad to my eyes. E.g. I'm daily shocked at how bad SD -> HD upscaling is when watching TV here in Germany. But I guess we're OT here, so I'll stop now...
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post #459 of 623 Old 10-17-2010, 01:52 PM
 
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post

I'm surprised that a $500/1000$ hardware can do this in good quality. But I'm still doubtfull that it's near "perfect quality" (meaning: maximum theoretically achievable quality, by using best algorithms known today). Ok, probably perfect quality doesn't exist today because the best algorithms don't run in realtime today. Anyway, from what I've seen, upscaled Blu-Rays, upscaled HD broadcasts and NTSC -> PAL conversions have all been pretty bad to my eyes. E.g. I'm daily shocked at how bad SD -> HD upscaling is when watching TV here in Germany. But I guess we're OT here, so I'll stop now...

It is an arcane argument: "Which is best?".

What amazed me working with this stuff just recently (early this year) was how a technology I first used in 1992 - Altera EPLDs - had progressed, even from 2005 when I last designed something using the then "latest" chip (never got built, though). I used their graphic interface for input - basically a "circuit diagram" approach - but apparently the real way to do it is to write Verilog code that cuts out the interpreter between graphics and silicon. Verilog is supposed to be ten times more efficient, if you're good at coding. These chips have thousand of times the logic capacity of their 1992 ancestors.

I gave up trying to understand the complexities of the 2010 version of programmable hardware and just concentrated on the production management side, a sad case (which comes to all of use eventually) of being content to regard a sufficiently advanced technology as indistinguishable from magic
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post #460 of 623 Old 10-17-2010, 11:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post

I enjoy all aspect ratios, Cinemascope ratios, Panavision Ratios, Odd ball ratios, all without black/grey bars on my setup except 4:3/1.33:1 on my horizontally maskable motorised 16:9 screen.

My next move is to mount a larger motorised maskable 16:9 screen in front of the existing one at the appropriate distance, so when viewing 2.35:1 films on the larger one it will be at the same vertical viewing angle as the smaller screen (behind it)displaying a 1.78:1 image.......essentially CIH by virtue of the viewing angle. By coinsidence the larger masked(to 2.35:1)16:9 screen will be the same area as the smaller unmasked 16:9 screen. This is achieved with a screen only 15% wider!

No scaling or A-Lens will be used, avoiding any scaling introduced softening/artifacts and not using an A-lens I can avoid pincushion etc. Sure the larger image will drop the On/Off CR a tad, but not that the eye will be able to detect...as I said the screen is only 15% wider. ANSI will be maintained, possibly increased as I will open up the iris a bit on the JVC for the larger screen.

With this set up I have the option viewing Imax type 16:9 presentations, at a higher height by raising the masking on the larger screen, than if I had a dedicated 2.35:1 screen, where I would have been restricted to the height of the 2.35:1 screen.

However say I had to reinstall in a different room and due to the projector placement/throw, if the ensuing image size was insufficent and it suffered inadiquate brightness, yes I would purchase an A-Lens.

If anamorphically encoded BluRays or other source material was available, yes without a doubt, I'd buy an A-Lens now!.........do like AB's A-Lens.

If your worried about pincushion, don't be. I measured mine at little over 1/4" or about 7-8 mm. Same goes for sharpness/resolving power. Comparing the image, Lens vs no Lens, at the pixel level shows this. I know if you ever had the chance to demo a top shelf A-Lens you would see the benefit. The problem is the cost. Its a very esoteric piece of equipment. Right off the top, maybe one in a hundred FP owners have purchased an A-Lens. And until you have one in your own system for a few hours, days, weeks can you begin to see the benefit of having one. Having said that, I could buy two RS40's for what I paid for my Isco. Currently its sitting on my dining room table. I walked by, started thinking of the purchase and kind of freaked out. But thats the cost if you wanna play the game. Its good new lower cost alternatives will be available. Sadly, I don't think it will make much of a difference. Unfortunately, I doubt anamorphic cinemascope will be coming to bluray anytime soon, unless a company like what Criterion did for LD, saves the day. I hear AIX is getting into the 3D game. Maybe they could help. It would take a company not bothered by small volume sales, to step up.
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post #461 of 623 Old 10-17-2010, 11:34 PM - Thread Starter
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What I find good is when calibrating the projector without the lens and then with the lens and there is no change in results that's a good indication in the quality of the lens.

Exactly. Good point.
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post #462 of 623 Old 10-17-2010, 11:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Gary Lightfoot View Post

I've no idea to be honest, but there are lots of people advertising them in mags and on tv etc and I see them in the shops, whereas I only see 2.35 stuff being mentioned on forums, so it seems that the industry is for making and promoting 3D and doing very little for 235. That's what makes me think we've little chance of getting anamorphic disks. Both BD and HDMI are already 3D ready, whereas nothing has happenned for scope.

Gary

One word, MONEY. Greed drives everything today. They will pass on the hundreds of thousands that 2.35 content and A-Lens sales would bring in, to get to the hundreds of millions that 3D brings in. Even though its the next step towards the progression to holography, 3D would be thrown to the wolves if it didn't produce. It does and hence the expansion of it at the rapid rate were seeing. Even I must admit I'm looking forward to my RS40 with great eagerness. And while it should be because of so many other reason like brightness, killer contrast, the 2.35 mode, its being my first LCOS and smooth film-like but sharp picture, it's because of it being 3D capable. Its the first thing I'll try. It may be days before I get around to watching 2D content and really evaluating the unit.
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post #463 of 623 Old 10-18-2010, 01:54 AM
 
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One of the sub-contractors who's doing some of the metal-finishing work on my lens finally asked me today "Well, what does this thing do?".

I explained what an anamorphic lens was and why some people liked them, and then he said, "Wow! Sounds great! We bought a 3D flat-screen the other day and watched the football Grand Final on it. Fantastic! Especially when some bod in the foreground popped up right in front of the camera and grinned into it... my wife nearly fainted... it was so realistic, he gave her a fright. Will your lens do the 3D thing?"

I explained to him that yes, of course it would... or rather wouldn't get in the way. But he won't be buying one soon as he's perfectly happy with his new, expensive LCD flatty, especially when the footy finals are on.

Having said that, I still haven't seen a 3D movie in a cinema (although have seen some SMPTE demos at "profesional" nights). Got a migrane from them. Saw Avatar in 2D, but couldn't image how a piece of melodramatic, cartoony schlock like Avatar could be improved by the addition of an extra dimension, or even two, or even a sex scene. Garbage is garbage, no matter how many dimensions it's in. Fell asleep in the big battle scene, it was so boring and predictable.

P.S. Rupert Murdoch making money out of it might have had something to do with my underwhelmment.
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post #464 of 623 Old 10-18-2010, 04:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post

One of the sub-contractors who's doing some of the metal-finishing work on my lens finally asked me today "Well, what does this thing do?".

I explained what an anamorphic lens was and why some people liked them, and then he said, "Wow! Sounds great! We bought a 3D flat-screen the other day and watched the football Grand Final on it. Fantastic! Especially when some bod in the foreground popped up right in front of the camera and grinned into it... my wife nearly fainted... it was so realistic, he gave her a fright. Will your lens do the 3D thing?"

I explained to him that yes, of course it would... or rather wouldn't get in the way. But he won't be buying one soon as he's perfectly happy with his new, expensive LCD flatty, especially when the footy finals are on.

Having said that, I still haven't seen a 3D movie in a cinema (although have seen some SMPTE demos at "profesional" nights). Got a migrane from them. Saw Avatar in 2D, but couldn't image how a piece of melodramatic, cartoony schlock like Avatar could be improved by the addition of an extra dimension, or even two, or even a sex scene. Garbage is garbage, no matter how many dimensions it's in. Fell asleep in the big battle scene, it was so boring and predictable.

P.S. Rupert Murdoch making money out of it might have had something to do with my underwhelmment.

Have to agree aussiebob 3D doesn't agree with me either but unfortunately it's the future.

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post #465 of 623 Old 10-18-2010, 04:31 AM
 
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Have to agree aussiebob 3D doesn't agree with me either but unfortunately it's the future.

It wasn't the medium that I loathed. It was the content. In any medium.
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post #466 of 623 Old 10-21-2010, 10:27 PM - Thread Starter
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And now we have another roadblock, no V-Stretch in 3D mode, which has caused at least a little angst in me. I can't imagine moving the lens out to zoom. The fact that there's little in the way of 2.35 3D content without paying a bundle(due to the fact that what 2.35 content there is, is pack-ins from starter kits), has led me to the decision that I'll record 3D content on the DVR(16x9 content) and wait until public release date's for 2.35 3D BR's. By then we should have an external VP that can scale 3D. I just can't bring myself to bypass the lens and zoom.

Like it or not, I think 3D is here for good. I don't like playing this endless upgrade game. With shorter and shorter product lifecycle's it can be overwhelming financially. New, perfectly good gear, is replaced at an increasingly rapid rate, many times out of necessity. Component video cables sure lasted a long time, didn't they. I sure hope my Lens isn't obsolete next year. I'd be pissed. I don't think so, as A-Lens seem to be gaining momentum. Here's hoping for a quick resolution to this potential major problem. Give me 3D scaling.
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post #467 of 623 Old 10-21-2010, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by coolrda View Post

And now we have another roadblock, no V-Stretch in 3D mode, which has caused at least a little angst in me. I can't imagine moving the lens out to zoom. The fact that there's little in the way of 2.35 3D content without paying a bundle(due to the fact that what 2.35 content there is, is pack-ins from starter kits), has led me to the decision that I'll record 3D content on the DVR(16x9 content) and wait until public release date's for 2.35 3D BR's. By then we should have an external VP that can scale 3D. I just can't bring myself to bypass the lens and zoom.

Like it or not, I think 3D is here for good. I don't like playing this endless upgrade game. With shorter and shorter product lifecycle's it can be overwhelming financially. New, perfectly good gear, is replaced at an increasingly rapid rate, many times out of necessity. Component video cables sure lasted a long time, didn't they. I sure hope my Lens isn't obsolete next year. I'd be pissed. I don't think so, as A-Lens seem to be gaining momentum. Here's hoping for a quick resolution to this potential major problem. Give me 3D scaling.

Just to give you an idea SD DVD are still going strong, why? Price. It's cheap. Not many care for 3D as you think.

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post #468 of 623 Old 10-22-2010, 05:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolrda View Post

And now we have another roadblock, no V-Stretch in 3D mode, which has caused at least a little angst in me. I can't imagine moving the lens out to zoom. The fact that there's little in the way of 2.35 3D content without paying a bundle(due to the fact that what 2.35 content there is, is pack-ins from starter kits), has led me to the decision that I'll record 3D content on the DVR(16x9 content) and wait until public release date's for 2.35 3D BR's. By then we should have an external VP that can scale 3D. I just can't bring myself to bypass the lens and zoom.

Like it or not, I think 3D is here for good. I don't like playing this endless upgrade game. With shorter and shorter product lifecycle's it can be overwhelming financially. New, perfectly good gear, is replaced at an increasingly rapid rate, many times out of necessity. Component video cables sure lasted a long time, didn't they. I sure hope my Lens isn't obsolete next year. I'd be pissed. I don't think so, as A-Lens seem to be gaining momentum. Here's hoping for a quick resolution to this potential major problem. Give me 3D scaling.

I'm pretty sure Lumagen has 3D support. Just releasd it recently. I haven't looked into the details, but IIRC, the stretch was one of the things it was doing. I've always loved their products, they do an outstanding job.
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post #469 of 623 Old 10-22-2010, 05:18 AM
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I'm pretty sure Lumagen has 3D support. Just releasd it recently. I haven't looked into the details, but IIRC, the stretch was one of the things it was doing. I've always loved their products, they do an outstanding job.

Duo is also releasing 3D support

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post #470 of 623 Old 10-22-2010, 06:09 AM
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I'm pretty sure Lumagen has 3D support. Just releasd it recently. I haven't looked into the details, but IIRC, the stretch was one of the things it was doing. I've always loved their products, they do an outstanding job.

Yes, the new 3D firmware for the Radiance XE/XS will support all of the current features for both 3D and 2D. It is getting ready for the beta stage at this time, which I will hopefully be participating in.

There are 10 types of people: those who understand binary, and those who don't.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

I'm pretty sure Lumagen has 3D support.
Just releasd it recently.
I haven't looked into the details, but IIRC, the stretch was one of the things it was doing.
I've always loved their products, they do an outstanding job.

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Originally Posted by HogPilot View Post

Yes, the new 3D firmware for the Radiance XE/XS will support all of the current features for both 3D and 2D.
It is getting ready for the beta stage at this time, which I will hopefully be participating in.

jrp post link

Beta $299
Post-beta $499

Beta expected to last 3-4 months.


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post #472 of 623 Old 10-22-2010, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolrda View Post

If your worried about pincushion, don't be. I measured mine at little over 1/4" or about 7-8 mm. Same goes for sharpness/resolving power. Comparing the image, Lens vs no Lens, at the pixel level shows this. I know if you ever had the chance to demo a top shelf A-Lens you would see the benefit. The problem is the cost. Its a very esoteric piece of equipment. Right off the top, maybe one in a hundred FP owners have purchased an A-Lens. And until you have one in your own system for a few hours, days, weeks can you begin to see the benefit of having one. Having said that, I could buy two RS40's for what I paid for my Isco. Currently its sitting on my dining room table. I walked by, started thinking of the purchase and kind of freaked out. But thats the cost if you wanna play the game. Its good new lower cost alternatives will be available. Sadly, I don't think it will make much of a difference. Unfortunately, I doubt anamorphic cinemascope will be coming to bluray anytime soon, unless a company like what Criterion did for LD, saves the day. I hear AIX is getting into the 3D game. Maybe they could help. It would take a company not bothered by small volume sales, to step up.

My goal is the best quality image and the two screen (CIH+CIA+CVIA) method will give me a better image quality than the very best A-Lens implimentation with non anamorphically encoded source material......as no scaling, filtering or additional optical expansion is implemented.

If one's projector's throw is insufficient to produce the image size one seeks or the brightness is insuficient then an A-Lens is one possible solution.

Interesting post here from Wolfgang Mayer on his tests with the ISCO3(same lens as yours?)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=242

"i post here at avs many times that the use of such a anamorphic
lens even if you use the best one the isco3 will decrease the
picture quality.
as i had in the past years 3 stacks with 2 pr.
-2 qualia
-2 christie hd6k(the one with the xenon lamp)
-2 benq w 5000

with the qualia and at the christie i can test this isco lens and i found
out that the best is to have not such a lens in front of the
pr.
in some set up its may a option as it can encrease the light out but
when you look for the best picture quality you should not use it.

you can see the decrease easy when you can switch fast between it
but your eye cant remember it when you see today a set up
without the isco3 and tomorror with it.

you have to have switch between it in sec. to see the impact such
a lens have.
when i sale one of the christie hd 6k about 8 months ago
i demo this to the buyer.
than he not want it anymore.
to bad for me i not sale it and the lens is still for sale if someone need it."

May the success of a Nation be judged not by its collective wealth nor by its power, but by the contentment of its people.
Hiran J Wijeyesekera - 1985.
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post #473 of 623 Old 10-22-2010, 07:59 PM
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People I know switch their IIILs in an out in less than a second all the time. Never heard that before.
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post #474 of 623 Old 10-22-2010, 10:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post


My goal is the best quality image and the two screen (CIH+CIA+CVIA) method will give me a better image quality than the very best A-Lens implimentation with non anamorphically encoded source material......as no scaling, filtering or additional optical expansion is implemented.

If one's projector's throw is insufficient to produce the image size one seeks or the brightness is insuficient then an A-Lens is one possible solution.

Interesting post here from Wolfgang Mayer on his tests with the ISCO3(same lens as yours?)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=242

"i post here at avs many times that the use of such a anamorphic
lens even if you use the best one the isco3 will decrease the
picture quality.
as i had in the past years 3 stacks with 2 pr.
-2 qualia
-2 christie hd6k(the one with the xenon lamp)
-2 benq w 5000

with the qualia and at the christie i can test this isco lens and i found
out that the best is to have not such a lens in front of the
pr.
in some set up its may a option as it can encrease the light out but
when you look for the best picture quality you should not use it.

you can see the decrease easy when you can switch fast between it
but your eye cant remember it when you see today a set up
without the isco3 and tomorror with it.

you have to have switch between it in sec. to see the impact such
a lens have.
when i sale one of the christie hd 6k about 8 months ago
i demo this to the buyer.
than he not want it anymore.
to bad for me i not sale it and the lens is still for sale if someone need it."

Each to there own

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post #475 of 623 Old 10-23-2010, 02:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post

My goal is the best quality image and the two screen (CIH+CIA+CVIA) method will give me a better image quality than the very best A-Lens implimentation with non anamorphically encoded source material......as no scaling, filtering or additional optical expansion is implemented.

If one's projector's throw is insufficient to produce the image size one seeks or the brightness is insuficient then an A-Lens is one possible solution.

Interesting post here from Wolfgang Mayer on his tests with the ISCO3(same lens as yours?)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=242

"i post here at avs many times that the use of such a anamorphic
lens even if you use the best one the isco3 will decrease the
picture quality.
as i had in the past years 3 stacks with 2 pr.
-2 qualia
-2 christie hd6k(the one with the xenon lamp)
-2 benq w 5000

with the qualia and at the christie i can test this isco lens and i found
out that the best is to have not such a lens in front of the
pr.
in some set up its may a option as it can encrease the light out but
when you look for the best picture quality you should not use it.

you can see the decrease easy when you can switch fast between it
but your eye cant remember it when you see today a set up
without the isco3 and tomorror with it.

you have to have switch between it in sec. to see the impact such
a lens have.
when i sale one of the christie hd 6k about 8 months ago
i demo this to the buyer.
than he not want it anymore.
to bad for me i not sale it and the lens is still for sale if someone need it."

I think a great many people who have done the A/B lens/zooming option have come to a completely different conclusion, especially those who prefer closer seating distances. If the image was inferior, they wouldn't have bought the lens. We've no idea if it was a set up problem in his case, but I wouldn't have thought those who've done the comparison would have spent money to deliberately reduce the quality of the image they were seeing.

Gary

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Who says Cameron is "right" and why do we care about him so much - lol!

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post #476 of 623 Old 10-23-2010, 05:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post

My goal is the best quality image and the two screen (CIH+CIA+CVIA) method will give me a better image quality than the very best A-Lens implimentation with non anamorphically encoded source material......as no scaling, filtering or additional optical expansion is implemented.

Please do come to the next GTG at Selbys HJ. I will have something to show that I am sure even you will be impressed by.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
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post #477 of 623 Old 10-23-2010, 05:29 AM
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Quote:
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Please do come to the next GTG at Selbys HJ. I will something to show that I am sure even you will be impressed by.

Selbys, where is that?

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post #478 of 623 Old 10-23-2010, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
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Selbys, where is that?

Melbourne. The next CIH gathering is the 19th of November. Last time we had to close the numbers at 50 and I think 42 attended. It was good night and those that attended got to see a number of products including a new subwoofer from Krix.

Mark Techer

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post #479 of 623 Old 10-23-2010, 05:42 AM
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Melbourne. The next CIH gathering is the 19th of November. Last time we had to close the numbers at 50 and I think 42 attended. It was good night and those that attended got to see a number of products including a new subwoofer from Krix.

Everything is Melbourne

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post #480 of 623 Old 10-23-2010, 05:45 AM
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Quote:
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Everything is Melbourne

Yeah and a short flight for me

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I love my Constant Image Height system!
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