Why O Why????........ - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 17 Old 05-26-2014, 01:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Why O Why???......

did I wait one and a half years to install my Panamorph 480?? It only took an hour. I thought it was going to be a huge chore to do what I wanted. The picture from my JVC 4810 was gorgeous before zoomed out but it is breath-taking and much more film-like with the 480 using the OPPO 105 to stretch the image.

OWA TAJER KIAM! OWA TANI DIOT IAM!

Does anyone know how to make the OPPO 105 stretch the image at all times since I am going to leave the lens in place all of the time? I know, I know... 16:9 content is better without a lens but it would be too much of a hassle to move it in and out. It is installed inside a wall now.

Maybe I will make it moveable a year and a half from now:D
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post #2 of 17 Old 05-26-2014, 05:11 PM
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I sort of know what you mean. I was intimidated by the idea of setting up my UH480 as well.

I like zooming, but I use the 480 for my largest image sizes and I'm continually amazed at the clarity of the image! Wonderful lens!
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post #3 of 17 Old 05-26-2014, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Ya, the thing is, the 480 is really pretty easy to set up (compared to lesser quality lenses.) At least it is easy to get 90% of where you want to be very, very quickly. I just over-scanned the image onto the velvet covered screen frame, focused in the middle and didn't worry about focusing the entire 10' wide screen (which the projector COULD do).

If I was as anal about the image as I used to be it would be another story. I was going to build a big track system inside the wall to slide the lens in and out of the light path but ended up just setting it up permanently installed instead. I mainly want the better image on movies which are mostly 2.35 anyway so there ya go.

Just watched Star Trek and X-Men and the images seem more real, more solid, less digital and more CRT-like. I LIKE IT!!
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post #4 of 17 Old 05-27-2014, 09:58 AM
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The hardest part of installing the 480 is adjusting the angle just right so that picture geometry is accurate. That took quite me a bit of trial and error with a grid test pattern and a measuring tape.

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post #5 of 17 Old 05-27-2014, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

The hardest part of installing the 480 is adjusting the angle just right so that picture geometry is accurate. That took quite me a bit of trial and error with a grid test pattern and a measuring tape.

Agreed. Once I got it as good as it will get, I feel like I dare not touch it again.
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post #6 of 17 Old 05-28-2014, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post

Agreed. Once I got it as good as it will get, I feel like I dare not touch it again.

Unfortunately, mine is ceiling mounted on a manual slide. Ever time I move the lens, I risk jostling it or the projector out of alignment!

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post #7 of 17 Old 05-28-2014, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post

Why O Why???......

did I wait one and a half years to install my Panamorph 480?? It only took an hour. I thought it was going to be a huge chore to do what I wanted. The picture from my JVC 4810 was gorgeous before zoomed out but it is breath-taking and much more film-like with the 480 using the OPPO 105 to stretch the image.

OWA TAJER KIAM! OWA TANI DIOT IAM!

Does anyone know how to make the OPPO 105 stretch the image at all times since I am going to leave the lens in place all of the time? I know, I know... 16:9 content is better without a lens but it would be too much of a hassle to move it in and out. It is installed inside a wall now.

Maybe I will make it moveable a year and a half from now:D

Welcome to a-lens user club Ed!


fwiw, I still get lens droop every so often, it's a basic design issue of the mtg system, discussed here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1136365/panamorph-uh380-480-lens-droop
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post #8 of 17 Old 05-28-2014, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
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I have no lens droop, it isn't possible. I built a cradle that the lens sits in and it has nowhere to go!
Watching the XMen movies in anticipation of 'Days of Future Past' this weekend. It is like I am discovering home theater all over again. Much more real looking, way less digital.
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post #9 of 17 Old 05-28-2014, 10:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Now that the lens is in place I am going to seal the wall off separating the theater from the projection room. Glass should be ready tomorrow. Nice thing is, they have the opti-white glass ten minutes from my house. If all goes well I will probably order Edmund's Optics AR coated glass and switch it out with the pieces I am getting cheap tomorrow.
Looking forward to having a dead silent viewing room !!
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post #10 of 17 Old 06-01-2014, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post


Does anyone know how to make the OPPO 105 stretch the image at all times since I am going to leave the lens in place all of the time? I know, I know... 16:9 content is better without a lens but it would be too much of a hassle to move it in and out. It is installed inside a wall now.

 

 

 

You need something panamorph calls "mode II" processing in your video chain:  

 

       http://avscience.com/2013/02/how-panamorph-anamorphic-lenses-work/

 

In my case I had a DVDO iscan processor on hand that does it. Purchased before the OPPO 103, in my case.

 

Mode II compresses the image in the horizontal direction, perfectly cancelling out the stretch of the anamorphic lens and displaying 16:9 content with the proper geometry. However, this mode reduces the resolution of 16:9 sources to 1440×1080.

 

You can find DVDO VP50 pro's for $450-$500 used. It's been discontinued for a few years, and was a bit 'tempermental". Some firmware revs are "good" some should be avoided. The DVDO Duo is still sold and probably does Mode I and II, but I have not checked this.

 

So I can leave the A-lens in place and electronically change from Mode I ( 2.35:1) to Mode II (16:9) to preserve the correct geometry. The DVDO Duo costs about what a motorized sled for the Panamorph lens costs. In my case my LCOS projector has intake and exhaust on the front of the projector so sliding the lens to either side blocked air flow. Not an option.

 

Maybe with some encouragement, OPPO will implement Mode II in their latest firmware. Since they do Mode I that means they support separate input and output aspect ratios which is what is needed in h/w. The built-in support for 4K would suggest they could improve on the 1440×1080 re-scale.

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post #11 of 17 Old 06-06-2014, 12:12 PM
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Most projectors have "Mode II" built in, except it is almost always called "4:3" mode. It's a simple 25% electronic reduction in image width.

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post #12 of 17 Old 07-01-2014, 07:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post
Now that the lens is in place I am going to seal the wall off separating the theater from the projection room. Glass should be ready tomorrow. Nice thing is, they have the opti-white glass ten minutes from my house. If all goes well I will probably order Edmund's Optics AR coated glass and switch it out with the pieces I am getting cheap tomorrow.<br>
Looking forward to having a dead silent viewing room !!
I'm curious to hear more about what you're doing with the Edmund's Optics AR coated glass.

It sounds like I have a similar setup to you. My PJ and equipment is in a separate room behind the back wall of my theater and I have a fixed anamorphic lens (in my case, an older UH-380 which I'm quite happy with). I mostly watch Blu-rays but when I watch 1.85:1 or similar content, or regular HD television, I use a custom setting to properly display it through the A-lens.

I can still hear some very minor PJ noise coming through the hole I have in the wall that the PJ shoots through and lens mostly sits in and it would be nice to completely seal it off but I didn't want to further impact the light path (now re-thinking this). How are you mounting/installing the glass? I would like to avoid having to do any more carpentry or repainting (mainly because I'm lazy and I don't want to mess up my newly remodeled theater) but I was thinking if I mounted the glass into a frame exactly cut to fit the hole I could install it with hardly any messing with what I have already built. Photo of my current lens opening attached.
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post #13 of 17 Old 07-01-2014, 08:10 AM - Thread Starter
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That looks an awful lot like my set up. I will try to remember to take a pic tonight and post it.

Looking at your pic, do you have much pincushion? I had my lens mounted high and straight on the projector like yours and got a lot of pincushion. It was a little bit of work but I tilted the front of the lens down and evened out the image on the screen a lot. If you are happy with the way your 380 is working now I wouldn't worry about it, I just thought I would throw that out there.

You are on the right track with your plan to mount the glass in a frame and fasten the frame behind the hole in the wall. I got an 8x10 picture frame and put an 8 x 10 piece of glass in it. It was then an easy task to slide the frame with the glass in it up to the back of the hole and secure it in place with a couple of blocks. Everything between the projector and the glass is covered with black velvet to absorb light and keep it from washing out the picture.

I experimented with a piece of water glass from the glass factory 10 miles from my house first. It didn't seem to degrade the picture but I did get a 'ghost' of refracted light spilling down over my shoulders. I have noticed this effect in the local movie theater. I sit in the back by the projection booth and there is a reflected image that spills down onto the back rows. Very annoying.

The theater became dead silent when the glass went in. Lowered the noise floor immensely and made everything way better so, since I liked the result, I decided to spend the $58 on an 8" X 10" piece of AR coated Edmunds Optics glass. The Edmunds glass is well worth the money. I got the thicker 3mm piece to help with sound and it didn't degrade the pic at all. The anti-reflective coating removed the ghost image I was getting with the other glass. I couldn't be happier with the Edmunds AR glass and highly recommend it. That $58 and whatever you spend on a frame to mount it with will be money well spent.

One other thing to mention is that I have an excellent ventilation system set up on a 12v trigger for the projector. Without that I would be hesitant to totally enclose the projector for fear that it would not get enough air movement and overheat.
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post #14 of 17 Old 07-01-2014, 09:53 AM
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Looking forward to seeing your pics.

I haven't really had any pincushioning issues. I fiddled around a little when I first set it up, experimenting with lens height and tilt while projecting a test grid, and I ended up with maybe half an inch at each end of the screen that I tried to even out between top and bottom. If it makes any difference, I have my PJ mounted pretty much dead center to the screen, and I'm throwing at around 18 feet.

If I do this I would like to insert the framed glass into the wall cavity from the front, as I have my lens poking into this cavity from behind the wall, although it's still recessed several inches from the front (I used 2x6's to frame the back wall). I suppose I could move the lens/PJ back but I was trying to keep the site lines on the cavity clear with a smaller opening, if that makes sense. I could experiment to see how far back I could move the PJ and lens but I kind of like how I have it currently set up. My opening is roughly 7 5/8 wide and 5 3/4 tall so I presume I could get the glass cut to size, maybe 7 1/2 by 5 1/2, and DIY a black-painted wooden frame that would fit snug inside, close to flush with the inside (or theater-side) wall.

I'm not too concerned about ventilation since the PJ and equipment is actually in another room (as opposed to a closet) close to the same size as the theater. Actually this was originally one giant theater with 3 rows of seats on 2-level risers, but it was way overkill and didn't really work with what I wanted to do with my remodel. I now have 5 seats in one row, which actually works great (even at the extreme left and right) for both picture and sound. Most of the time we're only using the center 3 seats anyway, and often I'm solo.
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post #15 of 17 Old 07-01-2014, 11:28 AM - Thread Starter
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no reason you could not put the frame on the outside. Just go on the Edmunds optical side and see what sizes the AR glass comes in. I got my glass next day in Indiana.
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post #16 of 17 Old 07-15-2014, 09:51 AM
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Can you have this glass cut to size like any other glass? Just wondering if cutting it damages the coating adjacent to the cut or scour.
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post #17 of 17 Old 07-15-2014, 10:01 AM - Thread Starter
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I dont know but you can contact edmunds and their cust service will get with you very quickly in my experience
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