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post #1 of 24 Old 09-03-2017, 01:21 AM - Thread Starter
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2.35:1 CIH with 3D Projector??

Hi I just decided to just do it and get the 3D now. but I was wondering if I buy all needed can you do CIH 2.35:1 with a 3D Setup and anamorphic lens..


here is what I was planning on getting..




1. DIY anamorphic lens if needed.
2. Oppo UDP-203 Blu ray
3. Optoma HD142x DLP PRojector.
4. 2.35 Screen I have just need to build it DIY..




Now I vagely remeber saying it might be possible but I wanted to find out for sure if it would be possible with said gear, before I buy the Prisms..


Thank You.
Nephilim'

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post #2 of 24 Old 09-04-2017, 08:12 PM
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You can do 2.35:1 CIH without an add-on lens using the Zoom Method. It's much easier and cheaper, and is the recommended way to start out. You can always add a lens later if you're not satisfied.

And yes, you can do CIH with 3D.

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post #3 of 24 Old 09-04-2017, 10:03 PM - Thread Starter
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OK If I did the Zoom Method would that be the same size of screen as when I would do with a A-Lens??


I ask because I have the screen and I can get the Projector and find the size of the screen and build it as I bought material just need to make a frame..


But I would like to find out the final size with the A-Lens inplace and if it would be the same size as if I zoomed it??


Thank you for the answer too

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post #4 of 24 Old 09-05-2017, 07:44 AM
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OK If I did the Zoom Method would that be the same size of screen as when I would do with a A-Lens??
That depends on the throw ratio of the projector. You can find a calculator for your model here:

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Opto...ulator-pro.htm

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post #5 of 24 Old 09-05-2017, 04:55 PM - Thread Starter
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well that webpage states the throw ratio is 1.48 - 1.62. a zoom factor of 1.1.. is there a formula I can use to get an idea of the size when zoomed and when with an A-Lens??

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post #6 of 24 Old 09-06-2017, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Nephilim1 View Post
well that webpage states the throw ratio is 1.48 - 1.62. a zoom factor of 1.1.. is there a formula I can use to get an idea of the size when zoomed and when with an A-Lens??
That means for every 1.48-1.62 feet back from the screen your projected image is 1 foot wide. So 14.8 feet back gives a 10 foot wide image.
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post #7 of 24 Old 09-06-2017, 10:07 AM
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well that webpage states the throw ratio is 1.48 - 1.62. a zoom factor of 1.1.. is there a formula I can use to get an idea of the size when zoomed and when with an A-Lens??
There's a calculator right on that page. Use the sliders to input your throw distance from the screen and zoom setting, and it will do the math for you.

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post #8 of 24 Old 09-07-2017, 01:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Well I thought the size of the screen would change when the A-Lens is inplace.. but that made a 2.35:1 screen of 106" but the 16:9 screen was 111" diagonal.. I am going to have to figure what to do here incase I want to watch HDTV..


I may make the screen huge and just mask the rest off when viewing differnt AR..


Thank you fo all the help everybody

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post #9 of 24 Old 09-07-2017, 06:33 PM
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Well I thought the size of the screen would change when the A-Lens is inplace.. but that made a 2.35:1 screen of 106" but the 16:9 screen was 111" diagonal.. I am going to have to figure what to do here incase I want to watch HDTV..
The calculators on Projector Central only do the math for 2.35:1 with the Zoom Method, assuming no anamorphic lens.

For a horizontal expansion lens, use the calculator to find out the size of a 16:9 image and then multiply the screen width by 1.33x.

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post #10 of 24 Old 09-07-2017, 06:56 PM - Thread Starter
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OH, OK that is what I was talking about earlier that Formula was what I am after.. THNX for that. I need to do some measuring in my room now to find out how big a screen I can go.. I will try and see what the reccomended size is for my screen distance from the front row.


Here are my initial measurments for the 2.39:1 screen.. 45"Height x 108" Wide x 117" diagonal..
I did not check my first row seating but I think it is 14' back.. the 2nd row is about 18'




EDIT: I just checked I need to move the Projector back a bit which will not be too much trouble.. now to find an A-Lens.. I will need to get a more accurate measurment on how far back it will need to be.. So when I get the Proj. I will line it up and get more accurate with it in place hand held at first..


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post #11 of 24 Old 09-08-2017, 06:15 PM - Thread Starter
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well according to the projector central calculator and the W x 1.33 rule the new Projector needs to sit at 10.5Feet.. this may pose a problem..




EDIT: I just looked again at the calculator and if I do the Zoom method I can leave the projector almost where it is now.. I think I will try that first and see how it goes maybe I will not bother with the lens..


What I do not quite get is if I want to watch another AR or HDTV Will the image be taller when unzooming the image then the screen size of the 2.35:1 screen I made up when zoomed in?


Or will I be limited to only watching 2.35 Content with that screen in place..


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post #12 of 24 Old 09-11-2017, 10:35 AM
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What I do not quite get is if I want to watch another AR or HDTV Will the image be taller when unzooming the image then the screen size of the 2.35:1 screen I made up when zoomed in?


Or will I be limited to only watching 2.35 Content with that screen in place..
The idea is that you zoom in when watching 2.35:1 content and zoom out when watching 16:9 content. Assuming that the projector has enough zoom range.

A 45" high screen is just shy of 92" diagonal for 16:9. According to the calculator, the minimum distance your projector can hit this is 9'11" at maximum zoom, but that gives you no option for zooming larger for CIH.

Minimum zoom requires 10'10". At that distance, the largest image you can get with maximum zoom is 95" diagonal (37" high). So, no, you wouldn't be able to do CIH with zoom alone, unfortunately.

Your best bet is 10' throw distance with a horizontal expansion lens. Minimum zoom gives you an 81" wide image. Multiply by 1.33x with the lens for 107.73" width (116.58" diagonal 2.39:1).

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post #13 of 24 Old 09-11-2017, 11:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi Sorry for the confusion. I calculated 10.5' for when the lens is in place. the Projector for using the Zoom method is going to be at about 13.6'


I did the math according to the formula you gave me.. but currently the Projector calculator showed for the Zoom method and a 108" @ 2.35:1 would need to be about 13.6' distance on the projector to the screen..


Is the Proj. Calculator wrong??

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post #14 of 24 Old 09-11-2017, 01:18 PM
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Hi Sorry for the confusion. I calculated 10.5' for when the lens is in place. the Projector for using the Zoom method is going to be at about 13.6'


I did the math according to the formula you gave me.. but currently the Projector calculator showed for the Zoom method and a 108" @ 2.35:1 would need to be about 13.6' distance on the projector to the screen..


Is the Proj. Calculator wrong??
The easiest way to think of the scope screen projection throw distance when zooming is to consider that the projector is actually projecting a 16:9 image of the equivalent width. So if your scope screen is 108" wide I throw that into the measurements here:

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Opto...ulator-pro.htm

And get 13' 4" as the minimum distance needed. I get that same measurement using a 16:9 screen 108" wide and a 2.35:1 108" wide.

With a lens you don't generally need any extra distance as the projector's anamorphic mode (it has to have this to work with the lens btw) will stretch the image and the lens expands it to fill the screen. Keep in mind lenses will look better with a longer throw distance vs. a short one due to the optical distortions. So even with a lens you'd want to move it further back than the minimum throw if possible.

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post #15 of 24 Old 09-11-2017, 02:23 PM
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With a lens you don't generally need any extra distance as the projector's anamorphic mode (it has to have this to work with the lens btw) will stretch the image and the lens expands it to fill the screen. Keep in mind lenses will look better with a longer throw distance vs. a short one due to the optical distortions. So even with a lens you'd want to move it further back than the minimum throw if possible.
Good point. At 10', he'd have to deal with some difficult pincushion.

Basically, the solution here is to put in a smaller screen and move the seating forward.

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post #16 of 24 Old 09-13-2017, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by The_Nephilim1 View Post
well according to the projector central calculator and the W x 1.33 rule the new Projector needs to sit at 10.5Feet.. this may pose a problem..




EDIT: I just looked again at the calculator and if I do the Zoom method I can leave the projector almost where it is now.. I think I will try that first and see how it goes maybe I will not bother with the lens..
To do the "zoom method" your projector would need to have a zoom lens with a minimum 1.33 ratio. The HD142x does not have a long enough zoom lens. That means the projector would need to move closer and farther from the screen. Then lens would have to be no further than 10'10" from the screen for the 16:9 image to fit in the height of the 2.35 screen. It would need to be a minimum of 13'6" to zoom large enough to fill the 108" width. You can do this by mounting a sliding fixture to the ceiling and then mounting the projector to the sliding mechanism to physically pull the projector back 3'.

You seem pretty focusing on this size screen, but you also mention first row seating all the way back at 14'. That is very far for such a small screen. The same issues would apply because the 1.1x zoom lens on the HD142x just cannot do it alone, but if you have the width in the room and are building your own screen, I would suggest you go larger or move the seating much closer -- like no further than 9' for the first row. Two rows of viewers really calls for a large screen to not seem small from the second row. If you have the width and really want to keep seating at 14' and 18' and plan on build a two prism lens, I would go for a 60"x144" screen and a fixed projector mounting at 14'4".

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post #17 of 24 Old 09-14-2017, 12:32 AM - Thread Starter
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OK I get it but what is the formula to figure out seating ddistance vs size of screen again..maybe I do need to adjust the distance of the seating??


http://myhometheater.homestead.com/v...alculator.html


I need to make the screen smaller and move the seatinng up a bit thnx..


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post #18 of 24 Old 09-14-2017, 04:08 AM
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OK I get it but what is the formula to figure out seating ddistance vs size of screen again..maybe I do need to adjust the distance of the seating??


http://myhometheater.homestead.com/v...alculator.html


I need to make the screen smaller and move the seatinng up a bit thnx..
That calculator only allows choices between 4:3 and 16:9 screen ratios. That tells you how old it is. It does not say anything about 2.35 screens. Then it only says what the maximum distances should be. All in all, I wouldn't put any stock in it.

Do you ever go to real cinemas ? If so, simply pace the width of the screen and then pace back how far it is to the seat you prefer. That will tell you the ratio of width to distance and you can replicate that at home.

I like the SMPTE standard which is based on the HEIGHT of the image. It suggests sitting between 2x and 3x away. So an image that is 5' tall should have seating between 10' and 15' away. If you want to accommodate two rows and keep everyone within the recommendation, then that is possible as long as the second row doesn't recline -- with a recliner in the second row, you really would need 6'+ between rows and a larger screen for both rows to stay within bounds.

For 15 years I've been watching my 5' tall screen for everything from 10' seating. It is perfect for TV, but when watching movies and the image height gets smaller due to letterbox bars, I wish for more width so the 2.40 movie could stay 5' tall.

If you have the room width, I would go larger screen rather than move seats closer. Either will work for first row, but the second row will suffer with a smaller screen.

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post #19 of 24 Old 09-15-2017, 08:49 PM - Thread Starter
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http://tripp.com.au/screenscope.htm


The room is 11' wide so I can not go bigger unfortunetly..


when does the CIH come into play.. I see without the lens I have 2 different Heights.. How can I get the height to be the same size when viewing 16:9 and 2.35:1 ar content?? Would I need to get a lens??


Also what lens' are avaialble under 1000USD??


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post #20 of 24 Old 09-16-2017, 02:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Nephilim1 View Post
http://tripp.com.au/screenscope.htm


The room is 11' wide so I can not go bigger unfortunetly..


when does the CIH come into play.. I see without the lens I have 2 different Heights.. How can I get the height to be the same size when viewing 16:9 and 2.35:1 ar content?? Would I need to get a lens??


Also what lens' are avaialble under 1000USD??
Go back and read post #16. The HD142x cannot do CIH without either an a-lens, of which there are none under $1000 unless you make one from prisms, or pull the projector back to a further throw distance. If you mount the projector to a slide on the ceiling, you can change the distance so the height stays the same for 2.35 and 16:9. You are lucky that the HD142x includes a digital image shift so you can move the 2.35 movie image up to the top of the screen. My Benq, for example, does not allow that. I cannot move the image up to eliminate the top black bar. There actually IS an a-lens for sale in the classifieds for $1000. It is a "Prismasonic".

FS: Prismasonic H-FE1500R anamorphic lens
FS: Prismasonic HD5000R Horizontal Expansion Anamorphic Lens

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post #21 of 24 Old 09-16-2017, 05:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Go back and read post #16. The HD142x cannot do CIH without either an a-lens, of which there are none under $1000 unless you make one from prisms, or pull the projector back to a further throw distance. If you mount the projector to a slide on the ceiling, you can change the distance so the height stays the same for 2.35 and 16:9. You are lucky that the HD142x includes a digital image shift so you can move the 2.35 movie image up to the top of the screen. My Benq, for example, does not allow that. I cannot move the image up to eliminate the top black bar. There actually IS an a-lens for sale in the classifieds for $1000. It is a "Prismasonic".

FS: Prismasonic H-FE1500R anamorphic lens
FS: Prismasonic HD5000R Horizontal Expansion Anamorphic Lens
I am currently looking for a A-Lens.. I seen a couple on the forums they look good.. Will still have to look into a DIY tho but will keep my eye on the 2 I saw..


Thank you everybody.. I did get the screen frame wood today. I was wondering should I wait too build the screen after I get the lens and Proj. to be sure of the size and distance to screen??


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post #22 of 24 Old 09-18-2017, 08:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Well since today turned out such a nice day I decided to get busy and build the screen.


I painted the wood then let it dry then I installed the screen.. It was not too hard a few screws into the wood into the studs and stapled the screen to the wood and finished it off with the black trim I got from Amazon for a really nice price..


The screen is Carls screen I bought off ebay.. I did watch the movie Serenity in Zoom mode for now as I did not get the Projector yet.. so it was on my old Proj. which almost filled the entire screen in Zoom Mode..


I thought it was Awesome having a large screen like this in 2.35:1 AR.. here are a few Pictures.. thnx for all the help so far and final size was 106" x 44". I think the final AR was 2.4







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post #23 of 24 Old 09-19-2017, 07:13 AM
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Looks good. And excellent Dark Side of the Moon poster

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post #24 of 24 Old 09-19-2017, 07:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes My Theater room also doubles as a music room and I have 2 Blacklights to lite up my Vaseline Glass that glows green..


I can not wait until I get the new Projector and 3D glasses.. To be able to finally watch some 3D at Home..


The Viewing last night of Serenity was pretty cool.. I think it worked out rather well..


I am still looking for Prisms of which I seen a lot of places where I can custom order some but I bet they will not come cheap on special order.. I did see some Lens' on Ebay I may go that route as well..

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