New JBL Speaker Technologies - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 07-26-2014, 12:47 PM - Thread Starter
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New JBL Speaker Technologies



Two JBL Professional representatives—Peter Chaikin, Sr. Manager of Recording and Broadcast Marketing, and Charles Sprinkle, Sr. Acoustic Systems Engineer—talk about the new 2-way M2 studio reference monitor, including its new transducers and waveguide, performance characteristics (frequency response, dynamic range, directivity, etc.), accompanying power amps and DSP, room considerations, the difference between professional and consumer speakers, the application of the technology in lower-cost speakers, answers to chat-room questions, and more.


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post #2 of 15 Old 07-26-2014, 07:43 PM
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That's some hi-res geekery, Scott! Super interview. This one was great listening.

Now I just need to figure out how to find some m2s to listen to.
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post #3 of 15 Old 07-26-2014, 11:01 PM
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I was amazed. I went online and checked out all the reviews I could on the LSR305 and 308. Very impressive; If money was no option I'd have already bought the M2's......as it is, the LSR308's are just a little under what I was planning to spend per-speaker on my upcoming upgrade.

due to this episode I'm finally starting to understand why imaging is so important, and what "holographic" actually means.

The following is a partial rabbit trail, but the podcast also reminded me that AVR companies are a little backward or behind the curve when it comes to processors. We are getting to the point where powered speakers are becoming a serious option for audiophiles as well as Home Theater enthusiasts, at multiple budget points. The problem is, AVR manufacturers are convinced that no one wants to buy a processor anywhere short of the $1500 mark. I'd much rather not have to pay for amplification on an AVR, and use the savings to buy powered speakers(which have amplification designed specifically for the speaker). People with my HT budget aren't likely to want to fork over money for powered speakers knowing they're going to have to throw away money on unused amplification in their AVR.

Why don't we see AVR manufacturers offering processors with the same sound quality and feature set as a $1K-$1.5K receiver, minus the cost of amplification? It would make powered speakers a much more viable solution.
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post #4 of 15 Old 07-26-2014, 11:45 PM
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This was easily one of my favorite episodes. It was great to hear Charles's erudite explanations of the technologies in the M2. The part about the dual voice coils and how the cross products work out was particularly interesting.

The M2 is a speaker I've had my eye on for a while now, and I've vowed not to do any more upgrades until I'm ready to get a set for LCRs.

That these guys are genuinely enthusiastic about it comes through clearly.
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post #5 of 15 Old 07-27-2014, 02:05 AM
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Scott this was a very good podcast. Me being a hardware guy, i liked the tech, and it was easy to follow and understand, so i can't call it outlandishly geeky. And you can really tell the JBL guys are very proud, as it shows.

I have hung hundreds, may be thousands of JBL Pro's in a lot of different cinemas around the country. And i have never dropped one on my foot yet, but, i know those who have. The joke is "If your foot wasn't there to break the fall, the speaker would have cracked the concrete."

Seriously, i have often wondered why there is not more of 120/240 Volt internal amp speakers offered. It seems there has always been a market for it, but it is not something done very often. I know there is a lot of 70/100 volt speakers out there, but, if you have low quality transformers on the speakers, you end up with the hospital or supermarket sound.

I have always thought that, for the cinema, internal amp screen array speakers would sound the best as they are often the furthest from the amps, and handle a majority of the movie audio. Also, a lot of modern cinemas are choosing more and more to do away with the projection booth in favor of hush boxes and centralization of equipment, is becoming incredible more common place, and adds, sometimes significantly, to the home runs for the speakers. I just wonder if JBL is planning more of this for large venues, or are they staying with studio monitors, with these speakers?

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.
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post #6 of 15 Old 07-27-2014, 07:00 AM
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Nice podcast. The M2 seems to be a special speaker with a lot of technology behind it.


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post #7 of 15 Old 07-27-2014, 10:07 AM
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wow... amazingly like something Paul w K. would design.

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post #8 of 15 Old 07-27-2014, 11:05 PM
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Very interesting, I wonder if this waveguide nozzle idea, which seems similar to the aperture on the new JBL EON 615 to increase the horizontal dispersion to 90 degrees except for the woofer instead of the compression driver, is part of a broad push over at JBL towards better sound fields for horns.

I'd love to hear the M2, but mostly I want this tech to trickle down to the end user at more earth-bound prices for us mere mortals.

These speakers are 20 grand! I wonder if that's per pair. Nah, don't tell me hehe
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post #9 of 15 Old 07-27-2014, 11:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE View Post
I want this tech to trickle down to the end user at more earth-bound prices for us mere mortals.
http://www.jblpro.com/www/products/r...s#.U9XqXGd0zIU

http://www.jblpro.com/docs/default-s...ar_jbl_dc2.pdf

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post #10 of 15 Old 07-28-2014, 09:29 AM
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I can't seem to find a price point for the M2's or the 3 series.....does anyone know what is the retail price of these speakers?
I am almost afraid to ask.

Paul
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post #11 of 15 Old 07-28-2014, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hidefpaul View Post
I can't seem to find a price point for the M2's or the 3 series.....does anyone know what is the retail price of these speakers?
I am almost afraid to ask.

Paul
I've heard several sources quote $20K for the M2s.

The LSR308s can be had for $250 each and routinely go on sale for $200 each
The LSR305s...$150 each... sale $120


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post #12 of 15 Old 07-28-2014, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacon13 View Post
I've heard several sources quote $20K for the M2s.

The LSR308s can be had for $250 each and routinely go on sale for $200 each
The LSR305s...$150 each... sale $120
Thanks Bacon13, wow, quite the jump in price.

Paul
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post #13 of 15 Old 07-28-2014, 12:43 PM
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Thank you for another great Podcast. The quality of your guests is always second to none. Being from the record and the film/TV industry for over 40 years I always find something of interest.
In the beginning of your podcast the listening level of mixing seems to confound everybody. Let me try to explain. In the record industry there are no standards (overloading doesn't count) where as in the film/TV industry there are "standards" on most everything, of our concern, the levels of playback and room size.
In the record industry the listening volume varies depending on the "buzz" you want to get or the fatigue of a long session without any detriments to the "product" where the customer has the “power” of customizing his listening experience (hands on the volume control). As opposed to the film customer who has no control on his listening experience he must trust the whole chain of production to safely supply he/she the experience the filmmaker intended. Hence standardization of said chain.
Since 1916 the Society of Motion Pictures and Television Engineers (SMPTE) is hard at work establishing and redefining the technical parameters for our enjoyment. Specifically to our subject matter : mixing at “loud” levels. The idea is to mix the way it will be presented in the theater. Artistically, dialogue is usually the anchor and an explosion is loud … it’s loud in real life too.
Theaters have to comply with the SMPTE standards and if the mixing stage complies to the same standards theoretically there’s no difference … I said in theory right?
Acoustics and equipment personalities aside, the magic numbers are : 85dBspl per loudspeakers (L,C,R) and a combined reading of the same 85dBspl for ALL surrounds to that add a 10 dBspl boost to the LFE.
But not all mix stages are the same size as a theater. That’s why, over the years, I revisited the 85dBspl reference depending on the size of the room(s) I’m working in.
Smaller rooms have mainly direct to mid field speaker, and noticed that when calibrated at 85dBspl my editing, sound designing or premixing work didn’t translate well at the mixing stage. After numerous testing and listening sessions I devised the included chart and voilà the whole process fitted much better.

Hope it all makes sense.


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post #14 of 15 Old 07-29-2014, 08:49 PM
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Thanks! I may very well buy those, once I can read a review of the new JBL Eon 615s which cost double but are 1000 watts and have 15 inch drivers, to compare them with.
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post #15 of 15 Old 08-12-2014, 02:32 AM
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Scott,

Thank you - that was great! I'm constantly looking for more info / impressions of the M2's - they're surprisingly hard to come by. Your podcast was packed with lots of great info - I really enjoyed it.

Now JBL just needs to come out with a mini-M2 of the same quality but with lower max SPL (and price) - say able to do reference at a listening distance of 12 ft (even being able to do reference at 9ft would be enough for me). I suspect the market demand for such a speaker could be huge.
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post #16 of 15 Old 08-12-2014, 10:08 PM
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For me, the best aspect of this video was that the JBL guys completely ignored Scott's giggety-giggety "high-rez" promotion nonsense at the beginning and actually talked about the technology of the M2 speaker. That's what it's all about. I can only hope future interviewees will do the same.
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