The Official ChromaPure thread - Page 78 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 11Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #2311 of 5552 Old 02-15-2012, 10:44 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TomHuffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 6,358
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Liked: 204
You can also just set Measurement Smoothing to take 5 or 6 readings when measuring 10% and then set it back to 1 for the remainder of the grayscale. As I think I mentioned before, this problem is most evident on plasmas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by .:GRiFFiN:. View Post

This happens to me on my plasma display.
What I do is use the whitebalance continous mode to set it and to check.
The when you want to make a full run to get a curve, just check the 10ire at continous mode in whitebalance, let it stabilize - remember the percentage, then go to the postcalib and just remeasure until you get the reading that you know is right from the continous mode.

The continous mode is the correct one so it doesnt really matter what the curve screen says but I know, sometimes one wants to post a curve or just to try and see the whole picture (if its difficult to get it spot on one might need to compromise)

It was a pain in the butt when I used 3 measurements but it helped when changing it to 1 reading. Its only 10 and maybe 20 that will have this big problem tho, but the rest of the curve can also faulter in small percent.


Tom Huffman
ChromaPure Software/AccuPel Video Signal Generators
ISF/THX Calibrations
Springfield, MO

TomHuffman is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2312 of 5552 Old 02-15-2012, 12:26 PM
AVS Special Member
 
flint350's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Baltimore, Md.
Posts: 2,164
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerJau View Post

There are 64bit drivers you will need to install from Chromapure for Win7 x64

I don't believe this is correct- and besides, it works on the laptop which is also Win 7 64 bit and both computers are up to date on all drivers. I still can't figure out why the desktop version of Chromapure/Windows can't see the Display 3 Pro. Since Windows reports it as a recognized HID device, it seems Chromapure should recognize it as well, like it does in the laptop. I'm pretty sure Tom has said earlier that you can install on 2 different computers as long as you are using the same, licensed device (I am). Mystery continues.

Ray
"You cannot reason a person out of a position he did not reason himself into in the first place." -Jonathan Swift
flint350 is offline  
post #2313 of 5552 Old 02-15-2012, 01:12 PM
Newbie
 
phead128's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Calman 4 commercial pro or bust!
phead128 is offline  
post #2314 of 5552 Old 02-15-2012, 01:52 PM
AVS Special Member
 
dsinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,631
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by flint350 View Post

I don't believe this is correct- and besides, it works on the laptop which is also Win 7 64 bit and both computers are up to date on all drivers. I still can't figure out why the desktop version of Chromapure/Windows can't see the Display 3 Pro. Since Windows reports it as a recognized HID device, it seems Chromapure should recognize it as well, like it does in the laptop. I'm pretty sure Tom has said earlier that you can install on 2 different computers as long as you are using the same, licensed device (I am). Mystery continues.

If you are not connecting the Display Pro prior to opening Chromapure, try doing so and see if that helps. Good luck
dsinger is offline  
post #2315 of 5552 Old 02-15-2012, 02:12 PM
Member
 
HomerJau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Melbourne, AU
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by flint350 View Post

I don't believe this is correct- and besides, it works on the laptop which is also Win 7 64 bit and both computers are up to date on all drivers. I still can't figure out why the desktop version of Chromapure/Windows can't see the Display 3 Pro. Since Windows reports it as a recognized HID device, it seems Chromapure should recognize it as well, like it does in the laptop. I'm pretty sure Tom has said earlier that you can install on 2 different computers as long as you are using the same, licensed device (I am). Mystery continues.

12 months ago this was correct for i1IPro. Have you tried installing as Administrator? (right-click on the Setup.exe and select 'Run as Administrator' - purely a guess, but worth a try as this can sometimes resolve driver issues with some s/w)
HomerJau is offline  
post #2316 of 5552 Old 02-15-2012, 04:44 PM
AVS Special Member
 
flint350's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Baltimore, Md.
Posts: 2,164
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Well, I finally got it to work. I had been connecting the Display Pro first and Chromapure always showed it w/ serial number, etc, but just wouldn't initialize it or connect with it. It showed "disconnected" and wouldn't respond. However, HomerJau's suggestion about re-installing as an Admin (which I routinely do for such things) made me think about trying something different: Instead of running Chromapure from the Desktop shortcut, I ran it from the start menu and used "run as Admin" from there. It loaded as normal and showed the Display Pro, but this time allowed me to "connect" with the device and use it. I don't know why that would make a difference, but it did and the reminder about running as Admin, despite having installed that way, may have done it. THanks for the help.

Ray
"You cannot reason a person out of a position he did not reason himself into in the first place." -Jonathan Swift
flint350 is offline  
post #2317 of 5552 Old 02-16-2012, 12:21 AM
Member
 
SteveWK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 22
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

You can also just set Measurement Smoothing to take 5 or 6 readings when measuring 10% and then set it back to 1 for the remainder of the grayscale. As I think I mentioned before, this problem is most evident on plasmas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by .:GRiFFiN:. View Post

This happens to me on my plasma display.
What I do is use the whitebalance continous mode to set it and to check.
The when you want to make a full run to get a curve, just check the 10ire at continous mode in whitebalance, let it stabilize - remember the percentage, then go to the postcalib and just remeasure until you get the reading that you know is right from the continous mode.

The continous mode is the correct one so it doesnt really matter what the curve screen says but I know, sometimes one wants to post a curve or just to try and see the whole picture (if its difficult to get it spot on one might need to compromise)

It was a pain in the butt when I used 3 measurements but it helped when changing it to 1 reading. Its only 10 and maybe 20 that will have this big problem tho, but the rest of the curve can also faulter in small percent.


Thanks for the input. I have used both methods with success. I also use the Gamma tab and after my initial reading set the IRE of interest to continuous mode and let it settle out. Works very well.

On another note, I do use the advanced CM tab. I would love to have a video processor that allowed me to calibrate 100, 75, 50, and 25% saturations at 100, 75, 50, and 25% amplitudes independently. Somebody needs to build one of these. All I can do now is try to average them out for the lowest average dE.
Ahh well, dreams.

Thanks again.

Steve
SteveWK is offline  
post #2318 of 5552 Old 02-16-2012, 09:19 AM
AVS Special Member
 
catmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: La Jolla, CA
Posts: 1,703
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
This is how I calibrate my LG 55LH90, an LED full backlit LCD with local dimming and it works well for me but make no claims for FP, DLP and plasma sets.

0. I always verify that the LH90 color gamut is set to wide since the Duo can only decrease saturation from the display's upper limit. I also leave LD on.
1. I always verify black and white levels using AVCHD burned to a BD25 and running on a Panasonic 210 BD player.
2. Then verify clipping with S&M since I like those clipping patterns.
3. Then bring up the Gamma module in CP Pro and with the Duo CMS disabled adjust RGB for a flat Gamma from 100 to 10 IRE. This usually involves reducing green and of course adjusting Red and Blue for equal percentages to green.
4. Then enable the Duo CMS and run the auto cal module.

All this with the D3.

Since the Duo only supplies 100% color saturation patterns I have not tried the Advanced CMS in CP on the supposition that to do do would require running AVCHD on the 210 and wondering whether using two different pattern sets would introduce errors.

That is about it for now but when Tom adds fine Duo CMS color adjustment to CP it will be time to repeat the calibration.

BTW, rowland-johnson does use the advanced CMS and calibrates his 47LH90 at 75% saturation since he found his set to be non-linear in that 75% and 50% were under saturated after calibrating at 100%.

Finally I examine scenes from the Torrey Pines and Pebble beach golf tournaments recorded on the Tivo and closely examine these for color fidelity. Since I live about 5 miles south of Torrey Pines I know what the scenery looks like. At this time I am satisfied that the LH90 performs very well.

And yes, I have the standard (non-compensated) C5 but have not used it since acquiring the D3.

Consider buying the Imax rendition of "Under the Sea"
Unlike most Imax movies which were originally authored for movie theater viewing and subsequently re-authored for home viewing, this one was authored at the outset for home viewing on a BD player. It plays in 3D or 2D and contains scenes from coral reefs near Fiji and the Great barrier reef. The colors are phenomenal.
While expensive for a 41 minute movie it is well worth it to check the calibration results visually.
In fact many ISF trained calibrators use this movie as a final check.

3D demos in stores often use scenes from this movie as was the case when I saw a demo of the LG 55LW5600 at Fry's a few months ago. The 3D effect is stunning and almost makes me wish for a 3D capable TV.

Certified HDTV junkie and AVS addict
U.S. Army FA WWII
catmother is offline  
post #2319 of 5552 Old 02-16-2012, 04:51 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mdrew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Up north
Posts: 1,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Any tricks to using the internal test patterns with the lap top connected to a JVC RS20?

I attempted to do this without any luck. I suspect it is a cable issue. I am using a Keyspan USB to serial, the same set up I use for my Radiance, but I can not get the test patterns to display on the projector. It is a Null modem cable if that matters.
mdrew is offline  
post #2320 of 5552 Old 02-16-2012, 06:04 PM
Senior Member
 
khollister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdrew View Post

Any tricks to using the internal test patterns with the lap top connected to a JVC RS20?

I attempted to do this without any luck. I suspect it is a cable issue. I am using a Keyspan USB to serial, the same set up I use for my Radiance, but I can not get the test patterns to display on the projector. It is a Null modem cable if that matters.

I'm not a projector guy, but the DB9 (RS232) connector on your PJ is for computer control, not sending image data. You need a Dvi-to-HDMI cable unless your laptop has a HDMI output. Basically you are trying to route your desktop over USB - that ain't happening (as you have found out).
khollister is offline  
post #2321 of 5552 Old 02-17-2012, 08:18 AM
Member
 
msamblanet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Fairfax, VA
Posts: 55
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Tom,

Do you have any plans to support reducing the white level in auto-cal to deal with undersaturated colors?

I have an RS-45 and a Lumagen. I found I can correct much of the undersaturation of cyan with a slight reduction in the white, but when I use auto-cal, the first thing it does is zero out all the settings...

My thought was an auto-cal option to specify I want the white point lowered by X% (or just not zero it) would accomplish this...
msamblanet is offline  
post #2322 of 5552 Old 02-17-2012, 08:25 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mdrew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Up north
Posts: 1,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by khollister View Post

I'm not a projector guy, but the DB9 (RS232) connector on your PJ is for computer control, not sending image data. You need a Dvi-to-HDMI cable unless your laptop has a HDMI output. Basically you are trying to route your desktop over USB - that ain't happening (as you have found out).

I tried using the PC connection and I can move my desktop to the projector, but I can use the projector's menu for some strange reason.

The Chromapure instructions says to use either USB or RS232.... I have no idea how it sends the display test patterns.
mdrew is offline  
post #2323 of 5552 Old 02-17-2012, 10:02 AM
Senior Member
 
khollister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdrew View Post

I tried using the PC connection and I can move my desktop to the projector, but I can use the projector's menu for some strange reason.

The Chromapure instructions says to use either USB or RS232.... I have no idea how it sends the display test patterns.

I think you are misreading the manual - the only reference I see to this is in the Signal Generator section and it tells you to use a USB or RS232 connection to an external signal generator to control it (e.g. an Accupel), not to send the internal patterns to a display.
khollister is offline  
post #2324 of 5552 Old 02-17-2012, 10:47 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Kilgore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Huntsville Ontario
Posts: 2,960
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 163
Quote:
Originally Posted by msamblanet View Post

Tom,

Do you have any plans to support reducing the white level in auto-cal to deal with undersaturated colors?

I have an RS-45 and a Lumagen. I found I can correct much of the undersaturation of cyan with a slight reduction in the white, but when I use auto-cal, the first thing it does is zero out all the settings...

My thought was an auto-cal option to specify I want the white point lowered by X% (or just not zero it) would accomplish this...

You have to set white level (Contrast) and black level (Brightness) in the display, not the Lumagen.
Kilgore is offline  
post #2325 of 5552 Old 02-17-2012, 12:50 PM
Member
 
msamblanet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Fairfax, VA
Posts: 55
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

You have to set white level (Contrast) and black level (Brightness) in the display, not the Lumagen.

I an looking to reduce the value for white in the Lumagen CMS so that there is headroom to adjust and correct individual colors with issues...this of course comes at a cost of brightness...

Lumagen discusses this in their Tech Tip #2 at step 13.

I can do this in an all-manual calibration but if I know I want to do it, would be nice to be able to either not have Chromapure's AutoCal zero it OR to inform Chromapure's AutoCal I want to do it...
msamblanet is offline  
post #2326 of 5552 Old 02-17-2012, 01:07 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mdrew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Up north
Posts: 1,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by khollister View Post

I think you are misreading the manual - the only reference I see to this is in the Signal Generator section and it tells you to use a USB or RS232 connection to an external signal generator to control it (e.g. an Accupel), not to send the internal patterns to a display.

You're probably right. This is too much of a PITA. I just wanted to calibrate the projector before putting it up for sale anyway... I might just plug my Radiance into it if I get motivated.
mdrew is offline  
post #2327 of 5552 Old 02-18-2012, 12:46 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TomHuffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 6,358
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Liked: 204
There has been some discussion here and elsewhere about issues arising from calibrating one of the new Sharp Elite LCDs.

I have now had more time to spend with one and here's what I found.
  1. Select the THX mode.
  2. You can leave the dynamic LED function on, but not in one of the advanced modes.
  3. Use the 10-point grayscale feature. It yields excellent results. You can get nearly perfect grayscale tracking with a ruler flat gamma at 2.2.
  4. I would not spend any time on the color management system, but if you do ensure that you use 75% intensity test patterns. You cannot get decent results with 100% patterns at all.
The problem with the CMS is that the colors on the Sharp will not track in a linear fashion between 100% and 75% intensity (as indicated above). Color will also not track in linear way throughout the color space. This is true even if you use an external CMS, such as provided on a Lumagen or DVDO Duo. When you average the dE results throughout the color space (and not just at the gamut boundary), you get no better color after calibration than you had before doing anything. This is not as bad as it sounds, because the default color in the THX is pretty good anyway.

After calibrating using 75% test patterns, I got excellent results at the gamut boundary, and if that's all you looked at you would think that you had significantly improved the color performance. However, that's an illusion that is revealed when you look inside the color space.

Note: The ACM module in ChromaPure uses 100% intensity test patterns. Based on this experience we will add 75% patterns as a user-selectable option. Nonetheless, the point remains that good color performance should results in little or no difference between 75% and 100% intensity. With this display, the differences are dramatic.

THX pre-calibration



Post-Calibration results



Results with Lumagen



Variations in luminance error at different levels of saturation



Variations in dE at various levels of saturation

Tom Huffman
ChromaPure Software/AccuPel Video Signal Generators
ISF/THX Calibrations
Springfield, MO

TomHuffman is offline  
post #2328 of 5552 Old 02-18-2012, 01:18 PM
Advanced Member
 
PE06MCG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
Posts: 729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 48
Hi Tom,

ACM already has an option to measure various amplitudes as well as saturations.
How is the diagnosis changed?

For instance, does it mean we should not only calibrate at say 100% and 75% saturation with 100% amplitude but also at both these saturations at 75% amplitude then assess the situation?
PE06MCG is offline  
post #2329 of 5552 Old 02-18-2012, 02:53 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TomHuffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 6,358
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Liked: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by PE06MCG View Post

ACM already has an option to measure various amplitudes as well as saturations.
How is the diagnosis changed?

What you can't do is measure how well the display tracks through the saturation scale at 75% amplitude.

Tom Huffman
ChromaPure Software/AccuPel Video Signal Generators
ISF/THX Calibrations
Springfield, MO

TomHuffman is offline  
post #2330 of 5552 Old 02-19-2012, 06:38 AM
Member
 
Pannus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 151
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

There has been some discussion here and elsewhere about issues arising from calibrating one of the new Sharp Elite LCDs.

I have now had more time to spend with one and here's what I found.

[*]Select the THX mode.[*]You can leave the dynamic LED function on, but not in one of the advanced modes.[*]Use the 10-point grayscale feature. It yields excellent results. You can get nearly perfect grayscale tracking with a ruler flat gamma at 2.2.[*]I would not spend any time on the color management system, but if you do ensure that you use 75% intensity test patterns. You cannot get decent results with 100% patterns at all.

The problem with the CMS is that the colors on the Sharp will not track in a linear fashion between 100% and 75% intensity (as indicated above). Color will also not track in linear way throughout the color space. This is true even if you use an external CMS, such as provided on a Lumagen or DVDO Duo. When you average the dE results throughout the color space (and not just at the gamut boundary), you get no better color after calibration than you had before doing anything. This is not as bad as it sounds, because the default color in the THX is pretty good anyway.

After calibrating using 75% test patterns, I got excellent results at the gamut boundary, and if that's all you looked at you would think that you had significantly improved the color performance. However, that's an illusion that is revealed when you look inside the color space.

Note: The ACM module in ChromaPure uses 100% intensity test patterns. Based on this experience we will add 75% patterns as a user-selectable option. Nonetheless, the point remains that good color performance should results in little or no difference between 75% and 100% intensity. With this display, the differences are dramatic.

THX pre-calibration

Post-Calibration results

Results with Lumagen

Variations in luminance error at different levels of saturation

Variations in dE at various levels of saturation

I guess my question is, how can we generate the 75% patterns? I have a Sencore and a Lumagen as a pattern generator... use lower initial saturation settings on the set itself or lower stimulus settings?
Pannus is offline  
post #2331 of 5552 Old 02-19-2012, 08:40 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TomHuffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 6,358
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Liked: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pannus View Post

I guess my question is, how can we generate the 75% patterns? I have a Sencore and a Lumagen as a pattern generator... use lower initial saturation settings on the set itself or lower stimulus settings?

The only way to generate a suite of test patterns that range through the saturation scale at 75% intensity is to create a custom disc or to use a test pattern generator that allows the user to specify his own RGB triplets. Neither the Sencore nor the Lumagen supports this, though the Lumagen will support this feature in the not too distant future. The AccuPel already has this.

Tom Huffman
ChromaPure Software/AccuPel Video Signal Generators
ISF/THX Calibrations
Springfield, MO

TomHuffman is offline  
post #2332 of 5552 Old 02-24-2012, 04:56 AM
Member
 
Chris5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Herts, UK
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hi Tom,
Now that Lumagen have a new version out with new test patterns - how long before a new version of cp that uses them?

Sorry for that inevitable question

Chris
Chris5 is offline  
post #2333 of 5552 Old 02-25-2012, 11:34 PM
Member
 
SteveWK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 22
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by catmother View Post

This is how I calibrate my LG 55LH90, an LED full backlit LCD with local dimming and it works well for me but make no claims for FP, DLP and plasma sets.

0. I always verify that the LH90 color gamut is set to wide since the Duo can only decrease saturation from the display's upper limit. I also leave LD on.
1. I always verify black and white levels using AVCHD burned to a BD25 and running on a Panasonic 210 BD player.
2. Then verify clipping with S&M since I like those clipping patterns.
3. Then bring up the Gamma module in CP Pro and with the Duo CMS disabled adjust RGB for a flat Gamma from 100 to 10 IRE. This usually involves reducing green and of course adjusting Red and Blue for equal percentages to green.
4. Then enable the Duo CMS and run the auto cal module.

All this with the D3.

Since the Duo only supplies 100% color saturation patterns I have not tried the Advanced CMS in CP on the supposition that to do do would require running AVCHD on the 210 and wondering whether using two different pattern sets would introduce errors.

That is about it for now but when Tom adds fine Duo CMS color adjustment to CP it will be time to repeat the calibration.

BTW, rowland-johnson does use the advanced CMS and calibrates his 47LH90 at 75% saturation since he found his set to be non-linear in that 75% and 50% were under saturated after calibrating at 100%.

Finally I examine scenes from the Torrey Pines and Pebble beach golf tournaments recorded on the Tivo and closely examine these for color fidelity. Since I live about 5 miles south of Torrey Pines I know what the scenery looks like. At this time I am satisfied that the LH90 performs very well.

And yes, I have the standard (non-compensated) C5 but have not used it since acquiring the D3.

Consider buying the Imax rendition of "Under the Sea"
Unlike most Imax movies which were originally authored for movie theater viewing and subsequently re-authored for home viewing, this one was authored at the outset for home viewing on a BD player. It plays in 3D or 2D and contains scenes from coral reefs near Fiji and the Great barrier reef. The colors are phenomenal.
While expensive for a 41 minute movie it is well worth it to check the calibration results visually.
In fact many ISF trained calibrators use this movie as a final check.

3D demos in stores often use scenes from this movie as was the case when I saw a demo of the LG 55LW5600 at Fry's a few months ago. The 3D effect is stunning and almost makes me wish for a 3D capable TV.

Somehow I missed your post. Sorry about that.

I use almost the exact same procedure to calibrate my TV. I even have the S&M Blu-Ray and use it for clipping too. I can get the white point almost exact using the two point TV white balance controls and an almost flat gamma of 2.23-2.25. The gamma increases linearly to 2.35 or so at the lower IREs (10-30), but I use the DUO to correct this. It makes some of the detail in dark scenes visible - less apparent black crush.

I don't have a wide color gamut mode on my TV or at least I haven't found one yet. It does have "Live Color", but I haven't played with that. The only color that doesn't fall within the Rec 709 spec or close to it is blue at 100% saturation.. It is slightly undersaturated and the hue is slightly off. Also, if I reduce the luminance of blue to match the spec, it is too low at other saturations. So, I just averaged it out.

I think your observation with the DUO not being able to increase saturation is not a problem with the DUO. I think it is what the TV considers fully saturated color and it won't display anything beyond what it thinks the color gamut is. I didn't understand that at first and almost whipped my remote at the TV - lol. The link below is an example of what I am talking about. You can see with green I was trying to move the 100% saturation point in the x direction, but all it did was affect the lower saturations. Yellow I can fix since it is over saturated at 100% to begin with.

http://www.steveinwichita.com/AVS/Greeen%20Offset.pdf

I do have the IMAX Under The Sea blu-ray. It is the 3d version too - 2D included too. I don't know, maybe it is just me or my TV, but 3D in general hurts my eyes. I feel like I'm cross eyed - lol. The 2D version is good though. The blu-ray that I got recently that impressed me for picture quality was Baraka. Blows Planet Earth out of the water. The subject matter is not for everyone though, but the picture quality is the best I have seen, i.e. sampled at 4k and then down sampled to 1080.

Thanks for your input. It sounds like you and I use the same procedure to calibrate our TVs. I am still learning, slowly. Chromapure, the D3 Pro, and the DUO have been invaluable in that process.

Thanks,
Steve
SteveWK is offline  
post #2334 of 5552 Old 02-26-2012, 05:35 AM
Senior Member
 
khollister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveWK View Post

I think your observation with the DUO not being able to increase saturation is not a problem with the DUO. I think it is what the TV considers fully saturated color and it won't display anything beyond what it thinks the color gamut is.

I think it may be quite a bit simpler - the hardware cannot physically output a 100% saturated blue per the target gamut and no amount of increased drive can force the panel to output something it is physically incapable of doing. Basically, you have saturated the panel.

Same thing with color printing - no amount of screwing around in Photoshop can make up for the fact that an inkjet printer's ink set can only reproduce a certain gamut. You can't make make R, G or B (or CMYK) more saturated than the ink is capable of just because you dialed saturation in PS to "11".
khollister is offline  
post #2335 of 5552 Old 02-26-2012, 05:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
thrang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 4,125
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 60 Post(s)
Liked: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by khollister View Post

I think it may be quite a bit simpler - the hardware cannot physically output a 100% saturated blue per the target gamut and no amount of increased drive can force the panel to output something it is physically incapable of doing. Basically, you have saturated the panel.

Same thing with color printing - no amount of screwing around in Photoshop can make up for the fact that an inkjet printer's ink set can only reproduce a certain gamut. You can't make make R, G or B (or CMYK) more saturated than the ink is capable of just because you dialed saturation in PS to "11".

Some innovators have done so...

thrang is online now  
post #2336 of 5552 Old 02-26-2012, 05:43 AM
Senior Member
 
khollister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Some innovators have done so...


Everyone should see Spinal Tap at least once just to understand the "the volume goes to 11" joke.
khollister is offline  
post #2337 of 5552 Old 02-26-2012, 08:43 AM
Member
 
SteveWK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 22
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Some innovators have done so...


it's one more colorful isn't it?
SteveWK is offline  
post #2338 of 5552 Old 03-07-2012, 07:33 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
millerwill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 11,356
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Tom, You mentioned a month or more ago that CP2.3 would be coming out 'soon', with some significant enhancements. Is there any ETA for this?

BTW, did an autocal with the RadianceMini on my Son VW1000: very, very nice result, though as you know the presets were not bad in themselves.
millerwill is online now  
post #2339 of 5552 Old 03-11-2012, 12:42 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Kilgore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Huntsville Ontario
Posts: 2,960
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 163
Tom, are you aware that CalMan allows you to choose three different size grayscale and color window patterns when using a Duo? Is it possible for ChromaPure to access this feature, or has CalMan secretly bought their way into some exclusive deal to allow this feature for themselves but not for anyone else?
Kilgore is offline  
post #2340 of 5552 Old 03-11-2012, 03:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TomHuffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 6,358
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Liked: 204
Not sure. This is certainly not part of the public specs of the Duo. I'll have to look into this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

Tom, are you aware that CalMan allows you to choose three different size grayscale and color window patterns when using a Duo? Is it possible for ChromaPure to access this feature, or has CalMan secretly bought their way into some exclusive deal to allow this feature for themselves but not for anyone else?


Tom Huffman
ChromaPure Software/AccuPel Video Signal Generators
ISF/THX Calibrations
Springfield, MO

TomHuffman is offline  
Reply Display Calibration

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off