Consumer Level Disney World of Wonder (WOW) vs. DVE Blu Ray - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 450 Old 11-01-2010, 12:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey all!

So tomorrow I notice Disney's World of Wonder (WOW) is released on Blu-Ray. I just got a new plasma, and up until now have been using a very old version of Avia to calibrate (which has done great considering how old it is and being aimed at mostly CRT's/rear projections/etc.).

I'd like to update to something new, and have been holding off to see how this is. Basically I'm looking at either WOW or Digital Video Essentials Blu-Ray.

There appears to be only one review so far:
http://www.bigpicturebigsound.com/Di...nder-WOW.shtml

What the review doesn't seem to say is which in his opinion does a better job for an average end-user.

Any thoughts? Anyone get to play with this title at all and have any impressions?

Hopefully post-release there will be some more reviews to look at.

Thanks!
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post #2 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 07:38 AM
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I posted a pretty extensive review of the WOW disc.

The BEST thing about this disc is it's ease of navigation. DVE is a stellar tool for DIY calibration but getting around the disc is extremely frustrating to me. Another great thing about the WOW disc is that you can select your display type in the Advanced section and it will somewhat customize the tests to your display's needs. There is also 3 parts to each video and audio test. The first part defines what is about to be tested. For example Brightness or White Level. The second part describes the test ans shows you visually how to work the test. The last part is Calibrate Now, where you actually perform the test. Each test is further explained in detail in an included 50+ page booklet.

When it comes down to do they work, yes they both will do a fine job at calibrating your display. However, I find the WOW disc easier to use.
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post #3 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 07:53 AM
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For those interested:

Link to Tracy's review
http://www.***************.com/showt...hp?tid/144738/

Link to CEPro review
http://www.cepro.com/article/hands_o...ibration_disc/



Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracy RainH2o View Post

I posted a pretty extensive review of the WOW disc.

The BEST thing about this disc is it's ease of navigation. DVE is a stellar tool for DIY calibration but getting around the disc is extremely frustrating to me. Another great thing about the WOW disc is that you can select your display type in the Advanced section and it will somewhat customize the tests to your display's needs. There is also 3 parts to each video and audio test. The first part defines what is about to be tested. For example Brightness or White Level. The second part describes the test ans shows you visually how to work the test. The last part is Calibrate Now, where you actually perform the test. Each test is further explained in detail in an included 50+ page booklet.

When it comes down to do they work, yes they both will do a fine job at calibrating your display. However, I find the WOW disc easier to use.


Richard J. Casey



Disney WOW - World of Wonder


Producers Guild of America, New Media Council
(BD Industry Insider)
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post #4 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 08:00 AM
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Thanks for the attempted link Richard. We are a competing site, our URL is blocked from AVS.

If any AVS members wanted to read my review I put a link to it on Home Theater Review's FaceBook page. You should see the WOW disc cover art near the top of the page.

It was a pleasure working with the disc.

One of the few. DCM Time Window Seven owners.
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post #5 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 09:38 AM
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A couple of us spoke to the people at the Disney booth at Cedia. It seems like they put in a great deal of work and it may be a good disc. I would probably choose this over Avia, but I am not sure how it compares to Spears.

Call AVS For the Best Deals!!!


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post #6 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

I would probably choose this over Avia, but I am not sure how it compares to Spears.

I haven't used the Spears & Munsil disc so I can not comment on how they compare.

One of the few. DCM Time Window Seven owners.
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post #7 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 07:47 PM
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Hi Tracy,

I just noticed your signature line...I used to own DCM Time Windows as well... DQ-10's before that...and now Gallo Strada's & Gallo Sub for Stereo Playback, Class A Amps, Tube DAC / Line Amp, Esoteric P-10 Transport, Vinyl, etc.

Finalizing the equipment list now for an all Class A Home Theater and a hybrid Solid State A/V Preamp / Tube Amplified Home Theater.

In fact, I still master all the audio on our projects in a Tube Analog chain..



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Originally Posted by Tracy RainH2o View Post

I haven't used the Spears & Munsil disc so I can not comment on how they compare.


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Disney WOW - World of Wonder


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post #8 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 08:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the wonderful feedback! I found that review via Facebook and it's exactly the type of review I was looking for - thanks for the thorough review and descriptions of features. =)

Sounds to me like DVE has a real competitor at this point - I'm glad I waited, as I think this is the one for me.

Avia's been great, but is also frustrating to find patterns and such on. DVE sounds like the tools it gives you are awesome, but for someone who wants to learn as they go and have a bit of fun, and someone who may want to recheck settings down the road quickly, it really sounds like WOW will do as good a job calibration wise while giving me a book, better navigation, and a better guide (ie. paper) along with more entertainment while learning. I also like the pixel flipper feature should I ever need it, and a section to just access patterns is great also, as is customized tests based on display type.

Given there's no direct "DVE is better" I'm hearing, I'm assuming results will be similar, so ease of use and a bit more flexibility wins.

Until I get an ISF calibration (which I may do down the road after ample breakin time), sounds like something worth trying.

Thanks for all the feedback thus far (and of course I'd love to see more).
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post #9 of 450 Old 11-02-2010, 09:21 PM
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Greetings

Considering that the disc streets like today ... not too many people have had a chance to look at the disc.

regards

Michael Chen @ The Laser Video Experience
ISF/THX/TLV Video Instructor
The Video Calibration Education Hub - www.TLVEXP.com

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post #10 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracy RainH2o View Post

I posted a pretty extensive review of the WOW disc.

The BEST thing about this disc is it's ease of navigation. DVE is a stellar tool for DIY calibration but getting around the disc is extremely frustrating to me. Another great thing about the WOW disc is that you can select your display type in the Advanced section and it will somewhat customize the tests to your display's needs. There is also 3 parts to each video and audio test. The first part defines what is about to be tested. For example Brightness or White Level. The second part describes the test ans shows you visually how to work the test. The last part is Calibrate Now, where you actually perform the test. Each test is further explained in detail in an included 50+ page booklet.

When it comes down to do they work, yes they both will do a fine job at calibrating your display. However, I find the WOW disc easier to use.

Are you referring to 'DVE' on DVD or the new 'HD Basics' version on BD?
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post #11 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 04:24 PM
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DVE on Blu-Ray was much better than the navigation on the DVD version. I still think the WOW disc is easier.

Don't get me wrong, DVE on Blu-Ray is still a great tool.

One of the few. DCM Time Window Seven owners.
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post #12 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 04:30 PM
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Another thought is, you can start off with the Beginner level on the disc if you are in a rush or new to display calibration. The Advanced level is more in depth and will get you a finer result.

Hopefully someone else will chime in who's seen the disc.

One of the few. DCM Time Window Seven owners.
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post #13 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 06:17 PM
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Richard, if you like reminiscing about DCM Time Windows, check out my thread.

http://72.9.159.100/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=652191

One of the few. DCM Time Window Seven owners.
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post #14 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 07:24 PM
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I have a copy arriving shortly, so I'll be able to get exposure to its contents in the next few days. I'll report back on my impressions.

Best regards and beautiful pictures,
G. Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
A Lion AV Consultants Affiliate

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post #15 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 09:11 PM
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I wish I never sold them ... or my Dahlquist Speakers ... or my classic Fender, Gibson, and Rickenbacker Guitars, or my Pre-CBS Fender Twin Revereb, or classic and now very valuable Martin Brazilian Rosweood D-41 Guitar...or a long list of other cool stuff I owned that I regret selling.

Makes me wish I was a packrat...

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Richard, if you like reminiscing about DCM Time Windows, check out my thread.

http://72.9.159.100/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=652191

Richard J. Casey



Disney WOW - World of Wonder


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post #16 of 450 Old 11-03-2010, 11:40 PM - Thread Starter
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I decided to go ahead and give WOW a go also. I'll be sure to post my impressions (should be coming tomorrow I think). =)
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post #17 of 450 Old 11-06-2010, 11:10 PM
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just gave it a quick look over. nice disc, lots of neat new patterns and the white level and black level set up is best i have seen so far. Using it for my CRT Blend was extremely helpful.

I did not se any windowed patterns though for doing a greyscale calibration. One thing they could have easily added.

this is more for a non probe type calibration.

Athanasios
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post #18 of 450 Old 11-07-2010, 07:27 PM
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A fairly extensive review posted at Blu-ray.com

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Disney.../16216/#Review

Richard J. Casey



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post #19 of 450 Old 11-08-2010, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFilms View Post

A fairly extensive review posted at Blu-ray.com

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Disney.../16216/#Review

I spent some time with it last night and don't have much to add to the review in the link. It has some unique and helpful test signals. I'm glad I can add it to my usual library of test discs. As mentioned previously, there aren't nearly enough test patterns for a complete calibration with instruments. It's obviously aimed primarily at display users and installers, rather than calibrators. I didn't find a discussion yet of viewing environment issues or a test pattern for adjusting ambient light level. One notable advantage of 'Digital Video Essentials: HD Basics' is the inclusion of native 720p test signals and demonstration material. When I have more time, I'll sit through the entire program and amend my remarks as needed.
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post #20 of 450 Old 11-08-2010, 08:20 AM
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Can someone elaborate on the disk letting you select your display type? So, the disk lets you choose "Plasma" or "LCD" and then either includes or removes the section on the backlight, etc?
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post #21 of 450 Old 11-08-2010, 04:39 PM
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I got this in the mail today, it lets you choose display type, but it is labeled lcd/plasma (together,not seperate). As for backlight toogle i didn't see one.

Josh
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post #22 of 450 Old 11-10-2010, 01:23 AM - Thread Starter
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So I got some time to spend with this disc (not Visions yet - been incredibly busy the last few days), and I can definitely say for me, it was worth the purchase:

The Good:
----------
- Great test patterns for contrast and brightness; much better (for me) than on my older Avia DVD. It allows for very precise calibration for nuanced detail and has some movement built in so your eyes don't get "tricked".

- Great explanation of all the patterns, plus a book to help further if need be. On the disc, each pattern has a brief description, detailed demo of how to use it, and then the pattern itself, all accessible independently.

- Great navigation - unlike Avia, you can get to the pattern you want very quickly.

- Good sound tests, from speaker response to testing all frequencies on specific speakers.


The Not-So-Good:
------------------
- I didn't like the color accuracy tests as well as the Avia disc. One is simply a series of images where you calibrate by eye (so useless for accuracy). The other is color bars you use a blue filter for to calibrate color and tint. This works well, but my two nitpicks are:
1.) The blue filter is actually a bit too small - it's difficult to use both eyes at once with it, which is silly as they show a "strip" blue filter like my Avia disc on the on-screen demo, which would have been cheaper to make (this one's kind of fancy with a cardboard section) and probably would have worked a bit better. I was able to use both eyes after getting closer to the screen and figuring the best way to hold it.
2.) The test pattern doesn't move/flash at all, so once you get close on tint or color, it's *very* difficult to tell minute differences. You're going to get very close, but it's almost impossible for me to discern perfect. The Avia disc has a very similar pattern, but with flashing boxes, and somehow the flashing...and getting it to look even...makes it much easier to arrive at "perfect" settings. Given the WOW disc contrast/brightness pattern has similar moving patterns, I'm not sure why they didn't do this for the color one.

- As mentioned, most of the demo material on the first disc is animated. It's beautiful, but I agree they should have included some more "real people".


OVERALL, great disc, and if I had to pick Avia or this, I'd probably still pick WOW for all the extras it has and the better contrast/brightness pattern. Color calibration takes more time, but you can still get to the same settings if you take the time and move closer to the screen - can't say that about the brightness/contrast test patterns.
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post #23 of 450 Old 11-11-2010, 01:06 AM
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Do you have the Spears and Munsil disc?

Tyler Pruitt - Technical Liaison at SpectraCal
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post #24 of 450 Old 11-11-2010, 11:20 AM
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Hi,

Thank you for your positive comments. We always appreciate comments from AVS Forum Menbers.

I truly apologize for any confusion using the Blue Gel in the "Disney WOW - World Of Wonder" disc, so please allow me to address your concerns:

* The reason it is now a "Single Eye Monocle Viewer" verses a set of "Glasses" was strictly a production decision. The cost was basically the same. However, with the thickness of the Printed Inserts and the 56 Page Booklet, we could not fit the glasses in the case. The case would bulge significantly with the "Glasses" verses the "Monocle."

* The image in the booklet was for reference and changing that image at the latter stages of production was not possible.

* Regarding the Blue Filter. I can assure you no expense was spared when it came to sourcing or producing the Blue Gel. We searched or 6 months to find the best, most accurate, and optically clear Blue Gel possible.

* We did not flash the Color Bars because we did not feel it was necessary for obtaining accurate results. A steady color reference image seemed to provide a consistent & stable reference for fine tuning as you got closer to optimal color setup.

We are confident that the Blu Gel in the package is accurate. In the end, we chose the best possible blue filter and it yields excellent results when compared to our reference. It has been tested by many professionals with excellent results.

Please try using it again with only one eye open and see if you get better results. This is the way it is designed to be used. I would be curious to know if this approach works better for you.

Richard Casey
Producer / Director
R&B Films, Ltd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgupta View Post

So I got some time to spend with this disc (not Visions yet - been incredibly busy the last few days), and I can definitely say for me, it was worth the purchase:

The Good:
----------
- Great test patterns for contrast and brightness; much better (for me) than on my older Avia DVD. It allows for very precise calibration for nuanced detail and has some movement built in so your eyes don't get "tricked".

- Great explanation of all the patterns, plus a book to help further if need be. On the disc, each pattern has a brief description, detailed demo of how to use it, and then the pattern itself, all accessible independently.

- Great navigation - unlike Avia, you can get to the pattern you want very quickly.

- Good sound tests, from speaker response to testing all frequencies on specific speakers.


The Not-So-Good:
------------------
- I didn't like the color accuracy tests as well as the Avia disc. One is simply a series of images where you calibrate by eye (so useless for accuracy). The other is color bars you use a blue filter for to calibrate color and tint. This works well, but my two nitpicks are:
1.) The blue filter is actually a bit too small - it's difficult to use both eyes at once with it, which is silly as they show a "strip" blue filter like my Avia disc on the on-screen demo, which would have been cheaper to make (this one's kind of fancy with a cardboard section) and probably would have worked a bit better. I was able to use both eyes after getting closer to the screen and figuring the best way to hold it.
2.) The test pattern doesn't move/flash at all, so once you get close on tint or color, it's *very* difficult to tell minute differences. You're going to get very close, but it's almost impossible for me to discern perfect. The Avia disc has a very similar pattern, but with flashing boxes, and somehow the flashing...and getting it to look even...makes it much easier to arrive at "perfect" settings. Given the WOW disc contrast/brightness pattern has similar moving patterns, I'm not sure why they didn't do this for the color one.

- As mentioned, most of the demo material on the first disc is animated. It's beautiful, but I agree they should have included some more "real people".


OVERALL, great disc, and if I had to pick Avia or this, I'd probably still pick WOW for all the extras it has and the better contrast/brightness pattern. Color calibration takes more time, but you can still get to the same settings if you take the time and move closer to the screen - can't say that about the brightness/contrast test patterns.


Richard J. Casey



Disney WOW - World of Wonder


Producers Guild of America, New Media Council
(BD Industry Insider)
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post #25 of 450 Old 11-11-2010, 08:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFilms View Post

Hi,

Thank you for your positive comments. We always appreciate comments from AVS Forum Menbers.

I truly apologize for any confusion using the Blue Gel in the "Disney WOW - World Of Wonder" disc, so please allow me to address your concerns:

* The reason it is now a "Single Eye Monocle Viewer" verses a set of "Glasses" was strictly a production decision. The cost was basically the same. However, with the thickness of the Printed Inserts and the 56 Page Booklet, we could not fit the glasses in the case. The case would bulge significantly with the "Glasses" verses the "Monocle."

* The image in the booklet was for reference and changing that image at the latter stages of production was not possible.

* Regarding the Blue Filter. I can assure you no expense was spared when it came to sourcing or producing the Blue Gel. We searched or 6 months to find the best, most accurate, and optically clear Blue Gel possible.

* We did not flash the Color Bars because we did not feel it was necessary for obtaining accurate results. A steady color reference image seemed to provide a consistent & stable reference for fine tuning as you got closer to optimal color setup.

We are confident that the Blu Gel in the package is accurate. In the end, we chose the best possible blue filter and it yields excellent results when compared to our reference. It has been tested by many professionals with excellent results.

Please try using it again with only one eye open and see if you get better results. This is the way it is designed to be used. I would be curious to know if this approach works better for you.

Richard Casey
Producer / Director
R&B Films, Ltd.

Wow - it's not often to hear a response direct from the company in a forum. I'm impressed, and thanks for replying!

- Re the glasses versus monacle, I can understand why you didn't want to include glasses because of the extra bulk. However, the image I saw...as well as the bundle with my Avia disk...showed a blue strip about the size of the monacle but without the cardboard (just a large blue filter strip). This of course was prone a bit more to fingerprints, but solves the space problem and allowed viewing with both eyes.

- I don't have any quality problems with the blue filter at all. Quality wise (material/etc.), it's definitely better made than my Avia disc; I just find it slightly less functional. As far as the blue it's made of, I do think it's a slightly different shade than what I have with Avia, so you may very well be right in it being more accurate.

- Understood about the color bar pattern. What I liked about the Avia flashing pattern is, it was immediately apparent from a further distance what effect dialing in settings had; even minor changes were quite noticeable in the flashing boxes (you tried to get the flashing to look equal), and it was relatively easy to get to an "exact" right setting. Now I will say WOW *DOES* get you to just as good a setting, but it takes longer, I have to get closer, and it just seems more difficult to tell the "best" setting once you're in the ballpark (ie. moving up one notch and deciding better or worse, so to speak). In the end, my settings with WOW were very close to my Avia settings (and I kept the WOW setting as I think they're great).

- I did try the one eye method, but felt like it was more difficult to analyze than using both eyes. You're essentially matching levels of blue with the top part of the bar and the smaller bottom block, and once you get in the ballpark, sometimes the change seems almost undetectable, even with both eyes. With one I was finding it even more frustrating. Just my experience, but my next revisit to the disc, I'll certainly try that again.

I want to reiterate I think this is a TERRIFIC set, and these are just meant as constructive criticisms based on comparison with another product. (To answer Wi-Fi Spy, no, I don't have Spears and Munsil - only the older DVD version of Avia - to compare). If I had to choose only one to keep, it would definitely be WOW.

One suggestion I do have - I'd like to see 3D compatible patterns on future versions of the disc. Some (possibly all?) 3DTV's have a special 3D-only mode that calibrates separate from 2D, and the only way to calibrate it is IN 3D mode. This makes it fairly difficult with a disc like this as you have to use a 3D mode and distort the pattern, then calibrate somehow while wearing 3D glasses around the distortion. I was able to do this alright in the Avia disc using top/bottom 3D mode and closing one eye, so hopefully it will be a similar solution with this - I still need to try it.
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post #26 of 450 Old 11-11-2010, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracy RainH2o View Post

Thanks for the attempted link Richard. We are a competing site, our URL is blocked from AVS.

I've seen this policy enforced on a few forums and it is always a petty move and only hurts users. I don't patronize forums that censor links and this will be the last time I read AVS. It has been deleted from my bookmarks. Yay!
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post #27 of 450 Old 11-12-2010, 07:47 AM
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Yes, we are active in several forums because we love this stuff as much as you do..

Again, thank you for your favorable comments. I worked for almost 3 years putting this together, so it is great to hear positive reviews. Thank you..

Please allow me to respond to your comments.


Comment - Re the glasses versus monocle ...


Reply - As noted below:


* If you look closely at our filter ... you will find that it is not a single strip of film.

* We tested every film there was ... almost literally in fact ... and in the end, we could not find ANY single layer Blue Gel ... including custom films we had created ... that could meet our very strict specifications for accuracy, optical quality, and light transmission.

* We put the Two (2) Filters in a "Monocle" to keep them together because "Glasses" did not fit in the case with the 56 page booklet.

* We went with the Monocle because we believe having two (2) loose film strips with instructions to "Double" them up would have been confusing for most consumers.

* All of the single filters we tried leaked an unacceptable amount of green. You can test this yourself by trying various filters and looking at the amount of Green transmitted.

* Yes, it is a different shade. You are correct. However, let's be clear on what I said and did not say. I did not make any claims compared to other blue gels on the market. You need to test that for yourself and feel free to report any results you come you with.

* Perhaps the Monocle takes a little getting used to, but we believe it was the best solution under the circumstances. Think if it like aiming and using your dominant eye. You can look online to see how to determine which eye is dominant. Here is a link as an example.

http://www.ehow.com/how_11347_determ...inant-eye.html

* Again, I hope you get a chance to check your color setup with our blue filter verses any other disc you may have used. I am fairly confident you will be happy with the results.


Comment - Color Calibration


Reply - As noted below:


* Understood. We did look at every other disc on the market before creating our patterns. In the end, we created what we thought works best. However, I assume everyone has different preferences .. and in fact I expect that to be the case. We understand it takes a bit more critical focus to adjust color...and do not feel that is necessarily a negative.

* Your comments are duly noted and we appreciate all feedback from end users and forum members. To be honest, a lot of this disc was created based on comments I recieved over the years for forum members. We thank you for your constructive comments.



Comment - 3D Calibration


Reply - As noted below:


* The jury is still out with 3D. We are primarily focused on the Sales & Marketing of our current products as a top priority right now.



NOTE: You may want to check the quality of the Audio / Video encodes on your system. We went through great pains to make this product look and sound stellar. Without giving away all of our trade secrets, I can only say that I believe in this product and feel that it is a world class reference for BD and HDTV.


In the end, we would like to think we created something that is reference quality yet very different than anything else on the market.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sgupta View Post

Wow - it's not often to hear a response direct from the company in a forum. I'm impressed, and thanks for replying!

- Re the glasses versus monacle, I can understand why you didn't want to include glasses because of the extra bulk. However, the image I saw...as well as the bundle with my Avia disk...showed a blue strip about the size of the monacle but without the cardboard (just a large blue filter strip). This of course was prone a bit more to fingerprints, but solves the space problem and allowed viewing with both eyes.

- I don't have any quality problems with the blue filter at all. Quality wise (material/etc.), it's definitely better made than my Avia disc; I just find it slightly less functional. As far as the blue it's made of, I do think it's a slightly different shade than what I have with Avia, so you may very well be right in it being more accurate.

- Understood about the color bar pattern. What I liked about the Avia flashing pattern is, it was immediately apparent from a further distance what effect dialing in settings had; even minor changes were quite noticeable in the flashing boxes (you tried to get the flashing to look equal), and it was relatively easy to get to an "exact" right setting. Now I will say WOW *DOES* get you to just as good a setting, but it takes longer, I have to get closer, and it just seems more difficult to tell the "best" setting once you're in the ballpark (ie. moving up one notch and deciding better or worse, so to speak). In the end, my settings with WOW were very close to my Avia settings (and I kept the WOW setting as I think they're great).

- I did try the one eye method, but felt like it was more difficult to analyze than using both eyes. You're essentially matching levels of blue with the top part of the bar and the smaller bottom block, and once you get in the ballpark, sometimes the change seems almost undetectable, even with both eyes. With one I was finding it even more frustrating. Just my experience, but my next revisit to the disc, I'll certainly try that again.

I want to reiterate I think this is a TERRIFIC set, and these are just meant as constructive criticisms based on comparison with another product. (To answer Wi-Fi Spy, no, I don't have Spears and Munsil - only the older DVD version of Avia - to compare). If I had to choose only one to keep, it would definitely be WOW.

One suggestion I do have - I'd like to see 3D compatible patterns on future versions of the disc. Some (possibly all?) 3DTV's have a special 3D-only mode that calibrates separate from 2D, and the only way to calibrate it is IN 3D mode. This makes it fairly difficult with a disc like this as you have to use a 3D mode and distort the pattern, then calibrate somehow while wearing 3D glasses around the distortion. I was able to do this alright in the Avia disc using top/bottom 3D mode and closing one eye, so hopefully it will be a similar solution with this - I still need to try it.


Richard J. Casey



Disney WOW - World of Wonder


Producers Guild of America, New Media Council
(BD Industry Insider)
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post #28 of 450 Old 11-12-2010, 07:52 AM
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All forums have rules and more often posts I disagree with. However, this is the way all forums operate I guess. Being too busy to start my own, I have to live by the rules of others I guess...

Also, and not having any affiliation with AVS whatsoever, I can honestly say that I would hate to see you go. It takes a blend of forum members provide balance and perspective. If we did not have everyone participating, it would all become very lopsided and pretty useless in the end.

I hope you decide to stay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spokker View Post

I've seen this policy enforced on a few forums and it is always a petty move and only hurts users. I don't patronize forums that censor links and this will be the last time I read AVS. It has been deleted from my bookmarks. Yay!


Richard J. Casey



Disney WOW - World of Wonder


Producers Guild of America, New Media Council
(BD Industry Insider)
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post #29 of 450 Old 11-13-2010, 12:06 AM - Thread Starter
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RBFilms, I'd honestly say in my opinion you've accomplished your goals and this really is a great set of discs. Since I haven't played with everything out there, I can't legitimately claim best there as (as I simply don't know enough to judge that), but I can tell you I think it's a fantastic resource and in most cases better than other things I've used, so based on what I've seen, yes it is.

I do see what you mean about the filter being thicker and multiple layers, which is not the case with my Avia rectangular filter. I can certainly see why this would be superior, and I had no issue with the blue gel itself; my only issue was with the shape and limited viewing area (the "monocle" design), but I now see where you're coming from.

Point taken about adjusting color taking more time being possibly a good thing. As I said, my Avia settings were very close to the settings I arrived at with WOW, and the former was easier/quicker to arrive at, but it would make sense that WOW might be slightly more accurate given the higher quality blue gel and it taking more time on the minute adjustments. I certainly didn't feel any reason to go back to the Avia values, and in fact, after a few days of watching like this, I can say all told, my picture overall has never looked as good! There's quite a noticeable improvement from the already pretty good picture I was getting from an Avia-only calibration. I think the biggest difference was made by the advanced contrast pattern, but other things like the small color difference may be contributing also.

Understood that 3D is a new technology and you need to concentrate on your current product. I guess I'm just saying I wish (with future products; I know that's unrealistic now for this one) there was a mode to use the 2D patterns in 3D mode (not completely new specific 3D-related patterns). In other words, take the current color pattern and convert it so it displays correctly when the TV goes into its 3D mode. As far as I know, there's still no product on the market that does this.

Again, thanks for taking the time to respond and the hard work on a product I'm sure I'll enjoy and keep using.
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post #30 of 450 Old 11-13-2010, 01:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgupta View Post
The Not-So-Good:
------------------
- I didn't like the color accuracy tests as well as the Avia disc. One is simply a series of images where you calibrate by eye (so useless for accuracy). The other is color bars you use a blue filter for to calibrate color and tint. This works well, but my two nitpicks are:
1.) The blue filter is actually a bit too small - it's difficult to use both eyes at once with it, which is silly as they show a "strip" blue filter like my Avia disc on the on-screen demo, which would have been cheaper to make (this one's kind of fancy with a cardboard section) and probably would have worked a bit better. I was able to use both eyes after getting closer to the screen and figuring the best way to hold it.
2.) The test pattern doesn't move/flash at all, so once you get close on tint or color, it's *very* difficult to tell minute differences. You're going to get very close, but it's almost impossible for me to discern perfect. The Avia disc has a very similar pattern, but with flashing boxes, and somehow the flashing...and getting it to look even...makes it much easier to arrive at "perfect" settings. Given the WOW disc contrast/brightness pattern has similar moving patterns, I'm not sure why they didn't do this for the color one.


Just want to mention that using a DVD designed for a CRT display that's standard definition released years before bluray was even a twinkle in Sony's eye is not the proper tool for calibration a bluray/high definition system.

Although Avia has some great patterns, keep in mind that you're making an awful large assumption that your player is properly converting standard definition into the correct HD color matrix. Many players do not.

Although I don't have the WOW disc yet, the correct comparison would be to the BluRay Digital Video Essentials disc, not either Avia (not the pro version) nor the old DVE disc that's a nightmare to navigate.

As for sound test decoding the new high definition formats is kind of a big deal so you do want to use one of the bluray mastered calibration disc especially if you're running your BD player audio as analog out.

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