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post #1 of 16 Old 01-16-2012, 08:12 PM - Thread Starter
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... went up.

Alright, I accidentally started this thread, so I might as well use it. It seems as though they've increased the price on their professional/expert level software from ~$1000 to ~$1500. The reason I say "professional/expert" is because I'm totally confused about their naming convention. It changed recently. I don't remember there being an 'expert' level before. All I remember is DIY, Professional, and Commercial.

I called a sales rep and spoke to him at length, which only added to the total confusion. I was told there was never a product for $1000... or something. I don't know. All I know is what I want went from $1000 to $1500. I already dropped $200 on the DIY version, and was told I could upgrade to professional/expert for $800. This is no longer the case.

I'm thinking of cutting my losses and just switching to Chromapure since they are 50% cheaper and since their lowest level won't require me to purchase $150 add-on license for the i1Pro. I really wanted to use Calman because it's what ISF uses and all... I'm also not attracted to the 'simplicity' of Chromapure. I've no fear of complexity. Both support pretty much all meters (except Chromapure doesn't do the D3 retail that I happen to own... I don't mind selling my retail version to get an OEM though.) I also like the idea of nice full color reports for my customers, but I'm assuming Chromapure does this too.

The real limitation it seems is what PATTERN GENERATORS each software supports. It looks like there are not many generators that are cross-supported.

Here's my questions:
1) How does the DVG-5000 $1300) compare to the DVG-1400 ($700)?
2) Does Chromapure have recurring annual charges?
3) Do you get new Chromapure versions for free? For how long?
4) Is there some other generator I should be considering in the $1000 to $1500 range?
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post #2 of 16 Old 01-18-2012, 02:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Bump.
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post #3 of 16 Old 01-18-2012, 03:33 PM
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CalMAN Professional became Commercial ($2495) - Professional allowed all meters/generators as does Commercial now.

CalMAN Expert is $1495.

If you are doing this Professionally, you need at least CalMAN Expert.

The big difference between Commercial and Expert, Expert does support many of the high-end meters.. Commercial supports all. Not all Calibrators have high end meters, many use ones like the i1Pro.

Click here to some other differences: http://store.spectracal.com/support/...e-support.html

btw, this was not a recent change, it happen over a year ago.. see: www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1296856

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post #4 of 16 Old 01-18-2012, 04:23 PM
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Greetings

THX has used Calman previously and currently uses a THX version of Chromapure.

Most THX guys using calman use a specific THX workflow which looks nothing like any of the calman flows ... especially those ISF ones. The professional workflow in Calman does approximate what the THX guys use. A "to the point" workflow that does not waste the calibrator's time.

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post #5 of 16 Old 01-18-2012, 07:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael TLV View Post

Greetings

THX has used Calman previously and currently uses a THX version of Chromapure.

Most THX guys using calman use a specific THX workflow which looks nothing like any of the calman flows ... especially those ISF ones. The professional workflow in Calman does approximate what the THX guys use. A "to the point" workflow that does not waste the calibrator's time.

Regards

Are the calman workflows customizable?
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post #6 of 16 Old 01-18-2012, 07:14 PM
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Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post

Are the calman workflows customizable?

Yes you can either customize an existing workflow or build your own.

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post #7 of 16 Old 01-18-2012, 09:55 PM
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Greetings

Strangely, the customizability of the Calman program just seems to be missed by so many.

Chromapure is just one workflow. Tom Huffman's workflow. The way he likes to do things (with a little prodding from the THX Video program among others.)

If that's all you like, then no wonder people find CP to be easier to use because there is no choice in the matter. That's it.

On the Calman side, there are workflows that are very similar to Tom's workflow in CP. The THX workflow for instance ... (and by default, the professional workflow.) Most seasoned calibrators only need what is seen in the CP flow and the THX flow.

Calman can be customized to give exactly the same workflow on load up as what is on the CP ... but it doesn't. That is often seen as the problem ... too much choice. Something similar to Tom's flow does exist, but the user has to wade through 30+ workflows to figure out where to begin and that can be very intimidating.

Calman opens up to that first user almost assuming that the user is a dummy. Too many explanations on screen ...

There are people out there that need to be led by the nose ... and have no time for creativity.

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post #8 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 12:15 AM
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Though customizable workflow is a nice feature, it's hardly a dealbreaker, nor is it essential. ChromaPure's given workflow will suit 90% of it's users. The other 10% can easily work around it. Each element is clearly labelled. If you want to calibrate color first, click the Color Management button first. Who cares if it's not first on the list.
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post #9 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 03:48 AM - Thread Starter
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I actually meant to ask if Chromapure had customizable work flows, I know Calman does, so thank you Michael. lol

Yeah, I really really like the customization. I'm planning on eventually taking whatever workflow I like and just throwing in 2 to 3 pages in between each step with text on customer education because it seems like that is 50% to 75% of a calibrator's job.
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post #10 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post

I'm planning on eventually taking whatever workflow I like and just throwing in 2 to 3 pages in between each step with text on customer education because it seems like that is 50% to 75% of a calibrator's job.

I don't think that is what Michael and others are talking about when it comes to educating the customer.. simply adding some descriptive text on the reports... perhaps in addition to....

What about having the customer present during the calibration, explaining each step and why (or why not) making each adjustment, viewing real world content with before/after calibrated settings, etc.... ?

but, just adding that to reports certainly is no substitute for a proper education experience for the customer...

Need to find a Professional Calibrator? Click Here to PM me with your Display & City

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post #11 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 08:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

I don't think that is what Michael and others are talking about when it comes to educating the customer.. simply adding some descriptive text on the reports... perhaps in addition to....

What about having the customer present during the calibration, explaining each step and why (or why not) making each adjustment, viewing real world content with before/after calibrated settings, etc.... ?

but, just adding that to reports certainly is no substitute for a proper education experience for the customer...

I've didn't intend to imply that any of that text would be on the reports. From my experience, when educating a customer it's easy to get sidetracked or miss some info when the customer starts asking questions 'out of order' so to speak. I'd have the text in the actual workflow so I'd remember to explain different points as I'm doing it. I have no faith in my memory.
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post #12 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post

... went up.

Alright, I accidentally started this thread, so I might as well use it. It seems as though they've increased the price on their professional/expert level software from ~$1000 to ~$1500. The reason I say "professional/expert" is because I'm totally confused about their naming convention. It changed recently. I don't remember there being an 'expert' level before. All I remember is DIY, Professional, and Commercial.

I called a sales rep and spoke to him at length, which only added to the total confusion. I was told there was never a product for $1000... or something. I don't know. All I know is what I want went from $1000 to $1500. I already dropped $200 on the DIY version, and was told I could upgrade to professional/expert for $800. This is no longer the case.

Not sure where you were told CalMAN expert was $1000. A little over a year ago we had CalMAN Pro now called Commercial for $2495. Then we added Expert for $1495 because the $2495 for Commercial was too high for many just starting out. The main differences from the two is very high-end meters, generators, displays for Commercial . If you were told $1000 and already have DIY we will stand behind the $800 upgrade.


As for customization many are talking about that is what CalMAN is all about being able to design or tweak your own workflows as needed. Now with that said we have some 20+ workflows that ship with CalMAN to suit many needs and in most cases you will never need to change them. From our QuickView that is just a few pages of data and charts to one of our many advanced workflows.

Derek

CTO / Founder - SpectraCal Inc.
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post #13 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 11:11 AM
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Just because I'm curious....

What happens to anyone who uses the non-pro versions of a program like CalMan or ChromaPure and charges for it?

Does every pro have to explicitly detail all the methods and software programs in use?

I understand the software ls licensed differently for use and all but, I wonder how a standard version user gets busted and then what happens.

-Brian
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post #14 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Hampton View Post

Just because I'm curious....

What happens to anyone who uses the non-pro versions of a program like CalMan or ChromaPure and charges for it?

Does every pro have to explicitly detail all the methods and software programs in use?

I understand the software ls licensed differently for use and all but, I wonder how a standard version user gets busted and then what happens.

-Brian

In theory it is exactly the same as using a pirated copy of Office or Photoshop.

In practice we try to structure software in such a way that for someone who does this for a living you get features in the Pro versions that essentially pay for themselves. Our reporting interface is a good example of that, available in the Expert and Commercial versions it allows you to create PDFs straight out of the app, neatly organized in 8.5x11 or A4, landscape or portrait formats. In conjunction with the customer database you'll be able to snap out fully customized reports that look extremely professional for ever customer. Even if the time savings is only 15-20 minutes per customer that means it saves you $100 for every 3-4 customers.

Joel Barsotti
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CalMAN Lead Developer
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post #15 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 11:38 AM
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Thanks,

I'm sure it voids the EULA and any support and warranty and so forth.

Likely gets you a spot on Santa's naughty list as well.

I could see myself being a pro someday. (As part of a larger list of custom electronic services.) I'm sure the difference in cost of packages to a pro that gets a steady workload is negligible.

-Brian
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post #16 of 16 Old 01-19-2012, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Hampton View Post

Thanks,

I'm sure it voids the EULA and any support and warranty and so forth.

Likely gets you a spot on Santa's naughty list as well.

I could see myself being a pro someday. (As part of a larger list of custom electronic services.) I'm sure the difference in cost of packages to a pro that gets a steady workload is negligible.

-Brian

Yes and that is exactly what we encourage. As you progress from DIY to Pro you move up the license ladder. But with tools you already know and trust.

Derek

CTO / Founder - SpectraCal Inc.
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