HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software - Page 118 - AVS Forum
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post #3511 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 05:21 AM
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Question on what to select for the startup .

Since I have a JVC projector do I choose it for both settings?

I am taking the reading off my screen . So do I put the second one as display?
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post #3512 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

Since I have a high power screen that is 2.4 gain would that effect it at all?

It seems like I am getting atleast somewhere and understanding the rgb.
Now I think I'm to the point on trying to understand what else comes into play and effects the rgb as well.

I don't know why I am having such a hard time setting the brightness and contrast.

I mean am I anywhere at all close to good results or way off? Starting to second guess myself again and either get a professional or autocal
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Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

Information overload . I really appreciate you taking the time to explain it though. I understand some of it but just not everything because I have not been hands on with a calibration yet.

But this did arrive today


When you use i1Display Pro with the latest version of HCFR, do you need to load any additional drivers for the software to recognize the sensor? Thanks!
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post #3513 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 10:39 AM
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On my laptop it worked right away. Desktop won't see the meter
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post #3514 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

On my laptop it worked right away. Desktop won't see the meter

This might be a USB 3.0 vs 2.0 compatibility issue .... apparently more than a few 2.0 designed devices don't like the new 3.0 ports ... Some folks have had success with forcing the ports to 2.0 mode in BIOS ... etc, etc ... YMMV ...
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post #3515 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 11:20 AM
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That probably is it. Good thinking.

Also for projector when you first start a new reading.

Do you choose projector for both drop down boxes?

I am taking the reading off my screen so is projector supposed to still be chosen
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post #3516 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 11:33 AM
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So I was able to achieve I think a decent Rgb last night. But my contrast output In measures is sill back down low.

I am thinking its something I am choosing when I start a new reading .

Here are some graphs.

I plan on using madvr to do the rest of the processing since I am told that it works almost as good as a lumagen.



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post #3517 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
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When reading off the screen choose reading type=display. The display type should be the one closest to your technology/spectral source.
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post #3518 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 11:53 AM
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Ok so I was doing it wrong I was keeping it as projector.

Also I have a JVC rs46 projector so the display should just be under projector then ?
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post #3519 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 12:04 PM - Thread Starter
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post #3520 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 12:50 PM
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Anyone else that knows what would be best for a JVC projector? That drop box doesn't really have specific details in newer brands or projectors.

Might be a simple update to the program as well?
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post #3521 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 06:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

That drop box doesn't really have specific details in newer brands or projectors.

Might be a simple update to the program as well?

Those choices are currently what X-rite provides in the way of correction files so it's out of my control.
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post #3522 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 06:25 PM
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Ahhhh I see so there is a chance I should maybe be selecting LCD or led?
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post #3523 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 06:43 PM - Thread Starter
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post #3524 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 06:44 PM
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I used the CRT display type for my projector but it's a DLP

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

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post #3525 of 4164 Old 05-23-2014, 07:47 PM
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It's a lcos
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post #3526 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 02:35 AM
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So After messing with this for another 8 hours tonight...

Here are my results still crap in the contrast area as well..






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post #3527 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 10:49 AM
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^^^^

Ugh ... hard to diagnose this from a distance. My initial impulse would be to just drop the contrast until you eliminate the clipping condition(s.) Also, don't get caught up with trying to make the "contrast ratio" number higher or match what you think it "should be."

Edit: Reviewed the work so far ... It looks like you're trying to "get more" out of the PJ than it can really do ... Your initial results look far better than this latest attempt. Back up a bit and relax. wink.gif

Even professional movie theaters have relatively "poor" measured contrast ratios. 500-700 (on/off) is probably "good enough" here.

Edit #2: In fact ... forget about the CR number entirely, this is clearly what's tripping you up.
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post #3528 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 12:46 PM
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Not sure what you mean by lowering contrast until clipping is gone. I'm pretty new to this.
You mean with the white clipping pattern on avs disk?

Bad thing is I never wrote down the settings for the last calibration. So I kinda have to do it all over again.

I was able to get 100% down to around 3.1 will a all around average of 1.5 across the de.

From what I read it's better to sacrifice in the high end then the low?
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post #3529 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 12:48 PM
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This is my latest one as of now
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Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

Ok So I decided to order a i1Display Pro last week and have been messing with HCFR to calibrate my projector..

This is the first time I ever tried doing this so was looking for some help.

Equipment
JVC RS46
133 HP Dalite screen
Onkyo 818 AVR
HTPC i7 Haswell gtx 760 Nvivda with 8 gigs of ram

What my plan is to use my htpc and Use Madvr Argyll to create a 3dlut. I don't have a Lumagen and from what I been reading this is the way to go.

I been going back and forth with it for the last week spending sometimes 8-10 hours plus a day and been getting advice from some but hey who else better to ask then the pros that worked on them themselves

Here Are some measures.. From my understanding is all I need to really get right is the RGB right now because MADVR will take care of the rest...
MY Contrast Ratio has been terrible low.

I have tried using my Panasonic Bluray player Direct to the JVC as well and still having problems .. So that means eliminated the onkyo 818 and if any at all problems in the HTPC

This is my latest Reading.








I know there is a learning curve with this stuff but for the past week all I have been doing is adjust RGB back and forth and basically the first steps of the guide..

Any help I would greatly appreciate because I am to the point of trying to pull my hair out

JVC Settings as of right now with those readings

Picture Mode= Natural
Contrast Brightness Color Tint all at 0
Color Temp Custom 1 with readings of
Gain Red -1
Gain Green -11
Gain Blue -8
Offset Red -11
Offset Green 3
Offset Blue -1

Color Space Standard
Custom 3 Gama 2.6
Lens Aperture 0
Lamp Power Low
HDMI Is set to Enhanced because when using HTPC That's the only way black lvls will show 17+,,, If I used a standard Bluray player the flashed in both super white and Standard
Color Space Auto
Control with HDMI On

For My black lvl I have it set at 3 because that's when both boxes look black


I would appreciate the Help because this is driving me nuts and I have been reading non stop... Thanks all
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post #3530 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

Not sure what you mean by lowering contrast until clipping is gone. I'm pretty new to this.
You mean with the white clipping pattern on avs disk?

Bad thing is I never wrote down the settings for the last calibration. So I kinda have to do it all over again.

I was able to get 100% down to around 3.1 will a all around average of 1.5 across the de.

From what I read it's better to sacrifice in the high end then the low?


clipping is when one of the colors is running low at the higher readings. looking at your grayscale, your blue from 50 to 90 is pretty good, but at 100 it falls low by a fair bit (from 90  to 100 your running out of blue output). this is usually caused by the contrast being set to high. if you were to drop the contrast level by 1 and remeasure you will likely find the blue improves at the 100 reading. being you are calibrating a projector, there may be other adjustments that can cause clipping, and you may even have a 10 point grayscale adjustment which would help in this case.

 

you may want to use the large size when posting your images to make them easier for everyone to read. I cannot see the reading clearly on the data chart.

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post #3531 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 02:20 PM
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I will try dropping the contrast down by1.

I have to work 14 hours tonight and tommorow night so I won't be able to do much probably until then.

I am going to try to do some more reading tonight but I'm at a standstill just going back and forth now with rgb.

I don't have no cms and from what I am told madvr will take care of it because I have a high end htpc.

I'm going to read over in there forums tonight as well to see if I find anything.

But as of right now it seems like I need to learn on other ways to approach rgb because for the past week all I been doing is taking measures and adjusting rgb.
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post #3532 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 05:14 PM
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Gain Red -1
Gain Green -11
Gain Blue -8
Offset Red -11
Offset Green 3
Offset Blue -1

Humm .... Clearly I don't have any direct experience with your PJ ... but these numbers don't look too "healthy" for a typical digital device. Firstly set everything back to zero, then adjust contrast until one of the colors clips. Leave this color (that clipped) at zero for both gain and offset . Now, adjust your greyscale by using *only* the other two colors ... try to use only negative numbers on the "gain." With a wee bit of luck, this should fix your clipping issues. ... In theory ... the devil's in the details. wink.gif Good luck.

Others should feel free to chime in here. smile.gif
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post #3533 of 4164 Old 05-24-2014, 05:28 PM
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Ok so put up the white clipping pattern from the avs disk and lower contrast until bars 234 or 235 are blinking?

What if they are blinking at 0
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post #3534 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 12:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

Ok so put up the white clipping pattern from the avs disk and lower contrast until bars 234 or 235 are blinking?

What if they are blinking at 0

No, no, no ... sorry for the confusion ... in my final edit I changed "increase contrast" to "adjust contrast" ... lots of distracting noise and static elsewhere on the forum tonight. wink.gif

You want to use the color clipping patterns to find the point at which one (or more) colors (R,G or B) clip while while increasing the contrast control. This will give you the maximum setting you can use for contrast without "running out" of any of the primaries. Then
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Leave this color (that clipped) at zero for both gain and offset . Now, adjust your greyscale by using *only* the other two colors ... try to use only negative numbers on the "gain."

This may not give you the "optimum" settings for the gain and offsets, but it should keep you in the "safe range." Leaving one color alone (set at zero gain, zero offset) will help you to avoid winding up with the sloped gamma curves that you had in your last run. Once you have a flat greyscale and gamma curve, then and only then you should worry about the actual gamma value. And don't worry about the reported "contrast ratio" at all ... you're ok there. smile.gif

The method above may not work 100% of the time. You might need to reduce contrast to a "safe level," set D65 for 100% (digital 235) or 109%(digital 254) white and then do the clipping test above ... lather, rinse, repeat ....This is one of those things that's much easier to demonstrate in person than it is to explain on a forum. Further complicated due to the fact that I've never gotten my grimy paws on an RS46 to learn it's quirks (if any.)
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post #3535 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 02:39 AM
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Ok I am getting a step forward now atleast on adjust more.

So the color clipping patterns are on the avs disk I just looked it up.

Is this pattern read with the meter or by eye?

Atleast I am getting somewhere more now I been playing with rgb gain and offsets for a week.

So adjusting this I'm looking for the bars to stop flashing correct. They should be flashing all the way across?
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post #3536 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 02:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

So the color clipping patterns are on the avs disk I assume?

Yep and on the GCD disk ... I like AVS disk better for this particular pattern ... easier for me to read.
Quote:
Or the Disney wow disk.

Can't say, I don't have that one.
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Is this pattern read with the meter or by eye?

Eye
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At least I am getting somewhere more now I been playing with rgb gain and offsets for a week

Keep at it ... You'll get the hang of it soon ... and hopefully I won't confuse you more in the meantime. smile.gif
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post #3537 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 02:58 AM
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No you actually atleast out me forward in the right direction I was at a stand still.

I confuse myself more reading on my own.

Another question was what am I actually trying to achieve ? Keep the bars all flashing and up the contrast until they stop at one point?
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post #3538 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 05:22 AM
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Ok I still can't get my desktop to find my i1 display pro in hcfr.

I went into devices and it's here under unspecified.



Has anyone else had problems with this ? It work right away on my laptop. Windows 8 on laptop windows 7 on desktop
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post #3539 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 10:40 AM - Thread Starter
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The previous suggestion that it may be a USB 3.0/2.0 problem would be the place to start. Try other ports and see if the bios allows forcing 2.0
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post #3540 of 4164 Old 05-25-2014, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
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Another question was what am I actually trying to achieve ? Keep the bars all flashing and up the contrast until they stop at one point?

Right. ... (but see step #2 below.)

---

PS: The reason I second guessed myself and wrote "adjust" instead of "increase" contrast is that you *might* already be clipping a color ... in which case you'd need to decrease contrast first.

In fact, now that I've thought about it some more, it might be beneficial time-wise to go ahead and:

1) Reduce contrast a few clicks.
2) Display a 100% or 109% white target. 100% is probably better here unless you are sure the PJ is displaying the "super-white" range: (236-254 digital.)
3) Adjust gains until you reach D65 on that white target ... (leaving green at zero gain, zero offset )
4) Display the color clipping pattern and increase the contrast until you find the point that one or more of R, G, B clips (stops flashing.)

Again ..there may be other factors that would affect your final contrast value, but hopefully this method will get you on the right page, if not the right sentence. For instance, it *might* be beneficial to find the clipping point and then back the contrast down one click (to leave a little "wiggle room" for adjusting the greyscale.) Lot's of moving parts ... unfortunately, I can only give generic pointers here
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