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post #4261 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 08:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
Changing it from 0 to 25 killed my contrast ratio. It makes the 0% reading much brighter (IIRC, 0.014) and raises the whole gamma curve. Doesn't seem to affect the colors much.
That's how Samsungs work, the contrast ratio is lower when viewing average screen content than when viewing dark scenes. You might want to see if any of the black optimizer settings affect the black level with the 25% APL patterns.

The measured average gamma rising with APL is a general characteristic of plasmas.

Did you happen to notice if you still needed the long latency when using these patterns?

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post #4262 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 12:03 PM
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Latency still made a difference, though it wasn't as dramatic (probably because the black wasn't as black).
I'll keep it high; it's not like it makes that much a difference in the duration of the sweeps.
And I guess I shouldn't bother trying to recalibrate it to this APL, so I now have some time for a movie!

I've played with black optimizer settings before:
Samsung PN60F5300B Settings And What They Do
I guess the whole point to "auto" settings like that is that they change things on the fly, so trying to calibrate to it is a crapshoot.

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post #4263 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
Changing it from 0 to 25 killed my contrast ratio.
It doesn't change the way the plasma works, or how it will look in real content. It just changes the measurement results. Supposedly you should calibrate a plasma with APL patterns since they're more representative of real world content.

Last edited by Stereodude; 09-18-2014 at 12:30 PM.
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post #4264 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
I guess the whole point to "auto" settings like that is that they change things on the fly, so trying to calibrate to it is a crapshoot.
On my F8500, in a dark room, Auto gave me the same performance as Bright Room, not Dark Room. Maybe the ambient light sensor is on the back and my bias light is throwing it off. I'm not sure.
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post #4265 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 01:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
And I guess I shouldn't bother trying to recalibrate it to this APL, so I now have some time for a movie!
APL patterns show you behavior that is more indicative of how the plasma will perform during normal use. I recommend using them to calibrate with.

Quote:
I've played with black optimizer settings before:
Not with APL patterns. The question I ask is if there is any reason to choose one black optimizer setting over another specifically using APL patterns to simulate normal use. Is the minimum luminance (maximum contrast) the same for all settings of this control?

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post #4266 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 02:14 PM
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Okay, so I won't watch a movie.
I'll let you know next week.
See, the fun never ends.
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post #4267 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 03:02 PM - Thread Starter
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No movie watching for you, must calibrate.

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post #4268 of 4281 Old 09-18-2014, 06:48 PM
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Just about ready to buy myself a new colorimeter. Previously, I asked and was told that the X-rite i1 display pro is the one I should buy. Is there a certain rev that works best with HCFR? Just want to make sure I get the right one. Appreciate it.
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post #4269 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 04:38 AM - Thread Starter
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There aren't different revs of the i1d3, just a retail and an oem version (oem usually costs more) so I suggest the retail version like this. The only advantage of having the oem version that I know of is that it is the only version supported by LightSpace.

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post #4270 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 05:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
There aren't different revs of the i1d3, just a retail and an oem version (oem usually costs more) so I suggest the retail version like this. The only advantage of having the oem version that I know of is that it is the only version supported by LightSpace.
Thanks Zoyd, I appreciate the info. One other question, I was using an older Spyder 2 with HCFR. I had to use an old Windows XP laptop to get things to work. Can I run HCFR and the X-Rite i1Display Pro under Windows 7? I have a Windows 7 session running under Parallels on my MacBook and was hoping it would work. Appreciate it.
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post #4271 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
There aren't different revs of the i1d3, just a retail and an oem version (oem usually costs more) so I suggest the retail version like this. The only advantage of having the oem version that I know of is that it is the only version supported by LightSpace.
Hi Zoyd, according to this X-Rite i1Profiler 1.5.4 Release Notes I have posted @ May 2014, that software update adds Support for New Version of i1Display Pro (i1Profiler has been updated to support a new revision level of the i1Display Pro hardware and firmware.)

There no more info about what difference or what revision number have the newer meters.


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post #4272 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 07:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carillon View Post
Thanks Zoyd, I appreciate the info. One other question, I was using an older Spyder 2 with HCFR. I had to use an old Windows XP laptop to get things to work. Can I run HCFR and the X-Rite i1Display Pro under Windows 7? I have a Windows 7 session running under Parallels on my MacBook and was hoping it would work. Appreciate it.
Not sure why you were having problems with the spyder 2 as it works fine on my win7 laptop as do all supported probes. I have never tested under a virtual OS though so I don't know if that works.

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Hi Zoyd, according to this X-Rite i1Profiler 1.5.4 Release Notes I have posted @ May 2014, that software update adds Support for New Version of i1Display Pro (i1Profiler has been updated to support a new revision level of the i1Display Pro hardware and firmware.)

There no more info about what difference or what revision number have the newer meters.
Thanks Ted.
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post #4273 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
No movie watching for you, must calibrate.
Orion has done some tests with APL:
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?

He didn't change his calibration, though. I'm interested in seeing what effect that has.
You're right, movies are overrated, anyway.
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post #4274 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 11:14 AM
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Not with APL patterns. The question I ask is if there is any reason to choose one black optimizer setting over another specifically using APL patterns to simulate normal use. Is the minimum luminance (maximum contrast) the same for all settings of this control?
Zoyd, not sure if you saw this when I'd posted in the 60F5300 thread a while back: Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?

Doesn't exactly answer your question, but I thought it was pretty interesting to note the differences between BO set to Dark Room, Auto and Bright Room.
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post #4275 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 11:17 AM
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He didn't change his calibration, though. I'm interested in seeing what effect that has.
Well, seeing as you have the enthusiasm to test things out I decided I'd rather let you wander down that rabbit hole
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post #4276 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 11:22 AM
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No problem.
Zoyd has a gun to my head.

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post #4277 of 4281 Old 09-19-2014, 11:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by orion2001 View Post
Zoyd, not sure if you saw this when I'd posted in the 60F5300 thread a while back: Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?

Doesn't exactly answer your question, but I thought it was pretty interesting to note the differences between BO set to Dark Room, Auto and Bright Room.

Thanks for pointing that out, I haven't been keeping on eye on the display forum so I missed those measurements. I guess the final answer on F series floating blacks is still out until you test using the random patterns. Another neat way to test it is to grab a variety of movie images off the web (from dimly lit to normal to bright) and then set each one as your extended desktop background for a black level measurement. To do this in HCFR switch the GDI generator to GDI(no background) and the window image will be overlaid on your video image.

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post #4278 of 4281 Old Yesterday, 03:13 AM
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The next time you get around to a total rewrite , please consider moving the dialog boxes off to the side.
Why? Because, every time a dialog pops up, it's right in the middle of the screen, BEHIND MY METER, and I have to move it over.
Just wanted you to have something to do while I recalibrate the set and run the APL patterns.
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post #4279 of 4281 Old Yesterday, 05:28 PM
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Just made more work for myself.
I noticed the same dialogue box has a radio button to change from limited (16-whatever) to full (0-255) output. Changing it to full made a DRAMATIC difference in my gamma curve, which means, I guess, that the settings on my HTPC are correct. So I'm recalibrating anyway!
I'll check black optimizer after that.
<sigh>
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post #4280 of 4281 Old Yesterday, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
The next time you get around to a total rewrite , please consider moving the dialog boxes off to the side.
Why? Because, every time a dialog pops up, it's right in the middle of the screen, BEHIND MY METER, and I have to move it over.
Just wanted you to have something to do while I recalibrate the set and run the APL patterns.
Michael
The program is not really set-up well for running it on the same screen that you are calibrating but there won't be any rewrite anytime soon, sorry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
Just made more work for myself.
I noticed the same dialogue box has a radio button to change from limited (16-whatever) to full (0-255) output. Changing it to full made a DRAMATIC difference in my gamma curve, which means, I guess, that the settings on my HTPC are correct. So I'm recalibrating anyway!
I'll check black optimizer after that.
<sigh>
Michael
It's always something. When using the PC generator it's always important to verify the levels are correct, usually the easiest way to do this is run a grayscale and make sure that 0% and 100% are where you expect them to be.

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post #4281 of 4281 Old Today, 03:18 AM
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The program is not really set-up well for running it on the same screen that you are calibrating but there won't be any rewrite anytime soon, sorry.
Actually, it runs beautifully. Compared to adding another screen, I will be very happy just moving the dialogue boxes, thank you very much.

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...make sure that 0% and 100% are where you expect them to be.
You're assuming I know where to expect them to be.
It turns out that "full" output on the video driver gives me a gamma curve I couldn't correct between now and Doomsday, so I went back to "limited" (or "default," something else I have to try). But running HCFR 0 - 255 still gives me BTB and WTW.

Though I'm not ready to cast this in stone yet, it appears that "black optimizer" actually affects whites, not blacks. It seems to lower/brighten the gamma curve at the light end, so, in a bright room, you get more light output than in a dark room, but the blacks are still the same black.

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