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post #4411 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
You are not doing the CMS correctly then, you can always hit the 75% saturation points within 0.5 dE. You need to use the colorspace option rec709 (75%) and appropriate patterns. Unfortunately it's a pain to use the AVSHD sweeps to do this and you'll be better off using the MCD or GCD patterns. You then adjust primaries/secondaries just like you do with the full gamut.

I am using rec709(75%). or I did for that last one.

I was using the slides in the saturations folder, 75% red, 75% green, etc

the one thing i'm trying to remember though, is whether it asked me for a white at the end still with the 75% values. for some reason I don't recall that happening, but if it did, I would have used the 100% white pattern. should I have used 75% gray?

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post #4412 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post
the one thing i'm trying to remember though, is whether it asked me for a white at the end still with the 75% values. for some reason I don't recall that happening, but if it did, I would have used the 100% white pattern. should I have used 75% gray?
I think your supposed to use the 75% gray when it asks for white, but I'm far from an expert.
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post #4413 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 08:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes, 75% white is expected here. You use 100% for the sweeps

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post #4414 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
Uploaded a minor upgrade version 3.1.6
+ Added selection of % input [BT.1886] offset to use in transfer function target, the remainder is output offset
+ Changed selected color display precision to 3 decimals for cd/m^2 field
+ Temporary fix to allow running a matrix corrected probe sheet alongside a ccss corrected probe (i1Display pro (D3) only)
+ Fixed rollover of APL values at high end of scale
+ Fixed change meter selection not working
+ Changed Relative BT.1886 label to Effective
Downloaded the latest 3.1.6 today but it crashes whenever I try to load a calibration file from 3.1.5.
Running Winodws 7 64-bit.
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post #4415 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 03:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Confirmed, thanks for the report. I've pulled 3.1.6 for the moment until I can fix it.

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post #4416 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 04:50 PM
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Zoyd, is it possible to have two instances of HCFR, on the same PC, to take simultaneous readings of two instruments? I can load up two sessions, each of which has a diff instrument loaded, but when I take free measures on one, the other one stops.
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post #4417 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 05:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Never tried that, I guess it doesn't work. The driver can probably talk to only one instrument at a time.

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post #4418 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 05:41 PM
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k thanks, may just use laptop to control second instrument
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post #4419 of 4438 Old 09-29-2014, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
Never tried that, I guess it doesn't work. The driver can probably talk to only one instrument at a time.
The ArgyllCMS instrument driver seems fine with more than one instrument at once (testing with spotread), so I'd suspect a bug in HCFR.
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post #4420 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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I've fixed 3.1.6 so you can restore older save files. If you have some recent 3.1.6 saves that you can't restore (unexpected file format message), zip and PM them to me and I'll convert them.
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post #4421 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
Yes, 75% white is expected here. You use 100% for the sweeps
I just tried this, I'm doing something wrong, I must be, because this made things WAY worse. I have delta luminance's of more than +100% right now,


I could not get dE's less than 10 with color set at 50.


I have a feeling the measures I'm doing aren't as independent as they seem to be. what am I do wrong:
-run greyscale sweep
-run primary/secondary sweep(reference set to 709/75%) using 75% patterns in saturation folder, and 75% gray pattern from one of the grayscale folders
-then I'd go in the cms, and adjust settings until each of the primaries/secondaries 'looks good'. and run the saturation sweeps(I never got them to look good this time though)


I think it's time for me to just be happy with the fact I have a calibration with dE's all under 2.5, and looks good with content, and stop worrying about why I needed 'bandaid' fixes

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post #4422 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
I've fixed 3.1.6 so you can restore older save files. If you have some recent 3.1.6 saves that you can't restore (unexpected file format message), zip and PM them to me and I'll convert them.
Works fine, even with a file from 2012
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post #4423 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post
I just tried this, I'm doing something wrong, I must be, because this made things WAY worse. I have delta luminance's of more than +100% right now,


I could not get dE's less than 10 with color set at 50.


I have a feeling the measures I'm doing aren't as independent as they seem to be. what am I do wrong:
-run greyscale sweep
-run primary/secondary sweep(reference set to 709/75%) using 75% patterns in saturation folder, and 75% gray pattern from one of the grayscale folders
correct so far.

Quote:
-then I'd go in the cms, and adjust settings until each of the primaries/secondaries 'looks good'.
Sounds right, run continuous measures and while you have the primaries/secondaries grid showing tune each color to minimize dE. Then take another primaries/secondaries sweep to confirm all colors are under 1 dE2K

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and run the saturation sweeps(I never got them to look good this time though)
Here you have to take a primaries/secondaries sweep at 100% in regular Rec709 prior to the saturation sweeps.

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post #4424 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
correct so far.


Sounds right, run continuous measures and while you have the primaries/secondaries grid showing tune each color to minimize dE. Then take another primaries/secondaries sweep to confirm all colors are under 1 dE2K



Here you have to take a primaries/secondaries sweep at 100% in regular Rec709 prior to the saturation sweeps.


thank you for this.


but this confirms my issue with color at 50 then. with color at 50, it's not possible for me to achieve 'acceptable' dE's. I'm sitting with values of 105% or higher, with settings of 0 for that corresponding color. I can't go lower than 0. I can 'balance' things at 105%, but then my delta luminance is very high, and the dE's are high anyway.


I've attached my most recent 'sweep' of all measures. and my settings are saved in the comments. the results look good to me, so I think I'm going to leave this for awhile, as it's started to frustrate me, and is no longer fun. I will thank you for all your help though!
Attached Files
File Type: zip fierce_gt_f8500.zip (4.7 KB, 7 views)

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post #4425 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post
I just tried this, I'm doing something wrong, I must be, because this made things WAY worse. I have delta luminance's of more than +100% right now,


I could not get dE's less than 10 with color set at 50.
I uploaded a file with my measurements using Color 50 and 75% targets to calibrate, but no one commented on it. The max & avg dE's aren't as good as when I calibrated with increased color and 100% but they're not 10 either. Now I'm out of town so no calibrating for a few days. That's fine as I need a break.

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post #4426 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
Yes, 75% white is expected here. You use 100% for the sweeps
Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post
I just tried this, I'm doing something wrong, I must be, because this made things WAY worse. I have delta luminance's of more than +100% right now,


I could not get dE's less than 10 with color set at 50.


I have a feeling the measures I'm doing aren't as independent as they seem to be. what am I do wrong:
-run greyscale sweep
-run primary/secondary sweep(reference set to 709/75%) using 75% patterns in saturation folder, and 75% gray pattern from one of the grayscale folders
-then I'd go in the cms, and adjust settings until each of the primaries/secondaries 'looks good'. and run the saturation sweeps(I never got them to look good this time though)


I think it's time for me to just be happy with the fact I have a calibration with dE's all under 2.5, and looks good with content, and stop worrying about why I needed 'bandaid' fixes
I don't get why zoyd was saying 100%. "-run primary/secondary sweep(reference set to 709/75%) using 75% patterns" All aligns properly with 75%sat/75%amp/709/75% primaries for as long as I can remember. I've never had to touch 100% settings or patterns. Unless there's a communication error?
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I uploaded a file with my measurements using Color 50 and 75% targets to calibrate, but no one commented on it.
I think it's a lot easier for most to comment and provide feedback when posting images with screenshots. It's a PITA to download a zip file and load it in HCFR to compare and then get back here to post. Moreover, a lot of us end up browsing the forums on computers/devices that don't have HCFR installed on them.
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I think it's a lot easier for most to comment and provide feedback when posting images with screenshots. It's a PITA to download a zip file and load it in HCFR to compare and then get back here to post. Moreover, a lot of us end up browsing the forums on computers/devices that don't have HCFR installed on them.
Zoyd asked for the .chc for the scenario I uploaded, hence the upload.
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post #4429 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 10:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

I've attached my most recent 'sweep' of all measures. and my settings are saved in the comments. the results look good to me, so I think I'm going to leave this for awhile, as it's started to frustrate me, and is no longer fun. I will thank you for all your help though!


Thanks, from your save file it looks like you have your HTPC levels set-up incorrectly for the display.

Cell light: 20, Contrast: 90 -> 100% white = 113.45 cd/m^2 Should be higher for these settings.

Brightness: 41 This should be close to 50

I'm guessing you have your video card set to YCC out so when feeding it video levels it's going to scale 16-235 into the range 30-218, 30->forces you to lower your brightness to compensate and 218 gives you the low peak white, it should be in the 130-140 cd/m^2 range. Set your card to full-range output so it doesn't do any scaling.

Getting the PC output set correctly may help with the color calibration.

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Last edited by zoyd; Today at 03:41 AM.
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post #4430 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 10:51 AM
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Thanks, from your save file it looks like you have your HTPC levels set-up incorrectly for the display.

Cell light: 20, Contrast: 90 -> 100% white = 113.45 cd/m^2 Should be higher for these settings.
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post #4431 of 4438 Old Yesterday, 12:08 PM - Thread Starter
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I've never had to touch 100% settings or patterns. Unless there's a communication error?
The comment was in reference to running the saturation sweeps, not rec709 75% color space.

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post #4432 of 4438 Old Today, 07:34 AM
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Accuracy of ambient light measurement?

This may be a bit of a strange question, but I am trying to use my Colormunki Display to measure Ambient light levels where my wife is growing a number of orchids that are housed under some grow lights. I know that Argyll/HCFR can measure ambient light level when the diffuser is in position on the meter. Given that the spectral distribution of the grow lights is an unknown, would that result in a potentially large uncertainty in reported ambient light levels?


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post #4433 of 4438 Old Today, 07:58 AM
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This may be a bit of a strange question, but I am trying to use my Colormunki Display to measure Ambient light levels where my wife is growing a number of orchids that are housed under some grow lights. I know that Argyll/HCFR can measure ambient light level when the diffuser is in position on the meter. Given that the spectral distribution of the grow lights is an unknown, would that result in a potentially large uncertainty in reported ambient light levels?
Should be moderately accurate in measuring visual light level (Lux). The filters in the i1d3 are certainly good enough, but in my experience the disagreement between absolute calibration of different instruments indicates some variations.
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post #4434 of 4438 Old Today, 08:17 AM
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Should be moderately accurate in measuring visual light level (Lux). The filters in the i1d3 are certainly good enough, but in my experience the disagreement between absolute calibration of different instruments indicates some variations.
Thanks Graeme. I'll give it a shot later today.


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Thanks, from your save file it looks like you have your HTPC levels set-up incorrectly for the display.

Cell light: 20, Contrast: 90 -> 100% white = 113.45 cd/m^2 Should be higher for these settings.

Brightness: 41 This should be close to 50

I'm guessing you have your video card set to YCC out so when feeding it video levels it's going to scale 16-235 into the range 30-218, 30->forces you to lower your brightness to compensate and 218 gives you the low peak white, it should be in the 130-140 cd/m^2 range. Set your card to full-range output so it doesn't do any scaling.

Getting the PC output set correctly may help with the color calibration.
yeah, i'll see what happens if I ever figure out how to run these patterns off a different source.

to be honest though, if I get a brighter image, i'm going the wrong way, haha. I went through great effort to get it DOWN to only 30ftl. for what it's worth, setting contrast to 100, still gets me over 50ftl, which seems in line with what others are getting.

but until I get the slides running off another source, and cross reference that to the pc, i'll never know for sure.

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post #4436 of 4438 Old Today, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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but until I get the slides running off another source, and cross reference that to the pc, i'll never know for sure.
I would reset everything to default since that calibration will be completely wrong for normal video level inputs.

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post #4437 of 4438 Old Today, 08:45 AM
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I would reset everything to default since that calibration will be completely wrong for normal video level inputs.
I'll run the hdmi2 input. not fixing what isn't broke, until I know it's broke, haha.

plus, i'd like to see HOW it's off. just for interest.

now. what's the easiest way to run the avs patterns off a ps3? haha

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post #4438 of 4438 Old Today, 09:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Set the PS3 for YCC output and go.

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