HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software - Page 179 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5341 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 10:01 AM
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I have a question please, a friend is trying to use HCFR with a retail version i1D3 meter on windows 7 platform, he gets the error 'cannot initialise' . The links to the drivers do not work, any ideas please ?,
Thanks.
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post #5342 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panman40 View Post
I have a question please, a friend is trying to use HCFR with a retail version i1D3 meter on windows 7 platform, he gets the error 'cannot initialise' . The links to the drivers do not work, any ideas please ?,
Thanks.
you do not need any drivers for the d3. be sure the diffuser is not in front of the lens on the meter.
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post #5343 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by vega509 View Post
you do not need any drivers for the d3. be sure the diffuser is not in front of the lens on the meter.
The diffuser was not on, hcfr just will not see the meter and initialise.
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post #5344 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by panman40 View Post
The diffuser was not on, hcfr just will not see the meter and initialise.
uninstall the x-rite driver, you do not need it for windows or hcfr.
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post #5345 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by WPWoodJr View Post
I can rent a ColorMunki spectro for $60 with shipping. Is it worth doing this to calibrate my i1D3? Or am I just chasing perfection? I have a Samsung PN60F8500, and am using the Plasma EDR setting in HCFR.
You can actually find outfits that will rent a ColorMunki for a little over half that price for 3 days.

The other thing you can do is find an owner with your same TV and same meter (iD3) and a spectro and have them share their profile file with you.

I started this way and got a 1 - 1.5 dE change versus the standard White LED/LCD profile.

Down the road I'll be getting my hands on a spectro for a couple days to run my own profile, but I suspect the conclusion is likely to be that any profile of the same TV on the same meter is likely to get you 90% of the way to what a direct profile provides (at least for similar-age panels and meters).

A year from now I'm probably going to repeat the same exercise in the hopes of being in a position to rank the impact of these four factors:

A/ specific profile for your meter type on your TV type versus stock generic profile (ie:white LED/LCD)

B/ pre-calibration profile of your meter on your TV versus specific profile for your meter type on your TV type (shared TV-and-meter-specific profile).

C/ pre-calibration profile of your meter on your TV versus year-old profile of same meter on same TV (meter and TV drift).

D/ pre-calibration profile of your meter on your TV versus specific profile of similar-age same meter type on similar-age same TV type (panel-to-panel and meter-to-meter variation over time).
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post #5346 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 12:31 PM
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I'm now using the generator on HCFR and it has made such a difference in how efficient and effective my calibrations are, I'm really amazed at how powerful this program is.

I have one little nit and I'm hoping there is a small further improvement I can make.

I find the entire gamma settings section confusing. I'm generally using power law gamma of 2.4 or 2.2 because I at least understand how the reference is being defined.

I am actually calibrating my gamma to BT.1886 and I am doing this by hand using the spreadsheet that is floating around to determine specific 21-pt levels based on 100% peak white level and 0% black level.

So this means I am totally ignoring greyscale luminance errors in HCFR.

I would like to use the BT.1886 setting in HCFR but I find it confusing and don't understand how to align it to the spreadsheet-driven luminance levels I am using.

The spreadsheet is based on 100% luminance and 0% luminance and I am fine with having HCFR base 100% based on the measured value but don't understand how to input the 0% value in the way I would like.

I would like the BT.1886 values to be based on 0% levels of 0.001 or 0.002 cd/m2 and don't want to rely on an imprecise near-zero meter reading for that input.

Is there a way to configure the BT.1886 setting in HCFR so that the gamma curve is based on measured 100% luminance and manually-input effective 0% level?
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post #5347 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 12:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Is there a way to configure the BT.1886 setting in HCFR so that the gamma curve is based on measured 100% luminance and manually-input effective 0% level?
I'll probably add a manual black level for the next update but for now you can do it this way on the grayscale measures page:

1. uncheck XYZ adjustments if checked in the parameters window
2. check editable data
3. enter black level Y for 0% level
4. recheck XYZ adjustments if you unchecked it in step 1

I'm also open to suggestions for a better layout to the gamma reference page, often times what makes sense to me doesn't translate well to others.
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post #5348 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
I'll probably add a manual black level for the next update but for now you can do it this way on the grayscale measures page:

1. uncheck XYZ adjustments if checked in the parameters window
2. check editable data
3. enter black level Y for 0% level
4. recheck XYZ adjustments if you unchecked it in step 1

I'm also open to suggestions for a better layout to the gamma reference page, often times what makes sense to me doesn't translate well to others.
Thanks - I'll give this a try. So by getting 0% grey manually set to the level I want, I understand I'll have the correct drivers for a standard BT.1886 gamma, but what do I do with the 'Effective', '% input offset' 'Reference Gamma' and 'Average Gamma' entry fields on the Preferences page once 'ITU-R BT.1886 has been selected? Are these all ignored and if not, how should they be configured for a standard BT.1886 gamma based on 0% black level, 100% white level, and power law gamma factor as used by the 'BT1886CalcV3' calculation spreadsheet?

Also, in case anyone on the thread knows, is a power law gamma factor of 2.4 or 2.35 generally considered the best for dark-room viewing calibration?
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post #5349 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 04:13 PM - Thread Starter
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The default values of 0 for effective gamma and 100% input offset gives you a standard BT.1886 target based on your 0% and 100% readings.
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post #5350 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
The default values of 0 for effective gamma and 100% input offset gives you a standard BT.1886 target based on your 0% and 100% readings.

Great - thanks.

And should 'Reference Gamma' and/or 'Average Gamma' be set to 2.4 if I want to calculate BT.1886 based on a gamma of 2.4, or are those settings ignored because that is the default?
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post #5351 of 5362 Old Yesterday, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by vega509 View Post
uninstall the x-rite driver, you do not need it for windows or hcfr.
Following this below from the maual when you click on the link in the folder nothing happens...


The USB drivers must be already on your computer. If you downloaded and installed the HCFR Colorimeter software before, you should find the USB drivers in the folder Pilote_USB under the installation folder of the software.
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post #5352 of 5362 Old Today, 05:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Great - thanks.

And should 'Reference Gamma' and/or 'Average Gamma' be set to 2.4 if I want to calculate BT.1886 based on a gamma of 2.4, or are those settings ignored because that is the default?
Reference gamma is the setting that pure power uses so it will have no effect when BT.1886 is selected, Average gamma is your average measured point gamma.


Quote:
Originally Posted by panman40 View Post
Following this below from the maual when you click on the link in the folder nothing happens...


The USB drivers must be already on your computer. If you downloaded and installed the HCFR Colorimeter software before, you should find the USB drivers in the folder Pilote_USB under the installation folder of the software.
1st post has driver installation instructions in the FAQ section, or you can get more details for each probe at the argyllcms.com site.
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post #5353 of 5362 Old Today, 08:36 AM
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Hi there,


I just started to Play around with projector calibration after a longer time again and wanted to update my 3.0.4 to the newest Version of HCFR.
Did so an now cannot open any of the old files I saved with my old Installation.
It seems that all newer Versions (newer then 3.0.4)cannot open the old files, also tried other Versions and all bot the 3.0.4 have this. Is that by intention?


Anyway to open the files there?


Regards
Stefan
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post #5354 of 5362 Old Today, 09:55 AM - Thread Starter
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There was an update to 3.0.4 (revision 3.0.4.4) which fixed reading of older HCFR versions but if you missed that update some 3.0.4 save files are not compatible with newer versions. If send me some files you wish to convert (zip and attach), I'll see what I can do.
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post #5355 of 5362 Old Today, 09:56 AM
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Does anyone else use a laptop with ATI Mobility Radeon (with extended display) for View Images? I get drastically different results compared to patterns on 2 blu-ray players (e.g. red delta luminance of -25% versus +5%), even after setting ati to default. Might borrow a laptop with Intel graphics if it's the way to go.
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post #5356 of 5362 Old Today, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
There was an update to 3.0.4 (revision 3.0.4.4) which fixed reading of older HCFR versions but if you missed that update some 3.0.4 save files are not compatible with newer versions. If send me some files you wish to convert (zip and attach), I'll see what I can do.
Thanks for that offer, but I be around 30 files or so. (I'm doing the measurements for our homecinema club here...)


Is it possible to somehow still get the install files/update from 3.0.4.0 to this 3.0.4.4 so I could do that myself?
I guess it is just opening the files in that newer Version and saving them again, right?


Regards
Stefan
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post #5357 of 5362 Old Today, 10:46 AM - Thread Starter
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post #5358 of 5362 Old Today, 11:28 AM
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What, you don't make house calls?!





Downloadable FREE demo discs:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1475769/de...ently-authored 

Did you really need to quote that entire post in your reply?
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post #5359 of 5362 Unread Today, 11:52 AM - Thread Starter
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What, you don't make house calls?!
Only if beer is involved.
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post #5360 of 5362 Unread Today, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
You can actually find outfits that will rent a ColorMunki for a little over half that price for 3 days.

The other thing you can do is find an owner with your same TV and same meter (iD3) and a spectro and have them share their profile file with you.
...
Thanks. Someone is lending me a profiled ColorMunki spectro .

Samsung PN60F8500, TiVo Roamio, ASRock Vision 3D HTPC, Chromecast
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post #5361 of 5362 Unread Today, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
...
Down the road I'll be getting my hands on a spectro for a couple days to run my own profile, but I suspect the conclusion is likely to be that any profile of the same TV on the same meter is likely to get you 90% of the way to what a direct profile provides (at least for similar-age panels and meters).

A year from now I'm probably going to repeat the same exercise in the hopes of being in a position to rank the impact of these four factors:

A/ specific profile for your meter type on your TV type versus stock generic profile (ie:white LED/LCD)

B/ pre-calibration profile of your meter on your TV versus specific profile for your meter type on your TV type (shared TV-and-meter-specific profile).

C/ pre-calibration profile of your meter on your TV versus year-old profile of same meter on same TV (meter and TV drift).

D/ pre-calibration profile of your meter on your TV versus specific profile of similar-age same meter type on similar-age same TV type (panel-to-panel and meter-to-meter variation over time).
I have found that the method you use to profile produces quite varied results. For instance, I was calibrating with 8% / 25% APL windows, and got results that were spectacular (only 20 patches above dE 2 on 1000 patch test set). Then the other day I tried 12% / 35% windows; after measuring the lux of some shows I like to watch I determined that 35% might be a better match for my viewing. While the dE's aren't as good, the skin tones are noticeably superior. This is on a plasma so perhaps it is more sensitive to APL changes than an LCD would be.

Samsung PN60F8500, TiVo Roamio, ASRock Vision 3D HTPC, Chromecast
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Ok, send me one file to test and I'll send you an executable you can use for the rest
Thanks for your help, really appreciate it!


I found a 3.0.4.4 Version somewhere and installed it, but it also cannot load the files I mesured with the 3.0.4.0.


Here one file as example:
Attached Files
File Type: zip Sony_310h_normal_16_9_low_gamma24_cal.zip (7.8 KB, 0 views)
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