HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software - Page 226 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6751 of 7743 Unread 11-09-2015, 10:29 AM
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I am new to using colorimeters. I have purchased a Colormunki Display and I'm using it with HCFR using the AVSHD Blu Ray to calibrate my new Sony 55XBR-850C TV. The TV has RGB Bias and Gain controls that are "global" and then has individual RGB offset controls for 10 point gray scale.

The thing I notice right away is that at the dark end of the scale 0%/10%/20% with the TV set to default settings, there is a huge amount of "Blue" being reported by HCFR. I can get it into the ball park by turning the TV's Blue Bias control down to Min. But, when I look at a gray ramp it is very clear that this has introduced a lot of colored tint into the dark end of the ramp.

I have to conclude the Colormunki is either broken or the built in calibration files for it in HCFR are completely wrong. I don't have access to any calibrated colorimeter to attempt to "calibrate the calibrator".

Can anyone advise me? Am I doing something stupid? Should I return the Colormunki?
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post #6752 of 7743 Unread 11-09-2015, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Persil View Post
I am new to using colorimeters. I have purchased a Colormunki Display and I'm using it with HCFR using the AVSHD Blu Ray to calibrate my new Sony 55XBR-850C TV. The TV has RGB Bias and Gain controls that are "global" and then has individual RGB offset controls for 10 point gray scale.

The thing I notice right away is that at the dark end of the scale 0%/10%/20% with the TV set to default settings, there is a huge amount of "Blue" being reported by HCFR. I can get it into the ball park by turning the TV's Blue Bias control down to Min. But, when I look at a gray ramp it is very clear that this has introduced a lot of colored tint into the dark end of the ramp.

I have to conclude the Colormunki is either broken or the built in calibration files for it in HCFR are completely wrong. I don't have access to any calibrated colorimeter to attempt to "calibrate the calibrator".

Can anyone advise me? Am I doing something stupid? Should I return the Colormunki?
You're fine. The Colormunki, the i1Display 2/LT, etc. have trouble reading such low light levels, so it's simply not reporting accurately, and it's usually advised to just ignore the below 10% stimulus readings when calibrating.

Just aim to get 10% and up correct and you'll be good to go!

sspears:
(Rules? Rules? In Television???? Thou shalt not oversaturateth red. RGB shall be thy rod and thy staff; there shall be no other color space before thee.)
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post #6753 of 7743 Unread 11-10-2015, 01:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Persil View Post
Can anyone advise me? Am I doing something stupid? Should I return the Colormunki?
You should set the TV like ColorMunki shows. ColorMunki is fine and sensitive enough at the low end. Certainly for LCD TV.

Last edited by jjccckk; 11-10-2015 at 07:45 AM.
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post #6754 of 7743 Unread 11-22-2015, 01:04 AM
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Hi
I'm new to display calibrating, so please forgive me if I'm simply repeating a problem/question that have arisen previously. I have a ColorMunki 'Display' along with version 3.3.7 of HCFR. When I run HCFR and select file/new, and select 'DVD manual', a message appears to the effect that there is a problem starting communications between HCFR and the ColorMunki device. This version of HCFR reportedly supports the ColorMunki 'Display'. Thus, does this mean I do not have copy files either to or from the 'Display' or HCFR? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers
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post #6755 of 7743 Unread 11-22-2015, 03:21 AM - Thread Starter
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That's correct, you do not need to install any driver files for the Colormunki display. Also make sure that there are no automatic X-rite services running since they will prevent communications with the probe.
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post #6756 of 7743 Unread 11-22-2015, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
That's correct, you do not need to install any driver files for the Colormunki display. Also make sure that there are no automatic X-rite services running since they will prevent communications with the probe.
Thanks Zoyd
As I said, I'm new to this and I'm unaware of what you mean by X-rite services. My next question is, how do I determine whether one or more is/are running and if so, how do I disable it/them?

Cheers
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post #6757 of 7743 Unread 11-22-2015, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PKAUS View Post
My next question is, how do I determine whether one or more is/are running and if so, how do I disable it/them?
Hi, If you are not using the X-Rite's i1Profiler Software, remove the X-Rite Device Manager (If it's installed) using Windows Control Panel.

If you cannot find X-Rite device services in control panel follow instructions below:

Open in the Administrative Tools / Computer Management /

Look for X-Rite Device Services Manager

Double click on that name and a new window will appear

Click the "Quit" button to close the process.

or:

Run "services.msc". At the bottom of the services list, if you see an X-Rite Device Service listed, turn it off.
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post #6758 of 7743 Unread 11-23-2015, 12:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, If you are not using the X-Rite's i1Profiler Software, remove the X-Rite Device Manager (If it's installed) using Windows Control Panel.

If you cannot find X-Rite device services in control panel follow instructions below:

Open in the Administrative Tools / Computer Management /

Look for X-Rite Device Services Manager

Double click on that name and a new window will appear

Click the "Quit" button to close the process.

or:

Run "services.msc". At the bottom of the services list, if you see an X-Rite Device Service listed, turn it off.
Thanks ConnecTEDDD. Problem solved; it's marvellous what can be achieved with the correct information. I had spend some considerable time trying to work through the problem before you and Zoyd responded to my posts, So your responses have been most welcome and very much appreciated. Once again thank you.
Cheers
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post #6759 of 7743 Unread 11-23-2015, 04:58 AM
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Dear all,

Since last updates, black patches appear randomly during mesurements (grayscale, primary and secondary colors, saturations)
sometimes it works sometimes not. The results are totally false when it happens.

I'm using the last version (v3.3.7) with an i1d3.

Is it the same for you?
Thanks

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post #6760 of 7743 Unread 11-24-2015, 10:15 AM
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Hey guys I updated HCFR today and went to recalibrate my set. I plugged in my i1pro and disabled the deleted the driver. I then tried to install the driver through HCFR like before to get the i1pro to work but this time I am greeted with an error message. Any idea on how to get around this? Has this method changed?

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post #6761 of 7743 Unread 11-24-2015, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superkyle View Post
Hey guys I updated HCFR today and went to recalibrate my set. I plugged in my i1pro and disabled the deleted the driver.
Why ? If it already has the Argyll/USBLib system driver running for it, no need to re-install.
Quote:
I then tried to install the driver through HCFR like before to get the i1pro to work but this time I am greeted with an error message. Any idea on how to get around this? Has this method changed?
Are you using MSWindows 8 or 10 ? Did you forget to reboot your system in "Disable Driver Signature Enforcement" mode before installing the driver ?
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post #6762 of 7743 Unread 11-24-2015, 09:02 PM
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HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwgill View Post
Why ? If it already has the Argyll/USBLib system driver running for it, no need to re-install.
It was using the plug and play driver I guess? Or possibly one that was previously installed back when using calman. Either way it was the incorrect driver to run with HCFR.



Quote:
Originally Posted by gwgill View Post
Are you using MSWindows 8 or 10 ? Did you forget to reboot your system in "Disable Driver Signature Enforcement" mode before installing the driver ?

I am using Windows 10 now. I did not reboot or disable driver signature enforcement. I will have to try that out when I get back in town. I think that's going to be it! Thank you.


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post #6763 of 7743 Unread 11-25-2015, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superkyle View Post
It was using the plug and play driver I guess? Or possibly one that was previously installed back when using calman. Either way it was the incorrect driver to run with HCFR.






I am using Windows 10 now. I did not reboot or disable driver signature enforcement. I will have to try that out when I get back in town. I think that's going to be it! Thank you.


Always destroying exergy!
I hope that solves your issue.

But usually Windows just tells you the driver isn't signed, spits it out, then beats you up until you leave the sandbox LOL. Perhaps this is an exception.

Regards,

Steve
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post #6764 of 7743 Unread 11-30-2015, 08:50 AM
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HCFR Display Type

Hi all,

Can someone please offer advice on what Display Type I should choose when using HCFR with a ColorMunki Display?

The three most popular recommendations I've seen so far for an LCD tv are non-refresh, white LED and RGB LED. I do not have a spectrometer.

The TV I'm calibrating is the 2015 Vizio M series, if that makes a difference.

I realize this has probably been asked 100 times already, so thanks for your patience and assistance.
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post #6765 of 7743 Unread 11-30-2015, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stockman20 View Post
Hi all,
The three most popular recommendations I've seen so far for an LCD tv are non-refresh, white LED and RGB LED. I do not have a spectrometer.
My understanding is that refresh and non-refresh settings are generic baselines to be used if you are using a spectro to "calibrate" the colorimeter. White LEDs are the most common form of LCD backlighting; if the TV has RGB LED the manufacturer will most likely "brag" about it.
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post #6766 of 7743 Unread 11-30-2015, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stockman20 View Post
The TV I'm calibrating is the 2015 Vizio M series, if that makes a difference.
It uses white LED backlight so that is the display type you should choose.
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post #6767 of 7743 Unread 12-08-2015, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
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post #6768 of 7743 Unread 12-11-2015, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Francois76l View Post
Since last updates, black patches appear randomly during mesurements (grayscale, primary and secondary colors, saturations)
sometimes it works sometimes not.
What do you mean about this exactly? I played around with the same combo but I haven't experienced this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
Version 3.3.8 has been uploaded to sourceforge
Wow! Thanks you! I'll try out during the weekend.

1. I have created a correction matrix (ccxx) file for id3 with i1pro and the help of dispalGUI. It in the Argyll folder where all the other ccss files are. I tried to use it with HCFR but I couldn't figure it out how (I ended up manually copy-paste the 9 float numbers in the menu). When there's a popup where I could select a correction matrix from the dropdown, the dropdown is empty.
Where should I copy my ccxx file to be recognized by HCFR? I tried the "C\Program Files (86)\HCFR\Etalon_Argyll", restarting the application, but it still empty.

2. Can I print out all the measurement tables and graphs all at once (not just 1 by 1)?

Thanks

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post #6769 of 7743 Unread 12-11-2015, 09:03 AM
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I mean that black patches appear randomly during measurements. Maybe I should make a new clean install.
I will try the last version tonight to see if the problem is solved

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post #6770 of 7743 Unread 12-11-2015, 04:17 PM
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I tested with the last version but I still have the problem:
https://*******/photos/gvTDhXVfhBBZYVPTA (******* = g o o . g l)

I'm using madtpg (last version)

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Last edited by Francois76l; 12-11-2015 at 04:24 PM.
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post #6771 of 7743 Unread 12-13-2015, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Francois76l View Post
I tested with the last version but I still have the problem:
https://*******/photos/gvTDhXVfhBBZYVPTA (******* = g o o . g l)

I'm using madtpg (last version)
Oh, I see now. Yes, I got the same problem: When I start a measure everithyng session, in the last round it displays black for several times and the counter of madtpg displays also wrong values (e.g. shows 54/54 (like it ended) but colors are still changing)!
So this is a bug.

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post #6772 of 7743 Unread 12-16-2015, 12:55 PM
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I've been reading around in circles about Calman and Chromapure and glad I finally decided to read through most of this thread. Excited to use this software. It looks like its a no bs, let you do whatever you want, kind of deal that doesn't baby you around. Especially appreciate the responsiveness of the software engineer in here, so if it all pans out, the money I would have spent on chromapure or calman, will get donated to this project instead.
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post #6773 of 7743 Unread 12-17-2015, 08:51 PM
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Quick mystery/question:

When using HCFR to generate test patterns using View Images, I need to configure for Gray Scale 0-255 or the patterns I get are off (too bright at the low-end; 0% is gray).

My Laptop is set for RGB output but appears to know that the extended display is a TV (so may be doing some adjustment of video levels automagically).

Grey-scale calibration goes fine in this way and then when I check with manual patterns using my Bluray player, everything jibes. The only issue is that the Bluray player shows black all the way to video level 16 (0%) and then begins to increase from there while HCFR states 0:0:0 at 0% and increases from there.

I've tried setting the Bluray player to both RGB output and Auto but that changes nothing.

Am I doing something wrong?

If HCFR said 16:16:16 on the 0% pattern I'd have no questions, but it seems like what it thinks is 0:0:0-255:255:255 is being mapped to 16:16:16-235:235:235 somehow
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post #6774 of 7743 Unread 12-17-2015, 09:18 PM
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Sounds like your laptop is compressing the desktop to 16-235 for video output. So what Windows thinks is 0 is actually getting output as 16.

This isn't ideal and can cause banding, but you may not be able to force rgb0-255 output from your laptop depending on chipset.

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post #6775 of 7743 Unread 12-17-2015, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Quick mystery/question:

When using HCFR to generate test patterns using View Images, I need to configure for Gray Scale 0-255 or the patterns I get are off (too bright at the low-end; 0% is gray).

My Laptop is set for RGB output but appears to know that the extended display is a TV (so may be doing some adjustment of video levels automagically).

Grey-scale calibration goes fine in this way and then when I check with manual patterns using my Bluray player, everything jibes. The only issue is that the Bluray player shows black all the way to video level 16 (0%) and then begins to increase from there while HCFR states 0:0:0 at 0% and increases from there.

I've tried setting the Bluray player to both RGB output and Auto but that changes nothing.

Am I doing something wrong?

If HCFR said 16:16:16 on the 0% pattern I'd have no questions, but it seems like what it thinks is 0:0:0-255:255:255 is being mapped to 16:16:16-235:235:235 somehow
are you going to be using RGB source for watching the tv?

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post #6776 of 7743 Unread 12-17-2015, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10k View Post
Sounds like your laptop is compressing the desktop to 16-235 for video output. So what Windows thinks is 0 is actually getting output as 16.

This isn't ideal and can cause banding, but you may not be able to force rgb0-255 output from your laptop depending on chipset.
Yeah, that's what I thought as well. I'm not really worried about banding as much as rounding.

HCFR allows you to characterize near-black at 1%. (as well as 2%, 3% and 4%)

With proper video levels, 1% ought to correspond to:

1%: 1%x(235-16)+16=18
vs. 1%x255=3 and then (3/255)x(235-16)+16=19
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post #6777 of 7743 Unread 12-18-2015, 08:38 AM
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How does HCFR know which chromecast to use when more than one are on the network? Is there a way to choose the desired one?
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post #6778 of 7743 Unread 12-18-2015, 03:02 PM - Thread Starter
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HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software

There is currently no way to choose from multiple CCs on the network so you'll have to unplug all but the one you want to use during calibration.
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post #6779 of 7743 Unread 12-18-2015, 07:20 PM
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Just checked and the max parameter for 'Number of grayscale levels' is 100.

That allows a full 1% sweep to be run (most video levels stepping by 2, some by 3) but it is not possible to make a sweep of each and every greyscale level (by setting Number of grayscale levels to 255 or 219).

Increasing 'Number of near black levels' above 4 just increases the number of 1% steps anove 0, but does not allow video levels 17, 18, 19, 20, 21 etc... to be tested.

I'm not really interested in 255 or 216 greyscale sweeps but would like to find some way to easily measure greyscal near black at single-step levels (video levels 16 - 27).

Is there any way to do this with HCFR (view image)? If not, it this a simple request for the next release?

These LG OLEDs are very funky in the near-black range and I believe near-black characterization at a finer level than 1% is a capability that more and more Forum members would appreciate...
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post #6780 of 7743 Unread 12-18-2015, 07:38 PM - Thread Starter
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