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Old 02-12-2016, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Can you post the HCFR data file (*.chc)?
Here are my color measures , colour measure1 is with Rec.709 and colour measures is with Rec709(75%/75%)
My pixel format is YCbCr422, HCFR generator - APL18%, Image Area 100%, PAtern intensity 100%, Gray scale 0-255
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File Type: zip color measures.zip (4.5 KB, 37 views)
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Old 02-13-2016, 07:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Old 02-13-2016, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by traykov77 View Post
Here are my color measures , colour measure1 is with Rec.709 and colour measures is with Rec709(75%/75%)
My pixel format is YCbCr422, HCFR generator - APL18%, Image Area 100%, PAtern intensity 100%, Gray scale 0-255
The 100%/100% results do look much better than 75%/75%. Was the CMS adjustments optimized for each run, or were these measurements taken with the same set of TV settings?
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Old 02-13-2016, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
The 100%/100% results do look much better than 75%/75%. Was the CMS adjustments optimized for each run, or were these measurements taken with the same set of TV settings?
I try to optimise settinhs for 75%/75% but the result is almost the same. Do I have to change anything in HCFR settings exept Rec.709/75%/75% when I measure colors? Generator parameters are Image area 100%, APL 18%, GDI, Display Triplets, Gray scale 0-255, disable video LUT. Pixel format YCbCr422, computer is connected to the receiver with HDMI, one monitor fullhd and one uhd tv samsung 7500hu. The tv is connected in receiver with HDMI.
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Old 02-13-2016, 09:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by traykov77 View Post
I try to optimise settinhs for 75%/75% but the result is almost the same. Do I have to change anything in HCFR settings exept Rec.709/75%/75% when I measure colors?
no, your interior colors are undersaturated and the CMS controls can't be used to addsaturation. Try upping the color control to something like 55 and try again. (this seems to be common problem on more recent Samsungs)

btw - even with that problem your colorchecker dE00 avg/max is around 1/1.5 which is quite good.
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Last edited by zoyd; 02-13-2016 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 02-14-2016, 05:33 AM
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(this seems to be common problem on more recent Samsungs)
I've been noticing that with their sets as far back as 2008. They always seem to struggle with the lower points for red and blue.
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Old 02-14-2016, 11:54 AM
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I tried with colour set on 57, the red is OK(delta xy 0.0019), but the blue delta xy is 0065. (on old settings is 0.0045). luminance of red and blue is +10-12%, to minimise other colours delta xy cms control have to be set 60-65 of some colours.
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Old 02-14-2016, 01:29 PM - Thread Starter
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You'll have to readjust color luminance at each color level but the goal is to minimize dE not necessarily dxy. So pick the color setting/calibration that gives the best overall average dE on the standard color checker and skin tone sweeps.
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Old 02-14-2016, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
You'll have to readjust color luminance at each color level but the goal is to minimize dE not necessarily dxy. So pick the color setting/calibration that gives the best overall average dE on the standard color checker and skin tone sweeps.
When I measure primary and secondary colours the setting is HDTV - Rec709. 75/75. When measuring color checker and skin tone sweeps do I have to change HDTV - Rec709 in HCFR or to stay HDTV - Rec.709 75/75?
The goal is to get delta E and delta luminance minimum I suppose.
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Old 02-14-2016, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Old 02-14-2016, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
dE includes luminance, saturation and hue errors. The color checker sweeps will work in either color space.
What color option to pick with color checker - gcd classic, calman sg or something else?
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Old 02-14-2016, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by traykov77 View Post
I tried with colour set on 57, the red is OK(delta xy 0.0019), but the blue delta xy is 0065. (on old settings is 0.0045). luminance of red and blue is +10-12%, to minimise other colours delta xy cms control have to be set 60-65 of some colours.
Those deltaxy seems not to that huge really. I have over 0.100 on green on my Epson PJ that cannot be calibrated right however much i turn saturation down. What happens is that the 0-75% saturation levels gets under-saturated if I try, but the 100% intensity level stays where it is. So, I have to live with that and get the 75% sat level correct for an Ok overall response.

Luma levels that you have problems with can be tuned if you have the CMS controls for it. (But beware that changing luma changes saturation equaly much on some displays, so they counter each other out to a degree).
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Old 02-15-2016, 04:56 AM
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The correction that I use for xrite i1 display for Samsung hu7500 is wled IPS Samsung lg in HCFR. But the TV is with PVA matrix. Is this correct or to use PVA Samsung LCD matrix.
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Old 02-15-2016, 02:14 PM
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I changed to RGB444 and measured again. What do You tnink about new results?
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Old 02-21-2016, 10:31 PM
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What would be the negatives for not achieving your set gamma in preferences and then calibrating color and saturation points at the gamma set in preferences. During grayscale(brightness/contrast) calibration gamma came out 2.26, but in preferences I set it to 2.2. I moved on to color from there.
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Old 02-21-2016, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
What would be the negatives for not achieving your set gamma in preferences and then calibrating color and saturation points at the gamma set in preferences. During grayscale(brightness/contrast) calibration gamma came out 2.26, but in preferences I set it to 2.2. I moved on to color from there.
Grayscale and color are dependent on each other and on gamma. So say you would try to fix that gamma later and get it perfectly then you would find that grayscale and color might be off a little. What this means in practice is that you need to do grayscale->gamma->cms->grayscale->gamma->cms and so on a few iterations until your dE is the lowest overall you can get and gamma is as good as you can get.

Now, it may be that you cannot get any better on the gamma than you already have, fine - then you are done! :-) 2.26 is pretty close to the target anyway. It depends on the viewing conditions. The darker the room, the higher gamma you can have. Too low gamma in a really dark room will render dark grays as too bright. Too high gamma in a brighter room will render darks grays as black.
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Old 02-22-2016, 04:40 AM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
What would be the negatives for not achieving your set gamma in preferences and then calibrating color and saturation points at the gamma set in preferences. During grayscale(brightness/contrast) calibration gamma came out 2.26, but in preferences I set it to 2.2. I moved on to color from there.
As zoyd explained in post 3807:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/newrep...ply&p=25374090
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Originally Posted by zoyd View Post
When you use BT.1886 all the color targets are based on the gamma target you've set. It's the same when you choose a power law target unless you check "use measured gamma", in that case the color targets are based on a power law using your average measured gamma.
If you cannot achieve the target gamma (e.g., if your TV does not provide a 10-point gamma adjustment", you may want to check the "use measured gamma" option so that the colour targets are calculated accordingly.

In your particular case, 2.26 is close to 2.2 so the difference will be negligible.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 02-23-2016 at 07:54 PM.
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Old 02-22-2016, 06:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
As zoyd explained in post 3807:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/newrep...ply&p=25374090
When you use BT.1886 all the color targets are based on the gamma target you've set. It's the same when you choose a power law target unless you check "use measured gamma", in that case the color targets are based on a power law using your average
Oh, I did not know that! Thanks for clearing that out. I always thought color targets was "fixed" regardless of gamma choice. But then, maybe I have been running the "measured gamma" option all along... What is changing if I use the gamma target? Just luma levels I suppose?
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Old 02-22-2016, 07:20 AM
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What is changing if I use the gamma target? Just luma levels I suppose?
I'm not sure, but when I tested it both delta-xy and delta-luminance changed.
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Old 02-23-2016, 01:16 AM
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I have a problem in 3.3.9 and I don't think I saw it brought up before, I use an ID3 for reference. After running a grayscale and primary/secondary (just 100%) run I usually do a free measure on the Primary & Secondaries at 100% and tune with my CMS (before I let ArgyllCMS + dispcalGUI take over for a 3DLUT for my eeColor, I get better results doing it this way). Older versions would show the RGB and dE correctly but on 3.3.9 it way way off when I do this and the dE goes to like 31 and the RGB levels are off.

My Home Theater/Video Gaming/HTPC/2 Channel rig (Mitsubishi, MartinLogan, Marantz, DIYMA, and others)

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Old 02-23-2016, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
As zoyd explained in post 3807:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/newrep...ply&p=25374090


If you cannot achieve the target gamma (e.g., if your TV does not provide a 10-point gamma adjustment", you may want to check the "use measure gamma" option so that the colour targets are calculated accordingly.

In your particular case, 2.26 is close to 2.2 so the difference will be negligible.
I was concerned that Y may have me increasing color brightness, based on the set gamma in preferences. Which would mean each shade of gray would be darker than the Y calculated by set preferences gamma. Possibly negatively affecting image detail.
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Old 02-24-2016, 10:46 PM
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Hey guys. I'm kind of bored right now and I'm thinking about making the Windows 10 jump. Does the program run fine on it? I'm still on Windows 7.

I'm getting my iDisplay Pro tomorrow and my TV on Monday, so the upgrade can wait, but if it's not an issue, I'll do it right now.

Thanks
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Old 02-24-2016, 11:08 PM
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Hey guys. I'm kind of bored right now and I'm thinking about making the Windows 10 jump. Does the program run fine on it? I'm still on Windows 7.

I'm getting my iDisplay Pro tomorrow and my TV on Monday, so the upgrade can wait, but if it's not an issue, I'll do it right now.

Thanks
I've been running HCFR on Windows 10 without any issues. The meter works just fine, too. Just make sure you don't install the software that comes with it.
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Old 02-25-2016, 03:32 PM
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No problems with win10 here in either hcfr or displaycal. I'm using a colormunki display and a colormunki photo.
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Old 02-25-2016, 08:11 PM
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I've been running HCFR on Windows 10 without any issues. The meter works just fine, too. Just make sure you don't install the software that comes with it.
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No problems with win10 here in either hcfr or displaycal. I'm using a colormunki display and a colormunki photo.
Alright cool, doing the upgrade now. Thanks guys.
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Old 03-01-2016, 12:43 AM
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When saving file .chc with color measures when try to open the program didn't start, just open warning that options is changed in HCFR. When open the saved file do I have to put the same options in HCFR when I made the calibration?
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Old 03-01-2016, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by traykov77 View Post
When saving file .chc with color measures when try to open the program didn't start, just open warning that options is changed in HCFR. When open the saved file do I have to put the same options in HCFR when I made the calibration?
This only happens if the current settings are different from the settings used when the file was saved. You can just follow the prompt to allow the program to use the settings that correspond to the saved file.
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Old 03-02-2016, 02:04 AM
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This only happens if the current settings are different from the settings used when the file was saved. You can just follow the prompt to allow the program to use the settings that correspond to the saved file.
I found a solution, open HCFR and from the menu browse the file with measurement and the work is done.
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Old 03-02-2016, 06:37 AM
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I found a solution, open HCFR and from the menu browse the file with measurement and the work is done.
This is a bug in HCFR if you try to open the *.chc file from the Windows File Explorer. The "preferences mismatch" dialog box pops up, but you cannot access it to make the Yes/No selection. I didn't realize from you previous post that was what you were trying to do.

You can simply right-click on the HCFR icon on the Windows taskbar and select "close all windows"; that would let you access the dialog box.

Opening the data file from within HCFR will not trigger this bug.
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Old 03-02-2016, 10:33 AM
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This is a bug in HCFR if you try to open the *.chc file from the Windows File Explorer. The "preferences mismatch" dialog box pops up, but you cannot access it to make the Yes/No selection. I didn't realize from you previous post that was what you were trying to do.

You can simply right-click on the HCFR icon on the Windows taskbar and select "close all windows"; that would let you access the dialog box.

Opening the data file from within HCFR will not trigger this bug.
Hi, here are my last measuring, my room is dark with a led light behind the tv, I choose ITU BT1886 2.4 with 50% offset RGB low on tv and pc, because I have connected receiver between pc and tv.
Please tell me how looks the measurement and do I need something to set more. I set color on tv 55 instead of default 50.
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