HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software - Page 273 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews

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post #8161 of 8190 Old 12-05-2016, 01:46 PM
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Dominic, thank you so much for all the continued support. I am starting to think what happened is that I measured my player before fiddling with any settings and that it was already in a mode similar to the one you displayed (although I don't have one called movie mode, I have one called theater room). Then during my calibration as I adjusted everything I must have measured something that made me change to standard mode, which means I got the right result from using Ted's disc, which is a relief. That would account for the 'gross' differences. Even in standard mode I had to make sacrifices to blue and cyan 100%/100% in order to get a better color checker result where I used the 75/75 trick you told me about earlier (without the bluray player no sacrifices needed to be made).


What still irks me is that brightness drop, if for no other reason that for understanding what is going on. I get 140 nits peak with CC then I use the disk and all of a sudden I am at 115 nits.


I am extremely happy with my picture now and fleshtones have never looked this good on my setup. Next weekend after I do a quick 25FTL night mode I may try to give 3D mode a go and then retire a year or so before I risk catching the calibrator disease
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post #8162 of 8190 Old 12-05-2016, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post
What still irks me is that brightness drop, if for no other reason that for understanding what is going on. I get 140 nits peak with CC then I use the disk and all of a sudden I am at 115 nits.
I just made some measurements with my BX-520. In the Standard mode the output is the same as HCFR laptop via HDMI cable. In the Theater Room mode, however, the output drops to about 83% which is similar to your 81% (115/140).
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Last edited by Dominic Chan; 12-06-2016 at 08:32 AM.
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post #8163 of 8190 Old 12-05-2016, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I just made some measurements with my BX-520. In the Standard mode the output is the same as HCFR laptop via HDMI cable. In the Theater mode, however, the output drops to about 83% which is similar to your 81% (115/140).

Thank you!! I've been going insane trying to figure out how I might have screwed up somehow to achieve that reduction. I'm going to conclude that my player's standard mode has a bug or just acts differently (sony s590). I have 3 modes, standard, theater room, and bright room. I even tried the bright room mode and that only bought me back a few nits at the cost of other issues I couldn't correct. Whenever I play around again, I'll try putting it back into theater mode and running the gamma to confirm the 'hump' you found. I am 99% sure you figured that one out though. Although I don't need the extra brightness right now, I have a feeling I am going to feel that 20% hit when I get to calibrating 3D mode. I'll run a 100% white through all 3 modes and post it back though at that time.


I think I'm getting pretty intimate with the various equipment and the various issues/complexity they bring to the table now.
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post #8164 of 8190 Old 12-05-2016, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I just made some measurements with my BX-520. In the Standard mode the output is the same as HCFR laptop via HDMI cable. In the Theater mode, however, the output drops to about 83% which is similar to your 81% (115/140).
Where are you guys finding they setting? I'm in Setup / BD/DVD Viewing Settings but don't see it there...
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post #8165 of 8190 Old 12-05-2016, 11:00 PM
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Where are you guys finding they setting? I'm in Setup / BD/DVD Viewing Settings but don't see it there...
Never mind - found it (in Pop Up Menu).

I had it set to Standard...
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post #8166 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 05:21 AM
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Some Sony bd player models are known for innacurate outputs:
http://hometheaterhifi.com/technical...-introduction/
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post #8167 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 06:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ntalwar View Post
Some Sony bd player models are known for innacurate outputs:
http://hometheaterhifi.com/technical...-introduction/
The review did not mention which mode setting they used when testing the Sony BD player.

As mentioned in my previous posts (8156 & 8162), my test results were similarly bad (non-linear gamma, lower level for reference white). However, that only happened in the Theatre Room mode. The Standard mode did not exhibit either one of those issues.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 12-06-2016 at 06:58 AM.
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post #8168 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 10:19 AM
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I'm wondering if someone can help me setup for color calibration. My CIE chart looks really weird with my current configuration:

Sensor:
- X-Rite i1 DisplayPro
- Display Type: LED OLED (my monitor is LG OLED C6)
- Reading Type: Display
- Observer Type: Default

Generator: DVD/Manual

Preferences - References:
Color Space: HDTV-REC 709 (I'm actually wondering if I should use UHDTV-DCI-P3 since the CIE chart would make more sense)
Gamma Calculation: Display Gamma(black compensation), Power Law Gamma: 2.2
Color Checker Patterns: GCD classic

TV is in default setting (except I changed gamma to 2.2)

For test pattern, I used AVSHD709 (mp4). I used shield TV/kodi player for playback.
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post #8169 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 10:43 AM
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You might want to play with the TV option for colorspace and remeasure. It looks like you are in some sort of 'wide' colorspace.
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post #8170 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 10:59 AM
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I have Color Gamut in normal but with HDMI deep color enabled. Could this be the cause?
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post #8171 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow2810 View Post
I have Color Gamut in normal but with HDMI deep color enabled. Could this be the cause?
Yes, turn it off for non-HDR/4k sources.
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post #8172 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 02:51 PM
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HDMI deep color is the culprit. I attached test results with different setting combination. Thanks guys.

Now I'm wondering how do I use TV for 4k HDR content, use different hdmi port for deep color?
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post #8173 of 8190 Old 12-06-2016, 05:07 PM
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Deepcolor isn't exactly an HDR feature. HDR has the wider 2020 colorspace (container) at 10+ bits. Deepcolor was a capability along with xvYCC that allowed regular old Rec709 stuff to get enhanced with a wider/deeper color gamut. The mastered in 4k Sony Bluray's are an example of content like that in practice.


Of course in practice if your particular set has its own issues that require that setting to get HDR to work right, then that's something else entirely, and the type of thing that drives you bonkers :/

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post #8174 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 01:37 PM
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No ChromeCasts Found

Guys and Gals.

I have an issue where my HCFR program can no longer find my chromecast.
When I try to run a measurement the I get an error that says "No ChromeCasts Found"

I verified that the ChromeCast is working.
  • I can cast netflix from my phone.
  • I can cast my desktop from the laptop I'm using HCFR.

Weird thing is, before HCFR stopped seeing the ChromeCast I was able to cast using HCFR, but only for the Gray Scale and Primary Color measurements.
If I did a Saturation sweep, the program would crash at 100% red saturation or 100% blue saturation.

To fix this I joined the Google preview program.
MY Chromecast is now on firmware 1.22.77272


Any ideas?

Devo
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post #8175 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 02:13 PM
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I had similar issues. The latest version of HFCR is unstable and rolling back to version 3.3.8 fixed it for me. (I also tried 3.3.9 and it seemed to work as well, I haven't tried any of the other 4.x.x yet)
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post #8176 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post
I had similar issues. The latest version of HFCR is unstable and rolling back to version 3.3.8 fixed it for me. (I also tried 3.3.9 and it seemed to work as well, I haven't tried any of the other 4.x.x yet)
I'm running HCFR 3.4.2.

So I should roll back to 3.3.9?

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post #8177 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 04:01 PM
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Yes, I would recommend you do that as well as configure your preferences not to check for updates until the matter is resolved. I haven't had a single crash after going back.
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post #8178 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 04:10 PM
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Are you using Chromecast v1 or v2?

I'm waiting for my i1 Display Pro and will be doing a calibration with the Chromecast. Is calibration a fairly easy process with the Chromecast?

I've used HCFR a long time ago by following the excellent Calibration for Dummies guide on curtpalme.com, but I haven't touched the Zoyd version of HCFR. Is there anything that I should look out for in the new version before I get started?

Thank you
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post #8179 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 04:13 PM
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v2.


And its astonishing how fast and easy the chromecast makes things. What I would do to test whether you have the same issues as us is to do a quick grayscale/primary/sedcondary sweep (there's a button that does all three in quick succession) and then use the dropdown selector to go to the Red Saturation area and run the saturation sweep. If the program crashes, you'll know what you need to do from above.
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post #8180 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post
Yes, I would recommend you do that as well as configure your preferences not to check for updates until the matter is resolved. I haven't had a single crash after going back.
Got it. Ill try tonight



Quote:
Originally Posted by a4tq View Post
Are you using Chromecast v1 or v2?

I'm waiting for my i1 Display Pro and will be doing a calibration with the Chromecast. Is calibration a fairly easy process with the Chromecast?

I've used HCFR a long time ago by following the excellent Calibration for Dummies guide on curtpalme.com, but I haven't touched the Zoyd version of HCFR. Is there anything that I should look out for in the new version before I get started?

Thank you

I have a chromecast v2. It was easy when it was working for me.
I like HCFR. Its real easy to use, especially when it generates the patterns.

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post #8181 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 04:54 PM
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Thank you for the replies.

I can test with v1 and v2 when I get the probe.

On another topic, is it recommended to profile my i1 display pro to a spectro when I get it? Only spectro I have available is a Colormunki Photo that I can rent.

Quote:
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v2.


And its astonishing how fast and easy the chromecast makes things. What I would do to test whether you have the same issues as us is to do a quick grayscale/primary/sedcondary sweep (there's a button that does all three in quick succession) and then use the dropdown selector to go to the Red Saturation area and run the saturation sweep. If the program crashes, you'll know what you need to do from above.
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post #8182 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post
v2.


And its astonishing how fast and easy the chromecast makes things. What I would do to test whether you have the same issues as us is to do a quick grayscale/primary/sedcondary sweep (there's a button that does all three in quick succession) and then use the dropdown selector to go to the Red Saturation area and run the saturation sweep. If the program crashes, you'll know what you need to do from above.
I have a Chromecast Ultra - can that be used by HCFR to generate patterns and if so, how do I set it up? Does HCFR 'find' the presence of a Chromecast/Chromecast Ultra on the network and cast to it?
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post #8183 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a4tq View Post
On another topic, is it recommended to profile my i1 display pro to a spectro when I get it? Only spectro I have available is a Colormunki Photo that I can rent.
Some people think that even a low end spectro is more accurate than a colorimeter, but I don't really believe this. The i1DP is very good (considering the price), and unless you have a display that the i1DP doesn't directly support, I wouldn't bother with the Colormunki, when is the lowest end spectro I know of.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; Yesterday at 10:28 PM.
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post #8184 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 10:11 PM
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Quote:
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I have a Chromecast Ultra - can that be used by HCFR to generate patterns and if so, how do I set it up? Does HCFR 'find' the presence of a Chromecast/Chromecast Ultra on the network and cast to it?
Assuming its the same as the other chromecasts which i bet it is.
Its auto. Open new file and select auto for pattern generator. Then just business as usual, configure the generator for windowsize and apl etc. when you run a sweep its automatic from there.
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post #8185 of 8190 Old Yesterday, 11:26 PM
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[QUOTE=Rumble Devo;48787209]Got it. Ill try tonight


Guy, I rolled back to 3.3.9 and am still having the "No ChromeCasts Found" Error

Any other suggestions?

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Devo
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post #8186 of 8190 Old Today, 06:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumble Devo View Post
Guy, I rolled back to 3.3.9 and am still having the "No ChromeCasts Found" Error
Not sure if this is the same issue as yours:
HCFR Chromecast

Last edited by Dominic Chan; Today at 12:50 PM.
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post #8187 of 8190 Old Today, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Some people think that even a low end spectro is more accurate than a colorimeter, but I don't really believe this. The i1DP is very good (considering the price), and unless you have a display that the i1DP doesn't directly support, I wouldn't bother with the Colormunki, when is the lowest end spectro I know of.
The main reason that a spectro is (almost) always more accurate than a colorimeter is because of the different technologies. A spectro measures the entire spectrum of the light from the display in narrow bands thus allowing it to compensate for the different spectral characteristics of different display technologies. A colorimeter has only red, green and blue optical filters and therefore cannot see the spectral characteristics well enough to be sure of a really accurate reading. So, a perfectly made spectro is always going to be better than a perfectly made colorimeter and even a low end spectro is generally going to better than any colorimeter.

It is possible to make a colorimeter correction file using a spectro on a display of the type that you want to measure. Once you have that (and many are already available on the web) you can make quite accurate (and often faster) measurements (ON THAT DISPLAY TYPE) using only a colorimeter.

Note that colorimeter measurements without a correction file may be good enough that you can't see the difference in practice, but for really accurate results there as to be a spectro in the process.
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post #8188 of 8190 Old Today, 09:04 AM
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[quote=Dominic Chan;48799441]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumble Devo View Post

Not sure if this is the same issue as yours:
HCFR Chromecast
I as well had to roll back to 3.3.8 a while ago. Any version after that would crash after a grey scale sweep - at the very end... I might have been using Chromecast come to think of it.

As far as Chromecast being seen on a network, I recently tried to use an NVidia Shield Android TV as the Chromecast device. It supports 4K HDR, Chromecast etc. Unfortunately HCFR didn't see it on the network - even though my phone had no trouble finding it.

From what I recalled, the Chromecast support in HCFR comes from Argylle CMS. I did some research and found this command that will look for Chromecast devices:

http://www.argyllcms.com/doc/dispwin.html

The relevant text or dispwin.exe is:

-dcc or -dcc:no causes test patches to be displayed using and available ChromeCast to your TV. Use -dcc:? to display a list of ChromeCasts on your local network. Note that the ChromeCast as a test patch source is probably the least accurate of your choices, since it up-samples the test patch and transforms from RGB to YCC and back, but should be accurate within ± 1 bit. You may have to modify any firewall to permit port 8081 to be accessed on your machine if it falls back to the Default receiver (see installation instructions for your platform).


I haven't downloaded and tried this yet, but will this weekend.
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post #8189 of 8190 Old Today, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmonier View Post
So, a perfectly made spectro is always going to be better than a perfectly made colorimeter
No doubt.
Quote:
and even a low end spectro is generally going to better than any colorimeter.
I see no basis for this. A low end spectro may "see" the whole spectrum but that says nothing about the accuracy. One test report shows that for the white level on a wide gamut RGB LED-backligt display, the Colormunki has a dE of 6.1 whereas the i1DP has a dE of only 1.7. The black level is even worse - 15.9 vs 2.8, although that's to be expected for a spectro.

Quote:
It is possible to make a colorimeter correction file using a spectro on a display of the type that you want to measure. Once you have that (and many are already available on the web) you can make quite accurate (and often faster) measurements (ON THAT DISPLAY TYPE) using only a colorimeter.
That's exactly why I said that, with a "supported" display, the i1DP can be very accurate. An by "supported" I mean the manufacturer has already provided a correction file that that type of display.
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post #8190 of 8190 Old Today, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post
Assuming its the same as the other chromecasts which i bet it is.
Its auto. Open new file and select auto for pattern generator. Then just business as usual, configure the generator for windowsize and apl etc. when you run a sweep its automatic from there.
Tried all of that but it does not 'find' the Chromecast Ultra...

The Chrimecast Ultra was on on and ready for me to cast to it from my iPad, so the issue was not with the Chromecast but with whatever way HCFR finds it on the local network...

[EDIT: I cam back to fix my little typo, but after spending $69 on a product that does not deliver the Dolby Vision streaming as advertised, I decided that it might have been an appropriate Freudian slip rather than a typo and decided to leave it as originally typed ,
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