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post #9001 of 9343 Old 06-06-2017, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, SDR vs. HDR mode of a display has very different primaries, you need to create a meter correction table for each mode,
Unless the display is extremely exotic (i.e. it really does have 6 different colored dots per pixel, or switches to a completely different backlight technology for SDR vs. HDR), then the colorimeter calibration will not change with DR mode, since it depends on the spectral shape of the primaries and the spectral sensitivities of the colorimeter, and not on the levels or brightness of test patches.
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post #9002 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 01:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwgill View Post
Unless the display is extremely exotic (i.e. it really does have 6 different colored dots per pixel, or switches to a completely different backlight technology for SDR vs. HDR), then the colorimeter calibration will not change with DR mode, since it depends on the spectral shape of the primaries and the spectral sensitivities of the colorimeter, and not on the levels or brightness of test patches.
From theory to practice, using JETI 1211 as reference and Klein K-10A to create the meter profiling, there created 2 different tables, one in HDR mode and one in SDR mode using an LG OLED E6 display. The following table is showing the differences of the XYZ matrix stored to Klein's memory slots and also the xyY correction differences between the 2 corrections. This shows that if there a primary is a lot of wider between SDR vs. HDR, this affects the correction, if you see Blue Primary, the difference is x 0.000 y 0.0001, so identical because Blue Primary had the exact same xy chromaticity between SDR - HDR mode. Since the Green Primary as a distance had the largest one between SDR-HDR, the offset has the largest difference also.



This is the reason why I suggested to the user that there will be a difference but not dramatic. This is why I have suggested to anyone who has spend money to get it's own spectro and it's using it only for 2 minutes to create a meter correction table to create difference tables for SDR/HDR/3D modes of it's display. It will not be a big deal to spend 5 minutes more to create a new table since this will affect it's accuracy of his whole calibration time he will spend.
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S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
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post #9003 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
This is the reason why I suggested to the user that there will be a difference but not dramatic.
Right - so 1) convince me that such a difference is any larger than the measurement error - i.e. that you are seeing larger differences than you get between two calibrations in the same mode using a different test patch set and 2) explain why the spectral output of the display is different in HDR vs SDR.
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post #9004 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by gwgill View Post
Right - so 1) convince me that such a difference is any larger than the measurement error - i.e. that you are seeing larger differences than you get between two calibrations in the same mode using a different test patch set and 2) explain why the spectral output of the display is different in HDR vs SDR.
1) Same meters measured the same panel, there no difference in Blue xy. 2) SDR gamut coverage is closer to REC.709 and HDR gamut coverage is the native (so wider).

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post #9005 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post

3.0.4 is relatively old, 3.4.3 is based off 3.4.2 code base.
I suggest you check with 3.4.2 first, which is the last official release made by zoyd
I don't think I made any changes to the measurement and calculation logic. Also, I can't recreate the issue with a single measurement freezing on my system.
It would be helpful to know if it's a problem introduced with my builds or the latest official release.
Thanks,
yes, 3.4.2 has the same bugs, I hoped your update helps.
Also 3.4.2 with GDI will freeze with a black (or white) screen using single measurement.
You have to cancel HCFR with the task manager. This is a heavy (not your) bug.
Old 3.0.4 seems to be the best.
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post #9006 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 11:38 AM
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@yogi2016

Thanks. I don't think I have the knowledge\understanding to tackle issue with measurements. Zoyd knows this stuff, but it's not really my area.
I decided to fix functionality issues, and other things I feel sure won't affect measurements.

I still can't reproduce GDI freezing on my machine, though, sadly

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post #9007 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post
I still can't reproduce GDI freezing on my machine, though, sadly
I use GDI exclusively, and single measurements frequently. Haven't experienced any freezing either.

However, depending on your setup (one or two screens), there are times when you have to use Alt-Tab to switch screens to get back to the main HCFR application window.

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Last edited by Dominic Chan; 06-07-2017 at 02:20 PM.
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post #9008 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 03:02 PM
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single measurement freeze

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I use GDI exclusively, and single measurements frequently. Haven't experienced any freezing either.

However, depending on your setup (one or two screens), there are times when you have to use Alt-Tab to switch screens to get back to the main HCFR application window.
Strange, I can reproduce the freezing with 2 private win8.1 PCs and my business win7 enterprise PC, with both i1 Display Pro and ColorMunki photo.
Single monitor operation.
But Alt-Tab brings back the application, now with a small black segment, thanks.
However, hard to understand, still looks to me like a bug, not a feature.
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post #9009 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
2) SDR gamut coverage is closer to REC.709 and HDR gamut coverage is the native (so wider).
The measured chromaticity of the primaries has no bearing on it - it's the spectral composition that counts.

i.e. say the display is inherently larger gamut than Rec709, then it will synthesize the apparent Rec709 primary chromaticity values from its native primaries, and since displays are additive the spectral composition in Rec709 mode is a linear sum of the native primaries, so the correction matrix remains the same.

For best accuracy though, the calibration should be done with the displays native primaries, since this will minimize the influence of measurement and repeatability errors. So if it's HDR mode that uses native display primaries, then use that to create the Colorimeter calibration.

Last edited by gwgill; 06-07-2017 at 04:56 PM.
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post #9010 of 9343 Old 06-07-2017, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by yogi2016 View Post
Strange, I can reproduce the freezing with 2 private win8.1 PCs and my business win7 enterprise PC, with both i1 Display Pro and ColorMunki photo.
Single monitor operation.
I have seen that behaviour. The application is not frozen (otherwise Alt-Tab will not bring it back). It does not seem to respond only because the actual "focus" (may not be the correct term) is on the windows that is hidden behind the displayed pattern.

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post #9011 of 9343 Old 06-08-2017, 02:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwgill View Post
The measured chromaticity of the primaries has no bearing on it - it's the spectral composition that counts.

i.e. say the display is inherently larger gamut than Rec709, then it will synthesize the apparent Rec709 primary chromaticity values from its native primaries, and since displays are additive the spectral composition in Rec709 mode is a linear sum of the native primaries, so the correction matrix remains the same.

For best accuracy though, the calibration should be done with the displays native primaries, since this will minimize the influence of measurement and repeatability errors. So if it's HDR mode that uses native display primaries, then use that to create the Colorimeter calibration.
About the data I posted earlier, I used Wide Gamut option @ SDR and Wide Gamut @ HDR mode also. So both modes are were working at their native gamut.

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How do I create a calibration correction file?

I have a ColorMunki Photo specto and an i1 Display Pro colorimeter. I would like to create a correction file, but I would like to confirm the method with those smarter than me.

1. Should I create the correction file by measuring primaries and secondaries only, or do I measure grayscale as well?
2. Will I get the same results if I take the measurements sequentially vs at the same time (I have two USB ports on my laptop)?
3. Which selection should I use in the Advanced section, under Meter Correction File?

Thank you in advance...be well
Ron
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post #9013 of 9343 Old 06-12-2017, 09:41 AM
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How do I adjust my OLED CMS using HCFR?

My OLED CMS is adjustable, with knobs for saturation, tint, and luminance. I would like to use my HCFR measurements to adjust it?

What would you recommend as a good workflow...
- do I make primary and secondary measurements, select the colors one at a time (select that column), and use xyY to adjust the CMS knobs?
- is there a way to use the 'target' display and somehow adjust the CMS knobs?
- does someone have a better method?

Thank you in advance...be well
Ron
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post #9014 of 9343 Old 06-12-2017, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIppolito View Post
My OLED CMS is adjustable, with knobs for saturation, tint, and luminance. I would like to use my HCFR measurements to adjust it?

What would you recommend as a good workflow...
- do I make primary and secondary measurements, select the colors one at a time (select that column), and use xyY to adjust the CMS knobs?
- is there a way to use the 'target' display and somehow adjust the CMS knobs?
- does someone have a better method?

Thank you in advance...be well
Ron
Go to Advanced --> Preferences, check HSV level bars.


That way you'll get a visual representation of saturation, tint and brightness (luminance).
You click at the top the 'table', on the name of the color you want HCFR to display on its pattern.

For a correction file you need a spectro to be used as a reference.

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post #9015 of 9343 Old 06-12-2017, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post
Go to Advanced --> Preferences, check HSV level bars.


That way you'll get a visual representation of saturation, tint and brightness (luminance).
You click at the top the 'table', on the name of the color you want HCFR to display on its pattern.

For a correction file you need a spectro to be used as a reference.
The Coolest,

Thanks for that tip on checking the HSV box.

As I said post 9012, I do have a specto as well as a colorimeter. Can you give me any insights into the best way to make a correction chc file?

On another note, I have used DisplayCal to produce a 3D LUT for an eeColor box for my 1080p sources. Using that tool, I was able to produce a correction matrix file. Is there a way to use that correction matrix file with HCFR?

Thank you in advance...be well
Ron
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@RIppolito

I can only answer about HCFR and spectro correction.
Open a new sheet, select your spectro. You'll need to run a gray scale and primaries sweep. At the top right corner check "Reference".
Open another sheet, select your meter. Run the same gray scale and primaries sweep with the meter. Then go to Advanced --> Meter Correction file and select Create using Existing Reference Measures.
Name the file, and you'll be able to select it as a correction when you open a new measures sheet.

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post #9017 of 9343 Old 06-12-2017, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post
Open a new sheet, select your spectro. You'll need to run a gray scale and primaries sweep. At the top right corner check "Reference".
To create the meter correction, you only need the 100% white and primaries, i.e., no need for grey scale or saturation sweep.

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@Dominic Chan


You're right, just tried it. For whatever reason I thought it didn't let you do a proper saturation sweep without first doing gray scale.
Thanks for the correction.

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post #9019 of 9343 Old 06-15-2017, 06:41 AM
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Hey all,
Figure some may be interested in this.
Posted in the deals section a pretty decent deal for the pink ColorMunki Display at Adorama: X-Rite ColorMunki Display (Pink) $99 at Adorama
I should be receiving mine on Monday. Should be an upgrade to my decrepit i1 Display LT


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post #9020 of 9343 Old 06-15-2017, 07:29 AM
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Hey all,
Figure some may be interested in this.
Posted in the deals section a pretty decent deal for the pink ColorMunki Display at Adorama: X-Rite ColorMunki Display (Pink) $99 at Adorama
That is a good price. Beware, however, that the ColorMunki Display does not work with most third party software, except those that use the ArgyllCMS driver (HCFR etc) instead of the OEM driver.
Here are the differences according to x-rite:
http://blog.xritephoto.com/2012/11/c....rXNL1Oi1.dpbs

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post #9021 of 9343 Old 06-15-2017, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
That is a good price. Beware, however, that the ColorMunki Display does not work with most third party software, except those that use the ArgyllCMS driver (HCFR etc) instead of the OEM driver.
Here are the differences according to x-rite:
http://blog.xritephoto.com/2012/11/c....rXNL1Oi1.dpbs
And additionally:

ColorMunki Display / i1Display PRO are based under the same hardware; they both have sealed and higher quality filters and they are less sensitive to drift over the time, you will get better and more stable/faster reading to any pulse display (Plasma/DLP projectors etc.) with i1Display PRO because it has better refreshing rate scan capability, I prefer i1Display PRO because is supported also from more calibration software solutions.

If you want to AutoCalibrate Monitors (PC/MAC) via VCGT or ICC, the ColorMunki Display is coming with a simple X-Rite software for this job but it lucks customization or the target colorspace/gamma...for example it has selection only to calibrate 2.2 gamma while that software is slow. i1Display PRO is coming with X-Rite's i1Profiler software that has customization, it's more advanced to it's calculations, X-Rite claims that is working 5x times faster, it can take sample of many more colors, and it has a Verification feature of the post-calibration results (with pass/fail also) to be able to see if it's accepted. ColorMunki Display software don't have verification feature. ColorMunki Display is a lot of slower compared with i1Display PRO. Generally the software which coming with ColorMunki Display is poor compared to i1Profiler which is coming with i1Display PRO.

If you want to calibrate TV/Projector, ColorMunki Display is not supported by CalMAN/ChromaPure calibration software.

You can use ColorMunki Display with HCFR and ArgyllCMS/DispcalGUI (additionally with LightSpace; contact me here to send you the instructions)

The latest generation of i1Display PRO (Rev.B) it features a new refresh rate detection and synchronization AIO (All in One) measurement mode which can improve the measurement stability for certain displays and provide lower reading times.

According to feedback I have from a Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk user which is using LightSpace HTL + i1DisplayPRO Rev.B + KURO + eeColor and he has performed a lot of testing using LightSpace's 'Measure and log' where it exports in excel (CVS) file format the xyY and the measuring times per each read in milliseconds, for us to find by comparing the data's which mode and integration time settings is giving him better repeatability while it has faster measuring speed (Test Procedure Link)....we found by comparing the data's between AIO vs. Burst Mode (Rev. A using Burst mode for Plasma) from i1DisplayPRO Rev.B Meter that that new AIO mode is about 30-50% faster from Burst Mode of Rev. A from the data I have.

AIO mode is supported from only from LightSpace and ChromaPure, HCFR/DisplayCAL/ArgyllCMS has also custom code for providing similar results with adaptive exposure times/sync modes without using AIO mode.
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post #9022 of 9343 Old 06-16-2017, 06:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
To create the meter correction, you only need the 100% white and primaries, i.e., no need for grey scale or saturation sweep.
After creating a correction file, I performed my initial calibration using the CMS in my set: the chc file with the results is enclosed. The picture is much improved, but I know it can be better.

When I looked at the colors that have dE larger than one, the HSV values don't have a common thread, meaning, there isn't a silver bullet that will make most better. My approach was to look at the CIE chart, make an adjustment for a given color, and see how it adjusted 25, 50, 75, and 100 percent, then rinse, lather, and repeat. Is that a good way, a dumb way, or what is a better way to do this?

Can anyone please take a look and let me know where I should go next?

Thank you for all help to date, and any additional help you can give me.
Ron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIppolito View Post
When I looked at the colors that have dE larger than one, the HSV values don't have a common thread, meaning, there isn't a silver bullet that will make most better. My approach was to look at the CIE chart, make an adjustment for a given color, and see how it adjusted 25, 50, 75, and 100 percent, then rinse, lather, and repeat. Is that a good way, a dumb way, or what is a better way to do this?

Can anyone please take a look and let me know where I should go next?
I would consider the results to be very good already. Have you tried to improve Red further by increasing its luminance and decreasing its saturation?

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post #9024 of 9343 Old 06-19-2017, 02:31 PM
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Please help my understanding in using the CMS to adjust my colors.
I have an LG plasma set (60PN5700) with saturation, tint, and luminance controls for the primaries and secondaries.
As I understand, and perhaps I'm wrong, I'll probably do better adjusting these with 75% color windows, vs. 100%. Does this typically correspond to 75% saturation, or 75% brightness?


Assuming it's 75% brightness, does this mean that my target "xyY" values are still for rec709:
Red: 0.064, 0.33, 0.2126
Green: 0.30, 0.60, 0.7152
Blue: 0.15, 0.06, 0.0722
White: 0.3172, 0.3290, 1.0000
Where the Y value is based on the white pattern, also at 75%?


If I work with 75% saturation windows (with still 100% brightness), will my xy values be different from those above, but Y will remain unchanged for the different colors?


I'm just all confused, and still not certain which patterns I have available to me with the AVS709 disk.
Which patterns should I use, and what would the target values be?


Thanks for the help,
CFC

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post #9025 of 9343 Old 06-19-2017, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post
Please help my understanding in using the CMS to adjust my colors.
I have an LG plasma set (60PN5700) with saturation, tint, and luminance controls for the primaries and secondaries.
As I understand, and perhaps I'm wrong, I'll probably do better adjusting these with 75% color windows, vs. 100%. Does this typically correspond to 75% saturation, or 75% brightness?
Some people use one, some the other. HCFR actually uses 75% saturation and 75% stimulus when you select REC 709 (75%/75%) as reference.

Quote:
Assuming it's 75% brightness, does this mean that my target "xyY" values are still for rec709:
Red: 0.064, 0.33, 0.2126
Green: 0.30, 0.60, 0.7152
Blue: 0.15, 0.06, 0.0722
White: 0.3172, 0.3290, 1.0000
Where the Y value is based on the white pattern, also at 75%?
Yes (except for the typo above - Red is 0.64, not 0.064)

Quote:
If I work with 75% saturation windows (with still 100% brightness), will my xy values be different from those above, but Y will remain unchanged for the different colors?
75% saturation will for sure have different xy (e.g., red xy is 0.64, 0.2071). I'm not sure if Y remains entirely the same, from what I saw in HCFR.

Quote:
I'm just all confused, and still not certain which patterns I have available to me with the AVS709 disk.
Which patterns should I use, and what would the target values be?
The AVS709 patterns labelled "75%" are 75% stimulus, except for the saturation sweep patterns which are explicitly labelled "75% Saturation" etc. It's probably easiest to use the HCFR built-in patterns, and double-check a few points against the disc patterns.

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Last edited by Dominic Chan; 06-20-2017 at 04:48 AM.
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post #9026 of 9343 Old 06-20-2017, 03:36 AM
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I'm just all confused, and still not certain which patterns I have available to me with the AVS709 disk.
Which patterns should I use, and what would the target values be?
Hi, AVSHD disk for Color Gamut calibration you have 2 options: 75% Color (which has 100% Saturation with 75% Luminance) or 100% Color (which has 100% Saturation with 100% Luminance)

There is no 75% Stimulus with 75% Saturation Patterns in AVSHD disk.

Also from the AVSHD Saturation Sweeps; using 75% Saturation with 100% Stimulus; the patterns are not matching the RGB Triplets of HCFR engine, they are slight different.

For Example:

AVSHD 50% Red Saturation Pattern has RGB Triplet 190.95.95 but HCFR's Color Engine needs/calculates errors from RGB Triplet 191.96.96, it's 0.42 dE2000 error.

AVSHD 75% Magenta Saturation Pattern has RGB Triplet 203.100.203 but HCFR's Color Engine needs/calculates errors from RGB Triplet 202.99.202, it's 0.36 dE2000 error.

Here is an example of calibration disk which is accurate for HCFR users with many measurement options for verification: ***Official B/C/E/G6P OLED Calibration Thread
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post #9027 of 9343 Old 06-20-2017, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Some people use one, some the other. HCFR actually uses 75% saturation and 75% stimulus when you select REC 709 (75%/75%) as reference.


Yes (except for the typo above - Red is 0.64, not 0.064)


75% saturation will for sure have different xy (e.g., red xy is 0.64, 0.2071). I'm not sure if Y remains entirely the same, from what I saw in HCFR.


The AVS709 patterns labelled "75%" are 75% stimulus, except for the saturation sweep patterns which are explicitly labelled "75% Saturation" etc. It's probably easiest to use the HCFR built-in patterns, and double-check a few points against the disc patterns.
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, AVSHD disk for Color Gamut calibration you have 2 options: 75% Color (which has 100% Saturation with 75% Luminance) or 100% Color (which has 100% Saturation with 100% Luminance)

There is no 75% Stimulus with 75% Saturation Patterns in AVSHD disk.

Also from the AVSHD Saturation Sweeps; using 75% Saturation with 100% Stimulus; the patterns are not matching the RGB Triplets of HCFR engine, they are slight different.

For Example:

AVSHD 50% Red Saturation Pattern has RGB Triplet 190.95.95 but HCFR's Color Engine needs/calculates errors from RGB Triplet 191.96.96, it's 0.42 dE2000 error.

AVSHD 75% Magenta Saturation Pattern has RGB Triplet 203.100.203 but HCFR's Color Engine needs/calculates errors from RGB Triplet 202.99.202, it's 0.36 dE2000 error.

Here is an example of calibration disk which is accurate for HCFR users with many measurement options for verification: ***Official B/C/E/G6P OLED Calibration Thread

Thank you both for the clarification.
I will try 100/100 first, and if I run into issues I'll look at the other options.
Would the "rounding off AVS/DVE" check box in the preferences account for the triplet differences?
Should I also be using APL patterns since I'm testing a plasma? I've turned off all TV settings like "Dynamic Brightness".


Thanks again for the help,
CFC

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post #9028 of 9343 Old 06-20-2017, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post
Thank you both for the clarification.
I will try 100/100 first, and if I run into issues I'll look at the other options.
Would the "rounding off AVS/DVE" check box in the preferences account for the triplet differences?
Should I also be using APL patterns since I'm testing a plasma? I've turned off all TV settings like "Dynamic Brightness".


Thanks again for the help,
CFC
Hi, you should tick the ''use round down levels'' @ HCFR ''Preferences'' -> ''General'' Tab radio box when you only use DVE or AVSHD calibration disks to provide a fix to grayscale differences you will have when you have it unticked.

AVSHD Window patterns have 14.16% size. They are not ideal for Plasma's because due to it's size they will trigger the ABL circuit. Better to use standard 10-11.11% Windows. I'm not a fan of APL patterns.

75% Stimulus provides (usually) better results because the Luminance of 75% Stimulus Patterns has about 50% of the luminance of 100% Stimulus, so your adjustment point is at the center of the color luminance range.

Using 100% Stimulus Patterns your adjustment point is at the highest end of the luminance range but you will probably have larger errors at lower luminance levels.

This works for some displays / don't work to others, some display has better tracking, so even using 100% Luminance / 100% Saturation pattern, it tracks good other saturation/luminance levels, but needs to test your own display to find out.

There displays where you get better final results when you use 100% Saturation than from 75% Saturation, there others where when you use 100% Saturation Patterns, you have great performance to 100% area more errors to the lower Saturation levels.



When you have to calibrate a display using it's internal available calibration controls, because the gamut control points are only a few (1-Point per color) you have to try to find out which patterns you have to use for your gamut calibration which will provide you less average errors to all measured saturation levels + colorchecker.

There is not any golden rule which says which type of patterns to use to calibrate the CMS for each display model, you have to try to your display these 4 options.

(75%/75% - 75%/100% - 100%/75% - 100%/100%) to find out which type of patterns will provide you lower dE overall, try to calibrate based to one of these options (for example 100SAT/75AMPL) and at the end, measure using 4-Point Saturation / 4-Point Luminance / ColorChecker / Fleshtones.

Later re-calibrate your display using another option (for example 75SAT/75AMPL) and remeasure at the end with Saturation/Luminance/ColorChecker etc... and compare these 2 reports to see what patterns are providing you lower dE numbers.



The average Caucasian skin tone resides well away from any grey scale, or primary color. That's why you have to check ColorChecker because it contains skin tones, grass, sky, etc.; which are memory colors.

Initially it will take some time to measure these 4 pattern options to find which patterns are providing better performance but next time you will know which patterns to use for that specific display you are calibrating.

This is happening because you have only 1 control point for each color of Gamut Calibration, so you have to find which point you will use (% Saturation/ % Luminance)...think that you have a display with 1-point Grayscale.....where you have to test to see which grayscale pattern will balance better the whole grayscale and provide the lower errors, from 10% Gray till 100% White.

Usually it's better to do 75% Saturation / 75% Intensity or 75% Saturation / 100% Intensity calibration, where you will improve the color tracking of primary color saturations internally; which is more important from having better performance (less dE errors) only to the gamut edges (100% Saturation).

For problematic display where you want to have the best possible performance at every area, you have to move to 3D LUT calibration/profiling, this will correct multiple saturation/intensity/hue levels.

When you have only a few internal display calibration controls to handle some million colors performance, usually you will have low dE using the patterns you used to do Gamut calibrations and moving away from these colors the errors will be increased, so the more points you will measure, the more errors you will discover. (see there an example)

If you want to get the best possible color accuracy to many different hue/saturation/luminance levels, then you have to move to 3D LUT display characterization solution.

If you use HTPC for watching your movies, you can use DisplayCAL (from free solution side, of CalMAN/LightSpace HTL from paid software side) with a software player which support MadVR as a renderer. So DisplayCAL/LightSpace/CalMAN will control the MadVR patch software generator and create a collection file for 65-Point Cube (about 275.000 points...using eeColor 65-Point file format).

If you are using a stand alone blu-ray player or media player for movie playback then you have to get a 3D LUT box which you will hook up between your source and the TV, so the correction file will be loaded to that device.....there a lot of solutions in the market for this job (only eeColor 3D LUT Box is supported from the free software solution DisplayCAL, CalMAN/LightSpace HTL from paid software side..I have posted a list of available 3D LUT Boxes of global market here: CMS controls broken

With 3D LUT you will have to do only basic setup from your internal calibration controls, contrast/brightness/sharpness, find native gamut and pre-calibrate only 100% White.

I have posted some results from 3D LUT corretion using an LG OLED here, and the Pioneer KURO there.

Moving to 3D LUT, it will save you some thousand new hours of trying different patterns and different values of internal calibration controls to minimize your color errors.

Also a good read about deltaE is here: http://www.lightillusion.com/delta-e.html
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post #9029 of 9343 Old 06-24-2017, 06:15 AM
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Is it expected for a plasma display to have a lower luminance reading at 24Hz vs. 60Hz for the same pattern, and have the grayscale track differently?
I've calibrated my set using the Chromecast, which outputs at 60 Hz.
When I verify results using the AVS disc from my Blu-Ray player at 24Hz, the readings are off. When forcing a 60Hz output, it tracks really close to the Chromecast.
I also get similar results from my HTPC when outputting 60 vs. 24 using .MP4 patterns.
I can use a different picture preset which has a different white balance adjustment to calibrate at 24p, but I just wanted to see if these results were typical.

On a different note, HCFR crashes any time I attempt to to do a dvd/manual reading. For the grayscale reading for example, after it records the 100% white pattern, it will just pop up a message saying that the program needs to close.

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post #9030 of 9343 Old 06-24-2017, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post
Is it expected for a plasma display to have a lower luminance reading at 24Hz vs. 60Hz for the same pattern, and have the grayscale track differently?
I've calibrated my set using the Chromecast, which outputs at 60 Hz.
When I verify results using the AVS disc from my Blu-Ray player at 24Hz, the readings are off. When forcing a 60Hz output, it tracks really close to the Chromecast.
I also get similar results from my HTPC when outputting 60 vs. 24 using .MP4 patterns.
I can use a different picture preset which has a different white balance adjustment to calibrate at 24p, but I just wanted to see if these results were typical.

On a different note, HCFR crashes any time I attempt to to do a dvd/manual reading. For the grayscale reading for example, after it records the 100% white pattern, it will just pop up a message saying that the program needs to close.

CFC
Hi, yes, this is happening, in that cases you need different calibration for 24p input (with 24p pattern) and another for 60p input (60p patterns).

For example you can use 24p patterns from your BD player and set the player to output 24p...do the calibration for 24p and then change it's output to 60p (if this possible, not available to all players)...to be able to do the 60p calibration to another TV mode.

Panels internally they are changing the way they operate according to incoming signal.
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