Calman AutoCal failure on PC - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 01:43 PM - Thread Starter
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OK, so I've got the latest version of the DIY calman, and I'm attempting to calibrate my HP dm4-2070us laptop. The only color management tools I can find are in the Intel Graphics and Media control panel. Non-linear response doesn't even BEGIN to describe how horribly unpredictable these controls are, but I was able to get a really really good result after an hour of tweaking on the PC-Single monitor workflow, Step 2 (F): Adjust the Monitors RGB Balance - I'm talking below 1 dE on both 30 and 100 IRE.

The next step is Calibrate Grayscale. I hit the autocal button and all hell broke loose. I let it run it's course, but when it was done, blue at IREs from 20 to 90 were at 40 to 60 dE!!! And it showed. The screen was BLUE. I don't know what the autocal function was trying to do, but it completely obliterated an hours worth of work CMS work. It did get red and green close though...

I also selected 11-PC (0 to 255) under Active Grayscale Points at the beginning of the workflow...

Any ideas???

FYI: I'm using the i1 Display Pro 3 retail
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post #2 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 02:15 PM
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So you have loaded the PC single monitor work flow.
You have the PC client installed and running
You have your meter connected and available
you have PC Client as your source
You have PC client as you display control and change the 14 step to 11
You have sRGB as your Gamut target and levels are set to PC
You have you meter hanging in the target spot.
Let her rip and you should be good to go. I have done more than a couple of laptop/PC and multiple monitors and projectors attached to the same PC and never had an issue. Also I do not think you should be messing with the video card adjustments. The only thing you should change is the adjustments on an external monitor. The laptop has none, so if all the above was correct, use the same video card utility and reset it to factory. Then run the autocal.
Good luck
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post #3 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 02:32 PM
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Reset all your intel controls to default.

Laptops can only calibrate grayscale and gamma.
Since laptops don't have any controls, don't change anything, don't attempt to modify anything via the intel control panel.
Let CalPC handle the grayscale control if you don't have hardware monitor controls.
In the PC space ICC profiles handle gamut in ICC aware applications.

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post #4 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 03:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airscapes View Post

So you have loaded the PC single monitor work flow.
You have the PC client installed and running
You have your meter connected and available
you have PC Client as your source
You have PC client as you display control and change the 14 step to 11
You have sRGB as your Gamut target and levels are set to PC
You have you meter hanging in the target spot.
Let her rip and you should be good to go. I have done more than a couple of laptop/PC and multiple monitors and projectors attached to the same PC and never had an issue. Also I do not think you should be messing with the video card adjustments. The only thing you should change is the adjustments on an external monitor. The laptop has none, so if all the above was correct, use the same video card utility and reset it to factory. Then run the autocal.
Good luck

I've done all that except "You have sRGB as your Gamut target and levels are set to PC". Not quite sure where I'd do that. I did just discover that I had mistakenly selected "PC Client Monochrome" so only the LUMA was being adjusted... DOH!

However, even after correcting that, the autocal keeps failing on 100 IRE with the message: "Error 213: 100% could not be calibrated to the reference White Point." It does get it down to about 2 dE before failing... Not sure why 2 dE is considered a failure, but it keeps me from progressing.

Edit: I repeated the process with my i1Pro and got the same results.
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post #5 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post

I've done all that except "You have sRGB as your Gamut target and levels are set to PC". Not quite sure where I'd do that. I did just discover that I had mistakenly selected "PC Client Monochrome" so only the LUMA was being adjusted... DOH!

However, even after correcting that, the autocal keeps failing on 100 IRE with the message: "Error 213: 100% could not be calibrated to the reference White Point." It does get it down to about 2 dE before failing... Not sure why 2 dE is considered a failure, but it keeps me from progressing.

Edit: I repeated the process with my i1Pro and got the same results.

It fails when it's made 15 adjustments and doesn't think it's successful.

You could try raising the dE threshold or changing the dE formula to something that might help it believe the calibration is working.

The settings for dE threshold and Formula are under settings->miscellaneous on the right hand side.

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post #6 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 03:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post

It fails when it's made 15 adjustments and doesn't think it's successful.

You could try raising the dE threshold or changing the dE formula to something that might help it believe the calibration is working.

The settings for dE threshold and Formula are under settings->miscellaneous on the right hand side.

Great, thank you! I'll keep that in mind for the future. I just manually did the whole 11 point gray scale. I love the i1Pro. It's actually faster than the D3 at most IREs.
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post #7 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post

Great, thank you! I'll keep that in mind for the future. I just manually did the whole 11 point gray scale. I love the i1Pro. It's actually faster than the D3 at most IREs.

Yeah, the i1 Pro is a GREAT instrument.

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post #8 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 07:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post

Reset all your intel controls to default.

Laptops can only calibrate grayscale and gamma.
Since laptops don't have any controls, don't change anything, don't attempt to modify anything via the intel control panel.
Let CalPC handle the grayscale control if you don't have hardware monitor controls.
In the PC space ICC profiles handle gamut in ICC aware applications.

OK, so let me rephrase that to see if I have it straight, especially since I plan on calibrating LOTS of laptops in the future.

Laptops don't have hardware controls for their displays, so it's all handled internally with profiles. Changing the internal controls manually (outside of Calman or CalPC) is in essence creating a profile but it's not a profile created by Calman, which is what you're trying to do. Also, on the PC-single monitor workflow, some of those layouts are in-applicable for laptop calibrations (I'm thinking of the color temperature and RGB balance layouts).

Does this mean laptop calibrations are not as accurate as their PC counter parts? I wouldn't think so, because going back over the color temp and RGB balance layouts AFTER running the gray scale calibration shows PERFECT color temp and excellent RGB balance. Also, the resultant picture quality is stunning when compared to the pre-calibration image! (Aside from the fact that the display itself sucks and the primaries are no where close to 709... Secondaries were pretty good.)

So... couldn't you skip all that color temp and RGB balance garbage on a PC as well, and just run the gray scale corrections, then double check the color temp, etc?

Edit: Or, maybe the color temp and RGB balance is intended to be fixed FIRST, using the display device controls, before an internal profile is created to further perfect?
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post #9 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 07:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post


So... couldn't you skip all that color temp and RGB balance garbage on a PC as well, and just run the gray scale corrections, then double check the color temp, etc?

Edit: Or, maybe the color temp and RGB balance is intended to be fixed FIRST, using the display device controls, before an internal profile is created to further perfect?

Some monitors let you choose the color temp, and it is best to choose the one that closest to your target just like a TV. It is a single monitor work flow, not a laptop workflow... you skip the parts that are not applicable to your hardware.
Yes, if your monitor has adjustments to do a 2 point gray scale, you would want to do that manually before you do the final corrections with the video cart LUTs.
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post #10 of 15 Old 02-19-2012, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post


So... couldn't you skip all that color temp and RGB balance garbage on a PC as well, and just run the gray scale corrections, then double check the color temp, etc?

Edit: Or, maybe the color temp and RGB balance is intended to be fixed FIRST, using the display device controls, before an internal profile is created to further perfect?

Since your PC only has 8 bit output, if you can reduce the amount of correction you need to do in the LUT the better your image will be. So when doing a PC with a stand alone monitor, you'll get the best results by calibrating the display as close as possible and then using the LUT.

On a Laptop, you can basically skip straight to the calibrate grayscale step because you don't have any hardware controls to calibrate.

Whatever you do don't use the graphics card controls to try and calibrate. It's essentially just another entry point to the LUT, and likely cause extra error.

If you think of it like TV chain, the monitor is the display/projector. Some have lots of controls some have very few. The Calibrate grayscale step that does the look up table is like a video processor, extremely capable, works with everything, but has to output in limited bit depth.

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post #11 of 15 Old 02-25-2012, 03:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Perhaps this issue deserves a new thread, but it seems as though the PC Client calibration ... just disappears. I did this three times so far, and my laptop (HP Pavillion LW475UA running Windows 7) will only keep the corrected gray scale for a few minutes. Then it just suddenly reverts back to the horrible bluish default. This time around, I noticed it happened after I opened the Intel Graphics and Media control panel. I looked at the power settings, because I noticed the laptop was changing brightness depending on whether or not it was plugged in. I made NO CHANGES in the Intel Graphics and Media control panel, and hit cancel. POOF - back to blue garbage.

Is that all it takes for the calibration to be wiped out? What is going on here? I hate for this to happen to others that I calibrate for...
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post #12 of 15 Old 02-25-2012, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZandarKoad View Post

Perhaps this issue deserves a new thread, but it seems as though the PC Client calibration ... just disappears. I did this three times so far, and my laptop (HP Pavillion LW475UA running Windows 7) will only keep the corrected gray scale for a few minutes. Then it just suddenly reverts back to the horrible bluish default. This time around, I noticed it happened after I opened the Intel Graphics and Media control panel. I looked at the power settings, because I noticed the laptop was changing brightness depending on whether or not it was plugged in. I made NO CHANGES in the Intel Graphics and Media control panel, and hit cancel. POOF - back to blue garbage.

Is that all it takes for the calibration to be wiped out? What is going on here? I hate for this to happen to others that I calibrate for...

its a win7 issue...
use pc client to load the calibrated profile instead of win7..in case you haven't tried that..
/H
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post #13 of 15 Old 02-25-2012, 07:44 AM - Thread Starter
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its a win7 issue...
use pc client to load the calibrated profile instead of win7..in case you haven't tried that..
/H

Yes, I have the PC Client installed... Any chance you know the step by step for loading a profile?
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post #14 of 15 Old 02-25-2012, 10:05 AM
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If the PC client is installed AND LICENSED it should start with windows and apply your profile at boot. Works prefect on all my PC.

When you do the calibration with calman the first time it will ask you to license the pc client from the Calman software. Now if you are suing standalone PCcal product I have no idea
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post #15 of 15 Old 02-25-2012, 04:35 PM - Thread Starter
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I've got Calman DIY, with the PC addon, and four PC client licenses. I don't know if I ever tried to reboot the PC actually... But what I did do that finally applied the profile, is to simply log off windows 7. I logged in as the administrator (to do something unrelated), but I noticed the picture was perfect. When I logged in again as my regular user, the profile stayed... I don't know if all that administration stuff had anything to do with it.
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