CalMan 5 Release Notes and Discussion - Page 46 - AVS Forum
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post #1351 of 2566 Old 04-08-2013, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Franin View Post

With the meter facing the screen at what distance is it recommended to place the meter? I was told today it should be at least 1-2 feet away from screen. i was under the impression that it should be close to your seating position. if it is 1-2 feet can the meter be angled up to avoid its shadow ?

Thank you
High end spectros, like the Jeti and PR units, can be located near the seating position because they have a very narrow field of view. Consumer grade colorimeters should be closer, about 1-2 feet away depending on their construction. Their FOV is wider.

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post #1352 of 2566 Old 04-08-2013, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

With the meter facing the screen at what distance is it recommended to place the meter? I was told today it should be at least 1-2 feet away from screen. i was under the impression that it should be close to your seating position. if it is 1-2 feet can the meter be angled up to avoid its shadow ?

Thank you

Here is a Spectracl document that will allow you to picture/measure your meters field of view.
http://store.spectracal.com/article-why-viewing-angle-is-important

The important thing is to have the meter at a height and angle that is the same as your eyelevel when seated. In your line of site but close enough so it is reading the area of the screen with the pattern and nothing out side that area.
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post #1353 of 2566 Old 04-08-2013, 07:22 PM
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I place my iDisplay 3 about 1-1.5 feet away from the screen, tilted sideways to avoid the shadow. Works perfectly fine. It helps to do a continuous measurement of a 100% White pattern, adjusting as you move it around to find the best spot.
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post #1354 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad B View Post

High end spectros, like the Jeti and PR units, can be located near the seating position because they have a very narrow field of view. Consumer grade colorimeters should be closer, about 1-2 feet away depending on their construction. Their FOV is wider.

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Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

I place my iDisplay 3 about 1-1.5 feet away from the screen, tilted sideways to avoid the shadow. Works perfectly fine. It helps to do a continuous measurement of a 100% White pattern, adjusting as you move it around to find the best spot.

Thank you. I'm going to have to do it again.

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post #1355 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airscapes View Post

Here is a Spectracl document that will allow you to picture/measure your meters field of view.
http://store.spectracal.com/article-why-viewing-angle-is-important

The important thing is to have the meter at a height and angle that is the same as your eyelevel when seated. In your line of site but close enough so it is reading the area of the screen with the pattern and nothing out side that area.

Thanks for the link. I will redo the calibration.

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post #1356 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 05:40 AM
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Another question ( if its ok ) how many hours esp. with JVC projectors am I looking at when I do my next calibration? After the fist initial one will I do my second after it hits 1000 hours or before?

Thank you

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post #1357 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Another question ( if its ok ) how many hours esp. with JVC projectors am I looking at when I do my next calibration? After the fist initial one will I do my second after it hits 1000 hours or before?

Thank you

I normally tweak my projector every 6 months.. Once the software and hardware is purchased and you are familiar with your display you will want to keep it looking as good as you can. Hardest part is getting a night when the wife will let me play for a couple of hours...
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post #1358 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airscapes View Post

I normally tweak my projector every 6 months.. Once the software and hardware is purchased and you are familiar with your display you will want to keep it looking as good as you can. Hardest part is getting a night when the wife will let me play for a couple of hours...

I rather play with calibrating, then the wife. Wife ALWAYS tells me what I'm doing wrong, the PQ just shows me!

Note: Lumagens have new FW updates!
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post #1359 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

...
Wife ALWAYS tells me what I'm doing wrong,
...

If that includes conjugal relations, then no wonder you'd rather play with calibrating! And, no, I don't want to hear any more details about that. smile.gif
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post #1360 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Another question ( if its ok ) how many hours esp. with JVC projectors am I looking at when I do my next calibration? After the fist initial one will I do my second after it hits 1000 hours or before?

Thank you

You can calibrate every week if you want to. I calibrate projectors I am reviewing every 200 hours and there are changes. Not big changes, but there are changes. dEs can change from all below 1 up to 2s and 3s within 200 hours. Note that this does not happen if the projector has an LED light source, it only applies to the high-pressure lamps used in most projectors that are supposed to last for 2000-4000 hours.

You can always measure the projector every 100 or 200 hours and keep a log of how much change you see from the original calibration. That way you can learn how often you might want to do the complete calibration. You may find that the lamp does not change in the same ways when the lamp has 200, 1000 or 2000 hours on it - and the speed of changes may be different with 1000 hours or 100 hours. So it is difficult to say 200 hours or 400 hours or 600 hours... you may want to calibrate at 100 hours, 300 hours, 700 hours, 1200 hours, 1800 hours, etc. Or you may find a different number of hours is best for your projector. When you change lamps, the new lamp may have a similar "change profile" or the new lamp could be very different. You just don't know what is happening without taking a series of grayscsale and CMS measurements.

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post #1361 of 2566 Old 04-09-2013, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by erkq View Post

If that includes conjugal relations, then no wonder you'd rather play with calibrating! And, no, I don't want to hear any more details about that. smile.gif

I get more compliments from the calibrating results, besides, at the age of 68 ? Pheromones gone, hormones gone, and the stress from the Government taking all my money, and trying to live on what's left! Oh yes, try to sneak a few pennies away here and there to save for the OLED 4K TV! (I wonder what it's going to be like to calibrate?)

Appendum after last night's calibration cession:

Whoops!
Crash! Due to the New Lumagen FW not quite getting along with Calman?
Started over. Sitting on the 30/100 2 Point Calibration Workflo Screen that was looking Peachy!
Did Reset - still Peachy, Reset again, still Peachy, One more time, Reset - finally get the 100 Screen.
Decided to do the Greyscale the old fashioned way ChadB had mentioned in the past, except this time,
instead of doing the calibration on the TV, use the DDC to calibrate the XE-3D. 100 set to the 0 Line,
then, starting from 10, work my way back up to 100, calibrating only the Green to 0 Line, start back at 10,
calibrate Blue to 0, with any fine tuning of Green. Once finished, back to 10 to do Red to the 0 line, Again
fine tuning Green and Blue. The result, a Greyscale almost perfectly straight across the 0 line!
Could never do this with the AutoCal, followed by using the DDC fine tuning. Tonight, 125 Point by AutoCal.
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post #1362 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Blackburn View Post

You can calibrate every week if you want to. I calibrate projectors I am reviewing every 200 hours and there are changes. Not big changes, but there are changes. dEs can change from all below 1 up to 2s and 3s within 200 hours. Note that this does not happen if the projector has an LED light source, it only applies to the high-pressure lamps used in most projectors that are supposed to last for 2000-4000 hours.

You can always measure the projector every 100 or 200 hours and keep a log of how much change you see from the original calibration. That way you can learn how often you might want to do the complete calibration. You may find that the lamp does not change in the same ways when the lamp has 200, 1000 or 2000 hours on it - and the speed of changes may be different with 1000 hours or 100 hours. So it is difficult to say 200 hours or 400 hours or 600 hours... you may want to calibrate at 100 hours, 300 hours, 700 hours, 1200 hours, 1800 hours, etc. Or you may find a different number of hours is best for your projector. When you change lamps, the new lamp may have a similar "change profile" or the new lamp could be very different. You just don't know what is happening without taking a series of grayscsale and CMS measurements.

Quote:
Originally Posted by airscapes View Post

I normally tweak my projector every 6 months.. Once the software and hardware is purchased and you are familiar with your display you will want to keep it looking as good as you can. Hardest part is getting a night when the wife will let me play for a couple of hours...

Thank you, I will look into it when the projector hits another 200 hours. Curious to see the change. The bright side of all this, it cost me nothing just my time( which I don't mind)

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post #1363 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

I get more compliments from the calibrating results, besides, at the age of 68 ? Pheromones gone, hormones gone, and the stress from the Government taking all my money, and trying to live on what's left! Oh yes, try to sneak a few pennies away here and there to save for the OLED 4K TV! (I wonder what it's going to be like to calibrate?)

Appendum after last night's calibration cession:

Whoops!
Crash! Due to the New Lumagen FW not quite getting along with Calman?
Started over. Sitting on the 30/100 2 Point Calibration Workflo Screen that was looking Peachy!
Did Reset - still Peachy, Reset again, still Peachy, One more time, Reset - finally get the 100 Screen.
Decided to do the Greyscale the old fashioned way ChadB had mentioned in the past, except this time,
instead of doing the calibration on the TV, use the DDC to calibrate the XE-3D. 100 set to the 0 Line,
then, starting from 10, work my way back up to 100, calibrating only the Green to 0 Line, start back at 10,
calibrate Blue to 0, with any fine tuning of Green. Once finished, back to 10 to do Red to the 0 line, Again
fine tuning Green and Blue. The result, a Greyscale almost perfectly straight across the 0 line!
Could never do this with the AutoCal, followed by using the DDC fine tuning. Tonight, 125 Point by AutoCal.

The latest FW for my Mini 3D as a pattern source generator is working fine with the latest Beta of Calman.

When I was using my Mini 3D to store and process the 125 point LUT, I would set both GS and LUT to 0.5 and used a 21 point RGB balance/Gamma/grayscale. Always got some very nice results.

When I did a manual 10 point ISF DDC RGB Balance using the controls of my VT50, I would never change Green only Red and Blue, used Luma to balance out RGB.
As you will see if you look at my link for my VT50's settings.

ss

BTW, the best wife repellent imo is playing a Blu Ray like Starz Spartacus. That will make her think twice before she enters your man cave.eek.gif
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post #1364 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 01:40 PM
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Have i1 pro 2 and calman control 5 on order. For profiling if I decide that's what I want to do, do I need to spend $695 on a c6 or is the OEM i1display the better move at $250?

Thanks.

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post #1365 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

Have i1 pro 2 and calman control 5 on order. For profiling if I decide that's what I want to do, do I need to spend $695 on a c6 or is the OEM i1display the better move at $250?

Thanks.

I am selling my I1Pro REV D and C6 both new from Calman.
I don't need them anymore because I got a K10-A new from Calman.

ss
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post #1366 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 01:51 PM
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Please pm me about C6. I did not see in classifieds.

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post #1367 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

...
BTW, the best wife repellent imo is playing a Blu Ray like Starz Spartacus.
...

"Wife repellent"... I don't understand you guys. Of course I've only been married only 18 months... give it time I guess...
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post #1368 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post



BTW, the best wife repellent imo is playing a Blu Ray like Starz Spartacus. That will make her think twice before she enters your man cave.eek.gif

Guess that depends on the wife.. Spartacus is one of our favorite shows,shame it is almost done.. along with Banshie (blows Spartus away for violence and sex), GOT, True Blood, The Americans and many others.. wink.gifeek.gif Hard to find a night when I can take over the projector for mind numbing gray scale readings.. mad.gif
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post #1369 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 03:33 PM
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I love Spartacus, Banshee and Strike Back. And with the equally naked men on Spartacus, I think women like it too LOL.

Totally OT! smile.gif

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post #1370 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by erkq View Post

"Wife repellent"... I don't understand you guys. Of course I've only been married only 18 months... give it time I guess...

24 Months is the Recognized amount of time, then things change, and you learn to calibrate!
Famous last words `Happy Wife, Happy Life!' , then you buy bigger and better, and then learn how to calibrate that one. At some point, it's got to be `Home Theatre!'. That now requires a new method of calibrating! Wecome to the Forum!
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post #1371 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

24 Months is the Recognized amount of time, then things change, and you learn to calibrate!
Famous last words `Happy Wife, Happy Life!' , then you buy bigger and better, and then learn how to calibrate that one. At some point, it's got to be `Home Theatre!'. That now requires a new method of calibrating! Wecome to the Forum!

6 months to go, then!

I calibrate! smile.gif I've got the CalMAN/Radiance/C6 package and do Color Cube and 21 pt gamma calibrations with it. My wife actually loves the results. I also already have a dedicated home theater... 10' wide AT screen, tiered seating, 16.5 by 21 feet. My wife is all for improving the look of that with printed fabric over the sound treatment and upgraded furniture. I haven't hit that 24 months yet.
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post #1372 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by erkq View Post

6 months to go, then!

I calibrate! smile.gif I've got the CalMAN/Radiance/C6 package and do Color Cube and 21 pt gamma calibrations with it. My wife actually loves the results. I also already have a dedicated home theater... 10' wide AT screen, tiered seating, 16.5 by 21 feet. My wife is all for improving the look of that with printed fabric over the sound treatment and upgraded furniture. I haven't hit that 24 months yet.

I don't know about Projection Systems, but on my LG 55LHX, the C6 reading of my set, is far different then the reading of the C6 Profiled off my i1Pro. The C6 seems to get the Reds wrong, whereas with the Profiling, this is corrected.
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post #1373 of 2566 Old 04-10-2013, 11:04 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

I don't know about Projection Systems, but on my LG 55LHX, the C6 reading of my set, is far different then the reading of the C6 Profiled off my i1Pro. The C6 seems to get the Reds wrong, whereas with the Profiling, this is corrected.

Maybe it would be worth it for me to try and rent a i1Pro. Reds sure look OK, but the eye is easily fooled.
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post #1374 of 2566 Old 04-11-2013, 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

I am selling my I1Pro REV D and C6 both new from Calman.
I don't need them anymore because I got a K10-A new from Calman.

ss

why not keeping the I1 Pro REV D for profiling the K10 ?
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post #1375 of 2566 Old 04-11-2013, 04:02 AM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

I don't know about Projection Systems, but on my LG 55LHX, the C6 reading of my set, is far different then the reading of the C6 Profiled off my i1Pro. The C6 seems to get the Reds wrong, whereas with the Profiling, this is corrected.

I recently had the chance to run my D3 pro after a reference meter. It wasn't near as close as I'd hope with the plasma profile.

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Is it worth the upgrade to a SpectraCal C6? Just for Home use only.

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post #1377 of 2566 Old 04-11-2013, 07:16 AM
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From what? I have the D3 pro with chromapure and its been nice. Its like the C6 with built in profiles.

That being said I decided to grab an i1 pro 2 and D3 OEM with calman 5 for profiling. Should be pretty deversified now smile.gif

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post #1378 of 2566 Old 04-11-2013, 09:14 AM
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All these meters are creating work for you. Ignorance is bliss smile.gif

Besides the studios are just screwing up the color timing in all the new film transfers.

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post #1379 of 2566 Old 04-11-2013, 09:15 AM
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U shd not need the d3 OEM as the one u hv will work with calman, I believe. Calman will not use the pro tables that's all.

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post #1380 of 2566 Old 04-11-2013, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

From what? I have the D3 pro with chromapure and its been nice. Its like the C6 with built in profiles.

That being said I decided to grab an i1 pro 2 and D3 OEM with calman 5 for profiling. Should be pretty deversified now smile.gif

I have both OEM D3 and a C6 and they are both excellent meters.

I think the idea of profiling is to check out the Display for conformity to its type.

I don't think either meter would be the cause of any errors, they give great accuracy for the amateur like me. However, if your display is not typical of the LUT type you use during calibration whether Calman or Chromapure that's where the error can be hence the use of profiling for each Display.

In all probability your Display will be typical but there's always that nagging doubt.
I bought a Spectro to check and it was very close so effectively wasted my money. If I change my Display however I can check that one as well, probably with the same result.
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