Radiance 3D LUT (5x5x5 Cube) Calibration with CalMAN 5 - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by sotti View Post

That is pretty close to what we'd expect out of the current build, hopefully I'll be able to get a little more light out the tweaks I've made for tomorrow's release.

Tomorrow's release: will there be two versions ... HOME version and BUSINESS version ?

Sources: Panasonic BDT-110, Toshiba HD-XE-1, Vantage VT-1S
Video processing: Lumagen Radiance 2041
Calibration: Full LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5 Business Pro, Chroma Pure
Probes: X-Rite EODIS3 / C6 / Chroma 5 / i1 pro 2
Targets: JVC-X500, TX-P65VTW60
Sound: Yamaha RX-V2067
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post #182 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Nudgiator View Post

Tomorrow's release: will there be two versions ... HOME version and BUSINESS version ?

yes that is the plan.

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post #183 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 04:57 PM
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yes that is the plan.

I will have a look at the Business version smile.gif

Sources: Panasonic BDT-110, Toshiba HD-XE-1, Vantage VT-1S
Video processing: Lumagen Radiance 2041
Calibration: Full LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5 Business Pro, Chroma Pure
Probes: X-Rite EODIS3 / C6 / Chroma 5 / i1 pro 2
Targets: JVC-X500, TX-P65VTW60
Sound: Yamaha RX-V2067
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post #184 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nudgiator View Post

Tomorrow's release: will there be two versions ... HOME version and BUSINESS version ?

Yes CalMAN 5 Home Video 5.03 RC2 and CalMAN 5 for Business 5.03 RC1

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post #185 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by sotti View Post

It's all targets based. So if you select power with an exponent of 2.35, all the saturation targets are calculated off of that.
I honestly haven't explored what tweaking the radiance gamma factor does to a cube post calibration.
But since we allow you to pick any old gamma formula and target exponent you want, I don't see a reason why you wouldn't just select your targets pre-cal. If you wanted to just turn the gamma down for daylight viewing, that's no big deal since it's not color critical anyway. If you did want a color critical version with a lower gamma, then just do that on a separate CMS entry.
If something goes sideways during the calibration, then we need to stop the calibration and re-run it. Usually we can correct from a bad reading or two, but in the above example I suspect what happen is was the gamma was all based off of the a mis-calibrated white point, so the target luminance was wrong during the the autocal portion. Upon remeasuring you see the final result.
Thanks for the info!

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post #186 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Geof View Post

Thanks for the info!

Geof, we just finished up testing the latest Radiance firmware 090712 on our JVC RS-55 in all filters modes and they all worked out well. I will get some data posted for each of the RS-55 filter modes.

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post #187 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by derekjsmith View Post

Geof, we just finished up testing the latest Radiance firmware 090712 on our JVC RS-55 in all filters modes and they all worked out well. I will get some data posted for each of the RS-55 filter modes.
Looking forward to that. My Blue primary has low saturation and when that is fixed it's luminance falls. There is a fine line where both are acceptable (but not great). No matter what was done blue had too much red tho and Cyan luminance is horrible and unfixable. This was using the Stage profile and the internal CMS to correct the colorspace as best I could before using the 125 pt cal. Out of curiosity do you know how many hours are on the lamp of your RS55?

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post #188 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Geof View Post

Looking forward to that. My Blue primary has low saturation and when that is fixed it's luminance falls. There is a fine line where both are acceptable (but not great). No matter what was done blue had too much red tho and Cyan luminance is horrible and unfixable. This was using the Stage profile and the internal CMS to correct the colorspace as best I could before using the 125 pt cal. Out of curiosity do you know how many hours are on the lamp of your RS55?

The ones we found where the best to start with was Vivid and Adobe. Not sure on the lamp I will have Darrell check. All of our tests were done with the RS-55 reset to factory.

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post #189 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by derekjsmith View Post

The ones we found where the best to start with was Vivid and Adobe. Not sure on the lamp I will have Darrell check. All of our tests were done with the RS-55 reset to factory.
I started fiddling with the Adobe profile right after I posted above. I used the internal CMS and got it close but that damn blue hue is too red and I can't quite get the undersaturation corrected. Everything else should be okay i think. You know when it's difficult to eek out a Rec709 colorspace from the supposed Adobe RGB colorspace something just doesn't seem like it was designed properly (maybe lamp age is a contributing factor here??). I may give vivid a try and see how that compares to Adobe. Thanks!

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post #190 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by derekjsmith View Post

The ones we found where the best to start with was Vivid and Adobe. Not sure on the lamp I will have Darrell check. All of our tests were done with the RS-55 reset to factory.

Thanks for this info! Did you tweak anything on the JVC RS55 (e.g. CMS) before starting after you reset to factory? SJ
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post #191 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 07:12 PM
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Derek,
I just looked at vivid and after a little tweaking with the internal CMS it looks to be the way to go. I'll try a cube cal with this profile (but not tonight any longer). Regardless this looks to be the best starting point I've found yet.
Thanks for the info!

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post #192 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by SJHT View Post

Thanks for this info! Did you tweak anything on the JVC RS55 (e.g. CMS) before starting after you reset to factory? SJ

I believe we calibrated the cuts and gains and brightness and contrast. But I believe that was it.

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post #193 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Geof View Post

Derek,
I just looked at vivid and after a little tweaking with the internal CMS it looks to be the way to go. I'll try a cube cal with this profile (but not tonight any longer). Regardless this looks to be the best starting point I've found yet.
Thanks for the info!

Here is Vivid on our RS-55 it should be more than enough to work with, maybe too much smile.gif


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post #194 of 825 Old 09-20-2012, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by derekjsmith View Post

Here is Vivid on our RS-55 it should be more than enough to work with, maybe too much smile.gif
I'll trade with you...wink.gifsmile.gif
Mine is not nearly that nice but I was able to adjust the internal CMS to make everything saturated or over saturated and almost all colors had enough luminance. I did rein in green a bit.

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post #195 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 07:25 AM
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Here is Vivid on our RS-55 it should be more than enough to work with, maybe too much smile.gif
Here is what I'm seeing. This is about the best case blue hue I've seen. This was right after a factory reset and was taken using the Standard profile and a fresh new lamp (w/0 hours) but I get nearly nearly identical results with my existing lamp (lower luminance's tho). I used the internal JVC patterns but the results match those I've gotten using the Radiance patterns. I can diddle the internal CMS control to improve this somewhat but nothing I've tried gets blue hue any better. It appears to have a purplish shade when looking at the pattern but fortunately it's is not horribly apparent when viewing real content.

PS: Forgive the CP screenshot....rolleyes.gif


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post #196 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 08:05 AM
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Any reason you didn't use vivid like we recommended?

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post #197 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 08:07 AM
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Any reason you didn't use vivid like we recommended?
I have not gotten to do a cube cal yet but even with vivid blue hue is about the same as shown above. It just doesn't get any better....but it's obvious your machine is much better in that dept.

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post #198 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 08:56 AM
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I believe we calibrated the cuts and gains and brightness and contrast. But I believe that was it.

What workflow is good to adjust the JVC cuts/gains? Thanks. SJ
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post #199 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 09:08 AM
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What workflow is good to adjust the JVC cuts/gains? Thanks. SJ

Everything you need to do a Cube, including cuts and gains is in the Cube workflow.

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post #200 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 09:10 AM
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What workflow is good to adjust the JVC cuts/gains? Thanks. SJ

Just a hint: DON'T touch the CUT controllers ! Do this:

1. Adjust white and black level with the controllers of the JVC
2. Adjust 100 IRE white point ONLY with the GAIN controllers of the JVC (go to a workflow where you can see a 100 IRE test pattern and adjust RGB balance)
3. Run autocal of grayscales, gamma ... then 125 point cube.

Sources: Panasonic BDT-110, Toshiba HD-XE-1, Vantage VT-1S
Video processing: Lumagen Radiance 2041
Calibration: Full LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5 Business Pro, Chroma Pure
Probes: X-Rite EODIS3 / C6 / Chroma 5 / i1 pro 2
Targets: JVC-X500, TX-P65VTW60
Sound: Yamaha RX-V2067
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post #201 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 12:57 PM
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I have not gotten to do a cube cal yet but even with vivid blue hue is about the same as shown above. It just doesn't get any better....but it's obvious your machine is much better in that dept.

What color is your room?

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post #202 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 01:28 PM
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What color is your room?
Mostly black (velvet) with some dark gray.

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post #203 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 01:39 PM
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Mostly black (velvet) with some dark gray.

Geof do you have access to a spectro? I would like to see the SPD of your RS-55 it should not be that far off even with an older lamp. Aged lamps usually become red deficient before any other color.

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post #204 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 02:11 PM
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Yes I have Rev A i1Pro.
BTW, Tom also used a spectro to train his colorimeter and my i1D3 appears to be accurate in chroma but off a tad in luminance. I am going to play some more with this tonight but this problem has been remarkably consistent. Various color profiles, lamps, and pattern sources all show similar hue issues with blue. In fairness I do have a dark burgundy carpet but the screen is not close and no other colors are exhibiting a red influence. I think I'm narrowing in on either some mis-adjustment or something is amiss in the projector as no one else seems to have this problem. I did email JVC support but have not heard back.

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post #205 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Geof View Post

Yes I have Rev A i1Pro.
BTW, Tom also used a spectro to train his colorimeter and my i1D3 appears to be accurate in chroma but off a tad in luminance. I am going to play some more with this tonight but this problem has been remarkably consistent. Various color profiles, lamps, and pattern sources all show similar hue issues with blue. In fairness I do have a dark burgundy carpet but the screen is not close and no other colors are exhibiting a red influence. I think I'm narrowing in on either some mis-adjustment or something is amiss in the projector as no one else seems to have this problem. I did email JVC support but have not heard back.

If you could shoot a SPD with your i1Pro I will pass it onto our lab and have them take a look. The SPD charts are on our Quick Analysis workflow.

They look something like this, from my LG LED:


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post #206 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 02:19 PM
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I'll try to do this with the i1pro facing the projector. Should I use a properly white balanced 100% pattern?

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post #207 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 02:25 PM
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I'll try to do this with the i1pro facing the projector. Should I use a properly white balanced 100% pattern?

Facing the projector if you have the white diffuser attachment for your i1Pro and in CalMAN 5 use "Facing Projector" display type. The calibrations should not matter but you should shoot with the profile off so we can see the native lamp and not the filters. Then again with Vivid to see the filters in the light path.

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post #208 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 02:30 PM
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Good point on the diffuser....I'm not sure if I have one for the i1Pro. Screen it is if not.

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post #209 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 05:41 PM
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Good point on the diffuser....I'm not sure if I have one for the i1Pro. Screen it is if not.

Here is ours RS-55:

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post #210 of 825 Old 09-21-2012, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by sotti View Post

Everything you need to do a Cube, including cuts and gains is in the Cube workflow.

Is this workflow information for both the "pre" things that need to be done such as the cuts and gains and contrast and gamma and grayscale, plus the instructions for when ready to push the button on the cube 125 point auto cal.....contained in a document on line anywhere yet? So a newcomer such as myself considering going this route can take a look at how much is there to walk me through the whole process?

thanks
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