Calman V4: Manually enter meter offsets? - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 49 Old 01-21-2013, 08:42 AM - Thread Starter
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So I choose "CRT" rather than Plasma in CM and use your matrix tool numbers?

bob
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post #32 of 49 Old 01-21-2013, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spongebob View Post

So I choose "CRT" rather than Plasma in CM and use your matrix tool numbers?

bob
yes.

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post #33 of 49 Old 01-21-2013, 09:10 AM
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Joel, so it would be the same for me if I was calibrating my Projector? Use Tom's numbers for Front Projector for the matrix, but choose CRT as the device in CalMan?
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post #34 of 49 Old 01-21-2013, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

Joel, so it would be the same for me if I was calibrating my Projector? Use Tom's numbers for Front Projector for the matrix, but choose CRT as the device in CalMan?

No, his offsets for the UHP mode is likely based off the base UHP table, but you'd have to ask him.

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post #35 of 49 Old 01-21-2013, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by sotti View Post

No, his offsets for the UHP mode is likely based off the base UHP table, but you'd have to ask him.

I asked Tom "What is your base table for the Front Projector offsets (both screen and lens) for the Display PRO I purchased from you?"

He replied "LCD".

So what is the proper choice for me?
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post #36 of 49 Old 01-21-2013, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

I asked Tom "What is your base table for the Front Projector offsets (both screen and lens) for the Display PRO I purchased from you?"

He replied "LCD".

So what is the proper choice for me?

Then I'd use CCFL LCD.

Base Profile + chromapure profile = results.

Since we can calculate the profile, once you know what the base profile is, you should be able to duplicate the results.

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post #37 of 49 Old 01-29-2013, 08:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Well, I tried "CRT" and "Plasma" and have tripled checked my numbers but the results are obviously very wrong. What is interesting is that the same numbers in the HCFR conversion matrix give perfect results. Oh, well.



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post #38 of 49 Old 04-06-2013, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spongebob View Post

Well, I tried "CRT" and "Plasma" and have tripled checked my numbers but the results are obviously very wrong. What is interesting is that the same numbers in the HCFR conversion matrix give perfect results. Oh, well.



bob

Joel, did you ever sort out this problem?
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post #39 of 49 Old 04-06-2013, 10:29 PM - Thread Starter
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I gave up. Too hard trying to get CM to support CP and vice versa; but I get it wink.gif


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post #40 of 49 Old 11-19-2013, 03:33 PM
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I've used this tool to create a XYZ offset matrix for use in CM with existing xyY meter profiles.

Problem is that the probe reads in CM 5 (with the offset matrix active) differ from probe reads in other applications with the same offset.

Can anybody from Spectracal confirm that this tool is actually working and calculates the XYZ offset matrix correctly ? Is there a newer version of this tool ?

In addition, is there a way to enter xyY meter values directly into CM ?


Thanks.

- M

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post #41 of 49 Old 11-19-2013, 05:33 PM
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wow, Calman 4 was asked about for help.

the help is for V5 and net 4.5.
issue of no V5 support for XP discussed.

I quit using the Calman stuff because of netframe issues in the last realease of V4
and general poor use of netframe versions and fontcache calls.

Found V5 to buggy and report differently than 4.

Loving D65
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post #42 of 49 Old 11-19-2013, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Mike View Post

I've used this tool to create a XYZ offset matrix for use in CM with existing xyY meter profiles.

Problem is that the probe reads in CM 5 (with the offset matrix active) differ from probe reads in other applications with the same offset.

Can anybody from Spectracal confirm that this tool is actually working and calculates the XYZ offset matrix correctly ? Is there a newer version of this tool ?

The tool is just a UI on top of the code that actually runs inside CalMAN. The tool is part of our build process and installs with CalMAN installs, so while it hasn't been updated directly it does sit on top of the newest codebase for CalMAN. So yes it absolutely works and does exactly what we advertise it to do, create a 4 color matrix from RGBW x,y,Y readings as if those readings were taken inside CalMAN. We can't say that you will match another software as there are a variety of things that could prevent that from being true. But the matrix is guaranteed to be correct for the given information.


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Originally Posted by Iron Mike View Post

In addition, is there a way to enter xyY meter values directly into CM ?
Yes if you have design mode.
You can make writeable x,y,Y fields.

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post #43 of 49 Old 11-19-2013, 10:14 PM
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@ sotti:

there is a problem: every time I enter XYZ values from the tool manually into the meter profile in CM5 it does not save cell 9 (Z/Z - bottom right) correctly. It saves it as 1. While the value I entered is 1.08949503. Within the CM5 session it does appears to store and use 1.08949503. But when I close and re-open CM and check on the meter profile again, bottom right cell has a value of 1.

All other cell values are saved correctly.

Regarding design mode:

I do have it. So with design mode enabled, I would be able to enter xyY values into the meter profile as an offset, replacing the current XYZ matrix ?

Could you describe step-by-step how to do this ?

Thanks.

- M

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post #44 of 49 Old 11-19-2013, 10:40 PM
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@ sottie:

2 more problems:

(1.) Either the XYZ matrix offset calculated by the Four color matrix tool is incorrect or CM does not use the reference offset correctly when adjusting the active probe's data. I've run lots of tests now. Every time there is no offset applied to the probe, the CM 5 probe data pretty much matches 2 other applications, which is good. With the offset applied, the probe data in CM 5 is way off what the other 2 applications report with the exact same offset.

So it is either the Four color matrix tool that is calculating the offset incorrectly or the offset is incorrectly applied.

(2.) When CM5 starts up and it auto connects to the Lumagen Mini as a pattern generator, it switches Memories. In our case it switches from 6A to 6C. If you don't notice it you're now profiling with contaminated patterns, depending on the internal setup of the Memory it switched to. Not good.


Please let me know about (1) asap. We need to figure out if we can use CM for our workflow of calibrating a larger number of displays for color critical application. If it is possible to enter xyY directly as an offset, that would even save us a step.

Thanks.

- M

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post #45 of 49 Old 11-20-2013, 09:52 AM
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Entering Matrix Data
It sounds like you aren't getting the meter profile entered correctly. I wasn't able to reproduce the issue, but make sure you tab out of the field so that it accepts the number before you close the tool. I was able to modify and switch profiles and have it restore correctly. If for some reason it wasn't having the one of the matrix value accepted into the profile that could be the reason for the issue. I also know that at one point there was a bug with it accepting negative entries.

I did all my testing with the released version of 5.2

Writable Datafields
Entering data into the app.

Add a Datafield:


Set the datafield to one of the x,y,Y writeable options:


The top drop down would allow you to set the datatype from grayscale, gamut, colorchecker, 3D Cube, ect...

Static Offset
If you just want a static x,y,Y offset you can enter that on the workflow advanced options:






I hope that covers your concerns, let me know if there is anything else I can clear up for you.

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post #46 of 49 Old 11-20-2013, 08:58 PM
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Sotti,

I've created and answered in a new thread: see here.

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post #47 of 49 Old 05-11-2014, 06:14 AM
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Is there any benefit from using XYZ versus x,y,Y?

....or is it exactly the same, just a different method of expressing the same thing?

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post #48 of 49 Old 05-11-2014, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

Is there any benefit from using XYZ versus x,y,Y?

....or is it exactly the same, just a different method of expressing the same thing?

same thing Jim, just 2 different color spaces, if you convert between XYZ and xyY you'll be referring to the same point just in a different space...
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post #49 of 49 Old 05-11-2014, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Mike View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

Is there any benefit from using XYZ versus x,y,Y?

....or is it exactly the same, just a different method of expressing the same thing?

same thing Jim, just 2 different color spaces, if you convert between XYZ and xyY you'll be referring to the same point just in a different space...

Yeap, during conversion you will end with the same results, for example Klein is measuring @ Klein's ChromaSurf with xyY but it's storing the correction tables in XYZ.

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