Colorimeter or Television? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 01-19-2013, 05:26 PM - Thread Starter
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I recently bought a Sharp LC-70C8470U and have been working off and on to calibrate it. I've had this particular TV for 6 days (first one is going back to Costco....was unable to tone down blue enough for a decent cal).

The day after I first turned on the TV, I dialed in the "movie" mode. Since then, I had not taken any measurements for 4 days, but today, while prepping to calibrate the HTPC, I noticed that blue had jumped up by 5%. Subsequent measurements and comparison to saved HCFR files with exact calibration parameters confirmed that blue is, on average, 5% higher now.

My question is, do you think this is the TV (perhaps breaking in) or the meter (i1 Display Pro/i1D3)? The TV is LCD/LED and I've read that they don't "break in" as a plasma does. I've also read that they do need a bit of time to stabilize.

I've triple checked that the HCFR settings are the same (as initial measurements) and that the calibration parameters are correct.

I"m concerned about the jump in blue because this is why the first TV is going back.

Thanks in advance for input.
BT

Sharp LC-70C8470U
Onkyo TX-SR606
PS-3
Homegrown HTPC

HCFR 3.0.4.0
i1 Display Pro (i1D3)
ControlCAL Elite X5 Edition v2
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post #2 of 11 Old 01-19-2013, 05:39 PM
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You need to let the TV warm up for 30 minutes before measuring. You are also supposed to let the meter warm up while placed on the TV for a minimum of 10 minutes too.

I don't know if it needs to be continuously reading during that point, but I typically leave my i1Display Pro taking continuous readings for 15 minutes with ColorHCFR or just plugged in for 15 minutes while resting on the TV with CalMAN open. (Since I see the power light on with CalMAN while the app is open.)

Current HT setup:

Samsung UN65F6300 65" LCD HDTV, Polk CS20 Center, 2x Polk Monitor 75T Fronts, 2x Polk TSI300 Backs, Polk PSW110 Subwoofer.

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post #3 of 11 Old 01-19-2013, 06:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaboy581 View Post

You need to let the TV warm up for 30 minutes before measuring. You are also supposed to let the meter warm up while placed on the TV for a minimum of 10 minutes too.

I don't know if it needs to be continuously reading during that point, but I typically leave my i1Display Pro taking continuous readings for 15 minutes with ColorHCFR or just plugged in for 15 minutes while resting on the TV with CalMAN open. (Since I see the power light on with CalMAN while the app is open.)

Good input. I didn't mention it, but my initial measurments were with tv and meter started up cold, but then I recalled reading about warming up both (particularly on plasmas). I left the meter in measurement position with the TV for over an hour. I did not leave the meter in continuous read mode for that time.

I'll try letting the meter run and see if that makes a difference.

Regards,
BT

Sharp LC-70C8470U
Onkyo TX-SR606
PS-3
Homegrown HTPC

HCFR 3.0.4.0
i1 Display Pro (i1D3)
ControlCAL Elite X5 Edition v2
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post #4 of 11 Old 01-19-2013, 06:28 PM
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I would chalk it up to your display being new. It may need some more use before the set (relatively) stabilizes.
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post #5 of 11 Old 01-20-2013, 02:44 AM
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I understood that the i1D3 shouldn't be left in contact with the display as the heat will effect it's accuracy. It should be set slightly away from the screen. Done this way I've found my readings (also on an LCD TV) have been much more consistent that with my old i1LT (using Chromapure, but this shouldn't effect consistency).

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post #6 of 11 Old 01-20-2013, 07:21 AM
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I have only heard that with plasma and i1D3. This is the first I have read about it with an LCD.

I will investigate it myself, though.

Current HT setup:

Samsung UN65F6300 65" LCD HDTV, Polk CS20 Center, 2x Polk Monitor 75T Fronts, 2x Polk TSI300 Backs, Polk PSW110 Subwoofer.

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post #7 of 11 Old 01-21-2013, 06:51 PM - Thread Starter
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By checking against my Mitsubish and the first Sharp 70" (Sharp #1), I was able to determine that the 2nd Sharp 70" (Sharp #2) has experienced a shift in the amount of blue being output. Prior to this change, I was able to get a very flat gamma with dE<2 except for 10% IRE (this was after only 1 pass). If I try to hit D65 as closely as possible, I get dE's ranging from 1-10 and gamma falls off pretty steep at 70%. I absolutely cannot balance R, G, & B at 70-100 IRE.

Here's a link to results prior the the blue-shift and prior to tuning primaries: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1451827/calibration-advice-needed-for-sharp-70-setting-primaries#post_22851852 I was unable to dial in the primaries, but did get a nice picture by using the 75% saturation method.

I can stil get a flat gamma by allowing blue to remain at and average of 109% (R & G @ 100%) across the grayscale, but dE's are running from 7.5-10.

So now I wonder what I"m giving up, in terms of an accurate picture, by having 10% more blue? The picture isn't bad, but after going through all this trouble, I want it right!

Do any of you think Sharp can do anything to correct this?

Also, is it possible to roll back the rev on firmware? I know that the firmware update installed prior to the blue shift.

Anyone else have this or a similar experience?

Regards,
BT

Sharp LC-70C8470U
Onkyo TX-SR606
PS-3
Homegrown HTPC

HCFR 3.0.4.0
i1 Display Pro (i1D3)
ControlCAL Elite X5 Edition v2
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post #8 of 11 Old 01-21-2013, 09:29 PM
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If your initial cal was done with a DVD or Blu-Ray player as the source, you may be seeing a difference in how the display handles YCbCr vs RGB (which the HTPC is probably sending). Some displays treat both the same, others deal with them differently.

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post #9 of 11 Old 01-22-2013, 08:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post

If your initial cal was done with a DVD or Blu-Ray player as the source, you may be seeing a difference in how the display handles YCbCr vs RGB (which the HTPC is probably sending). Some displays treat both the same, others deal with them differently.

Thanks for the response. The shift exists using all the equipment/conditions of the initial cal. In preparing for the HTPC cal, I was only recording the x, y, Y for 100% IRE and was intending to begin the HTPC cal by matching those number.

Regards,
BT

Sharp LC-70C8470U
Onkyo TX-SR606
PS-3
Homegrown HTPC

HCFR 3.0.4.0
i1 Display Pro (i1D3)
ControlCAL Elite X5 Edition v2
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post #10 of 11 Old 01-22-2013, 04:55 PM
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I would use a BluRay player or DVD player with the AVCHD disc to verify if the set can or cannot be calibrated. Using an HTPC creates may more variables in the video chain, mostly from the video card and its drivers, and less so from the OS settings.
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post #11 of 11 Old 01-22-2013, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vega509 View Post

I would use a BluRay player or DVD player with the AVCHD disc to verify if the set can or cannot be calibrated. Using an HTPC creates may more variables in the video chain, mostly from the video card and its drivers, and less so from the OS settings.

Thanks, a blu-ray player/AVS 709 in blu-ray format connected directly to the TV via HDMI (bypassing the HTPC) is what was used to calibrate the TV and to determine there has been a 10% increase in blue output.

Regards,
BT

Sharp LC-70C8470U
Onkyo TX-SR606
PS-3
Homegrown HTPC

HCFR 3.0.4.0
i1 Display Pro (i1D3)
ControlCAL Elite X5 Edition v2
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