What pic mode should I be calibrating in on a 2013 Panasonic Plasma (S60)? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 37 Old 09-29-2013, 08:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Should I be using Cinema or Custom when calibrating the Panasonic TC-P50S60 Plasma (and are blacks better in one of these modes)? Is Mid Panel Brightness better than Low or High? Is the CMS worth using and does it work right?

What is the Home Theater Picture Mode for?

(As you can see, I have a lot of questions about this TV since the last Panasonic I calibrated was a 2008 model.)




Panasonic TC-P50S60 Picture Settings Cinema 9-29-13.docx 19k .docx file
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post #2 of 37 Old 09-30-2013, 09:25 AM
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You can calibrate custom...it has everything that you need. IIRC CMS only for the primaries. make sure to turn off the AGC and black corrector, as they are both on by default in custom.

You can calibrate cinema in the SM...the gamut should be decent after a good WB
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post #3 of 37 Old 09-30-2013, 09:42 AM
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Cinema will allow the colors to line up much better. Check my link for some charts done with HCFR. Should be no difference in black levels between custom/cinema that I noticed. Also stay away from High panel brightness if you want to avoid increased dithering/noise in dark scenes.

Sony 32" EX400 calibrated settings

Panasonic 50" S60 calibrated settings

HTPC/Sony S5100 to Sony HT-CT150 to Panasonic 55" VT60, Sony 32" EX400, Panasonic 50" S60

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post #4 of 37 Old 09-30-2013, 12:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdoostil View Post

You can calibrate custom...it has everything that you need. IIRC CMS only for the primaries. make sure to turn off the AGC and black corrector, as they are both on by default in custom.

You can calibrate cinema in the SM...the gamut should be decent after a good WB

is gamma non-linear in custom? because the S60 lacks 10-pt grayscale and 10-pt gamma controls

any reason for using the SM for Cinema? the 2013 models have 2-pt grayscale controls in Cinema and Custom (plus gamma presets and HSL CMS controls for red, green, and blue) all in the user menu

my current results are with an unprofiled C6 in plasma mode, but I'd say the gamut results with 2-pt grayscale and color/tint changes alone are excellent (all dE2000's under 1.5)

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Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

Cinema will allow the colors to line up much better. Check my link for some charts done with HCFR. Should be no difference in black levels between custom/cinema that I noticed. Also stay away from High panel brightness if you want to avoid increased dithering/noise in dark scenes.

any difference between PB Mid and Low in dithering/noise? how does gamma in Custom compare to gamma in Cinema?
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post #5 of 37 Old 09-30-2013, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

any difference between PB Mid and Low in dithering/noise? how does gamma in Custom compare to gamma in Cinema?

There is no noticeable difference between Mid or Low. I always just use Mid as have others on the 2013 series of Panny plasmas. I believe gamma shows a similair behavior to Cinema while in Custom, though as you probably know, the type and size of patterns always has an impact on what the measured gamma is.

Use 4% APL window patterns vs 4% window patterns, and the measured gamma will be different. My current Cinema calibration I used 10% window patterns from the GCD disc as well as the 100%/100% color patterns from the GCD disc and as you noticed using 2.4 gamma preset gives me a measured 2.2 gamma.

Sony 32" EX400 calibrated settings

Panasonic 50" S60 calibrated settings

HTPC/Sony S5100 to Sony HT-CT150 to Panasonic 55" VT60, Sony 32" EX400, Panasonic 50" S60

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post #6 of 37 Old 09-30-2013, 02:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

There is no noticeable difference between Mid or Low. I always just use Mid as have others on the 2013 series of Panny plasmas. I believe gamma shows a similair behavior to Cinema while in Custom, though as you probably know, the type and size of patterns always has an impact on what the measured gamma is.

Use 4% APL window patterns vs 4% window patterns, and the measured gamma will be different. My current Cinema calibration I used 10% window patterns from the GCD disc as well as the 100%/100% color patterns from the GCD disc and as you noticed using 2.4 gamma preset gives me a measured 2.2 gamma.

I used the 15% windows (non-APL) from the AVSHD709 disc.
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post #7 of 37 Old 09-30-2013, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

I used the 15% windows (non-APL) from the AVSHD709 disc.

Cool, I used those when I did my first few calibrations. (my set is now over 1500 hours at last check several weeks ago) I am currently using the 10% window GCD patterns primarily because with them I can also run the color checker patterns with HCFR. (currently zoyd has added color checker support for both the GCD and Mascior discs)

Sony 32" EX400 calibrated settings

Panasonic 50" S60 calibrated settings

HTPC/Sony S5100 to Sony HT-CT150 to Panasonic 55" VT60, Sony 32" EX400, Panasonic 50" S60

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post #8 of 37 Old 10-01-2013, 06:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

Cool, I used those when I did my first few calibrations. (my set is now over 1500 hours at last check several weeks ago) I am currently using the 10% window GCD patterns primarily because with them I can also run the color checker patterns with HCFR. (currently zoyd has added color checker support for both the GCD and Mascior discs)

is that the 10% (Standard) or 10% APL patterns?
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post #9 of 37 Old 10-01-2013, 08:00 AM
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Just the 10% standard window patterns. I have tried various APL patterns but don't like the way the results look with actual content and ended up going back to just the standard windows.

Sony 32" EX400 calibrated settings

Panasonic 50" S60 calibrated settings

HTPC/Sony S5100 to Sony HT-CT150 to Panasonic 55" VT60, Sony 32" EX400, Panasonic 50" S60

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post #10 of 37 Old 10-01-2013, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

Just the 10% standard window patterns. I have tried various APL patterns but don't like the way the results look with actual content and ended up going back to just the standard windows.

yeah, sometimes the simple/standard approach is best
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post #11 of 37 Old 10-02-2013, 01:25 PM
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I only have about 100 hours on my new Panasonic ZT 65". When installing I was surprised that the set was almost dead on in terms of calibration when using the Spears and Munsil Blu Ray calibration DVD. Never the less, after a couple more 100 hours I will call in a pro calibrator who has the right sensors to do the job right.
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post #12 of 37 Old 10-03-2013, 03:25 PM - Thread Starter
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does the CMS work right on these Panasonics? does it affect grayscale? and does it affect one level of saturation more than others (75% sat vs. 100% sat)? any tips in general for 2013 Panasonics?

so far I've left it alone since color/tint gets things very close to perfect and I was afraid using the CMS wrong would do more harm than good
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post #13 of 37 Old 10-03-2013, 03:27 PM - Thread Starter
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also, does anyone know about whether the MLL drops around the 250-300 hour mark on these sets (50" 2013 models)?
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post #14 of 37 Old 10-10-2013, 10:10 AM - Thread Starter
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what exactly does 1080p pixel direct do? I think I remember reading it should be off but what happens when it's on?
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post #15 of 37 Old 10-10-2013, 02:57 PM
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It's currently not useable IMO because it has built into it a very high level of sharpening. It is defeatable by changing the HDMI setting to Photos, but then you get a color gamut that is much harder if not impossible to get to Rec709 when calibrating.

It basically provides a pure RGB 4:4:4 signal which is really pointless currently with blu-rays since they are all YCBCR 4:2:0. It might be useful if you play alot of games or do some other type of work on a PC which can benefit from the RGB 4:4:4 signal.

more info if you want to learn yourself:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma_subsampling

Sony 32" EX400 calibrated settings

Panasonic 50" S60 calibrated settings

HTPC/Sony S5100 to Sony HT-CT150 to Panasonic 55" VT60, Sony 32" EX400, Panasonic 50" S60

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post #16 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 07:45 PM - Thread Starter
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I did a comparison of grayscale and gamut readings using various sized standard and APL window patterns. I used the CMD HD, GCD, AVSHD709, and S&M HD Benchmark 2nd Edition discs.











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post #17 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 07:47 PM - Thread Starter
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post #18 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 07:47 PM - Thread Starter
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post #19 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 07:47 PM - Thread Starter
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post #20 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 07:48 PM - Thread Starter
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MLL @ 100 hours (all-black screen): 0.0031 fL

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post #21 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 08:43 PM
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Not bad, my 50 inch ST60 only reads .0024

HTPC: I3 2100, Radeon 6950.
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post #22 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 08:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ttnuagmada View Post

Not bad, my 50 inch ST60 only reads .0024

How many hours does your set have and what meter do you use?

I find running the screen wipe before measuring MLL produces a lower number than measuring during grayscale runs where IR is present. It makes about a 0.001 fL difference.
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post #23 of 37 Old 10-12-2013, 09:51 PM
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That's because it may have a little image retention from the brighter test patterns that may raise a bit the mll reading.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

How many hours does your set have and what meter do you use?

I find running the screen wipe before measuring MLL produces a lower number than measuring during grayscale runs where IR is present. It makes about a 0.001 fL difference.

It's at 200 hours, and I'm using an i1D3. I plan on playing around with it later, I'll see if I can get something lower.

HTPC: I3 2100, Radeon 6950.
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post #25 of 37 Old 10-13-2013, 12:05 PM
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Hello good people does anyone have the calibration settings for the samsung pn60e530af
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post #26 of 37 Old 10-13-2013, 12:38 PM
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Hello good people does anyone have the calibration settings for the samsung pn60e530af
See this "sticky" topic from above:

'Sharing display menu settings?'
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1055906
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post #27 of 37 Old 10-13-2013, 03:35 PM
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That was a good read. I loved that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Blackburn 
Your perception is a tricky thing. You can easily fool yourself into thinking you have "good" adjustments... then you actually measure what you've done and find you are so wrong it's not even funny.
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Surprisingly, when a video display is accurately adjusted with instrumentation... our perception INSTANTLY recognizes the images as accurate... though we may have THOUGHT the non-instrumented adjustments looked great, it's only when you see the instrumented/calibrated images that you think "Oh, guess I wasn't doing as well as I thought." Perception is a funny thing.
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post #28 of 37 Old 10-18-2013, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
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post #29 of 37 Old 10-18-2013, 12:23 PM - Thread Starter
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post #30 of 37 Old 10-26-2013, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Comparison of Pattern Types in Cinema Mode (GCD used):










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Panasonic TC-P50S60 Picture Settings Cinema 10-21-13.docx 19k .docx file
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File Type: docx Panasonic TC-P50S60 Picture Settings Cinema 10-21-13.docx (18.8 KB, 29 views)
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