We're no longer supposed to calibrate to NTSC? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 4 Old 10-01-2013, 10:26 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
earwicker7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 98
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I'm considering a purchase of the 10001 TruVue eeColor Processor, and in a conversation with one of their reps, something has come up that seems a bit off to me... based on the background material from my Blu-ray Digital Video Essentials, I was under the impression that you were always supposed to calibrate your TV to NTSC. When I asked the rep if there were any things I needed to do in advance regarding calibration, he said, "If you can have the TV calibrated for sRGB color gamut and gamma of 2.2. The eeColor tables assume an sRGB color gamut and 2.2 gamma."

I replied, "I’m planning on using it for playing movies, so I’d want it calibrated to NTSC, not sRGB, correct? Is it able to do this?"

He responded, "You want sRGB as all blu-ray content, etc... is master for sRGB and all HDMI DTVs now use the sRGB color gamut. NTSC color gamut is rarely used today and most DTV do not support this gamut."

Is this something that has changed in the last few years? The last time I had my TV calibrated was probably four to five years ago.

My new TV is a Samsung PN60F8500, if that matters.
earwicker7 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 4 Old 10-01-2013, 10:50 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Rolls-Royce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Victorville, CA
Posts: 1,991
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
Liked: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by earwicker7 View Post

I'm considering a purchase of the 10001 TruVue eeColor Processor, and in a conversation with one of their reps, something has come up that seems a bit off to me... based on the background material from my Blu-ray Digital Video Essentials, I was under the impression that you were always supposed to calibrate your TV to NTSC. When I asked the rep if there were any things I needed to do in advance regarding calibration, he said, "If you can have the TV calibrated for sRGB color gamut and gamma of 2.2. The eeColor tables assume an sRGB color gamut and 2.2 gamma."

I replied, "I’m planning on using it for playing movies, so I’d want it calibrated to NTSC, not sRGB, correct? Is it able to do this?"

He responded, "You want sRGB as all blu-ray content, etc... is master for sRGB and all HDMI DTVs now use the sRGB color gamut. NTSC color gamut is rarely used today and most DTV do not support this gamut."

Is this something that has changed in the last few years? The last time I had my TV calibrated was probably four to five years ago.

My new TV is a Samsung PN60F8500, if that matters.

Probably the vast majority of HD telecined content available today was mastered using Rec709, which is similar to sRGB (primaries are essentially the same, but their gamma curves are a bit different even though they both target 2.2). DVE does talk about NTSC, but in a historical context. HDTV calls for the ATSC standard. Now, if by NTSC you mean SD, that's Rec601, which has different primaries. If you're calibrating to watch broadcast or Blu-Ray HD, I'd go with Rec709.

I think the rep was trying to steer you into calibrating to sRGB because that's what their presets (according to him) are set up for. If you can-and are planning to-load new custom LUTs into the box, then it's a moot point. You can calibrate initially to whatever colorspace you like and build the custom LUT for that.

...Royce...

"I never drink...wine."
Bela Lugosi, DRACULA, 1931
Rolls-Royce is offline  
post #3 of 4 Old 10-01-2013, 12:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
sotti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,585
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 164
sRGB primaries and white point are exactly the same as Rec.709

Rec.709 does not include any recommendation for gamma.
sRGB does have a specific gamma formula, which is similar to a gamma of 2.2, but in no way is gamma 2.2

NTSC color gamut from the 50's was huge and never really used.
rec.601 was I believed first established in 1982 and used all the way up to the transition to HD.
rec.709 is what all HD content should be mastered to.

So sRGB with a gamma of 2.2 is exactly the same thing as rec.709 with a gamma of 2.2, they are entirely interchangeable. That would also be my default recommendation for calibration targets.
spacediver likes this.

Joel Barsotti
SpectraCal
CalMAN Lead Developer
sotti is offline  
post #4 of 4 Old 10-02-2013, 06:16 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Doug Blackburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Francisco - East Bay area
Posts: 3,453
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked: 207
Another issue that makes special calibration for SD necessary is that more and more products are correctly translating color when they upconvert SD to HD. And even when the color conversion isn't done at all, the difference between SD and HD isn't so huge that there's a huge problem.

Bottom line... these days we mostly completely ignore NTSC because it no longer exists. NTSC was an analog video system and analog video no longer exists unless you still own some old consumer product and software that uses the NTSC system. Frankly, it's not much fun watching SD sources on HD video displays... not even laserdisc looks very good when displayed at high resolution on a large screen.

"Movies is magic..." Van Dyke Parks
THX Certified Professional Video Calibration
ISF -- HAA -- www.dBtheatrical.com
Widescreen Review -- Home Theater & Sound
Doug Blackburn is offline  
Reply Display Calibration

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off