Jeti 1201 test results - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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Old 12-12-2013, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spacediver View Post

what does "pp" mean?

I was ready to ask the same question. smile.gif

Zoyd, do you have more data to show us?

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Old 12-12-2013, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

I was ready to ask the same question. smile.gif

Zoyd, do you have more data to show us?

sure, what do you want to see?

pp= peak-to-peak
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

I was ready to ask the same question. smile.gif

Zoyd, do you have more data to show us?

sure, what do you want to see?

pp= peak-to-peak

WRGB patch measurements @ Continuous mode

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Old 12-12-2013, 03:19 PM
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

Which continuous mode, LiVal or HCFR? I just installed LiVal so I'm not that familiar with it.

Whatever is easier for you.

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Old 12-12-2013, 03:40 PM
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

Just did 16 for each patch, 100% stim.


Thanks for that, clearly, AutoSync was the key for Plasma measurements wink.gif

What was your meter distance from the display?

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Old 12-12-2013, 03:49 PM
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:07 PM
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:29 PM
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Nice, for comparison, here are the phosphor SPDs of my FW900:

(from top to bottom, R G B)

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Old 12-12-2013, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

Thanks for that, clearly, AutoSync was the key for Plasma measurements wink.gif

What was your meter distance from the display?

Your not kidding....what a difference in repeatability!
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1forsnow View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

Thanks for that, clearly, AutoSync was the key for Plasma measurements wink.gif

What was your meter distance from the display?

Your not kidding....what a difference in repeatability!

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1504738/jeti-1201-test-results#post_24066939

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Old 12-12-2013, 05:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Chad is absolutely right about this. The 1211 does not suffer from this problem. I, too, suggested to JETI that the problem was based on a lack of refresh rate detection and synchronization. I was led to this belief by the fact that the 1201 problem did not appear at all on either LED displays or front projectors. This is exactly what I saw a couple of years ago when we were first building support for the 1211 prior to implementing sync support. However, JETI seems fairly confident that the problem is a S/N ratio issue.

You can test if syncing helps on the 1201 by using HCFR. Graeme has coded a refresh measurement function for this.
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Old 12-12-2013, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

You can test if syncing helps on the 1201 by using HCFR. Graeme has coded a refresh measurement function for this.
Is there a new build for this? I don't see a sync option.

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Old 12-12-2013, 08:02 PM
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This thread actully highlights an issue with calibration, especially for many Pro's and DIY/enthusiasts alike.

Methods.

Just so you are aware, apart from being an isf calibrator by night, In my day job I build research measurement systems using dataloggers with control and measurement peripherals and sensors. The current and last couple of installs are in the 1/4 to 1/2 million dollar cost range and envolve UV-vis spectrometers plus many sensors.

The common aspect to both research and calibration with respect to video, is signals, more importantly electrical signals where light is converted to electrical. This touchs upon what Steffen aludes to with respect to; electrical noise.This is the bain of highly sensitive equipment in research but is also an issue for video calibration.

Users of video equipment(Pro's and enthusiasts) ignore plugs and cables and "stuff" that can possibly interfere with measurements. Home environments can be a horror story for electrical noise, plasmas are particulary bad. Look behind any home audio and display setup and you will find a web of wires, although ironically a web of wire can have less noise than neatly coiled wire. Then there is the devices themselves, usually they have passed electrical noise tests, then again we connect directly to them to do auto calibration or just connected through the power supply. Then you are at the mercy of your earths.

Methods, the reason for methods. In reasearch is so that results can be duplicated and varified. This is the point of NIST, a way to trace back to a known fixed point that all reference too.
Sally, I'm absolutely sure Steffen took this very seriously and is the reason many tests and hoops need to be done to be sure of the cause and effect. Syncing may resolve one issue, noise is still a problem when you deal with high level highly sensitive equipment.

Methods are not just proceedures, but tools aswell. buying the right tool is actually part of good method, I studied the 1201 and 1211 with respect to Jeti's data. The 1201 was designed for a purpose alone, theatre and broad cast, but not really domestic work even though it became popular early on (as the Sp100 in the US). The 1211 was designed around the bread and butter of video measurements and so has shifted sensitivities and features that suit domestic displays as well as the proffesional market, Abeit a cost penalty with respect to the 1201. So I can see why the 1201 and a Klein K10 would seem a good match, but the 1211 is the better choice for general video work, even with possible software sync options that may help.

A bit of advice for those looking at high end equipment, seek advice first, talk to as many as you can and make an informed purchase, the cost is high if you make a mistake.



I still feel calibration methods mostly are very loose which can lead people into heated discussions about a whole lot of nothing. In research more time can be spent in discussions about proceedures and methods than the study itself, if you don't you get every man and his dog jumping on you pulling you up. Oh btw, if people start discussing stats some caution needs to be exercised with the use of excel as it can cause errors itself. This is because it rounds beyond 16 places, if you numbers have less digits than 16 it is ok. Just watch out for large data pools and extensive calculations like polynomials.
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Old 12-12-2013, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

You can test if syncing helps on the 1201 by using HCFR. Graeme has coded a refresh measurement function for this.
Is there a new build for this? I don't see a sync option.

If you choose refresh mode display and press calibrate, you will be asked to display an 80% pattern for syncing, 3.1+
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Old 12-12-2013, 08:19 PM
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It may be advisable to take readings from further away from the display. I believe I read on Jeti's website when I was researching my meter purchase that it should be 1.5 times farther back than the height of the screen. I try to keep about 3 feet away at a minimum, and when there is total light control I often take it much further back. It has an incredibly tight field of view.
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Old 12-12-2013, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

If you choose refresh mode display and press calibrate, you will be asked to display an 80% pattern for syncing, 3.1+
Display Type is grayed out. This is 3.1.0.4.


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Old 12-12-2013, 11:17 PM
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Old 12-13-2013, 12:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

Interesting, that field is available on the 1211 but its the first that I've had to test.
That's because the 1211 currently supports sync. The 1201 does not.

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Old 12-13-2013, 12:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank's to everyone for keeping this thread informative. smile.gif

With the first 1201 I received (xxxx36), I did do what you guys are suggesting. Yes Chad I agree about keeping the Jeti about 3+ feet back, in a very light controlled room.

Yes I did talk to as many insider's as I could before buying. I guess because of the great results I have with the K10-A and to a lessor degree with the I1Pro 2, I took the advise of the minority.

Smokey Joe.
I think Steffen probably did start to take this issue with the 1201 seriously when I had completed all of what was asked of me and Tom's test's were about the same as mine. However he became as frustrated as I was and his partner had to step into this. That's when they agreed to send me the 2nd 1201. The "extra" test on the 2nd 1201 that Steffen did showed a High of 6390 and Low of 6367 x value for red.

ss
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Old 12-13-2013, 02:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by <^..^>Smokey Joe View Post

Users of video equipment(Pro's and enthusiasts) ignore plugs and cables and "stuff" that can possibly interfere with measurements.

USB_Cable_01.png

USB_Cable_02.png

This a DIY Quick Test I have performed by comparing my i1PRO2 Spectro operating using i1PRO2 Stock USB Cable vs. an Expensive one.
(measurements taken @ 2012)

I used LightSpace CMS Measure & Log feature to export the measurements to excel file.

I used an Eizo FlexScan L550 PC Monitor, very stable monitor, that was displaying a Full Field 100% White Pattern for 1 hour already before any measurement.

I used both USB Cables from the same Notebook USB Connector, and fully restarted the Notebook after each cable changing.

The differencies are not visible for our eyes, but they exist, I have to repeat the same test many times to confirm these measurements, If I will do this again I will keep you informed.

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Old 12-13-2013, 05:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

That's because the 1211 currently supports sync. The 1201 does not.

Yes, thanks, you are the first to run a 1201 with HCFR. I checked the code and the minimum integration time for the 1201 is 3 times longer than the 1211. It looks like the sensor is run at 77 ms (~13 Hz), whereas the 1211 is 39 Hz. For comparison the i1D3 minimum integration time is 200 ms (5 Hz) and it does support a refresh rate calculation.

btw, you can still see if it's sync related if you find that 50% patterns are more stable than 100%
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Old 12-15-2013, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

This a DIY Quick Test I have performed by comparing my i1PRO2 Spectro operating using i1PRO2 Stock USB Cable vs. an Expensive one.

Yep, I've notices that my i1pro2 is much more sensitive to the cable and connections that all my i1pro Rev A-D's.

Sometimes is goes through the motions of doing a reflective measurement and produces garbage results.

As an electronics engineer, I can't help but think "they should have better power regulators in the instrument...."
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Old 12-15-2013, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

You can test if syncing helps on the 1201 by using HCFR. Graeme has coded a refresh measurement function for this.

Nope, I was informed that the 1201 doesn't support refresh. I went to some trouble to make sure the driver doesn't claim it does...
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Old 12-16-2013, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwgill View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

This a DIY Quick Test I have performed by comparing my i1PRO2 Spectro operating using i1PRO2 Stock USB Cable vs. an Expensive one.

Yep, I've notices that my i1pro2 is much more sensitive to the cable and connections that all my i1pro Rev A-D's.

Sometimes is goes through the motions of doing a reflective measurement and produces garbage results.

As an electronics engineer, I can't help but think "they should have better power regulators in the instrument...."

i1PRO = Made in Switzerland...
i1PRO2 = Made in China...

Did you see quality degration of the electronics inside the meter?

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Old 12-16-2013, 04:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post


i1PRO = Made in Switzerland...
i1PRO2 = Made in China...

Did you see quality degration of the electronics inside the meter?

I haven't pulled the '2 apart, although I've had a look at one of my Rev A's. Since it's designed by X-Rite (designed in Switzerland ?), I'm not sure I'd blame such problems on the assembly, even if it is done in China.
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:06 AM
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Since the problem with the 1201 is synching with plasma and other pulse type displays, does the i1pro2 have the similar issue?

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Old 12-16-2013, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
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Since the problem with the 1201 is synching with plasma and other pulse type displays, does the i1pro2 have the similar issue?

What other pulse type displays does the jeti have problems with?

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Old 12-16-2013, 07:42 AM
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Could be CRT... When I got my 1211, before CalMAN added the sync options in the 1211 setup menu, I had huge repeatability problems with a Pioneer CRT RPTV.

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