Official calibration of the Vizio P series - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 08:12 AM - Thread Starter
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@Ph8te I will add the video when I get home. Good call.

@buzzard767 I did my calibration with 75/75 so hopefully just a few more hours of tweaking should get a satisfying picture. Earlier you stated that be gentle with the hue adjustment on red and blue as this can cause the colors to deviate. When I did my cslibration I made sure not to go over -2 on hue and use saturation to to lower the Delta. One reason my delta is so high on red is the luminance is around +2. Lowering this value by using brightness actually makes the delta higher bc I did not want to adjust the hue to compensate for the mismatch between red and blue. With this red hue problem does going to positive numbers make it worse or negative numbers? I found yesterday I can get a fairly low delta by using a hue of -7 but following your advise I decided that was too much of a hue adjustment. As soon as I can today I will post my numbers and graphs. Hopefully someone can take a look and let me know what I can sacrifice in order to get the most accurate picture possible out of these sets.
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post #62 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Googer View Post
I agree; there's no way a GeekSquad calibrator that got an hour-long crash course in calibrating is going to know the ins-and-outs of getting good results out of these TV's. Heck, unless they've been reading the discussions on calibrating these sets here, even a highly experienced calibrator likely wouldn't unless they put a really significant amount of time into checking real content and / or at least use additional patterns that likely aren't considered part of their normal workflow (yet? ). I believe the absolute best of the best calibrators do actually do that already but even if they notice issues with real content after a 'normal' calibration pass, they may not have the time needed (again, unless they've been reading here) to know how to work with the set's controls to bring out its best (which of course is the point of calibrating in the first place )...

Viewing reference content is the last step in all calibration workflows. It "proves" the calibration even more than the graphs.
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post #63 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 08:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by pisymbol View Post
Yeah, that is some good numbers.

I did 1.59 avg dE w/max of 3.8 (Orange-friggin-yellow). I could have gone lower on the dE avg but then as you noticed, the colors don't track as well.

The above was a compromise after HOURS AND HOURS (I mean like 8+ hours over 2-3 nights) playing with it. Suffice it to say, unless someone sees something awful about my numbers, I'm leaving them! (I actually just updated my grayscale and got it down to an avg dE of 0.4! Updated picture on post).
Your numbers look pretty good across the board. I noticed that after I did my color calibration I needed to rerun my grey scale also so good call on that. I did that and made it in about the same delta as you. When I went back to color I reran that and it seemed to help line up my colors a tiny bit better. I'm kinda jealous you got your colors to track so well haha. Guess that's the price you pay for wanting a 70" screen. I have even had a problem getting the cyan to come in at a low delta for some reason and I see you did not. I spent at least 5 hours yesterday tweaking and getting things close. I will prob spend about the same tonight and then post my report. Wish me luck haha.
Also my orange yellow is a delta of 1.2 but my yellow is a delta of around 3. I think you are better with a high delta orange yellow rather than pure yellow. Just something else I want to try and tweak out. I have to say though learning all of this has been rather fun. Very very frustrating at times but as you begin to see everything come together it's rather rewarding.

Last edited by superkyle; 10-22-2014 at 08:27 AM.
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post #64 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post
Actually, that's a very bad option for two reasons. First, do a Google search re: BB calibrations and you'll find a ton of bad news. Secondly, the VA panels have a serious problem with Red and in all likelihood the BB calibrators aren't going to know a thing about it.
I agree; there's no way a GeekSquad calibrator that got an hour-long crash course in calibrating is going to know the ins-and-outs of getting good results out of these TV's. Heck, unless they've been reading the discussions on calibrating these sets here, even a highly experienced calibrator likely wouldn't unless they put a really significant amount of time into checking real content and / or at least use additional patterns that likely aren't considered part of their normal workflow (yet? ). I believe the absolute best of the best calibrators do actually do that already but even if they notice issues with real content after a 'normal' calibration pass, they may not have the time needed (again, unless they've been reading here) to know how to work with the set's controls to bring out its best (which of course is the point of calibrating in the first place )...
By any chance is anyone here from the Sacramento, ca area?
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post #65 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 10:11 AM
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Fleshtone reference

I use Color Girl # 2 for my primary Caucasian flesh reference. She's pale with just a hint of blush. AVS won't let me load the MKV *zip file so if you'd like to see it PM me with your email address and I'll send it to you.

I won't be around until late this afternoon....

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post #66 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 10:22 AM
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A question for those that calibrated a P-series, especially the 70 inch. When the TV is set to the widest gamut does the color space extend out as far as DCI-P3? It looks like that wider colorspace will be used, or at least an option, with the upcoming Blu-ray UHD discs.

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post #67 of 1975 Old 10-22-2014, 03:01 PM - Thread Starter
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P702ui-B2, FW 1.0.0, HCFR 3.0.6, X-Rite i1D3 Retail.

BT.1886, Gamma 2.22, Day Viewing at 45fTL.

Calibration was done with FALD off. Started in Calibrated Picture Mode.

All Picture Mode settings are turned off except for Game Low Latency.

Backlight 30
Brightness 50
Contrast 51
Color 50
Tint 0
Sharpness 50 ( can really be anything I don't see a change by adjusting sharpness)

In advanced Picture set the Gamma value to 2.2.
Note that this is for those of you that watch in a lit environment. These settings are not ideal for those who watch with no ambient light.

11 Point White Balance
5% 0 0 0
10% -6 -4 -7
20% -18 -14 -12
30% -23 -16 -18
40% -30 -23 -23
50% -30 -25 -24
60% -29 -28 -24
70% -34 -24 -25
80% -28 -21 -24
90% -26 -16 -15
100% -10 0 2
Updated to eliminate sunburn....
Color Tuner
Hue (4,8,1,1,1,-1)
Saturation (5,21,11,34,21,9)
Brightness (11,4,7,6,4,2)
Offset(3,-1,-4)
Gain(-16,0,-15)

If you plan to view the set in a mainly dark environment. Use the same settings in the calibrated dark setting.
Set the backlight to meet your viewing requirements however it must be noted that even using s backlight of 100 it is still fairly dim.
Under advanced picture turn smooth nothing to medium and clear action on. Also make sure GLL is on. Lastly set the gamma value to 2.4 and that should do it. I will run the calibration tonight to ensure that this does not mess up anything as far as the accuracy of the picture.

Attached below are the rest of my numbers.
I will update with more information once i get some more free time.
I am aware that the red saturation sweep shows a large delta however this was needed in order to remove the sunburn look from peoples faces. If you have any pressing questions that cant wait until I write out a step by step guide feel free to ask me.
Special thanks goes out to everyone that has helped me get to this point. Sorry for so many questions Time to finally sit back and enjoy the TV!!!!! If anyone sees any thing that stands out that I may have done wrong feel free to let me know as I want to make sure everything was preformed properly.
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post #68 of 1975 Old 10-24-2014, 05:25 AM
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Your numbers look pretty good across the board. I noticed that after I did my color calibration I needed to rerun my grey scale also so good call on that. I did that and made it in about the same delta as you. When I went back to color I reran that and it seemed to help line up my colors a tiny bit better. I'm kinda jealous you got your colors to track so well haha. Guess that's the price you pay for wanting a 70" screen. I have even had a problem getting the cyan to come in at a low delta for some reason and I see you did not. I spent at least 5 hours yesterday tweaking and getting things close. I will prob spend about the same tonight and then post my report. Wish me luck haha.
Also my orange yellow is a delta of 1.2 but my yellow is a delta of around 3. I think you are better with a high delta orange yellow rather than pure yellow. Just something else I want to try and tweak out. I have to say though learning all of this has been rather fun. Very very frustrating at times but as you begin to see everything come together it's rather rewarding.
No worries. Like I said, I spent hours upon hours calibrating this set as well as reading both Googer and buzz's excellent comments (and getting some explanations about HCFR specifics from the kind gentlemen over in that thread).

They are 100% correct though that without looking at reference material, in the end the numbers don't mean much. Put the meter down and watch something. How does it look?

I think at some point I will try to use the Calibrated Dark just to compare vs mine, though I must say, so far with high quality b-ray movies, it looks great.
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post #69 of 1975 Old 10-24-2014, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by pisymbol View Post
No worries. Like I said, I spent hours upon hours calibrating this set as well as reading both Googer and buzz's excellent comments (and getting some explanations about HCFR specifics from the kind gentlemen over in that thread).

They are 100% correct though that without looking at reference material, in the end the numbers don't mean much. Put the meter down and watch something. How does it look?

I think at some point I will try to use the Calibrated Dark just to compare vs mine, though I must say, so far with high quality b-ray movies, it looks great.
I started to give it a try yesterday but all of the oddities Buzz speaks of begin to happen. Apparently only calibrated dark on my set causes the large push toward blue you turn dimming zones on at 100%. The even more odd thing is I can adjust the blue 100% setting under the 11 point grey scale menu and the numbers don't change at all. Not to mention I am only getting 20 ftL output at 100% calibrating with clear action on and dimming enabled to calibrate the 100% blue push. I would like to stay around 30. I'll be busy this weekend so I won't have time to try it out again but possibly easy next week I can spend a day trying to tame it. I'll let you know if I find out anything that would be of use.
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post #70 of 1975 Old 10-24-2014, 12:00 PM
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I started to give it a try yesterday but all of the oddities Buzz speaks of begin to happen. Apparently only calibrated dark on my set causes the large push toward blue you turn dimming zones on at 100%. The even more odd thing is I can adjust the blue 100% setting under the 11 point grey scale menu and the numbers don't change at all. Not to mention I am only getting 20 ftL output at 100% calibrating with clear action on and dimming enabled to calibrate the 100% blue push. I would like to stay around 30. I'll be busy this weekend so I won't have time to try it out again but possibly easy next week I can spend a day trying to tame it. I'll let you know if I find out anything that would be of use.
Standard has so far yielded NONE of the errors people are reporting with Calibrated Dark.

With that said, I run bare bones - CA/SME are both off. I only use Game Low Latency and FALD.

Perhaps that is not completely optimal for movie going, but it seems to work very well for my setup.

If you are only getting 20ftL on CDark, I would avoid that setting then. That is way too low (for my tastes at least).
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post #71 of 1975 Old 10-25-2014, 10:13 AM
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Standard has so far yielded NONE of the errors people are reporting with Calibrated Dark.

With that said, I run bare bones - CA/SME are both off. I only use Game Low Latency and FALD.

Perhaps that is not completely optimal for movie going, but it seems to work very well for my setup.

If you are only getting 20ftL on CDark, I would avoid that setting then. That is way too low (for my tastes at least).
Correct, the calibration quirks with grayscale only apply to Calibrated Dark - other modes are much more straightforward. :-)

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post #72 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 03:10 AM
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Daytime settings

Quote:
Originally Posted by pisymbol View Post
P502ui-B1, FW 1.0.1, HCFR 3.0.6, X-Rite i1D3 Retail.

BT.1886, Gamma 2.22, Night Viewing at 35fTL.

Calibration was done with FALD off. Started in Standard Picture Mode.

All Picture Mode settings are turned off except for Game Low Latency.

Backlight 19
Brightness 50
Contrast 48
Color 50
Tint 0
Sharpness 0

11 Point White Balance
5% -4 -5 3
10% -4 -4 10
20% -21 -17 -9
30% -14 -17 -15
40% -4 -11 -16
50% -3 -8 -9
60% -3 -7 -8
70% -8 -6 -5
80% -11 -11 -6
90% -16 -13 -10
100% -7 0 -9
Just tried these out and they look great on my 50" P. What are your daytime settings or higher ambient settings?

Thanks so much to everyone for putting up some base numbers. They help get us to a much better starting point than factory.

matthayslett.com
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post #73 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 03:47 PM
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Just tried these out and they look great on my 50" P. What are your daytime settings or higher ambient settings?

Thanks so much to everyone for putting up some base numbers. They help get us to a much better starting point than factory.
I'm still deciding on whether to go with one Matt. The issue is I watch almost all of my TV at night.

I do have a Day Setting (50+ ftL) but I'm still toying with it.
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post #74 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 04:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Matt Ryan Hayslett View Post
Just tried these out and they look great on my 50" P. What are your daytime settings or higher ambient settings?

Thanks so much to everyone for putting up some base numbers. They help get us to a much better starting point than factory.
Since he used a gamma value of 2.22 you should be able to simply up the backlight and get great day time results without messing with the calibration any. Also since you are copying settings it is likely your not nearly as accurate as you could be. So even if it does play with the calibration a little you won't notice.
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post #75 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 04:18 PM - Thread Starter
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@pisymbol did you ever attempt a calibration using calibrated dark? If so I'm wondering what level of brightness you achieved? Also it is worth noting that when I attempted to do the calibration under calibrated dark you will see the blue push at 100% so watch out for that. Also if you turn clear action on and off you will see it alters your grey scale and color which I didn't think it would. So I recommend doing the calibration with clear action turned on and making sure you use the 100% workaround buzz stated earlier.
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post #76 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Googer View Post
I agree; there's no way a GeekSquad calibrator that got an hour-long crash course in calibrating is going to know the ins-and-outs of getting good results out of these TV's. Heck, unless they've been reading the discussions on calibrating these sets here, even a highly experienced calibrator likely wouldn't unless they put a really significant amount of time into checking real content and / or at least use additional patterns that likely aren't considered part of their normal workflow (yet? ). I believe the absolute best of the best calibrators do actually do that already but even if they notice issues with real content after a 'normal' calibration pass, they may not have the time needed (again, unless they've been reading here) to know how to work with the set's controls to bring out its best (which of course is the point of calibrating in the first place )...
Actually GeekSquad is ISF certified. They use pretty much the same software and hardware that most ISF/THX calibrators use.

One of the keys to a good calibration is knowing the display you are working on. The only way is to practice on that display (trail and error), more time than most pro calibrators are willing to spend.

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post #77 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 06:57 PM
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Actually GeekSquad is ISF certified. They use pretty much the same software and hardware that most ISF/THX calibrators use.

Uh, no.


I would not trust BB to do your calibration. If you want to hire someone, that's fine. But ask the ISF or the general forums members and find a dedicated pro in your area.
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post #78 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 06:59 PM
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@pisymbol did you ever attempt a calibration using calibrated dark? If so I'm wondering what level of brightness you achieved? Also it is worth noting that when I attempted to do the calibration under calibrated dark you will see the blue push at 100% so watch out for that. Also if you turn clear action on and off you will see it alters your grey scale and color which I didn't think it would. So I recommend doing the calibration with clear action turned on and making sure you use the 100% workaround buzz stated earlier.
I have not yet. Too busy, but I WILL get to it!
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post #79 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 08:03 PM
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Since he used a gamma value of 2.22 you should be able to simply up the backlight and get great day time results without messing with the calibration any. Also since you are copying settings it is likely your not nearly as accurate as you could be. So even if it does play with the calibration a little you won't notice.
I shoot commercials, music videos, and other video content for a living so I understand calibration accuracy and panel variation. Until I get a scope or meter I just needed a starting place because the standard settings are off. I'm not using this for color correction so getting it close is good enough for me and should be for everyone else. You will never get a consumer display 100% accurate, but I'm sure you all know that.

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post #80 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 08:13 PM - Thread Starter
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I shoot commercials, music videos, and other video content for a living so I understand calibration accuracy and panel variation. Until I get a scope or meter I just needed a starting place because the standard settings are off. I'm not using this for color correction so getting it close is good enough for me and should be for everyone else. You will never get a consumer display 100% accurate, but I'm sure you all know that.
No of course not. And if you take a look at mine and others as well the colors still have slight variations even more so the red. But it's a sacrifice you have to make with these panels as faces will appear sunburnt if you try and line up the colors perfectly. When I get time I plan to do a write up on this forum for a step by step process for how to calibrate both the calibrated dark and the rest of the picture options. So if you plan to get a meter yourself hopefully I can take out some of the steep learning curve with this tv.
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No of course not. And if you take a look at mine and others as well the colors still have slight variations even more so the red. But it's a sacrifice you have to make with these panels as faces will appear sunburnt if you try and line up the colors perfectly. When I get time I plan to do a write up on this forum for a step by step process for how to calibrate both the calibrated dark and the rest of the picture options. So if you plan to get a meter yourself hopefully I can take out some of the steep learning curve with this tv.
I own a Spyder Pro 3, but not sure how well it will work with this tv. What are your thoughts? I calibrate my desktop setup and macbook pro weekly since I do color correction as well, so I'm no stranger to calibrating. I just have always had a hard time using the same devices on a tv and getting accurate settings.

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post #82 of 1975 Old 10-26-2014, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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I own a Spyder Pro 3, but not sure how well it will work with this tv. What are your thoughts? I calibrate my desktop setup and macbook pro weekly since I do color correction as well, so I'm no stranger to calibrating. I just have always had a hard time using the same devices on a tv and getting accurate settings.
I personally have never used anything other than the 1id3 meter. For the price it's hard to beat its accuracy and functionality. I have read several things about the spyders though. From what I have read you should have no problem using the meter for the tv. im sure you already know but the better the meter the better the calibration however. The process should still be the exact same however since I think but I may be wrong HCFR supports that meter.
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post #83 of 1975 Old 10-27-2014, 05:15 PM
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Uh, no.


I would not trust BB to do your calibration. If you want to hire someone, that's fine. But ask the ISF or the general forums members and find a dedicated pro in your area.
You misunderstood me (easy to do), all I was saying is the GeekSquad is ISF certified. My point is just because a "Pro" calibrator is "certified", that means very little.

I have no need for a "Pro" calibrator. I do my own very large calibrations (3DLUT), setting about 10,000 color points of correction when profiled.
Most calibrators use only 16 points of color corrections, including the GeekSquad. And use the same non reference meters.

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post #84 of 1975 Old 10-27-2014, 07:07 PM
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You misunderstood me (easy to do), all I was saying is the GeekSquad is ISF certified. My point is just because a "Pro" calibrator is "certified", that means very little.

I have no need for a "Pro" calibrator. I do my own very large calibrations (3DLUT), setting about 10,000 color points of correction when profiled.
Most calibrators use only 16 points of color corrections, including the GeekSquad. And use the same non reference meters.

ss
Ah. All good points. Agreed.
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post #85 of 1975 Old 10-28-2014, 04:00 AM
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Do the P-series UHDTVs have a service menu that can be accessed for additional settings? If so what's the remote's sequence to access the service menu?

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post #86 of 1975 Old 10-28-2014, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok I have a question for some of the other owners. I'm looking into buying a square trade warranty for my tv. 3 years should be enough and Costco seems to have the best deal. Is there an issue buying this since I bought the tv from Amazon? Would you guys recommend buying the square trade? Also since I got the tv from Amazon does the square trade add 3 years to the warranty such that the first year is vizio and 2nd-4th is Costco? Or does it double the first year such that vizio and costco will cover it the first year and costco will last until year 3 at that point the warranty ends.
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post #87 of 1975 Old 10-28-2014, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superkyle View Post
Ok I have a question for some of the other owners. I'm looking into buying a square trade warranty for my tv. 3 years should be enough and Costco seems to have the best deal. Is there an issue buying this since I bought the tv from Amazon? Would you guys recommend buying the square trade? Also since I got the tv from Amazon does the square trade add 3 years to the warranty such that the first year is vizio and 2nd-4th is Costco? Or does it double the first year such that vizio and costco will cover it the first year and costco will last until year 3 at that point the warranty ends.

Costco has nothing to do with it if you don't buy directly from Costco. The ST from Costco is one of the best deals going and recommended for most that want an extended warranty. I believe the ST starts when the manufacturer's ends.


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post #88 of 1975 Old 10-28-2014, 11:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post
Costco has nothing to do with it if you don't buy directly from Costco. The ST from Costco is one of the best deals going and recommended for most that want an extended warranty. I believe the ST starts when the manufacturer's ends.


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Ok so with Costco are you saying that the tv must be purchased from Costco in order to use their ST?
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post #89 of 1975 Old 10-28-2014, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by superkyle View Post
Ok so with Costco are you saying that the tv must be purchased from Costco in order to use their ST?

No what u am saying is that with TVs bought from Costco there is an extra year added to the warranty that is covered by Costco. Anyone can purchase the warranty, if you purchase it from somewhere else however the warranty starts after the manufacturer's ends. That is the only real difference.


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post #90 of 1975 Old 10-31-2014, 12:20 AM
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Can any of you post some pictures of full red content on the p50, 60, or 70 post calibration? I ended up getting a P60 on a stupidly good deal a few days ago but have been completely unable to calibrate out the piss poor orange tint in reds. I realize that they aren't going to be perfect but I have used my own calibrations(i1 display pro + calman 5) as well as every other one posted here and reds are just terrible no matter what I do. What I am trying to figure out is if what I am seeing is what others are seeing too in regards to reds. I am desperately trying to convince myself that I just have a bad panel because as it is, I will not keep this set.
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