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post #1 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 07:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Official calibration of the Vizio P series

In this thread you will find a guided solution to how to properly calibrate the vizio P series tvs. In an effort to keep things clean and tidy please limit all talk to calibration information only. When posting the calibration workflow it would be really helpful if you identify which tv you are calibrating. Also I am going to reserve a few spots on the first page to link all of the calibration workflows such that they are easy to find.

If you have come across this thread by mistake and are looking for technical questions about the P series and not calibration help please refer to the link to the P series thread: ***Official 2014 Vizio P Series Owner's Thread
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Last edited by superkyle; 10-18-2014 at 07:40 AM.
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post #2 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 07:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Please test all calibrations to find the set that looks the best to you. Enjoy!!!!

Calibration settings for P702-ui:
- Firmware version 1.2.23-UHD:
Googer P70 calibration - Night Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Googer P70 calibration - Day Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Superkyle P70 calibration - Night Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Mavinwow P70 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series

Calibration settings for P652-ui:
- Firmware version 1.2.23-UHD:
beardontwalk123 P65 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Mike-SC P65 Calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series



Calibration settings for P702-ui:
-Firmware version 1.1.14:
Googer P70 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Superkyle P70 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Fafrd P70 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series
Firmware 1.0.4.1:
Googer P70 calibration for a friends Tv - Official calibration of the Vizio P series

Calibration settings for P652ui-B2:
-Firmware version 1.1.14 no changes to firmware 1.0.0:

Farrow099 P65 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series

Calibration settings for P602ui-B3:
Firmware 1.1.14:

No settings found
Firmware 1.0.0:
Still looking for Buzz's settings

Calibration settings for P552ui-B2:
Firmware 1.1.16:

No settings updated
Firmware 1.0.0:
Buzzard767 calibration settings and other information - ***Official 2014 Vizio P Series Owner's Thread

Calibration settings for the P502ui-B1 120hz version:
Firmware 1.1.16:

No settings have been updated yet
Firmware 1.0.0:
pisymbol P50 calibration - Official calibration of the Vizio P series

Various information provided by Buzzard comparing the P602ui-B3 to a 65VT60 and F8500 as well as grey scale and more!

Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post
Calibrations of various panels:

P60 side by side with the Panasonic 65VT60 plasma here
P60 side by side with the Samsung F8500 plasma - here and here
P60 side by side with a Samsung 55F8000 - here and here
P60 (maybe P70) easy setup to alleviate reddish flesh tones here
P60 Grayscale Calibration Workflow - here
P60 input lag when the signal is processed through an eeColor Processor - here No increased lag.
P60 Native Contrast - here
The strange thin vertical line on the right edge of the screen - here.







3D LUT Calibration and how it compares to internal controls only
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post #3 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 07:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Reserved for downloadable tools needed to complete the calibration as well as information for beginners.

Calibration for dummies: http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457

i1 display pro (good introductory meter): http://www.amazon.com/X-Rite-EODIS3-...+i1display+pro
C3 calman 5 bundle: http://www.amazon.com/SpectraCal-Mon...s=specracal+c3
HCFR info and download links: http://www.homecinema-fr.com/colorim...fr-colormeter/
Masciors calibration disc: Mascior's Calibration Disc
AVSHD 709 pattern disc: AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration

Calman Guide: http://www.spectracal.com/downloads/...tion-guide.pdf
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post #4 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 07:36 AM
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Only keeping this post around in case it's linked to elsewhere... See this post.
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Last edited by Googer; 01-29-2015 at 11:14 AM.
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post #5 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 08:09 AM
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P60 Calibration

The P60 has some Grayscale anomalies and additionally has a skewed (away from Red) native color gamut. The Gamut problem is similar in the P70 and possibly the P50 as well. They all share Sharp VA panels.

Grayscale Calibration

Before I get into white balance calibration throughout the luminance scale I want to warn about some "triggers" I found. You probably wouldn't be adjusting in the following ranges but if you do, here's what happens. In the 11 point White Balance module the color temperature will jump to VERY Blue (and increases luminance by about 10 Foot Lamberts) when increasing 100% from Red 11 to 12, Green 15 to 16, and Blue 8 to 9. The same thing occurs at 5% when increasing Red from 26 to 27. The other, and more important trigger for practical purposes, is when switching from dimming OFF to ON, 100% White goes very Bluish. This does not happen from 90% down to 5%.

Grayscale workflow:

Assumption - dimming will be turned ON for normal viewing

100% must be calibrated with dimming ON because it skews the balance. Do not calibrate 100% with dimming OFF. Set the back light to meet your luminance requirement.

5 - 90% is calibrated with dimming OFF and the back light must be lowered (based on 100% readings) to meet the same luminance requirement. I use the ChromaPure Gamma module where I can watch Gamma and Grayscale simultaneously.


In the ChromaPure Gamma module (figure it out for your software):

1. Before running the 11 point, do the 2 point (offsets and gain) using 100% with dimming on and 30% with dimming off. Because of the 100% dimming ON pop I came up with Gain settings of 0, -42, and -36.
2.Turn dimming ON, adjust the back light, and take the 100% measurement only - you've already balanced RGB, or if not, do it now.
3. Turn dimming OFF, adjust the back light.
4. Start at 5% and work your way up adjusting both Gamma and RGB balance at each step.
5. Reiterate as required.



Color Calibration

The P60 has a problem calibrating color with both 100/75 and 75/75. A 75/75 calibration shows excellent graphs but like the Panasonic VT30, content flesh tones are Red and the VT30 fix by reducing the Color control does not work.

more later.............

Buzz
THX Certified Video Calibrator

 


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post #6 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 08:20 AM
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VIZIO P702ui-B3 Firmware 1.0.0

This calibration was done utilizing my D3 colorimeter profiled against my Pro2 spectro, preset Calibration Dark, gamma 2.4, and with a max light output of 30ftl at 100% stimulus with "Active LED Zones" on/plus Clear Action. This Panel seems to calibrate very well besides the well known issue of inaccurate red curving towards orange near 75/100% saturation. The Calibration Dark preset is definitely far superior in comparison to the other presets...at least with its dimming implementation. After completing my calibration, I a made a few adjustment to red a 25%, 50%, and 75% saturation levels to help subdue the sun burnt faces. I then rechecked 21 point grayscale/color with "Active LED Zones" on, checking for any discrepancies. The picture looks great, shadow detail, saturation, black levels, all acceptable! I have my settings listed below along with a few graph attachments.

Ryan

Calibration Dark*

Basic settings:

Backlight: 78
Brightness: 50
Contrast: 50
Color: 50
Tint: 0
Sharpness: 0


Advanced Picture:

Color Temperature: Normal
Black Detail: Off
Active LED Zones: On
Smooth Motion Effect: Off
Clear Action: On
Reduce Signal Noise: Off
Reduce Block Noise: Off
Game Low Latency: Off
Picture Size & Position: Off
Film Mode: Auto
Gamma: 2.4

Color Tuner:

Code:
              Red    Green   Blue   Cyan   Magenta   Yellow
 Hue           0      23      -4     -1       1       -6
 Saturation    0       4       8     30       5        2
 Brightness    7       1      15     -2       4        0
 
 Offset        1       0      -1
 Gain          0       0      -7
11 Point White Balance:

Code:
            Red    Green     Blue
5            0       0        0
10          -6      -6       -3
20          -6       0       -3
30          -3      -3       -4
40          -6      -3       -2
50          -4      -2       -5
60           2       1        2
70          -3      -2       -2
80          -4       0        1
90          -1       1        0
100          0       0      -39
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Last edited by mascior; 11-04-2014 at 06:39 AM.
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post #7 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 08:34 AM
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P502ui-B1, FW 1.0.1, HCFR 3.0.6, X-Rite i1D3 Retail.

BT.1886, Gamma 2.22, Night Viewing at 35fTL.

Calibration was done with FALD off. Started in Standard Picture Mode.

All Picture Mode settings are turned off except for Game Low Latency.

EDIT: These work well with GLL off, SME High, and Film Auto as well.

Backlight 19
Brightness 50
Contrast 48
Color 50
Tint 0
Sharpness 0

11-Point White Balance
5% -4 -5 3
10% -4 -4 10
20% -21 -17 -9
30% -14 -17 -15
40% -4 -11 -16
50% -3 -8 -9
60% -3 -7 -8
70% -8 -6 -5
80% -11 -11 -6
90% -16 -13 -10
100% -7 0 -9

Color Tuner is in attached image for this calibration above.

Another calibration from Calibrated Dark, BT.1886 Gamma 2.4, 35ftL, ADZ off throughout calibration, FW 1.0.1:

Backlight 23
Brightness 50
Contrast 48
Color 50
Sharpness 0

Color Tuner
5 5 -6 2 2 -8
16 11 9 45 3 12
-1 0 -4 -5 1 0
-1 1 -13
11 0 -19

11-Point White Balance
5% 3 0 6
10% 17 18 35
20% 10 16 12
30% 19 17 17
40% 31 26 11
50% 31 27 16
60% 32 26 14
70% 22 25 11
80% 14 15 13
90% 4 2 -1
100% -1 16 -9

Settings while watching, everything is off except for SME (High though Med and Low make very little difference if any), CA on.

UPDATED: F/W 1.19
11-Point White Balance
5% 3 -1 6
10% 18 18 35
20% 11 17 18
30% 20 18 21
40% 30 26 19
50% 30 26 25
60% 29 25 22
70% 23 23 23
80% 15 13 21
90% 4 2 8
100% -1 24 5

Biggest change was blue which is now a pleasure to calibrate. dE was 0.28 or 0.23, I forgot which. No changes to CMS from above.
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post #8 of 1641 Old 10-17-2014, 12:32 PM
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While the following link concerns calibration of a Samsung TV, the video and the thread in general may be helpful for people new to calibration with a colorimeter and CalMAN software.

Calibrating Leo Laporte's Samsung KN55S9C OLED TV
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post #9 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 11:31 AM - Thread Starter
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OK guys I have just started doing my calibration of the P70. First off using the i1d3 meter what do is set the display type to. I am using HCFR. I currently have it set to LCD CCFL IPS (CCFL AC EIZO HP with corrections) Not sure if this is the correct screen type or not as none of the listed options makes sense to me. I begin by trying to calibrate the grey scale first. In calibrating the grey scale i was able to bring the colors in line however by doing so the Delta E went way up. I am not sure how this Delta E is calculated. I would think that it is the error in the measurement based off the over or undershoot of your colors. It does not appear to be this was bc as I bring the colors closer and closer to the 100% line it seems to be getting worse. Can someone inform me how this value is calculated. I know it is more important to get the Delta E value as low as possible and Im guessing if that results in the colors being over or under 100% then so be it? Also I have no idea what is going on with my gamma curve. I have the tv set to 2.4 i saw this graph and have no idea what is going on. I have attached a couple screen shots of my work hopefully one of you guys will see what i am doing wrong and can help me out a bit.
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post #10 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 03:37 PM
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dE is calculated taking the luminance into account as well as the RGB balance. Make sure you turn local dimming off before trying to calibrate the full grayscale since that will wreak havoc with your attempts to get this right as that messes up the gamma response of the test patterns.
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post #11 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 03:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Googer View Post
dE is calculated taking the luminance into account as well as the RGB balance. Make sure you turn local dimming off before trying to calibrate the full grayscale since that will wreak havoc with your attempts to get this right as that messes up the gamma response of the test patterns.
Ahh that just be it. I'll give it a try after the football games today. I was reading over what others were doing and i was under the impression it was best to calibrate 100% with dimming off and the rest with dimming on.
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post #12 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 08:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok so I took your advise @Googer and it is still not cooperating with me. My gamma graph is not tracking at all. I must be doing something wrong. I open HCFR and I am using the AVS HD709 dist as my pattern generator. When opening the software I select To use DVD manual and then select my sensor. The next part is the part I am really confused about and may be my issue. It asks for a display tyoe with several options I have tried a few thus far. Im not sure if i should use a refresh display non refresh display or one the CCFL options. I know i am suppose to start with a 2 point grey scale calibration using the 40% and 100% points while turning on dimming for 100% and off for all other measurements but HCFR does not allow you to do this or at least I can not find it. It will only do the 11 point grey scale. I zeroed out all the value and just started completly over. I set the gamma value of the tv to 2.2 as most often I will be viewing in a lit environment. Under preferences I have it set to REC 709 (75%/75%) as i believe you guys said this will deliver the best results. the White is set to D65. My gamma calculation is set to ITU_R BT.1886 in the box for effective i have it set to 0 and a 100% offset. Now when I run the grey scale I basically am getting a decreasing exponetial function. By changing the number under the grey scale you are effectivly changing the the gain correct? so if i am low on the gamma scale i should increase the gain of that color in order to seek the desired gamma right? I have change the values of 50-100% all the way to negative 50 and have not been able to get anything except the decreasing function. Do i have something set wrong? I dont get why it is acting like this. I have spent hours just on the grey scale and have basically restarted. If anyone could give me a little push in the right direction that would be greatly appreciated.
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post #13 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 08:49 PM
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Did you remember to turn the dimming back to off after doing 100%

Buzz
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post #14 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post
Did you remember to turn the dimming back to off after doing 100%
FYI, buzz, I tried several attempts using FALD on with 100% and I got to tell you, with HCFR, the results were less than stellar.

I actually wound up turning it off for the full calibration and got a much more rational gamma curve.

Last edited by pisymbol; 10-21-2014 at 08:18 PM.
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post #15 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 08:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post
Did you remember to turn the dimming back to off after doing 100%
As of now I have tried it with dimming off for all numbers and then also tried dimming off for 5-90 and on only for 100. No difference.
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post #16 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Googer View Post
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pisymbol View Post
FYI, buzz, I tried several attempts using FALD on with 100% and I got to tell you, with HCFR, the results were less than stellar.

I actually wound up turning it off for the full calibration and got much more rational gamma curve.
Did you first check to see it turning dimming off and on while displaying a 100% pattern dramatically changed the picture? If it didn't, dimming off throughout the entire GS calibration would be correct.

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post #17 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 08:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pisymbol View Post
FYI, buzz, I tried several attempts using FALD on with 100% and I got to tell you, with HCFR, the results were less than stellar.

I actually wound up turning it off for the full calibration and got much more rational gamma curve.
What gamma vmcurve did you use to calibrate? Also what did you set the tv type to. I've never seen this not sure what I should set it to and can't find any information on it throughout the other forums. If you look at my posted pics above do you have any advise on what would make this occur?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superkyle View Post
Ok so I took your advise @Googer and it is still not cooperating with me. My gamma graph is not tracking at all. I must be doing something wrong. I open HCFR and I am using the AVS HD709 dist as my pattern generator. When opening the software I select To use DVD manual and then select my sensor. The next part is the part I am really confused about and may be my issue. It asks for a display tyoe with several options I have tried a few thus far. Im not sure if i should use a refresh display non refresh display or one the CCFL options. I know i am suppose to start with a 2 point grey scale calibration using the 40% and 100% points while turning on dimming for 100% and off for all other measurements but HCFR does not allow you to do this or at least I can not find it. It will only do the 11 point grey scale. I zeroed out all the value and just started completly over. I set the gamma value of the tv to 2.2 as most often I will be viewing in a lit environment. Under preferences I have it set to REC 709 (75%/75%) as i believe you guys said this will deliver the best results. the White is set to D65. My gamma calculation is set to ITU_R BT.1886 in the box for effective i have it set to 0 and a 100% offset. Now when I run the grey scale I basically am getting a decreasing exponetial function. By changing the number under the grey scale you are effectivly changing the the gain correct? so if i am low on the gamma scale i should increase the gain of that color in order to seek the desired gamma right? I have change the values of 50-100% all the way to negative 50 and have not been able to get anything except the decreasing function. Do i have something set wrong? I dont get why it is acting like this. I have spent hours just on the grey scale and have basically restarted. If anyone could give me a little push in the right direction that would be greatly appreciated.
First off superkyle, don't make the same mistake I made, use the GCD disc, not the AVS709 disc. It will be a lot easier when you wound up getting to color.

BT.1886, 2.22 (basically the default, I like 2.22, be my guess and target 2.4, personal taste, etc.). I have Game Low Latency on, everything ELSE is off. (post calibration FALD goes back on obviously).

Please do this (turn FALD off for the this whole procedure):

1) Insert GCD disc
2) Select 10% Windows -> Grayscale -> 100% White
3) Measure your ftl, bring backlight down to where you feel comfortable - I like 35ftL which turned out to be 19 on the P502ui-B1 out the gate
NOTE: I double checked this using the AVS709 -> 100% White pattern AS WELL AS zoyd's aweomse GCD. 19 is what my iD3 said was 35ftL. I even checked post calibration, it's friggin 19.
4) Go now to Main -> Basic Patterns
5) Black Clip Pattern -> Make sure 16 is black, 17 and up are blinking
6) Got back one menu and go to White Clip Pattern -> Set Contrast to a reasonable value where you can barely see 235 or above blink.
NOTE: You NOT going to believe this, but I actually tried to get S&M disc, AVS709, and GCD all to agree. I was 2/3 (S&M is a strange disc).
7) Perform an initial Grayscale sweep by selecting 10% Windows->Grayscale->10% steps
8) Press the HCFR Grayscale sweep button (the gray bubbles!)
9) Follow directions
10) Go now to 10% Window->Grayscale
11) Go into on your Vizio to the Color Tuner Menu, you are going to now adjust Offset (lowend) and Gain (highend)
12) I do 80/30, some like to do 90/20, doesn't really matter, but 80/30 worked for me just fine.
13) Start Free Measurement (press Play), you are going to first do a 2-pt Grayscale tune up to get the whole sweep in general alignment (you still need to work on luminance and dEs for the full 11-pt later on).
14) On 80% modify Gain's Red and Blue (do not touch green, there is no need to) to get the dE bar <1.0
15) On 30% modify Offset (R,B, and Green if you like) to get dE bar < 1.0
16) Go back to 80%, is it still less than <1.0? No, adjust. Go back to 30%, is it still less than <1.0? No adjust. Rinse, repeat
17) Now you are going to do a full Grayscale calibration, go to Color-Tuner 11pt Whitescale (the menu over)
18) Start at 100%, get the dE down to sub zero by adjusting RGB under 100%.
19) From 90%-5% you want to do TWO things simultaneously:
- Match delta Luminance value first by reducing or increasing RGB to the target value, you have to scroll down in the measurements column to see it. (read the HCFR posts for pics) - this is the Y value, you are matching the Y value with what HCFR calculated as the correct luminance value for the gamma at that point in the grayscale.
- Once you get the delta Luminance value in place, then continue to modify to get the dE under 1.0
20) After you are done doing 90%-5%, perform another grayscale sweep (NOTE: 5% for me was a wash since HCFR didn't offer a luminance value nor wanted it for the sweep, but I did get the dE low
21) How does your gamma curve look now? Should be a lot better. Look at each percentage point, if you are little low or high, more than likely you luminance value is off. Go back to 90%, work your way down, follow step 19 again.

Once your done with all of the above, let me know how you made out. I wrote the above off the top of my head but I believe it will get you very far.

Then on to colors...which you will want the GCD above for 75%/75% saturation/luminance sweeps. Do the above first, then we can talk about colors.

buzz has A LOT of good notes about the color issue and ultimately, I did find red to be the most difficult to get inline (you have to compromise and unless he feels differently, with my i1D3 I could not get 100% saturation right, everything was fairly good, avg dE 2.24 because 100% drove it up).

I need to post my CORRECT numbers which i think look great on my set. I have tested plenty of content now and I'm startled how good it looks compared to factory settings. The only thing about my calibration that has me surprised is the backlight. I had to bring it down to 19 for 35ftLs. I don't know if the P502B1 is just brighter than the P60/70. I think his night time backlight is at 28 and that is insanely bright on the 502B1.

One last, but important thing: WAIT FOR THE TV TO WARM UP. I can't stress this enough. Watch a few YouTube videos or what you have (Btw, I can not get audio to work from the Internet apps to my Onk via ARC, very frustrating).

Last edited by pisymbol; 10-18-2014 at 09:39 PM.
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post #19 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 09:15 PM
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What gamma vmcurve did you use to calibrate? Also what did you set the tv type to. I've never seen this not sure what I should set it to and can't find any information on it throughout the other forums. If you look at my posted pics above do you have any advise on what would make this occur?
Display Type is LED RGB IPS I believe. I'm not sure there are any other that are even remotely close (it's certainly not CCFTL nor Plasma).
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post #20 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 09:16 PM
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Did you first check to see it turning dimming off and on while displaying a 100% pattern dramatically changed the picture? If it didn't, dimming off throughout the entire GS calibration would be correct.
buzz you are the man. It DID NOT so I left it OFF.
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post #21 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 09:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you @pisymbol I will try all of that first thing in the morning. I was really struggling hopefully I can get it all worked out. Awesome information
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post #22 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 09:37 PM
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Thank you @pisymbol I will try all of that first thing in the morning. I was really struggling hopefully I can get it all worked out. Awesome information
Check the HCFR thread about Display type. I'm not a 100% what the right answer is now so I asked. Hopefully the HCFR experts will give us a clue.

I have spent no less 20+ man hours on my first calibration and I'm going nuts! But I am learning a whole lot and minus a few odds and ends, I am super comfortable calibrating this TV (even if I make mistakes, I can recover).
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post #23 of 1641 Old 10-18-2014, 09:44 PM
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Ok so I took your advise @Googer and it is still not cooperating with me. My gamma graph is not tracking at all. I must be doing something wrong. I open HCFR and I am using the AVS HD709 dist as my pattern generator. When opening the software I select To use DVD manual and then select my sensor. The next part is the part I am really confused about and may be my issue. It asks for a display tyoe with several options I have tried a few thus far. Im not sure if i should use a refresh display non refresh display or one the CCFL options. I know i am suppose to start with a 2 point grey scale calibration using the 40% and 100% points while turning on dimming for 100% and off for all other measurements but HCFR does not allow you to do this or at least I can not find it. It will only do the 11 point grey scale. I zeroed out all the value and just started completly over. I set the gamma value of the tv to 2.2 as most often I will be viewing in a lit environment. Under preferences I have it set to REC 709 (75%/75%) as i believe you guys said this will deliver the best results. the White is set to D65. My gamma calculation is set to ITU_R BT.1886 in the box for effective i have it set to 0 and a 100% offset. Now when I run the grey scale I basically am getting a decreasing exponetial function. By changing the number under the grey scale you are effectivly changing the the gain correct? so if i am low on the gamma scale i should increase the gain of that color in order to seek the desired gamma right? I have change the values of 50-100% all the way to negative 50 and have not been able to get anything except the decreasing function. Do i have something set wrong? I dont get why it is acting like this. I have spent hours just on the grey scale and have basically restarted. If anyone could give me a little push in the right direction that would be greatly appreciated.
1. Since you want to target a gamma of 2.2, you need to tell HCFR that's your desired gamma as well - this will directly impact its calculated dE's since any deviation from a flat 2.2 will increase the error significantly. Taking a quick look at its preferences, try setting the gamma calculation to 'display gamma (power law)' in Preferences / References and see if that helps. When you have it set correctly, on the gamma graph, your target gamma line (the display reference) should just be a straight line at 2.2 from 0-100% white.

2. You should initially use just the 2-point RGB offsets and gains in the Color Tuner for grayscale-setting at 100% and 30% levels. You don't want to touch the 11-point grayscale until you have grayscale measuring relatively closely, or you're doing something completely nuts (as I did in my last night-time calibration ). I would say to get your feet wet with this don't worry about the difference that local dimming on can or does cause at 100% and try to get a good grayscale across the board solely with local dimming off (so have it off even for setting 100%). You may find your set is like mine when the difference between local dimming on and off only affects 100% white when you're starting your calibration from the 'Calibrated Dark' preset (which won't be usable for you during daytime anyway since it'll likely be too dim even if you max the backlight at 100). You should be able to get both 30% and 100% awfully close to 0 dE with just the 2-point settings and once you do, the 11-point settings should just be for fine-tuning slight bumps along the way and getting the gamma dead-on instead of just close. One thing to keep in mind with this - don't assume that a bump you see at a given level on a color will be affected by the corresponding 11-point value - the values above and below it have an impact too, especially if one or both of them are wildly different than the one that you want to adjust. Try to keep your changes from one level to the next a relatively smooth variation to make the interpolation the set needs to do easier (i.e., avoid doing something like -10 -> +15 -> -10 - that's a surefire way to getting bad results ).

3. Display type - this has to do with a correction table that is applied to the raw results coming from your sensor. If there's any sort of option for white LED's, that's probably what you want. I don't believe this should really matter in regards to getting a good gamma though - what it could / likely will mean, though, is that your readings are all off by a static amount, so instead of D65, you may end up with D67 or something like that, and all your color readings (for once you get to playing with the CMS) would have similar issues.
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post #24 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 03:23 AM
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Im a noob but heres my opinion....
1.Gamma is more dynamic than just a single number and is hard to impact w/2pt so just concentrate on balancing rgb. I'm not familiar with hcfr but see if you can calculate dE w/o Y....or if thats even a real thing lol. Also...
2. You decrease luminance to raise gamma and increase luminance to lower gamma...kinda the inverse of each other. This can be accomplished with a multi pt grayscale by lowering or raising rgb drives together at the individual intervals. I have an lg with 21pt and I start by balancing rgb at each interval then go back and tweak for gamma. Say I set a target of 2.2 and my gamma is ruler flat with a dip in the middle so it reads gamma of 2.0 @ interval 50. That means that the measured luminance is higher than the calculated target for level 50. I would then go into 21pt control menu, find level 50, and lower rgb together to decrease the luminance and raise the gamma.....although I find I have to lower R 6 clicks and GB 5 clicks to decrease them equally. Hope I helped....

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post #25 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 01:45 PM - Thread Starter
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@buzzard767 @Googer @pisymbol First off thank you all for the help you have provided me with thus far. I have spent the day.. yes the day finishing my grey scale. I wanted to inform you that the P70 does have the same odd blue push under certain numbers. I played around with this and where it flips to blue actually varies based on the values of the percent before it. On my P70 the it would do this at 20% 30% and 70%. I have no idea what causes this but was a HUGE pain to calibrate around. It would even change at one gain level and the next go back to normal and then back again if adjusted higher. Anyways I think I got it. If you guys don't mind take a look at my graphs and tell me what you think. I was able to bring all 0-100% in line, however the values I used to do so are much higher/lower than I expected them to be. I followed your advice Buzz and did a 2 point grey scale calibration using the offset and gain bringing the dE to as close to zero as I could on 100% and 30%. From there I tweaked the settings using the 11 point grey scale. Everything appears finished. I know that no two sets are identical but I did not expect to see such a large variation from Googers settings. I did calibrate to a gamma of 2.2 however. I also used the calibrated setting as my base. If you guys don't mind please take a look at my settings and my graphs and let me know if this is ok. I don't want to start calibrating the color until I know the grey scale is 100% finished. Thanks in advance guys.
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post #26 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 01:54 PM
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@buzzard767 @Googer @pisymbol First off thank you all for the help you have provided me with thus far. I have spent the day.. yes the day finishing my grey scale. I wanted to inform you that the P70 does have the same odd blue push under certain numbers. I played around with this and where it flips to blue actually varies based on the values of the percent before it. On my P70 the it would do this at 20% 30% and 70%. I have no idea what causes this but was a HUGE pain to calibrate around. It would even change at one gain level and the next go back to normal and then back again if adjusted higher. Anyways I think I got it. If you guys don't mind take a look at my graphs and tell me what you think. I was able to bring all 0-100% in line, however the values I used to do so are much higher/lower than I expected them to be. I followed your advice Buzz and did a 2 point grey scale calibration using the offset and gain bringing the dE to as close to zero as I could on 100% and 30%. From there I tweaked the settings using the 11 point grey scale. Everything appears finished. I know that no two sets are identical but I did not expect to see such a large variation from Googers settings. I did calibrate to a gamma of 2.2 however. I also used the calibrated setting as my base. If you guys don't mind please take a look at my settings and my graphs and let me know if this is ok. I don't want to start calibrating the color until I know the grey scale is 100% finished. Thanks in advance guys.
Post your gamma curve!

Here are my values.

Btw, what was the target ftL you used? That is the one thing I don't understand about Googer's calibration which would be INSANELY bright on the P502ui-B1. I targeted 35ftL.

buzz talked about the crazy color adjustments made at certain levels. You can avoid that at least on the 50" doing the 2-pt first and then the 11-pt to fine tune. I never got to those thresholds but I did notice them playing around.

EDIT: Googer's comment about the percentages of white above and below a certain point in your grayscale are SPOT on. When I adjusted 70%, I actually rechecked above and below it and made changes accordingly.

Last edited by pisymbol; 10-19-2014 at 02:00 PM.
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post #27 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 02:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Post your gamma curve!

Btw, what was the target ftL you used? That is the one thing I don't understand about Googer's calibration which would be INSANELY bright on the P502ui-B1.

buzz talked about the crazy color adjustments made at certain levels. You can avoid that at least on the 50" doing the 2-pt first and then the 11-pt to fine tune. I never got to those thresholds but I did notice them playing around.

EDIT: Googer's comment about the percentages of white above and below a certain point in your grayscale are SPOT on. When I adjusted 70%, I actually rechecked above and below it and made changes accordingly.
The second picture is my gamma curve. I used a constant gamma of 2.2 so it is a straight line.
I did do the 2 point first and still had to change a lot on the 11 point. If you notice my numbers you will see there is little change to the ones that i used for the 2 point and a lot of change to all the others
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post #28 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Im unsure what gamma I should have used for day time viewing. I played around and did a little research and it seemed that a constant 2.2 would be best. Maybe its not I have no idea but so far llooks good haha. I plan to do a night mode with a gamma of 2.4 and ill use the BT1866 because it seems to be the most commonly used for night viewing.
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post #29 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 05:47 PM
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The second picture is my gamma curve. I used a constant gamma of 2.2 so it is a straight line.
I did do the 2 point first and still had to change a lot on the 11 point. If you notice my numbers you will see there is little change to the ones that i used for the 2 point and a lot of change to all the others
What was your target brightness though? 30-40ftL?
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post #30 of 1641 Old 10-19-2014, 07:49 PM - Thread Starter
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What was your target brightness though? 30-40ftL?
I guess I never had a target brightness. Under references I set that to rec 709(75%/75%) and D65. I left the brightness at 50 which is the highest I could leave it at not to notice any dimming artifacts. I figured from there I could just alter the backlight to tweak the brightness of the picture to my liking. How did you set a target for the brightness? Is that something I have to do? I figured doing it this way would be fine but then again If I am going to take the time and do all of this I would like to make sure it is as good as it can get. But in short at 100% my brightness is 43.86ftL

It was my understanding that @buzzard767 said on the other forum that you should leave contrast and brightness control set the 50. And that the greyscale gamma and backlight will be your means of altering the overall brightness of the picture but I could be wrong. Also It is my understanding that I should leave the color set to 50 also(basically leave all basic setting alone) as the grey scale and color calibration will fix all of this. Maybe he can chime in and enlighten us a little more on this.

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