The Official ChromaPure 3 thread - Page 33 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 04-21-2017, 03:26 AM
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Tom,
Pls check the calx file. Thanks.
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Old 04-23-2017, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Yes, it's the same for both devices.

For RGB Infoframe use: 00:E8:64:5D:00
For YCbCr 4:2:0 Infoframe use: 60:E8:64:5D:00
For YCbCr 4:2:2 Infoframe use: 20:E8:64:5D:00
For YCbCr 4:4:4 Infoframe use: 40:E8:64:5D:00
Ted,

Tom concluded my measurement of RGBCMB are not identical to Ryan's UHD test pattern when Integral + Accupel or Intergral + AVLab TPG is used as a signal generator. Grayscale were very good but the luminance of primary/secondary color was quite different compared to Ryan's 50/50 HDR test patterns.

Do you have some test results when HDFury Linker was used or any comments?
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Old 04-23-2017, 02:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
Ted,

Tom concluded my measurement of RGBCMB are not identical to Ryan's UHD test pattern when Integral + Accupel or Intergral + AVLab TPG is used as a signal generator. Grayscale were very good but the luminance of primary/secondary color was quite different compared to Ryan's 50/50 HDR test patterns.

Do you have some test results when HDFury Linker was used or any comments?
Hi, the HD Linker or Integral are just adding a metadata to signal, they are not affeting the RGB Triplets any pattern generation will send. I have checked with DVD AVLab ColorChecker the signal when it's coming throu Linker and it's bit-perfect, this means the Linker is not affecting the signal you pass-throu.

What metadata the colors Tom used from Ray's Patterns had?

The Metadata I posted for the HD Fury is for 1.000 Max. / 0.005 Min. Mastering Display Luminance, 1000 MaxCLL, 400 MaxFALL.

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Old 04-23-2017, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, the HD Linker or Integral are just adding a metadata to signal, they are not affeting the RGB Triplets any pattern generation will send. I have checked with DVD AVLab ColorChecker the signal when it's coming throu Linker and it's bit-perfect, this means the Linker is not affecting the signal you pass-throu.

What metadata the colors Tom used from Ray's Patterns had?

The Metadata I posted for the HD Fury is for 1.000 Max. / 0.005 Min. Mastering Display Luminance, 1000 MaxCLL, 400 MaxFALL.
Ted,

He actually accessed my laptop remotely and measured the 10% windows in 50% intensity and 50% saturation RGBCMY colors with K-10A. And he said Ryan's UHD test pattern is only trust-worthy.
You can check my previous post on the screenshots of measurements when Accupel/Integral is used.
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Old 04-23-2017, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
Ted,

He actually accessed my laptop remotely and measured the 10% windows in 50% intensity and 50% saturation RGBCMY colors with K-10A. And he said Ryan's UHD test pattern is only trust-worthy.
You can check my previous post on the screenshots of measurements when Accupel/Integral is used.
Can you provide the measurements you have from Accupel+Integral vs. Ray's patterns?

Post also the Accupel settings you used and the way you display Ray's patterns, also you have to check what metadata the Ryan's patterns you used have, different metadata will have different results.

This is why I posted the metadata info I send you for Accupel to see if you have agreement with Ryan's Patterns.

There nothing special about a HDR10 signal, when you have an known reference device which can output reference RGB triplets, you add there the metadata using Integral/Linker and you have perfect HDR patterns.

Also when you compare a reference pattern generator vs. a source or USB input; and you found a difference...then it means that there is mismatch between processing or the source/USB input with the one you are sending, not all players are bit-perfect. You can find problems with agreement if you compare the same patterns from difference sources also.

The difference you posted is very large, something is very wrong somewhere, but if you post more detail we will try to locate the issue.

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Old 04-23-2017, 05:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
The difference you posted is very large, something is very wrong somewhere, but if you post more detail we will try to locate the issue.
For 50%/50% 2020/HDR red ChromaPure generates a test pattern call for 115, 86, 86 to the signal generator. That is the same triplet that Ryan uses.

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Old 04-23-2017, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
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ChromaPure 3.1.5 Beta Released

The ChromaPure 3.1.5 beta is now available for download from the ChromaPure News site.

It primarily fixes some issues that arose as a result of the 3.1.4 release.

Tom Huffman
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Old 04-24-2017, 12:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
For 50%/50% 2020/HDR red ChromaPure generates a test pattern call for 115, 86, 86 to the signal generator. That is the same triplet that Ryan uses.
Ok, so Accupel configured to output RGB-Video and at it's output an HD Intergral/Linker which adds the metadata can have the same results as Ryan's (if the source you playback the Ryan's file is accurate).

Differencies between the metadata infoframe HD Intergral/Linker is sending compared with Ryan's metadata can affect the results, so use MediaInfo to see what metadata is using the Ryans file you are using, it it's different from the metadata I posted let me know to post a new one to match Ryan's metadata.

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Old 04-24-2017, 07:32 AM
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Hi
I have just started to use Chromapure 3.1.4 to calibrate UHD/HDR with the R. Masciola Patterns. Before I was still using CP2. So far I am quite pleased with the Software - besides some initial software stability issues. These I could handle. I think it is nice and straightforward to work with this software.

Some questions:

1) I read that the colour checker was not working. Is that now corrected ?
2) Then I used the R. Masciola patterns and somehow I realize that the sequence of patterns for the saturation sweep seems not to be the same. Is that really the case ?
3) to calibrate my JVC X7000 projector I used its BT2020 gamut profile and I got the attached results. I wonder about the green. Is there a way to improve it or is the result quite ok ? Thanks for any constructive comments.
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Old 04-24-2017, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Mori* View Post
Hi
I have just started to use Chromapure 3.1.4 to calibrate UHD/HDR with the R. Masciola Patterns. Before I was still using CP2. So far I am quite pleased with the Software - besides some initial software stability issues. These I could handle. I think it is nice and straightforward to work with this software.

Some questions:

1) I read that the colour checker was not working. Is that now corrected ?
2) Then I used the R. Masciola patterns and somehow I realize that the sequence of patterns for the saturation sweep seems not to be the same. Is that really the case ?
3) to calibrate my JVC X7000 projector I used its BT2020 gamut profile and I got the attached results. I wonder about the green. Is there a way to improve it or is the result quite ok ? Thanks for any constructive comments.
1. The ColorChecker is broken for HDR. It is fine for SDR. It will be fixed in 3.1.5.

2. Since using an external file system like Ryan's images is a manual process in any case, the order doesn't really matter. Just select the color that matches what is requested by the software. The order in the software is W(100%) RGBYCM (100%), RGBYCM (75%), RGBYCM (50%), RGBYCM (25%).

3. That's probably the best you are going to get. It looks like JVC targeted DCi-P3 instead of Rec. 2020, which is too saturated for any commercial display to render in any case.

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Old 04-24-2017, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
The ChromaPure 3.1.5 beta is now available for download from the ChromaPure News site.

It primarily fixes some issues that arose as a result of the 3.1.4 release.
Thanks Tom but what if the PC outputs RGB 0-255 over HDMI?
Do you now show RGB 18 on a RGB 16 background and 232 on 235?

Markus

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Last edited by markus767; 04-24-2017 at 02:36 PM.
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Old 04-24-2017, 02:35 PM
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Thank you Tom for your feedback. I appreciate this a lot because I feel there is not so much info around about HDR / UHD calibration. Keep up the good work and best regards.
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Old 04-24-2017, 08:11 PM
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Tom,

Here is a few feedback for 3.1.15.

1. The saturation value is reset when clearing all the measurement from Color mgt i.e. measuring colors with Sat 50% option and then erasing them all also resets saturation to 100%. Changing sat to 50% again to measure the color repeatedly is a tedious job.

2. If accidently clicking export measurement from color mgmt and if it opens the new window to choose the filename to save, canceling that export job crashes CP3. It's 100% reproducible.

3. After measuring grayscale with HDR gamma, the generated quick reports shows wrong gamma target line. i.e. flat 2.8 line w/o actual measurement.

4. Running 'erasing measurements' from color mgmt blinks test pattern from the signal generator. ie. if it removes White and RGBMCY, it seems it blinks 7 times until the command finishes. It was annoying.
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Old 04-24-2017, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Can you provide the measurements you have from Accupel+Integral vs. Ray's patterns?
I've done one more time to compare the following combinations with Chromapure 3.1.15.

1. DVG-5000 + Integral
2. Avlab TPG + Integral
3. Ryan's UHD patterns

Accupel and TPG were setup like RGB 16-235, 1080p/24, 50%/50%. Also used 50%/50% Ryan's UHD patterns.

Integral was set up to send RGB color in Rec2020 like attached.

Pls check the attached results of color mgmt.

This time the luminance error was not that huge and I think the reason why was I incorrectly set up Integral to send RGB color while my Accupel was sending YCbCr 4:4:4 at the time Tom has checked my laptop and measurements.

How do you think the results?
Attached Thumbnails
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ID:	2101201  


Last edited by freebits; 04-24-2017 at 09:27 PM.
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Old 04-25-2017, 12:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Thanks Tom but what if the PC outputs RGB 0-255 over HDMI?
Do you now show RGB 18 on a RGB 16 background and 232 on 235?
The video card software in newer PCs allows you to select between PC and Video levels for the HDMI output. Older systems without this generally default to video levels.

Yes, we adjusted the levels accordingly.

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Old 04-25-2017, 01:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
The video card software in newer PCs allows you to select between PC and Video levels for the HDMI output. Older systems without this generally default to video levels.

Yes, we adjusted the levels accordingly.
Great. You probably should add a note on the pattern screen itself so novice users get some guidance how to use those patterns.

By the way, I've checked my PF1000 and "Low" is indeed 16-235 and "High" is 0-255. So I had the correct settings but the new patterns don't seem to work well. The problem might be the amount of stray light?

Markus

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Old 04-25-2017, 02:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
The ChromaPure 3.1.5 beta is now available for download from the ChromaPure News site.

It primarily fixes some issues that arose as a result of the 3.1.4 release.
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
Tom,

Here is a few feedback for 3.1.15.

1. The saturation value is reset when clearing all the measurement from Color mgt i.e. measuring colors with Sat 50% option and then erasing them all also resets saturation to 100%. Changing sat to 50% again to measure the color repeatedly is a tedious job.

2. If accidently clicking export measurement from color mgmt and if it opens the new window to choose the filename to save, canceling that export job crashes CP3. It's 100% reproducible.

3. After measuring grayscale with HDR gamma, the generated quick reports shows wrong gamma target line. i.e. flat 2.8 line w/o actual measurement.

4. Running 'erasing measurements' from color mgmt blinks test pattern from the signal generator. ie. if it removes White and RGBMCY, it seems it blinks 7 times until the command finishes. It was annoying.
Tom, any advices?
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Old 04-25-2017, 03:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by freebits View Post
2. If accidently clicking export measurement from color mgmt and if it opens the new window to choose the filename to save, canceling that export job crashes CP3. It's 100% reproducible.
Not here. I can't reproduce it at all.
http://www.chromapure.com/bugtest/ex...exportBug.html

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Old 04-25-2017, 03:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by freebits View Post
Tom, any advices?
Advice? Well, of the 4 reports only two are bugs and one I cannot reproduce. The other two issues are minor workflow matters. The remaining HDR report bug that I can reproduce we'll fix in 3.1.5.

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Old 04-25-2017, 03:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
I've done one more time to compare the following combinations with Chromapure 3.1.15.

1. DVG-5000 + Integral
2. Avlab TPG + Integral
3. Ryan's UHD patterns

Accupel and TPG were setup like RGB 16-235, 1080p/24, 50%/50%. Also used 50%/50% Ryan's UHD patterns.

Integral was set up to send RGB color in Rec2020 like attached.

Pls check the attached results of color mgmt.

This time the luminance error was not that huge and I think the reason why was I incorrectly set up Integral to send RGB color while my Accupel was sending YCbCr 4:4:4 at the time Tom has checked my laptop and measurements.

How do you think the results?
Check with MediaInfo utility what metadata Ryan's patterns you use have and post them.

Skip sending AVI infoframe.

Be sure that you are using the 50% REC.2020 Saturation of Ryan's pattern, not the 50% DCI-P3 inside REC.2020.

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Old 04-25-2017, 03:20 AM
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Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
Not here. I can't reproduce it at all.
http://www.chromapure.com/bugtest/ex...exportBug.html
Ok. I check again and record the screen later too.

Last edited by freebits; 04-25-2017 at 03:27 AM.
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Old 04-25-2017, 03:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Check with MediaInfo utility what metadata Ryan's patterns you use have and post them.

Skip sending AVI infoframe.

Be sure that you are using the 50% REC.2020 Saturation of Ryan's pattern, not the 50% DCI-P3 inside REC.2020.
01. 10%_Window Gray_50_C502_HDR10.mp4 :

Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : SMPTE ST 2084
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primaries : R: x=0.680000 y=0.320000, G: x=0.265000 y=0.690000, B: x=0.150000 y=0.060000, White point: x=0.312700 y=0.329000
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0005 cd/m2, max: 1000.0000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level : 400 cd/m2


02. 10%_Window Red_50_50_HDR10.mp4 :

Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : SMPTE ST 2084
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primaries : R: x=0.680000 y=0.320000, G: x=0.265000 y=0.690000, B: x=0.150000 y=0.060000, White point: x=0.312700 y=0.329000
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0005 cd/m2, max: 1000.0000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level : 400 cd/m2

Is this sufficient or need more?
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Old 04-25-2017, 03:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
01. 10%_Window Gray_50_C502_HDR10.mp4 :

Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : SMPTE ST 2084
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primaries : R: x=0.680000 y=0.320000, G: x=0.265000 y=0.690000, B: x=0.150000 y=0.060000, White point: x=0.312700 y=0.329000
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0005 cd/m2, max: 1000.0000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level : 400 cd/m2


02. 10%_Window Red_50_50_HDR10.mp4 :

Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : SMPTE ST 2084
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primaries : R: x=0.680000 y=0.320000, G: x=0.265000 y=0.690000, B: x=0.150000 y=0.060000, White point: x=0.312700 y=0.329000
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0005 cd/m2, max: 1000.0000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level : 400 cd/m2

Is this sufficient or need more?
Ok, to match the same metadata, use that one, because Ray's is using 0.0005 and the metadata I send you has 0.005.

87:01:1a:a1:02:00:c2:33:c4:86:4c:1d:b8:0b:d0:84:80 :3e:13:3d:42:40:e8:03:05:00:e8:03:90:01

Be sure about the other details, about REC.2020 50% Saturation. (not DCI-P3)

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Old 04-25-2017, 03:44 AM
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Ok, to match the same metadata, use that one, because Ray's is using 0.0005 and the metadata I send you has 0.005.

87:01:1a:a1:02:00:c2:33:c4:86:4c:1d:b8:0b:d0:84:80 :3e:13:3d:42:40:e8:03:05:00:e8:03:90:01

Be sure about the other details, about REC.2020 50% Saturation. (not DCI-P3)
Excellent info! I'll get back with new results. Thanks.
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Old 04-25-2017, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Ok, to match the same metadata, use that one, because Ray's is using 0.0005 and the metadata I send you has 0.005.

87:01:1a:a1:02:00:c2:33:c4:86:4c:1d:b8:0b:d0:84:80 :3e:13:3d:42:40:e8:03:05:00:e8:03:90:01

Be sure about the other details, about REC.2020 50% Saturation. (not DCI-P3)
Ted,

Please check the attached measurements. I did this a few times and the results were mostly the same to the attached.

I think the difference is still there between the test pattern and Integral?
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Old 04-25-2017, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
Not here. I can't reproduce it at all.
http://www.chromapure.com/bugtest/ex...exportBug.html
Tom,

It was 'load custom targets' not 'export measurements'. It's always reproducible. Pls see the following screen recording too. Thanks.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p5jgns7s99...50515.wmv?dl=0
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Old 04-26-2017, 12:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
Tom,

It was 'load custom targets' not 'export measurements'. It's always reproducible. Pls see the following screen recording too. Thanks.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p5jgns7s99...50515.wmv?dl=0
That option shouldn't even be there. It is intended for Raw Data only. We'll remove it.

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Old 04-26-2017, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post
Ted,

Please check the attached measurements. I did this a few times and the results were mostly the same to the attached.

I think the difference is still there between the test pattern and Integral?
Compare only 100% Saturations and report back if you see the same difference.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
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Old 04-26-2017, 05:28 PM
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Couple questions from a new user.
1. I have an i1D3 (OEM), when should I use slow mode?
2. I see a comment on 3.1.5beta about contrat and brightness test screens. Where are they found and are there instructions for them?
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Old 04-26-2017, 05:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rlrbjr View Post
Couple questions from a new user.
1. I have an i1D3 (OEM), when should I use slow mode?
2. I see a comment on 3.1.5beta about contrat and brightness test screens. Where are they found and are there instructions for them?
Only use the Slow Mode when you want to measure black level. The best example is when you want to measure on/off contrast.

This question referred to the Brightness and Contrast Built-in test patterns. The instructions are on screen. There is a weird bug right now that prevents the individual built-in test patterns appearing in the drop down when you first start the software. Just close the software and then start again and then they are available.

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