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post #1 of 24 Old 07-18-2007, 01:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Has anyone ever been able to properly calibrate any of the new Sharp Aquos HD component inputs to 6500K in both the gains/bias adjustments. I recently purchased a large number of lc-26d43U, and Sharp is now telling me after I recieved the units that they cannot be calibrated "in the field". This of course is different from what they were telling me previous to my purchase.

I am a fully certified calibratior and have calibrated many a Sharp display. The service menu's in the new ones are vast, but do have structure similiar to previous models. I have been able to interpret some of them but not the pages for a good white balance/grey scale. Sharps documentation shows the need for a laptop/PC to be connected to it to set correct greyscale points. The extremely limited documentation I have recieved from Sharp was like getting blood out of a stone.

Sharps technical support is terrible and they have totally left me and the company I work for hanging. I'm looking for some assistance from anyone who actually knows how to calibrate the new Sharps. I am about to return them but as I mentioned I purchased ALOT of them.

Thank you
~MG~
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post #2 of 24 Old 07-18-2007, 03:13 PM
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I did some research on this. It doesn't look good. A lot of ISF guys are scratching their heads about this.

Tom Huffman
ChromaPure Software/AccuPel Video Signal Generators
ISF/THX Calibrations
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post #3 of 24 Old 07-18-2007, 05:42 PM
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What a shame, why are manufacturers hostile towards the ISF? I would think after all this time manufacturers would start making things easy for ISF guys. Making ISF friendly sets would offer a company a distinct competitive advantage.
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post #4 of 24 Old 07-18-2007, 05:44 PM
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Greetings

Here's a tidbit for calibration. It's actually very calibration friendly for grayscale ... if you know where to look in the service menu.

The Sharp does not use a traditional cut driver based grayscale system. The TV's base grayscale is done with a six point grayscale system.

This tip came from Randy Tomlinson (Rest in peace, you will be missed.) a few months before he passed on.

Look at the Gamma section of the SM ... Gamma 1.2.3.4.5.6 ... broken down into RGB ...

Each Gamma has three colors ... 1 R .... 1 G ... 1 B ... 2 R ... 2G ... 2B and so on.

They correlate to 20% 35% 50% 65% 80% 95% roughly speaking.

Six point grayscale systems are far preferable to the standard 2 point systems most are used to. The other stuff you see in the service menu are offsets to these master controls ... or at least they are supposed to be.

So here you go ... make sure you write the changes as you go along.

Regards

Michael Chen @ The Laser Video Experience
ISF/THX/TLV Video Instructor
The Video Calibration Education Hub - www.TLVEXP.com

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post #5 of 24 Old 07-19-2007, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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I appreciate so much, the responses and the information. The 6-point grey scale makes sense given my research and re-assures I wasnt totally off track. The gamma adjustments are where I will now go for the grey-scale adjustments. Having the image not change when some adjustments are made must be an incorrect input page being adjusted relating the the actual signal being used. Also there are "gamma write" options and do these need to be turned on.

In repsonse to manufacturers not giving ISF and aother qualified people information is extremely confusing. Sharp is beyond a doubt the worst I have encountred in the Pro-sumer industry. Maybe 20 minutes talking to a Sharp tech who actually knows something would solve all my problems, I did after almost a month of phone tag finally speak to a couple front end techs, but they were completley useless. For example cut/pasting the users manual to me in an email. I am now going to make a point to spread all information I recieve about these displays. This thread will be hopefully continuous and helpfull for others too.

I'll will defintly update my results and again appreciate all comments and information.
~MG~
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post #6 of 24 Old 07-19-2007, 11:45 AM
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Greetings

I should note that the changes are only seen when out side of the service menu area. You need to go in and out ... a royal pain ... but if you have the remote code for service menu access it goes faster.

Regards

Michael Chen @ The Laser Video Experience
ISF/THX/TLV Video Instructor
The Video Calibration Education Hub - www.TLVEXP.com

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post #7 of 24 Old 07-19-2007, 12:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks again for this valuable information.

Anyone know what the remote-code might be. This is something Sharp seemed to dodge. I know the typical hold down vol and input while plugging in trick but a code entry as noted would be way easier.

Michael TLV may I contact you off list ??
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post #8 of 24 Old 07-19-2007, 12:56 PM
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greetings

I have the CCF file for it ... so if you have a pronto type device, this will work for you.

You can always contact me ... although better through my furrypig01@yahoo.com email.

Regards

Michael Chen @ The Laser Video Experience
ISF/THX/TLV Video Instructor
The Video Calibration Education Hub - www.TLVEXP.com

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post #9 of 24 Old 07-19-2007, 06:07 PM - Thread Starter
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I am very happy to report that based on the information in this thread..(thank you very much Michael) I have successfully fully calibrated this display to meet our studio specs.

The best part of the information was the fact that you dont see a difference until you go out of the service menu i.e. pulling the power plug. THere is also a new "gamma write" feature you have to select after changing parameters but after that its pretty straight forward adjusting the greyscale.

By dividing the 6 point adjstments into 100 IRE will determine which points you adjust. Gamma1 controls the lower parts of the gamma curve and up to the last gamma6 will set 100% color temperature.

Thanks again....now only if I could throw the "it cant be calibrated" back at Sharp. In my world there is no cant. It just depends on how bad you want it.

Thanks again for the help.

~MG~
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post #10 of 24 Old 08-01-2007, 05:53 PM - Thread Starter
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So continuing on with my calibration and tests I was able to color balance the Sharp to 6500k, but the display easilly falls apart when tryin to push the unit to 35ft/l. It start posterizing and producing noise.

They also seem to do a hard luminance clip at about 75 cd/m2.

I would never recommend anyone EVER buy a Sharp Display....especially for gaming.

Their technical support is terrible, their product line cant hold up to a internationally recognized SMPTE standard. I'll keep supporting them because I have to, not because I want to.

If anyone wants to know more specifics on my results just post on this thread.
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post #11 of 24 Old 08-04-2007, 03:18 AM
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Hi MG,

I am interested to know more about your results with the sharp. first was it a 52" set you did?

did you notice a color push in the primaries?

what values you had the backlight and color temp (in the basic menu) set to?

It would be also very good to see the values you used for the 6 point gamma showing RGB level tracking (with DE per step) and perhaps the gamma curve (if not asking too much )


looking forward to your reply.
Many thanks,

kopa13
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post #12 of 24 Old 08-04-2007, 07:38 AM
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Just to add another question on the Sharp (before) calibration...

I have the 52 XDE1 (UK) model. Now I understand that the US models have the dot-by-dot feature to get 1:1 pixel mapping.

However, the UK one does not have this. Using hdmi outputs in HD signals I only get two options under wide menu; Full mode and underscan.

I have a dvdo vp50 in chain feeding the telly and when I use the full mode (on the telly) I seem to get a (pseudo?) 1:1 by using the overscan on the VP50 by 30%.

If I put the Telly in underscan mode I seem to get a bit tear on the pixel mapping tests. Not very noticeable but noticeable nevertheless which, I don't get with Vp50 overscanning and telly in full mode.

Can someone tell me if it is possible to get 1:1 with this telly? or Am I missing something? btw, I have the sharp setting is all the way down (-10 lowest value in the UK model).

Thanks and Regards,

Kopa13
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post #13 of 24 Old 08-07-2007, 06:24 AM
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@kopa13

Master_Gamma was referring to moddel lc-26d43U which from the model number should be a 26" display.

As for your model, I calibrated the LC42XD1E this weekend, results and settings in the attached zip file.
There are a few strange things in calibrating this model.
When entering the service menu, the display always switches to "high" colour profile and maximum backlight (in our case +8). The service manual for the US model LC46D62U (which is calibration wise identical to the 42" and 52" models acoording to this manual) only states settings for this "high" colour mode; it should be calibrated at a colour temp near 12000K. Once calibrated, the other settings should be fine, with "warm" being close to 6500K.
Unfortunately, this didn't work for me, so I calibrated the "high" setting to 6500K. That's why in my user mode settings you see the colour temp set to "high".

Another anoying thing is the overall gamma. Because the sevice menu defaults to "dynamic" mode, the gamma curve is S-shaped, so you cannot calibarate colour at a certain luminance level for the six calibration points. I simply used the reference points as mentioned in the service manual and kept green at that value while adjusting red and blue. This method yields in usermode a gamma of 1.78. I'm lucky to use a HTPC with ATI card that corrects the gamma to 2.1 (setting 0.85 in the CCC colour settings).

BTW, 1920*1080 from the HTPC gives me a 1:1 pixel mapping on the display. I am using the HDMI input of the TV.

Calibration tools used were a SpyderTV and HCFR Colorimetre software.

regards, Bert

 

P1040010.zip 224.1162109375k . file
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post #14 of 24 Old 08-07-2007, 11:56 AM
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Many thanks for the useful info BertM.

Very strange behavior indeed. Have you tried the "hint" mentioned above about going in and out of the service menu to see the changes?

captures Looking good though. any pictures of the gamma plot?

I have a VP so I am hopping to get to correct gamma (2.2 I'd assumed in dimmed conditions) using the VP50 settings.

I'll probably be using i1 LT colorimeter and HFCR and/or CalMAN (to see differences between the softwares). I have the S2 as well but it is not very accurate for the low perception levels ie <20% (not that it matters that much such low but anyway )

Regarding pixel mapping what setting are you using over hdmi (full mode or underscan)?

PS. I have also PMed you on another matter as well.

Many thanks again for the info.
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post #15 of 24 Old 08-07-2007, 12:09 PM
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Also forgot to mention,

You seem to have tru(D) on (Understanding that actually the setting may be on all the time regardless of the setting, as I read once in the UK AV forums from various posts).
But I would imagine you'd want as less as possible processing on the telly while using the Ativo HD s/w with your ATI (is it the new 2400/2600 series you are using with UVD?) for the processing and upscaling of SD to HD.

Regards,

Kostas
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post #16 of 24 Old 08-08-2007, 04:28 AM
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Here you go, Kostas, some extra info

The TruD setting is shown only because no input was present when I took the picture. Of course I run my TV with as less image processing as possible. With signal on the HDMI the TruD isn't shown.

The TV is in underscan mode. Because ATI has timings that shift the display one line up, I use powerstrip to set correct timings:

Horizontal (pos synch):
scan rate: 56.250 kHz
total pixels: 2640
active: 1920
front porch: 528
synch: 44
back porch: 148

Vertical (pos synch):
scan rate: 50.000 Hz
total pixels: 1125
active: 1080
front porch: 3
synch: 5
back porch: 37

Calibrating the XD1E is much easier than the above mentioned sharp model; while adjusting the values for r, g, b on the six reference points, the readings of the colorimeter changes accordingly, so no use to go in and out of service mode.

And yes, I am using one of the new HD2600XT cards. The program DVBViewer manages my TV (satellite), DVD and of-disk video files. Way better than my old setup with QualiTV and DVDO iScan HD.

regards,
Bert
LL
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post #17 of 24 Old 08-08-2007, 07:39 AM
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Hi Bert,

Sounds nice setup . One of the good things of using HTPC among others, is also the ability to add SDI cards in 2 seconds a difficult procedure otherwise especially for sat receivers....

Regarding PM, the reason I mentioned it is because if I use the full mode I need to use underscan (~30%) on the VP50 to make it pseudo 1:1. So you'd think with underscan on the telly this would be 1:1 native. But like you discovered also it does not give 1:1 precisely. So me too had to adjust the horizontal lines through the vp50 to get it to display the pixel mapping patterns right but still in the checkerboard and horizonta/vertical lines tests (assuming you are familiar with the test patterns since you've had a dvdo vp before) I notice flickering and the one pixel checkerboard is hardly distinguishable even at 1 cm distance from the screen

Regards,

kostas
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post #18 of 24 Old 08-08-2007, 10:42 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael TLV View Post

Greetings

Here's a tidbit for calibration. It's actually very calibration friendly for grayscale ... if you know where to look in the service menu.

The Sharp does not use a traditional cut driver based grayscale system. The TV's base grayscale is done with a six point grayscale system.

This tip came from Randy Tomlinson (Rest is peace, you will be missed.) a few months before he passed on.

Look at the Gamma section of the SM ... Gamma 1.2.3.4.5.6 ... broken down into RGB ...

Each Gamma has three colors ... 1 R .... 1 G ... 1 B ... 2 R ... 2G ... 2B and so on.

They correlate to 20% 35% 50% 65% 80% 95% roughly speaking.

Six point grayscale systems are far preferable to the standard 2 point systems most are used to. The other stuff you see in the service menu are offsets to these master controls ... or at least they are supposed to be.

So here you go ... make sure you write the changes as you go along.

Regards

20%, 35% of IRE, right?

Kinda like a "graphic equalizer" for grayscale - neat concept!

-D
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post #19 of 24 Old 08-08-2007, 04:44 PM
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Greetings

Yes ... IRE ... % gray ...

Regards

Michael Chen @ The Laser Video Experience
ISF/THX/TLV Video Instructor
The Video Calibration Education Hub - www.TLVEXP.com

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post #20 of 24 Old 08-09-2007, 06:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Such valuable information regarding these displays thanks to everyones posts.

My previous post of the unit clipping @ 75 cd/m2 was a result of a procdure sent to me by Sharp of inputing a 100% HD 1080i, component color bar signal and then pressing enter in the HDTV service page so the unit can "self-calibrate" It does alright, but not properly. It alters the "HDTV Y A_GAIN" value.

Based on my tests this actually shifts the clipping level on the luminance output. By generating a peak 100 I.R.E. signal and altering this value to "201" I achieved 120 cd/m2. I would not recommend this "self-calibrate" procedure Sharp Aquos product lines have.

I definitly noticed about a 5000K temperature shift when I as in the service mode and changed values based on the difference. I did a many unplug/plugin/record having no special interfaces to balance it to 6500k in PRO mode. I use Colorfacts Professional software with Greytag Macbeth eye-one probes and Sencore VP401 generators

I am very interested in what was also said about a true 1920*1080 underscan/overscan on this display or was that for a larger model.

Disclaimer: These are my own numbers and may vary with each display but they will get you close . The contrast number is actually a bit high for my application and starts to cause some strange polarizing when these custom gamma settings are used for gaming. Losing details and the whites start to bloom and it produces some noise.

Makes a great picture when attatched to a HD-DVD though.

Sharp Aquos 26d43U calibration settings

User Settings Service menu Settings

Backlight -7 Gamma R1 200
Gamma G1 190
Contrast 30 Gamma B1 149

Brightness 1 Gamma R2 261
Gamma G2 256
Color -3 Gamma B2 206

Tint 1 Gamma R3 456
Gamma G3 436
Sharpness 3 Gamma B3 376

Advanced Gamma R4 566
Color-temp-"LOW" Gamma G4 563
Gamma B4 500

Gamma R5 793
Gamma G5 786
Gamma B5 730

Gamma R6 941
Gamma G6 932
Gamma B6 800

Sorry about the formatting being strange.

Once again thanks for all the posts. My faith in forums has been rekindled.

~MG

P.S. My newly arrived Bravia S-series LCD's are a breathe of fresh air to calibrate.
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post #21 of 24 Old 08-10-2007, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master_Gamma View Post


I am very interested in what was also said about a true 1920*1080 underscan/overscan on this display or was that for a larger model.

Hi MG. Yes the pixel mapping issue was mentioned for a 52" model. Behavior wise and service menu, the 52 is the same with 42 and 46 inch models.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master_Gamma View Post

Disclaimer: These are my own numbers and may vary with each display but they will get you close . The contrast number is actually a bit high for my application and starts to cause some strange polarizing when these custom gamma settings are used for gaming. Losing details and the whites start to bloom and it produces some noise.

Makes a great picture when attatched to a HD-DVD though.

Sharp Aquos 26d43U calibration settings

User Settings Service menu Settings

Backlight -7 Gamma R1 200
Gamma G1 190
Contrast 30 Gamma B1 149

Brightness 1 Gamma R2 261
Gamma G2 256
Color -3 Gamma B2 206

Tint 1 Gamma R3 456
Gamma G3 436
Sharpness 3 Gamma B3 376

Advanced Gamma R4 566
Color-temp-"LOW" Gamma G4 563
Gamma B4 500

Gamma R5 793
Gamma G5 786
Gamma B5 730

Gamma R6 941
Gamma G6 932
Gamma B6 800

Sorry about the formatting being strange.

Once again thanks for all the posts. My faith in forums has been rekindled.

~MG

P.S. My newly arrived Bravia S-series LCD's are a breathe of fresh air to calibrate.

Thanks for this. I do understand the settings vary accordingly and although I missed initially that this was for a 26" model (quite different regarding calibration than mine) I do appreciate you postingyour settings.

Kind Regards,

kostas

p.s. enjoy your Sony
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post #22 of 24 Old 12-02-2007, 02:20 PM
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hello i am spanish
solo daros las gracias por la calibracion , ya iva a devolver el sharp 37xd1e, lo dicho muchas gracias a todos , ahora se ve de maravilla, un saludo desde españa.
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post #23 of 24 Old 07-06-2009, 11:57 AM
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Mayby someone already calibrated SHARP LC-46DH77E or other model from DH77 series?
I found info, that this is very difficult to calibrate this model properly -

hdtvtest.co.uk/news/sharp-lc42dh77e-20090519148.htm

It will be a good starting point for my own "non profesional" settings.
Thank you in advance
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post #24 of 24 Old 11-05-2010, 11:47 PM
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Firstly, apologies for resurrecting an old thread.
TLR; Newbie tip: If you've pushed your user menu to the limit and still can't flatten out your greyscale, it's time to hit the service menu.

Its been several frustrating months trying to get the greyscale of my Aquos LC-40LB700X anywhere near D65 (deltaE's all >10). Hitting the limits of what I could adjust in the user menu, I was getting blues >120% and reds/greens <90% in the upper IRE range. After reading this thread, I decided to have a go at the service menu; previously having avoided it due to the constant stream of warnings. It turns out that the greyscale RGB offsets in the service menu were all defaulted at 0, and by adjusting these, was able to change the range over which I could correct back in the user menu. My deltaE's are now all < 3. Happy days.
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