AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration - Page 115 - AVS Forum
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post #3421 of 3963 Old 09-20-2012, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airscapes View Post

Couple things you have to consider when setting contrast, No discoloration, No color clipping and no Eye Fatigue.
I got lots of that watching football Sunday at the +25 setting.

So set your contrasts so you have 240 flashing, then check the color clipping pattern to make you can see 240 flashing on all 3 colors, if not turn it down till all colors flash at 240. Next check a gray scale ramp and make sure none of the bars are showing any signs of color, if so turn it down till they are all gray. If good then this is a proper contrast setting.
Ok, I'll try that.

Unfortunately if it is still to bright, you can drop it a bit more, try a different mode like Theater if you are not using that to start, add an ND filter (sunglasses for the projector lens) or add bias lighting to reduce eye strain (what I have done.. also helps you find the remote!). Make sure you recheck brightness after adjusting contrast, it is ok to go native. One other thing to remember if your lamp has less the 500 hours on it, it will dim considerable as it gets more hours on it.
I'm in cinema mode. I had just painted the walls and ceiling very dark gray from a white ceiling, light gray walls, a week ago, and that deepened the blacks wonderfully but messed the whites and color up. It's very dark in there now to the point that you can't see the screen from 21 feet away in the middle of the day with the pj off.

I may have to do as you suggest about adding some light as I'm getting a lot of eye strain. I've noticed that my eyes are losing focus when scenes change. I believed that making it a 'cave' would be great but I'm having second thoughts now.

My lamp has around 1300 hours on it in low mode (approximate life, 5000hrs) and by 'going native' do you mean setting it by eye to my own preference? Also, some people suggest to set the contrast first and then brightness but this disk seems to have the opposite order, does it matter?


Hope that helps!
Very much so. The other patterns give me more options to get it right, I would guess. We'll see.
Thank you so much.
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post #3422 of 3963 Old 09-20-2012, 12:32 PM
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yes Brightness first then contrast, then recheck brightness and repeat.
Sounds like an ND filter would be in order to reduce the light output .. or sunglasses for you! cool.gif
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post #3423 of 3963 Old 09-22-2012, 03:44 PM
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I use to do Contrast first and at the sametime mesure the white point and adjust the ftl output.

Then I do brightness and then contrast again.


Now when the new CalMan have been rlsed you can mesure the clipping in the greyscale top.
And then I wonder if you gonna rls a new version for this?
Because the mesurement is on 90,95,96.97.98.99.100 IRE
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post #3424 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 02:03 PM
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Hello, I was wondering if some of the experts here might have some advice for me. I have the PS3 and Xbox 360 and I've been using the AVS HD patterns to calibrate my Panasonic GT30 for both systems in custom mode. I know that every source is going to produce slightly different results and therefore require different calibration, but here's the weird thing.

On Xbox 360 I can push contrast to about 75 and adjust brightness to the proper level and the color steps pattern will be just fine, showing every step of color for all the colors. On the PS3, however, I have to dial contrast way, way down to ensure that the Color Steps will display properly (it's mostly the bright green steps which blend together).

After I dial back the contrast, I can see the last two bright green steps clearly, but then I feel like my overall picture is a bit too dim.

Is the PS3 just inferior? Am I doing something wrong? Any ideas? Thanks in advance to those who reply!
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post #3425 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesb23 View Post

Hello, I was wondering if some of the experts here might have some advice for me. I have the PS3 and Xbox 360 and I've been using the AVS HD patterns to calibrate my Panasonic GT30 for both systems in custom mode. I know that every source is going to produce slightly different results and therefore require different calibration, but here's the weird thing.
On Xbox 360 I can push contrast to about 75 and adjust brightness to the proper level and the color steps pattern will be just fine, showing every step of color for all the colors. On the PS3, however, I have to dial contrast way, way down to ensure that the Color Steps will display properly (it's mostly the bright green steps which blend together).
After I dial back the contrast, I can see the last two bright green steps clearly, but then I feel like my overall picture is a bit too dim.
Is the PS3 just inferior? Am I doing something wrong? Any ideas? Thanks in advance to those who reply!

Use YCbCr output from the PS3, not RGB and turn Super-White On. Also make sure RGB is set to Limited for gaming/XMB/Netflix/etc. (YCbCr output is only available for DVD/BD video playback, nothing else).
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post #3426 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

Use YCbCr output from the PS3, not RGB and turn Super-White On. Also make sure RGB is set to Limited for gaming/XMB/Netflix/etc. (YCbCr output is only available for DVD/BD video playback, nothing else).

I have Super White On already, and I know I set RGB to Limited. I will double check that I have it on YCbCr (I think I do). So given all that, what could be causing this problem?
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post #3427 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesb23 View Post

I have Super White On already, and I know I set RGB to Limited. I will double check that I have it on YCbCr (I think I do). So given all that, what could be causing this problem?

On several of my sets, RGB clips colors more easily... try YCbCr instead.
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post #3428 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

On several of my sets, RGB clips colors more easily... try YCbCr instead.

Ok, I just double checked. I did indeed have it on YCbCr and so that wasn't the issue. I still have to dial the contrast down to avoid color clipping in the bright green, whereas on Xbox 360 I don't. So I'm not sure what the answer is.
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post #3429 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 08:29 PM
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is the xbox set to standard reference levels?
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post #3430 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 08:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

is the xbox set to standard reference levels?

Yes, I had it on expanded for a while but when I decided to calibrate I read that it's better to put in standard. So it's now calibrated in standard, and it has no color clipping at all in the color steps.
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post #3431 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 08:40 PM
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do both consoles have the latest firmware? I know the X360 had a levels issue a while back that was fixed with a firmware update, maybe that's the issue?
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post #3432 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

do both consoles have the latest firmware? I know the X360 had a levels issue a while back that was fixed with a firmware update, maybe that's the issue?

Nope, that can't be it. I have both consoles completely updated. Are we certain that RGB should be limited and Super White should be on? Maybe on the Panasonic GT30 switching one of those might produce better results?
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post #3433 of 3963 Old 09-24-2012, 08:56 PM
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Also, I used the version that's AVCHD and burned to a DVD since I don't have a Blu-ray burner. Maybe that's it? Would I get a better result with the Blu-ray version of AVS?
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post #3434 of 3963 Old 09-26-2012, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesb23 View Post

Also, I used the version that's AVCHD and burned to a DVD since I don't have a Blu-ray burner. Maybe that's it? Would I get a better result with the Blu-ray version of AVS?

I burned both the HDMV and AVCHD version to a DVD+R, and both played back fine on my Sony BDP S185/BX18 bluray player. There were some menu differences, but the images are identical. I like the HDMV (bluray) version a bit better as it gives me better context menu. But in terms of calibration I didn't see any differences in the image themselves.

You can burn the HDMV version to a DVD using your DVD burner, and try play it back on your bluray player. Depending on the player, it may just play fine (as a bluray disc). I tried this first on a DVD+RW disc, since I wasn't sure if it will work or not. Once it worked, I burned it to a DVD+R.
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post #3435 of 3963 Old 09-26-2012, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by wildgoose View Post

I burned both the HDMV and AVCHD version to a DVD+R, and both played back fine on my Sony BDP S185/BX18 bluray player. There were some menu differences, but the images are identical. I like the HDMV (bluray) version a bit better as it gives me better context menu. But in terms of calibration I didn't see any differences in the image themselves.
You can burn the HDMV version to a DVD using your DVD burner, and try play it back on your bluray player. Depending on the player, it may just play fine (as a bluray disc). I tried this first on a DVD+RW disc, since I wasn't sure if it will work or not. Once it worked, I burned it to a DVD+R.

I guess I'll give that a try, thanks. EDIT: Actually, it looks like PS3 isn't a blu-ray player that has DVDM, so I don't think this is possible.
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post #3436 of 3963 Old 10-06-2012, 04:12 AM
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Hi,

I wonder if someone could help.

I've used the basic calibration patterns on my Samsung UE40D5003 LED to great effect.

Recently I went to calibrate it with my Xbox 360 using the MP4 version, but after calibrating I find that games are really dark. I can't tell if that's correct and it's just the game and/or I am just not used to such darks or if something isn't right.

For example in Grand Theft Auto 4, The out of sun shadows are really quite black and in the night time it can be impossible to see in the unlit alley ways. I understand that dark is supposed to be dark, but there is a point where I just can't really play comfortably with it being that dark.

Another example is Battlefield 3, again the dark areas are just so dark, I feel I am at a disadvantage, even though I technically may not be seeing any less.

I guess technically it looks fine, but I feel it can be a real strain to play game with such deep blacks.

Has anyone else had similar issues?
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post #3437 of 3963 Old 10-06-2012, 05:04 AM
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Originally Posted by asou68 View Post

Hi,
I wonder if someone could help.
I've used the basic calibration patterns on my Samsung UE40D5003 LED to great effect.
Recently I went to calibrate it with my Xbox 360 using the MP4 version, but after calibrating I find that games are really dark. I can't tell if that's correct and it's just the game and/or I am just not used to such darks or if something isn't right.
For example in Grand Theft Auto 4, The out of sun shadows are really quite black and in the night time it can be impossible to see in the unlit alley ways. I understand that dark is supposed to be dark, but there is a point where I just can't really play comfortably with it being that dark.
Another example is Battlefield 3, again the dark areas are just so dark, I feel I am at a disadvantage, even though I technically may not be seeing any less.
I guess technically it looks fine, but I feel it can be a real strain to play game with such deep blacks.
Has anyone else had similar issues?

Sure-- Don't feel bad you're not alone in this one. It's a very known & argued/discussed problem with recent updates to the XBOX. I won't go into the real details; but, the jist if it is that correctly switching between YCbCr & RGB is pretty much busted and there's no 100% way to make it work correctly.

But you can get close.

http://forums.xbox.com/xbox_forums/general_discussion/f/135/p/171713/1784906.aspx#1784906

The above xbox forum link has four pages of some pretty intense back and forth.

The jist of it is if you're a gamer, you'll need to set the XBOX 360 Color Space to RGB (not Auto or Source), and the Reference Levels to Expanded. On your TV, set the HDMI Black Level to NORMAL (Not Low). Turn of Dynamic Contrast on the TV, then calibrate with the MP4 disk--
Here's the catch. You'll need to calibrate from the Xbox MediaCenter Extender, NOT the build in MediaPlayer.

I have a Samsung UND8000 and have gone this way and it's the only way that gets me correct games and video playback (netflix, hbo go, amazon, windows media center).
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post #3438 of 3963 Old 10-06-2012, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by osburnfamily View Post

Sure-- Don't feel bad you're not alone in this one. It's a very known & argued/discussed problem with recent updates to the XBOX. I won't go into the real details; but, the jist if it is that correctly switching between YCbCr & RGB is pretty much busted and there's no 100% way to make it work correctly.
But you can get close.
http://forums.xbox.com/xbox_forums/general_discussion/f/135/p/171713/1784906.aspx#1784906
The above xbox forum link has four pages of some pretty intense back and forth.
The jist of it is if you're a gamer, you'll need to set the XBOX 360 Color Space to RGB (not Auto or Source), and the Reference Levels to Expanded. On your TV, set the HDMI Black Level to NORMAL (Not Low). Turn of Dynamic Contrast on the TV, then calibrate with the MP4 disk--
Here's the catch. You'll need to calibrate from the Xbox MediaCenter Extender, NOT the build in MediaPlayer.
I have a Samsung UND8000 and have gone this way and it's the only way that gets me correct games and video playback (netflix, hbo go, amazon, windows media center).

ah I see thanks alot!

Unfortunately the issue now is trying to get Xbox Media Center Extender working without it disconnecting before I play something.

EDIT: It seems I can't even play the MP4 files as the Xbox Media Center Extender is giving me an error about having files installed to play the videos....
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post #3439 of 3963 Old 10-07-2012, 09:18 AM
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I should also mention that I use the AVCHD DVD on my Panasonic BMP - BD75. The only issue I encounter was having to press the "skip back" button twice to get it to go the prior clip.
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post #3440 of 3963 Old 10-08-2012, 10:23 AM
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when using the black clipping pattern on my new Samsung LED-LCD, a brightness setting of 45 shows digital 17 flashing brightly and a setting of 44 shows it either flashing very, very faintly or not at all (can't tell for sure, it's too subtle)... should I use 44 or 45 for the brightness setting?
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post #3441 of 3963 Old 10-08-2012, 11:44 AM
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on 45 how far down can you see flashing bars?
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post #3442 of 3963 Old 10-08-2012, 12:34 PM
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Hi everyone, sorry for my english )
I have questions about the setup, calibration PS3 "game mode" on the TV needs to be turned on or off? (I have a Samsung UE40EN6037) settings should be the "default"?
Please do explain how to start USB Flash drive? I download the files that represent the disk image that I can not run USB Flash drive.
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post #3443 of 3963 Old 10-08-2012, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by visca blaugrana View Post

on 45 how far down can you see flashing bars?

17 since BTB is not being passed, but 17 is very bright
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post #3444 of 3963 Old 10-09-2012, 03:33 AM
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I would go for 44 but that's because I like black to be black and not gray.



Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
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post #3445 of 3963 Old 10-09-2012, 09:52 AM
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Should I be using the fields for contrast, and grayscale adjustment on an LCD/LED? If so, when setting contrast, do I still target 30-40 ftL using the 100% gray field as I would do with the 100% gray window?
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post #3446 of 3963 Old 10-09-2012, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by visca blaugrana View Post

I would go for 44 but that's because I like black to be black and not gray.
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

that's what I thought too, which is why I've been using 44 since I got the TV over a week ago... just wanted to make sure it was the right thing to do
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post #3447 of 3963 Old 10-09-2012, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daMaster View Post

Should I be using the fields for contrast, and grayscale adjustment on an LCD/LED? If so, when setting contrast, do I still target 30-40 ftL using the 100% gray field as I would do with the 100% gray window?

it should be the same for both windows and fields... fields are only necessary on LED/LCD when there is local or global dimming present that dims the backlight on lower APL patterns/scenes
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post #3448 of 3963 Old 10-12-2012, 05:50 AM
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Hi!

I own an LG 42LD650. It has ISF Expert mode with plenty of options, color filters, etc. I have no colorimeter, unfortunately, and i do all adjustments by eye.

When i set the primary colors to perfectly match the Flashing Color Decoder chart, i do re-check the Color Bars, wich appears ok, but the center bar (green) turns "bluish" or "washed blue" when looking through the blue filter, instead of black. Is it normal?

Thanks!
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post #3449 of 3963 Old 10-23-2012, 06:16 PM
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Been out of the game awhile. Was wondering if you folks feel the grayscale windows on 709, the APL windows on 709, or the 10% sized windows on the GCD disc would be best for a newer plasma grayscale calibration. I was kinda of thinking the 10% windows on GCD, since the accupels have used 10% size windows for awhile. Thanks.

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post #3450 of 3963 Old 10-30-2012, 07:15 AM
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Hey guys,

I also want to calibrate my Samsung LED-TV to get the best results out of it. But I have some issues with the white levels. I cannot get the reference white (value 235) no matter what I am setting in the adjustments menu (Brightness, Contrast, etc.). All picture enhancements are off. It is always more like a gray than a white and I can see other gray values beyond 235. Other than that, in the blinking color pattern (under Misc. Patterns) I only see the green channel blinking. As soon as I put on xvYCC color space enhancement I can also see the red and blue channel blinking (from 219 to 235).

The black reference level is really easy to calibrate but I have issues with the white one. For the test I used the AVCHD version of the AVD HD 709 patterns burned on a DVD.

Here is my device chain (all bought in Germany, so should all be European device versions):

- Panasonic DMP-BD60 Blu-ray Player
- Denon AVR-1610
- Samsung LED-TV Series 7 UE32B7090

This is what my AVR says for the HDMI input signal from my Blu-ray player:

- Color Space: YCbCr 4:4:4
- Pixel Depth: 12 bits

(Hm, shouldn't it be 8 bits?)

Here are my device settings so far:

DMP-BD60:

- HDMI Video Mode: On
- HDMI Video Format: Automatic
- 24p Output: On
- HDMI Output Range: Standard (What does Enhanced do? 0-255 xvYCC extended range?)
- HDMI Audio Output: On

Samsung LED-TV Series 7 UE32B7090:

- Backlight: 8
- Contrast: 100
- Brightness: 51
- Sharpness: 13
- Colour: 50
- Tint: G51/R49
- Black Tone: Off
- Dynamic Contrast: Off
- Gamma: 0
- Colour Space: Auto
- White Balance (default values: 25)
- Flesh Tone: 0
- Edge Enhancement: Off
- xvYCC: actually Off (but as I mentioned the red/blue channel only appear blinking when On)
- Colour Tone: Normal
- Size: Screen Fit
- Screen Mode: 16:9 (grayed out)
- Digital NR: Off
- HDMI Black Level: Normal (grayed out)
- Film Mode: Off (grayed out)
- 100 Hz Motion Plus: Off
- Blue Only Mode: Off

So any suggestions? TIA! smile.gif
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