AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration - Page 133 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #3961 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 08:57 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
alluringreality's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Freeman View Post
its going to be my first time on Plasma.
This sort of thing might get more of a response in the main forum. The measurements I've looked at on plasma tend to vary xy, Y, and gamma depending on the chosen measurement patterns, so I consider it a given that the display will also vary to some extent in typical use. My impression is that the general opinion is to choose smaller windows than are available from this project for both xy and Y measurements. Exact recommendations might vary to some extent depending on the model, since discussions across various models seem to suggest potential operational differences. I never encountered what I considered a well-documented explination for how to approach plasma calibration across various models with a single measurement series in a way that clearly compares against how fixed-backlight LCDs measure, where xy and Y are absolutely tied to the video level displayed, but there are some other pattern sets that are more focused around providing various patterns for measurements. Zoyd and Chad B have posted some very thorough measurement data on a couple plasma displays, but otherwise the plasma discussion was too subjective for my taste, and I decided I would just measure how my own display operates with a few pattern series if I ever bought one.

Last edited by alluringreality; 07-14-2014 at 09:20 AM.
alluringreality is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #3962 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 09:19 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
alluringreality's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deaddy View Post
One thing I don't understand is the gamma setting, and how to set that. In Cinema mode I believe the default gamma is at -2 so I left it there. In other modes it's at 0.
The easiest way to look at gamma in the way it's usually discussed is with measurements. If you don't have a way to measure the display, then the best you can likely do is to try to find measurements from someone that has measured their TV of the same model. I believe on Sony displays lowering the gamma control tends to increase gamma. In that case the -2 setting would likely be intended for a room with very limited lighting (there's a misc. pattern related to room lighting), while the 0 setting would likely be intended for very bright rooms. For more information than you likely want to know about gamma see:
http://www.poynton.com/GammaFAQ.html

Last edited by alluringreality; 07-14-2014 at 09:24 AM.
alluringreality is offline  
post #3963 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 10:00 AM
AVS Special Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,820
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, If you have de-saturated a primary (for example Blue) it will contain green-red, it will not be a pure blue anymore, so viewing this throu a blue filter it will look no right.
A high quality blue filter effectively removes this green-red. Is it as ideal as using external instrumentation? No, I never said that, but if you can provide external documentation (a link), not written by you, which discusses your claim that blue filters simply aren't a valid method when adjusting a modern, non-CRT display that uses the three color primaries, such as traditional plasmas and LCDs, please provide it. I'd like to read more about it.


[Companies which manufacture or sell colorimetry instruments obviously have a stake in this game and might scoff at any "poor man's method", but if that's the only kind of link you can provide me with, I'll take that too. ]


Thanks.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

m. zillch is offline  
post #3964 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 11:32 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
A high quality blue filter effectively removes this green-red. Is it as ideal as using external instrumentation? No, I never said that, but if you can provide external documentation (a link), not written by you, which discusses your claim that blue filters simply aren't a valid method when adjusting a modern, non-CRT display that uses the three color primaries, such as traditional plasmas and LCDs, please provide it. I'd like to read more about it.


[Companies which manufacture or sell colorimetry instruments obviously have a stake in this game and might scoff at any "poor man's method", but if that's the only kind of link you can provide me with, I'll take that too. ]


Thanks.
Hi, I haven't found or searched about any document that is available on-line about that topic. My recommendation is coming by calibration experience with different display technologies over the years because I'm using meters to verify the calibration results, and they are not match any color filter, I have THX Glasses, Digital Video Essentials R/G/B Filters, Spears & Munsil v1 & v2 filters here....there is not perfect match of a filter to a perfect calibrated modern display.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3965 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 12:19 PM
Advanced Member
 
sawfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 753
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
A high quality blue filter effectively removes this green-red. Is it as ideal as using external instrumentation? No, I never said that, but if you can provide external documentation (a link), not written by you, which discusses your claim that blue filters simply aren't a valid method when adjusting a modern, non-CRT display that uses the three color primaries, such as traditional plasmas and LCDs, please provide it. I'd like to read more about it.
Here's an hour-old post from Spears of Spears and Munsil fame, who sell a well-regarded setup disk and began to supply a blue filter in the 2nd edition due to popular demand, despite believing "they are not reliable":

Spears & Munsil HD Benchmark Blu-Ray 2nd Edition
ConnecTEDDD likes this.
sawfish is online now  
post #3966 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 12:24 PM
AVS Special Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,820
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 103
pending


[edited after having read the above post]


Poor man's solutions are never as good as using high quality external instrumentation, I've said that all along, however I don't agree with this:


Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, Blue Filter Glasses are useless for displays other than CRT.

We now know that this assentation was based on personal experience, and is not an industry wide accepted opinion.

Blue filters vary from make to make (maybe even batch to batch), unfortunately making results slightly inconsistent, true, however the basic premise of attempting to visually replicate a display which has a true "blue mode only" setting works by using a good blue filter, at least for any display technology based on a three primary colors design, including conventional plasmas and LCDs.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..


Last edited by m. zillch; 07-14-2014 at 12:45 PM.
m. zillch is offline  
post #3967 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 12:56 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
Blue filters vary from make to make (maybe even batch to batch) unfortunately making results slightly inconsistent, true
Another reason that are inaccurate, if you use 4 different blue filters you will see slight different results.

Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
however the basic premise of attempting to visually replicate a display which has a true "blue mode only" setting works by using a good blue filter for any display technology based on a three primary color design, including conventional LCD and plasmas.
If a display has a Blue only mode, then you don't need to use any blue filter.

This reply is from Joel, the lead programer of SpectraCAL's CalMAN software:

Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post
The blue filter is an old method that was designed for displays with color and tint only. Any display with a CMS fundamentally breaks the paradigm the blue filter is based off of. Blue filters work because red should have no blue and green should have no blue in them. But an oversaturated red or an over saturated green needs to have blue added to be de-saturated to it's target. So the blue filter now has blue light coming from all three primaries, making it's "match the luminance" method of adjustment no longer capable of giving you an accurate result.

And all of that is before we even get into the accuracy of the plastic filter itself. In case I need to elaborate on that, the filters don't aren't matched well enough to the response of the display. So even when the filters work, they are far less accurate than a meter.
This is coming from Michael Chen, THX/ISF Instructor:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael TLV View Post
All the blue filters are not accurate. They were designed for CRT phosphors.

The purpose of the filter is to get you into the ballpark of where correct should be. YOu use your eyes as the final determiner after that.

regards
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael TLV View Post
One does not use the blue filter for calibrating RGB on TVs. It is only a tool for doing color and tint and nothing else. Depending on the technology, its usefulness may also be limited. They are designed to work best with CRT type technology ... not LCD ... DLP ... Plasma.
Blue filters used before 10 years, when the calibration software/meter access were so limited and so expensive.....now in 2014 you can get an amazing for the performance colorimeter like i1d3 for 150$ and use an open source software for free, there is no reason to use any blue filter anymore.

Now all displays are coming with 6-Axis CMS controls, noone is using color/tint anymore.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3968 of 3981 Old 07-14-2014, 01:39 PM
AVS Special Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,820
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 103
If anyone reading this has links to a third party source that doesn't sell/distribute colorimetry gear, software, or training in using them, which concurs that blue mode only or good quality blue filters used to simulate blue mode only, is for some reason useless for non-CRT displays, that use the three primaries, including plasmas and LCDs, please post it. Thanks.


Sorry, not looking for forum posts or personal blogs.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..


Last edited by m. zillch; 07-14-2014 at 01:49 PM.
m. zillch is offline  
post #3969 of 3981 Old 07-18-2014, 04:03 PM
Member
 
carillon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 174
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I downloaded the MP4 file, decompressed and burned it to a DVD-R. Viewing the disc on my laptop shows all the individual folders etc. My Xbox doesn't read it, when I insert it, all it says is mixed media content. What am I doing wrong? Thanks
carillon is offline  
post #3970 of 3981 Old 07-18-2014, 04:10 PM
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by carillon View Post
I downloaded the MP4 file, decompressed and burned it to a DVD-R. Viewing the disc on my laptop shows all the individual folders etc. My Xbox doesn't read it, when I insert it, all it says is mixed media content. What am I doing wrong? Thanks
You didn't read through the very first post apparently. You have to download the appropriate file type for what you are trying to do. The MP4 files are for using via a media PC or the like. You need to burn one of the other file types to a DVD-R, assuming your XBox can read a DVD-R with blu-ray formatted data.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #3971 of 3981 Old 07-18-2014, 05:01 PM
Member
 
carillon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 174
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Mickunas View Post
You didn't read through the very first post apparently.
Below is what I read and thought would work...

"MP4 (.exe) or MP4 (.7z)
Plays on: Many MPEG-4 AVC or H.264 video players. For example computer video players, or the Xbox 360 after update. See the player specifications for types of video supported.
Media: Depends on player, for example the Xbox 360 can play files from DVD media."
carillon is offline  
post #3972 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 01:43 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
We now know that this assentation was based on personal experience, and is not an industry wide accepted opinion.
Hi, there some other professionals that have the same opinion with my post about Blue Filters to this thread also.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3973 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 10:11 AM
AVS Special Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,820
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 103
^Thanks, but I might not have been clear that my last sentence [which I've now underlined below, for emphasis] was referring to what sort of links I was seeking:
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
If anyone reading this has links to a third party source that doesn't sell/distribute colorimetry gear, software, or training... Sorry, not looking for forum posts or personal blogs.
But thanks anyways. Ideally I'm looking for original research and scholarly papers, although I realize those are often hard to come by.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, there some other professionals that have the same opinion with my post about Blue Filters to this thread also.
And then there are some professionals in that same thread, such as Don Munsil, co-creator of the Spears and Munsil calibaration disc, which concurs with me that the basic premise of blue mode only calibration didn't "go away" when CRTs did and "is more than accurate enough to be used by professionals", even if using external colorimetry instrumentation is admittedly, generally more accurate, which I never questioned:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmunsil View Post
The blue-only mode is extremely accurate, and does not rely on your eyes' color sensitivity; it couldn't, because the image is monochromatic. The test relies on your eyes' sensitivity to small brightness differences, which works great. If the blue filter works for your display (i.e. it cuts out the red and green and you don't have wide-gamut display with an active CMS), then it's also quite accurate; more than accurate enough to be used by professionals. It's also fast and has very few gotchas. It's definitely the go-to way to adjust color and tint for displays that it works for. Using instruments is much slower.
Although it is true that not all blue filters are created equal in there ability to filter away red and green (some having higher quality than others), so how well they replicate using a display with a true "blue only" mode switch is a good question, let's not forget that using external instrumentation can have some possible drawbacks compared to using blue mode, as well:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmunsil View Post
With a colorimeter, you have the problem that some of them are really inaccurate with light sources with spiky spectra, and that sadly describes a lot of modern display technologies. So it's very possible to get a worse calibration with a colorimeter, if it can't read your display accurately.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..


Last edited by m. zillch; 07-23-2014 at 10:16 AM.
m. zillch is offline  
post #3974 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 10:23 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
^Thanks, but I might not have been clear that my last sentence [which I've now underlined below, for emphasis]But thanks anyways. Ideally I'm looking for original research and scholarly papers, although I realize those are often hard to come by.
No problem, I understand, but it's dificult to find published documents for calibration methods that was used the last 2 decades @ 2014.

Calibration is not possible by any type of filter 1$ that is coming with disks or by photographic use quality and more expensive ones (Rosco E-Colour Tokyo Blue #071 or Lee Sheet Colour Filter #071 Tokyo or Kodak Deep Blue Tricolor #47B ) or by user eyes.

Just the blue filter glasses report is no matching of the results from my JETI 1211 (11.000$) spectro of a calibrated display. JETI says that I'm correct, the glasses that I'm off....

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3975 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 12:08 PM
AVS Special Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,820
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
No problem, I understand, but it's dificult to find published documents for calibration methods that was used the last 2 decades @ 2014....
I guess companies continue to produce non-CRT displays to this very day, including ISF certified ones, with "Blue Mode Only" switches [which is sort of like using a "perfect" blue filter] is because many experts like Don Munsil are of the mind that the method is still fundamently, "extremely accurate" and "is more than accurate enough to be used by professionals" as he put it in that recent, 07-14-2014 quote above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Just the blue filter glasses report is no matching of the results from my JETI 1211 (11.000$) spectro of a calibrated display. JETI says that I'm correct, the glasses that I'm off....
Without knowing what your actual dE value is[see:http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/Delta_...lor_Difference], knowing that your particular blue filter's calibration measures differently than another method doesn't really do anything for me. As an analogy, if one amp measures as having .001% THD and another one as .0001%, that means nothing to real world, human perception. [No offense, but you also don't strike me as being a "neutral, unbiased calibrator" when it comes to carefully using either a good blue filter or an actual blue mode only non-CRT display, since some patience and diligence is involved and we already know you deem the method "useless", as you put it, plus there's no need to tell me the price of your calibration gear, by the way.]
---


On a side note, I find that source material varies so widely, even just changing from one TV broadcast station to the next or movie disc to movie disc, that any attempt to reach a magical "perfectly accurate color calibration" seems pointless to me. Getting a display "in the ballpark" is usually good enough for me. [This statement of course opens me up to condescending put down attacks of "Well, obviously you just aren't a discerning individual who has a taste for the finer things", etc., but such insults stick to me about as well as water to a duck's back.]

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..


Last edited by m. zillch; 07-23-2014 at 12:56 PM.
m. zillch is offline  
post #3976 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 12:29 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
[No offense, but you also don't strike me as being a "neutral, unbiased calibrator when it comes to carefully using a good blue filter or an actual blue mode only design, and there's no need to tell me the price of your calibration gear.]

I find that source material varies so widely, even just changing from one TV broadcast station to the next or movie disc to movie disc, that any attempt to reach a magical "perfectly accurate color calibration" seems pointless to me.

Any use of Blu-Filter is useless if you have reference measuring gear. Anyone can use any type or filter that makes him happy with the results or makes him believe that he has calibrated his CMS with that 1$ filter. No problem.


Most of people prefer dynamic mode from any calibrated mode...

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3977 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 12:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
Without knowing what your actual dE value is[see:http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/Delta_...lor_Difference],
Thank you for the dE link, I will read it carefully, I have seen this dE numbers to my reports many times but I was aware what these number means exactly.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3978 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 12:43 PM
AVS Special Member
 
airscapes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 4,573
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Liked: 107
looks like this thread is a wee bit off topic!
airscapes is online now  
post #3979 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 12:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
I guess companies continue to produce non-CRT displays to this very day, including ISF certified ones, with "Blue Mode Only" switches [which is sort of like using a "perfect" blue filter], is because many experts like Don Munsil are of the mind that the method is still fundamently, "extremely accurate" and "is more than accurate enough to be used by professionals" as he put it in that recent, 07-14-2014 quote above.
ISF/THX Displays have a lot of wrong descriptions to their controls, for example:

They say Brightness....someone will think that this is adjusting the display's backlight for more peak output.....the correct term is Black Level.

They say Contrast, the correct term is White Level.

They say 10-IRE , 20-IRE etc.....wrong too..IRE is term for analog signal...the levels are different...7.5IRE is the reference black in analog term. They have to say 10% Gray etc.....

They say Sharpness.....we live in digital world, artificial detail control...the digital signal no need any sharpness adjustment...does PC monitors need sharpness controls?

Control descriptions are all coming from CRT analog world.... Blu-Filter too.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3980 of 3981 Old 07-23-2014, 12:59 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ConnecTEDDD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by airscapes View Post
looks like this thread is a wee bit off topic!
I'm moving out... sure it's off-topic.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS + CalMAN ColorChecker
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, CalPC, ControlCAL
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
ConnecTEDDD is online now  
post #3981 of 3981 Old Yesterday, 12:54 PM
Senior Member
 
RyanHomsey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 256
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 13
I recently calibrated my plasma (samsung F5350) via PS3 with this disc (blu ray version). RGB set to limited. Got everything real nice (attacked grey scale and gamma via i1d2/HCFR).

Decided to move my Xbox One into that room with the plasma. Xbox One will not allow burned blu ray discs so I had to burn the AVC version on a DVD to use with it.

Where everything was perfect with the PS3/BluRay AVS Disc, with the XB1/AVC AVS Disc the grey scale is shifted way red ... and all bars are visible in the white clipping pattern (there's nothing that can be done to make them visible).

What gives?

XB1 is also set to limited.

Is the AVC disc burned to a DVD giving me skewed readings? The picture looks good, aside from an issue I had from one clip in netflix (which prompted me to check it with the AVC disc), which makes me think something is off with what the disc is telling me. Something is off....

**UPDATE** : I put in my spears/munsil calibration blu ray and it revealed the same thing. That rules out the calibration disc being a problem... Not sure what the issue is.

I'm stumped. I've been through every setting attempting to get white level right to no avail. Anyone have any insight on this? I feel like I must be overlooking some trivial/simple thing.

**UPDATE AGAIN** :

I hooked up both my XB1 and PS3 to a different TV (Vizio FALD LED-LCD) to see if there was any difference in white level readings. They were exactly the same, the patterns turned white at the reference white level (bar #235 ).

Why can I not get a white level with the XB1/Plasma while I can with the PS3/Plasma? Doesnt make any sense to me.

(all settings left he same)
PS3/LCD - Works Great!
XB1/LCD - Works Great!
PS3/Plasma - Works Great!
XB1/Plasma - Whacked out grey scale and severely crippled white output!??!?

Last edited by RyanHomsey; Yesterday at 02:46 PM.
RyanHomsey is online now  
Reply Display Calibration

Tags
Lcd Hdtv , Led Hdtv , lg bp530
Gear in this thread

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off