AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration - Page 22 - AVS Forum

AVS Forum > Display Devices > Display Calibration > AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration

Display Calibration

azyme's Avatar azyme
04:08 PM Liked: 10
post #631 of 4106
03-28-2008 | Posts: 25
Joined: Jan 2007
Sorry, I meant HD DVD. I was looking at the first page for the correct titles and just typed in the name of the first download. HD DVD A30.
alluringreality's Avatar alluringreality
09:03 AM Liked: 41
post #632 of 4106
03-31-2008 | Posts: 3,204
Joined: Jul 2006
I checked the original video and I looked at the two patterns on my player. They seem to match from what I can see. If it has to do with the A30, I don't know.

Honestly I always found the APL pattern a little difficult to read, so I might change it to more closely resemble the clipping patterns. I had been putting off making a new release, but it doesn't look like there's going to be an inexpensive way to author 24p with menus for Blu-ray anytime soon. Because of that, I suppose we might as well update the disk to 1.0 at some point. It would just be minor changes to the Basic Settings, Adjust Gray, Near Black, and Near White sections.
nicholc2's Avatar nicholc2
02:19 PM Liked: 10
post #633 of 4106
03-31-2008 | Posts: 1,138
Joined: Nov 2006
Not sure if someone has mentioned this yet, but would it be possible to add 0% IRE at the beginning of the "Adjust Gray" chapter? That's a great chapter if you're wanting to do the 4 step calibration in HCFR, but you have to use a 0% field from 10% or 5% and then go back. Would be nice to have that before 25%.
alluringreality's Avatar alluringreality
03:05 PM Liked: 41
post #634 of 4106
03-31-2008 | Posts: 3,204
Joined: Jul 2006
The adjust gray section started out like the high low grayscales that for example GetGray includes. White was added for 100% light readings and 50% was added for a middle grayscale check. I somewhat miss the point of having black, because I'm not aware of any meters that are going to be accurate anyway with a low light level. I'm open to other thoughts on this, but I don't get it and I'd probably just measure 25% twice and then paste a previously measured black.
scivian's Avatar scivian
04:22 AM Liked: 10
post #635 of 4106
04-11-2008 | Posts: 109
Joined: Dec 2007
Can I just use "AVCHD" without a hardware device (colormeter?) and get a semi adequate calibration on my Samsung 650?
hwjohn's Avatar hwjohn
07:29 AM Liked: 10
post #636 of 4106
04-11-2008 | Posts: 1,018
Joined: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by scivian View Post

Can I just use "AVCHD" without a hardware device (colormeter?) and get a semi adequate calibration on my Samsung 650?

There are some patterns that only require your eyes, such as the flashing black bars for setting brightness. Most of the color related patterns at least require a blue color filter. A blue filter can get you in the ballpark.

You probably want to start off by reading the first post in this thread, that should help you get started.
bodean's Avatar bodean
10:10 PM Liked: 26
post #637 of 4106
04-11-2008 | Posts: 625
Joined: Mar 2008
So I can use the HD DVD disc to calibrate my tv, even though I have no other tools? Or should I just go on what others have calibrated it with, and use those settings?
CT_Wiebe's Avatar CT_Wiebe
02:13 AM Liked: 11
post #638 of 4106
04-12-2008 | Posts: 6,437
Joined: Nov 2003
The reason for calibration software (discs) is that no 2 displays are identical. Other members settings may be close, but are not the best for your set. Other than the disc and your eyeballs, no other instrumentation is needed for a reasonably good calibration. Using quality instrumentation, or hiring a professional calibrator will get you the last 5% to 10% closer to perfection.

The biggest problem with calibration is psychological (your brain is easily fooled and hard to correct). Most people have never seen a well calibrated set (the ones in the stores are way off, because they sell sets that way). You have to do a calibration and use it for a week. You will discover that the picture actually looks more natural and realistic, once you get rid of the preconceived notions of what a good video display looks like.

Yes, you should use the HD DVD disc to tweak your set. You also want to get the THX Optimizer glasses (blue filter), so you can adjust the color (see hwjohn's previous post, #636). The site is www.thx.com/home/dvd/blueGlasses.html, per Google - but it is not responding right now (an alterate link is www.thx.com/home/dvd/optimizer/index.html, but it is not responding either).
kjgarrison's Avatar kjgarrison
11:04 AM Liked: 11
post #639 of 4106
04-13-2008 | Posts: 2,243
Joined: Feb 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by CT_Wiebe View Post

The reason for calibration software (discs) is that no 2 displays are identical. Other members settings may be close, but are not the best for your set. Other than the disc and your eyeballs, no other instrumentation is needed for a reasonably good calibration. Using quality instrumentation, or hiring a professional calibrator will get you the last 5% to 10% closer to perfection.

The biggest problem with calibration is psychological (your brain is easily fooled and hard to correct). Most people have never seen a well calibrated set (the ones in the stores are way off, because they sell sets that way). You have to do a calibration and use it for a week. You will discover that the picture actually looks more natural and realistic, once you get rid of the preconceived notions of what a good video display looks like.

Yes, you should use the HD DVD disc to tweak your set. You also want to get the THX Optimizer glasses (blue filter), so you can adjust the color (see hwjohn's previous post, #636). The site is www.thx.com/home/dvd/blueGlasses.html, per Google - but it is not responding right now (an alterate link is www.thx.com/home/dvd/optimizer/index.html, but it is not responding either).

This is the same "blue" as in the AVIA and DVE packages isn't it?
CT_Wiebe's Avatar CT_Wiebe
02:45 PM Liked: 11
post #640 of 4106
04-13-2008 | Posts: 6,437
Joined: Nov 2003
Yes the THX Optimizer Glasses use the same "blue" as in the AVIA package (= Kodak Deep Blue Tricolor #47B). The "blue" filter in the DVE package is a different shade of blue, but appears to give the same results (and seems to work better with some plasma displays). The equivalent Lee Filter (to the AVIA filter) is their Tokyo Blue #071 filter.

NOTE: The Red and Green filters in AVIA and DVE packages are the same. The DVE "blue" filter seems to have an added UV filter component, which is why it seems to work better with those plasma displays that also radiate in UV wavelengths.
scivian's Avatar scivian
04:22 PM Liked: 10
post #641 of 4106
04-13-2008 | Posts: 109
Joined: Dec 2007
Thanks for your help. I have read the first page along with a few of the links.

My Samsung 650 has a blue filter setting. I am about to get a PS3 so then I can put the AVCHD in the Blu-Ray player for calibration. Will the disc tell me how to use the blue filter and what to look for?
CT_Wiebe's Avatar CT_Wiebe
05:12 PM Liked: 11
post #642 of 4106
04-13-2008 | Posts: 6,437
Joined: Nov 2003
I don't think so. That's why you need to read the first posts in this thread, that's where the instructions are. You might also want to go to www.calibrate.tv and scan towards the bottom of that page. You will find the GetGrayReadme.zip file there. Download it and read it (it's geared towards the GetGray caldisc, but should give you a general idea and some more information).

If your Samsung has a "blue filter" setting, that's really all you should need - since it should turn off the red and green video (= guns on a CRT). It doesn't hurt to get the THX Optimizer glasses anyway, for future use with other displays.
soccerluv's Avatar soccerluv
08:06 PM Liked: 10
post #643 of 4106
04-14-2008 | Posts: 76
Joined: Nov 2005
Just a quick question on the brightness patterns. Do I need to set brightness from my seating area or should I be up close to the TV to read the patterns?

I am loving this disk!
alluringreality's Avatar alluringreality
07:08 AM Liked: 41
post #644 of 4106
04-15-2008 | Posts: 3,204
Joined: Jul 2006
I would probably err on the side of being able to make out 234 flashing from where you're seated. My digital TV has a color shift in the grayscale and gamma drops when contrast is set high, so without anything more to go on I'm just going to tend toward being slightly conservative when setting white-level.
soccerluv's Avatar soccerluv
05:18 PM Liked: 10
post #645 of 4106
04-15-2008 | Posts: 76
Joined: Nov 2005
thank you for the reply!
WolfyA's Avatar WolfyA
10:25 AM Liked: 10
post #646 of 4106
04-22-2008 | Posts: 192
Joined: Jul 2007
alluringreality, any chance that you and the ones behind this excellent effort will release a set of media files from the AVS HD content, i.e. .wmv (WMV-HD) or .mkv (matroska, AVC)?
alluringreality's Avatar alluringreality
11:48 AM Liked: 41
post #647 of 4106
04-22-2008 | Posts: 3,204
Joined: Jul 2006
The original files are mpeg2 video. Although m2ts is somewhat still an obscure format, on a quick google search I would guess that xport could demux the BDMV back to the original files. Once you had more common filetypes by demuxing you could probably put it into whatever filetype you wanted. There might also be ways to transcode m2ts, but generally that sort of thing is outside the original intent and I'm not sure there would be much demand for general video file types.

EDIT: I suppose we could upload .mpg or .ts like w6rz.net for anyone recording HD for playback on a computer if there were more requests for that sort of thing.
WolfyA's Avatar WolfyA
04:47 PM Liked: 10
post #648 of 4106
04-22-2008 | Posts: 192
Joined: Jul 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

... EDIT: I suppose we could upload .mpg or .ts like w6rz.net for anyone recording HD for playback on a computer if there were more requests for that sort of thing.

That's exactly what I would be very interested in, the format of the files are less important, I just posted a couple of examples, .mpg or .ts would be fine. Thank you for the quick reply and for the tips. I'm not at home with converting so I would definitely trust files uploaded by you more than my own feeble attempts. We'll see if anyone else shows any interest in this, otherwise I guess it's just me
WTS's Avatar WTS
05:25 PM Liked: 10
post #649 of 4106
04-22-2008 | Posts: 1,769
Joined: Nov 2002
I wouldn't mind getting a .ts file of your AVS disc.
nicholc2's Avatar nicholc2
07:02 PM Liked: 10
post #650 of 4106
04-22-2008 | Posts: 1,138
Joined: Nov 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

The adjust gray section started out like the high low grayscales that for example GetGray includes. White was added for 100% light readings and 50% was added for a middle grayscale check. I somewhat miss the point of having black, because I'm not aware of any meters that are going to be accurate anyway with a low light level. I'm open to other thoughts on this, but I don't get it and I'd probably just measure 25% twice and then paste a previously measured black.

If you just measure 25% twice, then it'll mess up the gamma curve. I only mentioned this because with HCFR you can set it up to do 0, 25, 50, 75, 100 and that comes in handy to get initial settings sometimes until you get down and dirty getting it lined in with the normal 0, 10, 20, etc. Right now, to do 0, 25, 50, 75, 100, I have to start with 0 from another chapter and then go to the gray measurement chapter to get the rest. Was just a suggestion for those who use HCFR and want to do a 4 point grayscale instead of a 10.
alluringreality's Avatar alluringreality
08:01 PM Liked: 41
post #651 of 4106
04-22-2008 | Posts: 3,204
Joined: Jul 2006
On the older version of HCFR I never had any issues with copy and paste, but for some reason I can't seem to copy and paste in values for 0% on this computer. It's only one image, so I'll throw it on my list of items to consider for the final release.
nicholc2's Avatar nicholc2
08:22 AM Liked: 10
post #652 of 4106
04-23-2008 | Posts: 1,138
Joined: Nov 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

On the older version of HCFR I never had any issues with copy and paste, but for some reason I can't seem to copy and paste in values for 0% on this computer. It's only one image, so I'll throw it on my list of items to consider for the final release.

Cool. Was just a suggestion. BTW, Awesome Job on both versions!
WTS's Avatar WTS
07:20 AM Liked: 10
post #653 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,769
Joined: Nov 2002
Hi,

I use a copy of the AVS BR disc in my PS3 and when it is on the title page my projector (Barco Cine8) says it is in 1080p, but when I go to any of the test patterns it switches to 1080i. I don't know if this is a problem with the disc or the PS3, anyone else have a PS3 who has tried this disc.
hwjohn's Avatar hwjohn
08:07 AM Liked: 10
post #654 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,018
Joined: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by WTS View Post

Hi,

I use a copy of the AVS BR disc in my PS3 and when it is on the title page my projector (Barco Cine8) says it is in 1080p, but when I go to any of the test patterns it switches to 1080i. I don't know if this is a problem with the disc or the PS3, anyone else have a PS3 who has tried this disc.

Are you using the BDMV version or AVCHD version? The AVCHD is 1080i, but it doesn't really make any difference for the patterns.
WTS's Avatar WTS
09:03 AM Liked: 10
post #655 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,769
Joined: Nov 2002
Hmmm, good question, I just downloaded the one that was meant for the PS3 at the time. I'll have to look at what file it was when I get home.

I know it really doesn't make any difference but I have several cal blocks in my PJ and one is cal'd for 1080p and the other is cal'd for 1080i sources.
hwjohn's Avatar hwjohn
09:09 AM Liked: 10
post #656 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,018
Joined: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by WTS View Post

Hmmm, good question, I just downloaded the one that was meant for the PS3 at the time. I'll have to look at what file it was when I get home.

I know it really doesn't make any difference but I have several cal blocks in my PJ and one is cal'd for 1080p and the other is cal'd for 1080i sources.

If you burned it to a DVD, then it is the AVCHD version.

All of the patterns should be accurate for any resolution (except for geometry related patterns), provided that your display chain doesn't do anything funny when it scales. Even the geometry related patterns should be fine for 1080p<-->1080i.

We had been working on 1080/24p for AVCHD, but it isn't easy. I'm the hold up on that end. We have taken a break with the release of RC1, but I'm thinking about running some more tests for 1080p AVCHD soon and we will probably make RC1 --> 1.0 soon, so keep your eyes open.

alluringreality, are you ready to start working on this again?
WTS's Avatar WTS
05:05 PM Liked: 10
post #657 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,769
Joined: Nov 2002
Hi,

Yes it was the AVCHD iso I burnt to the dvd. Okay so it's all in 1080i, but why does the title page come up as 1080p?

Not sure why the PS3 isn't taking it from 1080i to 1080p.
sperron's Avatar sperron
05:51 PM Liked: 11
post #658 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 847
Joined: Dec 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by WTS View Post

I use a copy of the AVS BR disc in my PS3 and when it is on the title page my projector (Barco Cine8) says it is in 1080p, but when I go to any of the test patterns it switches to 1080i. I don't know if this is a problem with the disc or the PS3, anyone else have a PS3 who has tried this disc.

The PS3 will not deinterlace 1080i material. You can force it to output 1080i as 1080p by unchecking the 1080i selection in the video options. However if you do force 1080i to 1080p. it outputs each field as an individual frame (it scales each 1920x540 field to 1 1920x1080 frame).
hwjohn's Avatar hwjohn
06:03 PM Liked: 10
post #659 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,018
Joined: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by WTS View Post

Hi,

Yes it was the AVCHD iso I burnt to the dvd. Okay so it's all in 1080i, but why does the title page come up as 1080p?

Not sure why the PS3 isn't taking it from 1080i to 1080p.

alluringreality could better answer that question, but it basically has to do with the authoring software we use. AFAIK, it is normal.
WTS's Avatar WTS
07:01 PM Liked: 10
post #660 of 4106
04-24-2008 | Posts: 1,769
Joined: Nov 2002
Thanks for your answers guys. I guess I'll have to wait for 1080p test patterns or for Sony to change the firmware.
Tags: Lcd Hdtv , Led Hdtv , lg bp530

Gear in this thread - bp530 by PriceGrabber.com
Reply Display Calibration

Subscribe to this Thread

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3