AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration - Page 8 - AVS Forum
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post #211 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 06:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awssvtt View Post

I did sucessfully downloaded both versions and it did worked for HD-DVD and PS3. However, the author mentioned that these 2 versions were created mainly for 1080P projector. Can these versions be utilized for a 720P front projector. Many thanks for the works.

Lin

You should be able to use all of the patterns for a 720p projector except for the single pixel patterns (the 3 patterns at the end of the Misc. section). Those patterns are intended for 1080p only. Everything else should be fine.

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post #212 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 09:22 AM
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Hey All,

Downloaded and used AVS HD 709 HD-DVD version last night for my 37" LCD HDTV, however I am unable to view the video black reference bar (bar 16) in basic settings for all the test patterns. How would one go about calibrating their set if they are unable to ever see bar 16?

Regards,

Craig
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post #213 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

If you can't see 16, then you can take black-level as low as it's possible to still see 17. You don't necessarily need 16 or below-black to set black-level, and 17 is actually all that's really needed. On my TV I have to get right up close to the screen to tell when 17 is flashing and when it begins being clipped, but it's very clear that it shows on one setting and going any lower will clip 17.

Thank you so much for the reply. So basically you want to bring black level down (brightness) to the point that if it goes one step lower, you will fail to see 17 flashing anymore.

Correct?
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post #214 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 10:38 AM
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Any recommendations for setting the contrast properly on an LCD using the grey-scale ramps pattern? (The pattern that has the dots at video black, 50% and 100%)
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post #215 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccraig View Post

Correct?

That's right. The lowest setting you can go before 17 disappears is most likely the correct level as long as you can still see the dark gray bars on the 2nd APL pattern also flash. There's an edge on the 2nd pattern that I use to tell when it's flashing.

Some TVs might clip at different levels depending on the APL of the image. DVE HD has pluge patterns on their windows which I suppose is intended to show the effect. We could probably put some dark gray on our window patterns show the same effect, but to this point no one has complained about any problems with using the first pattern for digital TVs and then double checking with the second pattern. My TV doesn't seem to exhibit any changes in where it clips regardless of APL, so any pattern changes in this area would have to be by request.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mccraig View Post

Any recommendations for setting the contrast properly on an LCD using the grey-scale ramps pattern?

Someone else would have to address that. I tried to present what seemed some of the best information I've ran across for setting contrast. While I have found the ramp useful for some applications, I haven't used it for contrast.
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post #216 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

That's right. The lowest setting you can go before 17 disappears is most likely the correct level as long as you can still see the dark gray bars on the 2nd APL pattern also flash. There's an edge on the 2nd pattern that I use to tell when it's flashing.

Some TVs might clip at different levels depending on the APL of the image. DVE HD has pluge patterns on their windows which I suppose is intended to show the effect. We could probably put some dark gray on our window patterns show the same effect, but to this point no one has complained about any problems with using the first pattern for digital TVs and then double checking with the second pattern. My TV doesn't seem to exhibit any changes in where it clips regardless of APL, so any pattern changes in this area would have to be by request.



Someone else would have to address that. I tried to present what seemed some of the best information I've ran across for setting contrast. While I have found the ramp useful for some applications, I haven't used it for contrast.

Thank you again for your continued support! It is very much appreciated.

I have found that setting the contrast to be the most difficult task for myself, at least on a Digital Display. I've read for the grey-scale ramp and colour contrast that you can turn the contrast up until you notice that the lighter bars begin to blend (or rather, you cannot delineate them anymore). The strange thing for me is that when I turn my contrast all the way up, i can still delineate them.

I will set the brightness again via the two APL patterns and then retry contrast again.
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post #217 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 11:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccraig View Post

I have found that setting the contrast to be the most difficult task for myself, at least on a Digital Display.

I agree, so I changed the description a bit to make this link http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post12471330 stand out more. Without being able to measure light levels, the first three steps are about the best description I've read.
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post #218 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 07:15 PM
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I have burnt the HD version on to sevral different dvd-r and +r s with no success.
I have used

Nero 7
Imgburn
Roxio

I have tried it on

PS3
A2

On my A2, it seems to freeze after it reaches the menu screen.
PS3, it displays as a data disc and it just shows couple of folders within the disc.

I have tried it on various speeds but I had no success...

Any ideas?
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post #219 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang View Post

I have burnt the HD version on to sevral different dvd-r and +r s with no success.
I have used

Nero 7
Imgburn
Roxio

I have tried it on

PS3
A2

On my A2, it seems to freeze after it reaches the menu screen.
PS3, it displays as a data disc and it just shows couple of folders within the disc.

I have tried it on various speeds but I had no success...

Any ideas?


Not sure what is wrong. AVS HD has been confirmed as working on both the PS3 (AVCHD version) and A2(HD DVD version). Maybe try a different burner?

AVS HD 709 - Free calibration disks
The 2007 Patriots: 18 -1
Tom who?
"...the small of napalm in the evening breeze, as I crouch behind a shopping cart in the parking lot..." - The Mall Ninja
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post #220 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang View Post

I have burnt the HD version on to sevral different dvd-r and +r s with no success.
I have used

Nero 7
Imgburn
Roxio

I have tried it on

PS3
A2

On my A2, it seems to freeze after it reaches the menu screen.
PS3, it displays as a data disc and it just shows couple of folders within the disc.

I have tried it on various speeds but I had no success...

Any ideas?


Not sure what is wrong. AVS HD has been confirmed as working on both the PS3 (AVCHD version) and A2(HD DVD version). Maybe try a different burner?

AVS HD 709 - Free calibration disks
The 2007 Patriots: 18 -1
Tom who?
"...the small of napalm in the evening breeze, as I crouch behind a shopping cart in the parking lot..." - The Mall Ninja
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post #221 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 07:43 PM
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i tried it on my different burner sony, LG and Asus with no success.
Perhaps different region code?

I live in US.

Thanks for the fast reply btw.
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post #222 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang View Post

i tried it on my different burner sony, LG and Asus with no success.
Perhaps different region code?

I live in US.

Thanks for the fast reply btw.

There shouldn't be any region codes, but if there are, they would be US as well.

You aren't by chance getting the two formats mixed up are you? AVCHD for PS3 and HD DVD for A2...

Can you explain step by step what you are doing in ImgBurn?

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post #223 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 08:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang View Post

I have burnt the HD version on to sevral different dvd-r and +r s with no success.
I have used

Nero 7
Imgburn
Roxio

I have tried it on

PS3
A2

On my A2, it seems to freeze after it reaches the menu screen.
PS3, it displays as a data disc and it just shows couple of folders within the disc.
I have tried it on various speeds but I had no success...

Any ideas?

I used Imgburn to burn both discs on DVD-R. The AVCHD version played fine on my 40GB PS3, and the HD DVD version also played fine in my XBOX 360 addon. In both cases, on my Windows machine, I right-clicked on the iso file, and selected "Burn using ImgBurn", and everything went fine.
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post #224 of 3971 Old 01-04-2008, 10:33 PM
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hmm.. someting was apparently wrong with my computer.

I burned again using sony drive and sony dvd-r and now it works like charm.
Sorry for the inconvenience guys and thanks for everything.
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post #225 of 3971 Old 01-05-2008, 05:07 AM
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... may be the patterns (windowed and full field) for the saturation measurements of the primary and secondary colors @0%, @25%, @50%, @75% (like the HCFR SD DVD).

Do you think that is possible?

Thank u so much,
acta.

Ups ... another question: I've made the calibration of my EX1 (european versione of the AX1) using your HD test.
I've made a perfect setting using your patters.
But when I watch a movie it seems that I've lost so many shades in the dark areas of the image.
I've also the white crushing.

This is so strange.

I've spoken about this with a italian AV Guru (Luciano Merighi) that has a immense experience about producing DVD test discs.
He suggest to give an enormous attention on the settings of the encoder video.
A wrong setting can produce a compression of the levels 0-255 into 16-235. That's an error that Luciano made in the first releases of it's dvd test.

What kind of HD encoder you're using?

acta.
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post #226 of 3971 Old 01-05-2008, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actarusfleed View Post

... may be the patterns (windowed and full field) for the saturation measurements of the primary and secondary colors @0%, @25%, @50%, @75% (like the HCFR SD DVD).

Do you think that is possible?

Thank u so much,
acta.

Ups ... another question: I've made the calibration of my EX1 (european versione of the AX1) using your HD test.
I've made a perfect setting using your patters.
But when I watch a movie it seems that I've lost so many shades in the dark areas of the image.
I've also the white crushing.

This is so strange.

I've spoken about this with a italian AV Guru (Luciano Merighi) that has a immense experience about producing DVD test discs.
He suggest to give an enormous attention on the settings of the encoder video.
A wrong setting can produce a compression of the levels 0-255 into 16-235. That's an error that Luciano made in the first releases of it's dvd test.

What kind of HD encoder you're using?

acta.

We use HCenc, which is a free MPEG2 encoder. The levels have been checked on disc in YCbCr space, and verified as correct.

AVS HD uses video levels (16-235), so if your projector is expecting PC levels(0-255), I suppose that could cause some problems. In general, no DVD should be mastered using PC levels.

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post #227 of 3971 Old 01-05-2008, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actarusfleed View Post

when I watch a movie it seems that I've lost so many shades in the dark areas of the image.
I've also the white crushing.

Encoding is hwjohn's area, and outside of a comparison on that player against DVE HD I really don't have any ideas. To this point the levels have matched between this disk and the others I've measured with my players.

Like mentioned in one of my replies above, I suppose it's possible some displays might clip at different levels depending on APL. Levels can certainly look subjectively different depending on APL, even if they're not being clipped. Without more information I can't say if either might be the case with what you're observing.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Actarusfleed View Post

... may be the patterns (windowed and full field) for the saturation measurements of the primary and secondary colors @0%, @25%, @50%, @75% (like the HCFR SD DVD).

Do you think that is possible?

I know this sort of thing was requested in the GetGray thread, but I don't know how many people would actually find it useful. With the two SXRDs I've owned, there aren't any controls to make adjustments so it wouldn't really be useful for me. I would like to hear from people that would actually be able to use the pattern because it's certainly creatable, but my impression is that probably only a rather small portion of equipment is actually going to be able to make adjustments from the readings.

The authoring software we're using is rather limited. In order to keep the disk somewhat streamlined so that it's useable, patterns have to be limited. If other inexpensive authoring software was to become available or someone offered to author the disk with better software, that could change. At this time though, I have to be rather selective with what to include and how to include it. What you're suggesting is 60 patterns, which is a lot in comparison to the current disk size. While I might choose to include a full set of 10% grayscale and 75% color fields, generally I'm not convinced that fields are widely useful. Many TVs also only actually produce primaries, so even if I went with windows I don't know that I would include secondaries.
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post #228 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 08:27 AM
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Downloaded the HD-DVD .exe, extracted it, downloaded ImgBurn and made copy on DVD+R using all the default ImgBurn settings.
I end up with a "Not recognized DVD" error on my Tosh HD-D3.
Any ideas?
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post #229 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 11:22 AM
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Download and install 'DVD Decrypter' .

Very simple, just set it to ISO write and make your copy.
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post #230 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 01:31 PM
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i used this with my 360 add on and i must say this is far more accurate than dve hd. primarily in the color adjustment dept. my brightness needed to go up a couple of notches and i found out i was going in the wrong direction toggling color and tint. everything looks great. i peeked at the geometry testing screen and it looked way too zoomed. and i know mine is correct so i wont use that pattern. anyone looking to tweak color, brightness and grayscale will be pleasantly surprised with the disc. its better than hd dve and its free.
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post #231 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyR View Post

Download and install 'DVD Decrypter' .

Very simple, just set it to ISO write and make your copy.

Imgburn is the software DVD Decrypter uses.
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post #232 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

Imgburn is the software DVD Decrypter uses.

DVD Decrypter and ImgBurn are two different programs, written by the same author (LightningUK). The steps for each are very similar. ImgBurn is currently under development, while DVD Dec development stopped some time back because of legal issues.

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post #233 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiolab1 View Post

Downloaded the HD-DVD .exe, extracted it, downloaded ImgBurn and made copy on DVD+R using all the default ImgBurn settings.
I end up with a "Not recognized DVD" error on my Tosh HD-D3.
Any ideas?

Make sure you are doing an "ISO write." I'll try to post a tutorial some time soon since people seem to be having problems with it.

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post #234 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whityfrd View Post

i peeked at the geometry testing screen and it looked way too zoomed.

Can you give us some more info on this?

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post #235 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hwjohn View Post

DVD Decrypter and ImgBurn are two different programs, written by the same author (LightningUK). The steps for each are very similar. ImgBurn is currently under development, while DVD Dec development stopped some time back because of legal issues.


My point is that if you have a problem with Imgburn, DVD Decrypter won't be any better.
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post #236 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

My point is that if you have a problem with Imgburn, DVD Decrypter won't be any better.

Not true, it is different and that makes it "better".
DVD Decrypter worked for me where Imageburn did not when making a copy of this disk.

Come on, it cost's nothing at all to give DVD Decrypter a try except a few minutes time and it does work with +, - DVD RW's everytime for this cal disk.

Edit: As an after thought I would completly remove Imageburn and then reboot before installing DVD Decrypter. Maybe an wasted exercize but could be worth the trouble.
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post #237 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 03:22 PM
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I used Imgburn on both iso's and they both worked fine.
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post #238 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 03:38 PM
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Same thing here.
ImgBurn did not work, DVD Decrypter using the same burner and media worked fine. I selected burn from ISO in ImgBurn. So who knows?!

One question now that I have the disc working.
I originally setup my 42" Sony GWIII using DVE and most adjustments were confirmed to be correct with this disc. However, I'm confused with the White Clipping Pattern test. With my current settings, I see no white bars flashing anywhere on the pattern. What does this suggest I need to adjust? And should it be adjusted at the source or the display?

Thanks guys for your hard work and a fantastic HD tool!!!
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post #239 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 04:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiolab1 View Post

Same thing here.
ImgBurn did not work, DVD Decrypter using the same burner and media worked fine. I selected burn from ISO in ImgBurn. So who knows?!

One question now that I have the disc working.
I originally setup my 42" Sony GWIII using DVE and most adjustments were confirmed to be correct with this disc. However, I'm confused with the White Clipping Pattern test. With my current settings, I see no white bars flashing anywhere on the pattern. What does this suggest I need to adjust? And should it be adjusted at the source or the display?

Thanks guys for your hard work and a fantastic HD tool!!!

If you don't see any white bars at all, then you are clipping whites pretty severely (assuming something isn't wrong with your playback device). Try lowering the contrast and see if the bars start to appear.

AVS HD 709 - Free calibration disks
The 2007 Patriots: 18 -1
Tom who?
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post #240 of 3971 Old 01-06-2008, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
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Can you give us some more info on this?


after adjusting for overscan with dve hd, the geometry tweaking screen should be aligned in full tact with all circles within the edges of your screen. this is the case with dve hd. i was able to get my overscan and geometry spot in with dve hd. with this disk, i just decided to look at it and the outer edges of the circles are cut out of the picture. like its incredibly zoomed. anybody else experience this?
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