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post #2371 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 02:53 PM
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Thanks!
I have a PS3, and only DVD burner. So, I assume I should get the AVCHD version, is this right?
What is the differences between HDMV and AVCHD is both can be burnt to DVD burner and played through PS3 (according to the list)? Do they have same resolution and frame rate etc?
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post #2372 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 03:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post

Thanks!
I have a PS3, and only DVD burner. So, I assume I should get the AVCHD version, is this right?

Yes


Quote:


What is the differences between HDMV and AVCHD is both can be burnt to DVD burner and played through PS3 (according to the list)? Do they have same resolution and frame rate etc?

The PS3 is one of the players that will not play HDMV from DVD. AVCHD includes some information that the PS3 requires to play the disc from DVD media. Both versions share the same video files.
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post #2373 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 05:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bama29 View Post

I have a Panasonic DMP-85 that seemed to get stuck in some type of a disk loading loop. It required a power off to gain control of the player and eject the disk. The DMP-85 was able to play the AVCHD version 1.3 without issue. Not sure exactly what is going on with that.

To create the current version labeled AVCHD I tried using the HDMV and multiAVCHD re-author. I figured out why the previous PATCHED version would not play correctly on PowerDVD and fixed that. I hadn't ran into this item.

Based on some text in the multiAVCHD program, and other comments, I have a theory at what could be going on. The menus you see on screen can be created a couple different ways. My best guess is that the Panasonic is expecting a different type of menu for AVCHD, and the other players are not respecting this expectation. If this is the issue, I'm not aware of a way to fix it without knowing a lot more about Blu-ray/AVCHD authoring.

The AVCHD could be authored separately with a true AVCHD authoring program, like the last version. It's just a rather large project to consider, especially since I use HDMV and have no personal interest in AVCHD. I somewhat anticipated this might happen again, like what happened with v1.2, but I still haven't decided what to do with it. Really the current version marked AVCHD is simply an improved PATCHED version. The most expedient thing to do would be to rename the AVCHD to REAUTHOR or PATCHED. I'm not sure I can at all justify the sort of time investment a true AVCHD authoring would take unless this turns out to be a much larger issue.
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post #2374 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

I think I'm going to let this one sit for a few days to see if more AVCHD-compatible players balk at the current "AVCHD" authoring.

Just want to confirm the behavior reported in the other post regarding the BD85 as I also ran into this issue today. I'm currently downloading the HDMV version to see it that works.

UPDATE: Just tried it and, as expected, it was a no-go. So for at least the time being I'll need to stick to the prior version.
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post #2375 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

To create the current version labeled AVCHD I tried using the HDMV and multiAVCHD re-author. I figured out why the previous PATCHED version would not play correctly on PowerDVD and fixed that. I hadn't ran into this item.

Based on some text in the multiAVCHD program, and other comments, I have a theory at what could be going on. The menus you see on screen can be created a couple different ways. My best guess is that the Panasonic is expecting a different type of menu for AVCHD, and the other players are not respecting this expectation. If this is the issue, I'm not aware of a way to fix it without knowing a lot more about Blu-ray/AVCHD authoring.

The AVCHD could be authored separately with a true AVCHD authoring program, like the last version. It's just a rather large project to consider, especially since I use HDMV and have no personal interest in AVCHD. I somewhat anticipated this might happen again, like what happened with v1.2, but I still haven't decided what to do with it. Really the current version marked AVCHD is simply an improved PATCHED version. The most expedient thing to do would be to rename the AVCHD to REAUTHOR or PATCHED. I'm not sure I can at all justify the sort of time investment a true AVCHD authoring would take unless this turns out to be a much larger issue.

I absolutely understand. I would think you should wait for more feedback, to see if it is indeed a much larger problem, rather than isolated to a few players, before investing a lot of time. I thank you for the answer, and still can make good use of your work by using my PS3. Evidently that is not so picky.

If I can be of assistance in testing any fixes you might decide to pursue, please call upon me.

Thanks again,

Michael
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post #2376 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 06:30 PM
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I successfully downloaded and decompressed the AVCHD-2a and the AVCHD-2a-alt files and burned the ISO on my MacBook running OS-X 10.6.3 with all current updates. Neither disc will play on my Panasonic BD80. Both the AVCHD v1.3 and Patched v1.3b made on the same MacBook work perfectly.

The 2a and 2a-alt ISO size are both 4 459 790 336.
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post #2377 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by billcushman View Post

Panasonic BD80. Both the AVCHD v1.3 and Patched v1.3b made on the same MacBook work perfectly.

Thanks for the feedback. This supports what I suspected. Three replies above this I posted a comment that is also relevant for your player. The next part probably won't make much sense without reading that reply first.

On Doom9 people talk about in-mux and out-of-mux menus. In-mux menus have the background and the controls in the same stream (single m2ts file), while out-of-mux menus have different streams (two m2ts files) for the menu controls and background. The new version uses an out-of-mux menu, while all the previous versions use in-mux menus. The out-of-mux menu allowed me to solve the previously-reported PowerDVD issue, but it seems to be the cause of the new Panasonic playback item. I've read that AVCHD is supposed to have in-mux menus, so the Panasonic players are basically just going by the book the same as PowerDVD not playing the v1.3 Patched version.

I'm not currently aware of a way to solve both the PowerDVD and Panasonic items, without doing a complete AVCHD re-author. That's what was done for v1.3, and it could be recreated. I think the AVCHD includes over 90 sections, but it might be quicker to just do a reauthor than trying to figure out a way to mux the menus based on what I've seen so far. Doing the chapters with BDedit might be faster than how they were done on the last version.

Building the AVCHD is much easier than the HDMV, because it doesn't offer popup menus or items like the top navigation, but it's still a significant task and makes the project more complex from a development standpoint. For example I believe the AVCHD authoring was why CalMAN continued to host the old version. Currently I'm leaning towards again creating a true AVCHD, like was done for v1.3, but it will take some time. Likely it will end the project, and any future pattern changes from CalMAN, ChromaPure, or ColorHCFR will be unsupported, simply because 3 distinct versions where I have no interest in 2/3 makes no sense to continue.


Quote:
Originally Posted by T Morris View Post

UPDATE: Just tried it and, as expected, it was a no-go. So for at least the time being I'll need to stick to the prior version.

I'll take it you mean HDMV on DVD media.


Anyway, thanks to everyone for the good feedback. I had figured the two snags hit so far might show up. If using the .iso for Blu-ray holds I'm at least 1 for 3 on guesses.
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post #2378 of 4075 Old 10-31-2010, 11:49 PM
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The AVCHD version works perfectly on my Samsung BD-C6900.

I love the new main menu and popup menu layouts. Navigating the disc is infinitely easier. Very nice job!
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post #2379 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 05:15 AM
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Only thing i don't like on this version is the menu at the top. Can't navigate it if you have a 2.40 aspect ration set up. Wish it was in the 2.40 aspect range.

Athanasios
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post #2380 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 05:18 AM
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I downloaded and burned to DVD the AVCHD.exe iso.
It worked very well on my PC. (I like it, thanks, a great job)
Unfortunately it don't play on my Panasonic BD30.
The AVCHD version 1.3 had no problems on my Panasonic BD30.
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post #2381 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 06:09 AM
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Norton Internet Security 2011 flagged the download (AVCHD.exe) and immediately removed it. I found it in Quarantine and was able to get it back. After burning the disk, it worked great.
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post #2382 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 07:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nashou66 View Post

Only thing i don't like on this version is the menu at the top. Can't navigate it if you have a 2.40 aspect ration set up. Wish it was in the 2.40 aspect range.

All the releases have been standard 1080p, so I don't know how the new version is any different.
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post #2383 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 07:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biriem View Post

Unfortunately it don't play on my Panasonic BD30.

Thanks for the feedback. There will probably be some sort of a re-author. I suspected some players could end up balking at the re-authoring but it didn't show up in initial testing. This is a rather large change and I haven't decided how to handle it yet.
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post #2384 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 08:30 AM
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FWIW, the main download site triggers "Untrustworthy" warnings from Norton. Not so for the mirror.

Also Orbit Downloader installs a bunch of additional functionality, even though I declined all the offered additional components, that I did not expect and haven't yet decided if I want.
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post #2385 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 08:35 AM
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I visited Best Buy to check the new versions that won't play on my Panasonic BD80. They only had a Samsung player hooked up. Both discs worked fine on the Samsung (model number unknown). I will try to check them on other players tomorrow. A friendly local store is closed on Mondays.

I also tried turning 24p off on the Panasonic. It still would not play either disc.
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post #2386 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 08:44 AM - Thread Starter
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The newest version of BDedit has some new editing functions that were unavailable the last time I looked at AVCHD compatibility. I have one last idea that I'm going to try to correct a multiAVCHD issue that I previously encountered. If that works on my players, I'll need some Panasonic testing later. The upside would be that popup menus would remain, but the way the top menu works would have to change. It took me about half a week to figure out the PowerDVD issue, so this could take some time. I pulled the first post because the AVCHD is the most popular version.
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post #2387 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 11:08 AM
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Downloaded AVCHD, HDMV, hash checked and burned with Image Burn.
AVCHD to DVD and HDMV to 25GB BR.

HDMV success with Panasonic BD65, BD60, LG BD390, BR drive on Gateway NV59C09 (Bundled OEM PowerDVD), LG combo (HDDVD,BR), LG BR burner on main PC using Powerdvd ver 7.3 (OEM bundled with LG combo drive)

AVCHD fails on Panasonic BD65, BD60.
AVCHD success with LG BD 390, Gateway drive, Both BR drives on main PC.

Link to Gateway laptop in case anyone is interested:
http://www.gateway.com/systems/produ...46.php#prodBar

alluringreality: Congratulations and thanks, excellent product. As a ChromaPure user, those patterns are especially welcome.

FYI: Cyohash, free open source, calculates MD5, SHA1, CRC32, works on XP, Vista, Win7 32/64 bit versions. Shows in file context menu.

http://www.cyotec.com/2009/09/cyohash.html

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post #2388 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 11:31 AM
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Alluringreality,

I did a test run with the HDMV-2a.EXE posted above burned to a regular DVD +R.

The Panasonic DMP-85K gave a "This disk is not compatible" error and would not load.
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post #2389 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 12:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bama29 View Post

I did a test run with the HDMV-2a.EXE posted above burned to a regular DVD +R.

The Panasonic DMP-85K gave a "This disk is not compatible" error and would not load.

HDMV is a Blu-ray format, and it's very hit or miss on DVD media. Generally the playback varies by manufacturer. Except for the PS3, Sony will play it. Denon and Magnavox will. Apparently the recent Panasonics are a no.
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post #2390 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catmother View Post

AVSHD to DVD and HDMV to 25GB BR.

Thanks for the reply. I'll take it this was AVCHD.
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post #2391 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

HDMV is a Blu-ray format, and it's very hit or miss on DVD media. Generally the playback varies by manufacturer. Except for the PS3, Sony will play it. Denon and Magnavox will. Apparently the recent Panasonics are a no.

I figured it was a long shot, but at least gave you some more data to think about
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post #2392 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 02:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, the idea I wanted to check out for a fix also looks like a long shot. I have not found any tools to convert Mpeg-2 video to AVC video, while also retaining the menu controls that are included in the .m2ts files. I can demux, trancode to AVC, and remux the attached video, but the menu controls from the .m2ts are lost in the process.

 

00008.zip 204.59765625k . file
Attached Files
File Type: zip 00008.zip (204.6 KB, 6 views)
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post #2393 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

All the releases have been standard 1080p, so I don't know how the new version is any different.

The Previous version had the menus on the side going vertical. With that set up even if you had a 2.4 aspect set up you can still see the top and bottom choices. Now All i see is the AVS-HD. None of the choices along the top are visible.If the menu choices were lower to with in what would be below the 2.4 aspect id be able to see them, now I have to use my oppos 1/2 size function to see what i select, like cal man , then i select any of the cal man choices then i can go back and zoom out to normal size. I can work around it but its just annoying. Other wise its a very nice disc.

Athanasios
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post #2394 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 03:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

Thanks for the reply. I'll take it this was AVCHD.

Yes, my bad, corrected my post.

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post #2395 of 4075 Old 11-01-2010, 04:44 PM
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For the AVCHD version on my PS3, I noticed that the flashing bars in the black clipping pattern had some lines going through them and other weird artifacts. Didn't seem to notice this on the APL clipping pattern though. Overall, 17 seems brighter now at the same brightness setting on my TV, but the end setting did not change in the process.
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post #2396 of 4075 Old 11-02-2010, 09:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

For the AVCHD version on my PS3, I noticed that the flashing bars in the black clipping pattern had some lines going through them and other weird artifacts.

I've looked at the patterns on my Sony player and two computer decoders. I'm not seeing anything unusual.


Quote:


Overall, 17 seems brighter now at the same brightness setting on my TV

The text was dimmed by request for plasma displays, and all the AVC video was recoded based on newer information.


Quote:


the end setting did not change in the process.

Based on this I wasn't really going to consider it, but since I'm going to have to make a test disc for the Panasonic playback I may throw some other patterns on it for this. Since I'm not seeing anything unusual, my best guess is that maybe it has to do with what I think may be referred to as dithering on plasmas. I don't have a plasma to consider the idea, and without more feedback I don't have much of a guess.
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post #2397 of 4075 Old 11-02-2010, 10:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nashou66 View Post

2.4 aspect set up

The top menu, APL menus, ChromaPure, and the HDTV Calibration video were the ideas I liked enough to make Version 2. The initial AVCHD idea was a disaster, so I'll eventaully make a new one. So far I haven't had any ideas I like enough to address this on the HDMV, but the consistent top menu and popup menus are going to have to be scrapped on the AVCHD. I suppose I could fit the main menu text into 2.35:1 on the AVCHD. For me the project is mainly about trying out different design ideas and seeing how they turn out, so I'll throw it on the list for the AVCHD and see if I can come up with anything I like.


Quote:


I have to use my oppos 1/2 size function to see what i select, like cal man

The navigation is intended to be uniform in some respects. The main menu should always start at Basic Settings. Up on Meter Position should always go to Basic Settings. So you could count over three places right of Basic Settings for CalMAN, even if you can't see it. The sections are all intended to go to Windows as the initial choice.
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post #2398 of 4075 Old 11-02-2010, 11:18 AM
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More data/confirmation of previous, mostly.

Panasonic DMP BD-60 result:

AVCHD to DVD: No. Just ejects the disk without any explanation

HDMV to DVD: No. Says "incompatible disk"

I saw a poster (catmother) list the BD-60 as a "success" earlier for HDMV burned to BR. Could be the media. Mine is Sony DVD-R

The post on players lists DVDM ?, but I don't see a download for DVDM.
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post #2399 of 4075 Old 11-02-2010, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post

I've looked at the patterns on my Sony player and two computer decoders. I'm not seeing anything unusual.




The text was dimmed by request for plasma displays, and all the AVC video was recoded based on newer information.




Based on this I wasn't really going to consider it, but since I'm going to have to make a test disc for the Panasonic playback I may throw some other patterns on it for this. Since I'm not seeing anything unusual, my best guess is that maybe it has to do with what I think may be referred to as dithering on plasmas. I don't have a plasma to consider the idea, and without more feedback I don't have much of a guess.

Upon a second look, it seems what issues I saw were only clearly apparent in a very dark room and did not ultimately alter the functionality of the pattern.

On a separate note, the convergence patterns under the misc. section don't work properly in terms of chapter skip (must hit skip many times before pattern changes or use fast forward for a long time) and there is a huge delay to go from the misc patterns sub menu to the first convergence pattern.

All these observations were on my PS3 with the AVCHD version and a Samsung CCFL-LCD.
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post #2400 of 4075 Old 11-02-2010, 03:09 PM
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I visited a friendly local retailer today and checked both the 2a and 2a-alt discs on two different players.

Both discs played perfectly on the Sony BDP-S470. Using the Sony player remote, all functions appeared to work properly.

They also played on the Samsung BDC5900. The store was not using the Samsung remote, but was using a programmed universal remote. The Chapter skip function did not work, but I suspect this was not the fault of the player or disc.

I talked to the person who programmed the remote today (11/3) and he said that to skip chapters, the remote was pre-programmed to use the Channel +/- buttons, and that the Chapter skip did not work.
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