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post #15961 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by emartins View Post
@slyderulz

For the giggles I did plug in my 3D BR player into the XB1. It did not want to give the 3D signal though. It came up as a normal 2d image. I swapped the HDMI back to the original and it went right back to 3D image. Back to the xb1 and the signal goes 2d. I didn't need the extra input as I just purchased a switch but I was curious as it could of come handy with my outdoor setup.
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post #15962 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 07:51 AM
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Count me in for 3D BD on the Xbox One. I really hope they add that sooner.

And as an owner of a 7.2 audio setup, I do hope they fix the audio bugs as well.
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post #15963 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by slyderulz View Post
.......The kid still loves 3D and despite what's happening in the consumer space, arguably to of the biggest movies of the past year were both 3D releases in the theater - "Frozen" and "How to Train Your Dragon 2".
I actually agree, just making the point that they likely have more pressing issues at this point.............just a guess. They made some good strides so far, let's hope they continue.

It's just my opinion & it's worth exactly what you paid for it.
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post #15964 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 08:31 AM
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I think one of the best things going on the Xbox right now is the rate of updates. They are all in on this right now. If they maintain these monthly updates consistently bringing fixes, updates, and enhancements, by end of this year we should have a ton of features.

This is such a better model today for software versus the spring/fall cadence used on the 360. It is and will continue to become even more of a big competitive advantage.
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post #15965 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 09:07 AM
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Regarding 3D, I think the reason it hasn't taken off in the consumer space is that most people don't spend the money/time on a proper 3D setup. You need a large TV (70+ inches or projector) and a quality surround system to really get the immersive theater-quality 3D experience at home.

If you're watching 3D movies on a 50" TV with a HTiB (or worse), then I can understand why people would be less than enthused by the experience.

Anyhow, I think the AVS crowd in general consists of HT enthusiasts (myself included), so I'm really looking forward to the eventual 3D support on the X1/PS4. It will be nice to retire the PS3, although it has done an admirable job...
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post #15966 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by tsaville View Post
Regarding 3D, I think the reason it hasn't taken off in the consumer space is that most people don't spend the money/time on a proper 3D setup. You need a large TV (70+ inches or projector) and a quality surround system to really get the immersive theater-quality 3D experience at home.

If you're watching 3D movies on a 50" TV with a HTiB (or worse), then I can understand why people would be less than enthused by the experience.

Anyhow, I think the AVS crowd in general consists of HT enthusiasts (myself included), so I'm really looking forward to the eventual 3D support on the X1/PS4. It will be nice to retire the PS3, although it has done an admirable job...
That's a terrible way to promote 3D considering it's been marketed towards families with Disney movies. If that's the standards needed to enjoy it no wonder it hasn't taken off. It's not the consumers fault at all in that case. Personally I'd rather have higher resolution, better color depth, less compression, etc. over 3D. Once 4K takes hold maybe 3D will make sense again. Until then it's much ado about nothing.
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post #15967 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by tsaville View Post
Regarding 3D, I think the reason it hasn't taken off in the consumer space is that most people don't spend the money/time on a proper 3D setup. You need a large TV (70+ inches or projector) and a quality surround system to really get the immersive theater-quality 3D experience at home.

If you're watching 3D movies on a 50" TV with a HTiB (or worse), then I can understand why people would be less than enthused by the experience.

Anyhow, I think the AVS crowd in general consists of HT enthusiasts (myself included), so I'm really looking forward to the eventual 3D support on the X1/PS4. It will be nice to retire the PS3, although it has done an admirable job...

I also think the industry did everything it could to ruin 3D. Charged a fortune for the TVs initially. Multiple types of incompatible (and way too expensive) 3D glasses. Exclusive content deals locked out the poster child for 3D (avatar) to everyone for a stupid long time, and the prices for 3D discs were 2x-3x the 2D version. On the gaming side, the aging consoles could barely run the games in 3D, unless they used dirty hacks like reprojection, which looked absolutely terrible. And then on the PC side, NVIDIA had a total lock on 3D, requiring you to buy specific monitors, graphics cards and INSANELY expensive glasses...and since they had total control, they basically stopped developing it and let it languish.

So all these vain efforts to corner an aspect of the 3D market or extort consumers for ridiculous prices basically destroyed it for everyone.
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post #15968 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 02:58 PM
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Microsoft just posted the most detailed info I've seen about the GPU thing:


http://news.xbox.com/2014/06/xbox-one-xdk-qa


Quote:
Xbox Wire: What features are lost if developers use the extra GPU performance?

Kareem:
Kinect Depth and infrared sensors which enable biometric sign-in skeletal tracking, controller pairing, etc. will no longer work for these game titles. Developers can choose to disable Kinect depth and infrared sensing in different parts of their titles. The full Kinect experience including skeletal tracking is automatically re-enabled when the user switches back to Home (or other applications), even while in the middle of a game.

Xbox Wire: What about Snap, Broadcast, Voice commands and other system features? Will they still work if a game uses the extra resources?

Kareem:
Yes. Platform level voice commands such as “Xbox On,” “Xbox, Record That,” and “Xbox, Go Home” will continue to work as they do today, as will any in-game speech commands or Snap mode. The Kinect (RGB color) camera will still continue to work, so your friends can watch you while you’re playing your favorite games. Snap mode for TV, Achievements and other features will continue to work.
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post #15969 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by jhoff80 View Post
Microsoft just posted the most detailed info I've seen about the GPU thing:


http://news.xbox.com/2014/06/xbox-one-xdk-qa
About what I figured....video processing is disabled while in game.

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post #15970 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 03:24 PM
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You left out an important point:

Quote:
Kareem: Developers have more choice and flexibility to manage the resources of the Xbox One to deliver bigger and richer game experiences. Previously, 10% of the GPU was reserved for system level processing which included Kinect-related skeletal tracking data. With this change, titles that are not using skeletal tracking with Kinect can choose to use that portion of the system reserve for other purposes. We have also optimized the entire system so that titles have access to 100% of the Xbox One GPU for increased resolution and graphical effects.

Nothing is reserved if they turn video processing off.

How many games actually use that? Kinect Sports Rivals, of course; I think that Peggle 2 has a gesture mode that I tried briefly and was unimpressed by. Voice commands are much more useful and they can process them without GPGPU.

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post #15971 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
You left out an important point:




Nothing is reserved if they turn video processing off.
Doesn't it go without saying that nothing is reserved for video processing if they turn video processing off? Unless I'm misunderstanding you?

Quote:
How many games actually use that? Kinect Sports Rivals, of course; I think that Peggle 2 has a gesture mode that I tried briefly and was unimpressed by. Voice commands are much more useful and they can process them without GPGPU.

What's mainly lost is the system wide stuff....the gestures, the immediate auto sign in as soon as someone enters the room, detecting which player is holding which controller, etc - although a good dev could temporarily re-enable those things when appropriate.
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post #15972 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post
Doesn't it go without saying that nothing is reserved for video processing if they turn video processing off?

My point was that there's no 2% or whatever continuing to be reserved for GPGPU processing of voice. That's an idea that's been bandied about in this discussion.


Quote:
What's mainly lost is the system wide stuff....the gestures, the immediate auto sign in as soon as someone enters the room, detecting which player is holding which controller, etc - although a good dev could temporarily re-enable those things when appropriate.


Auto-sign-in while a game is being played is, I suppose, a "loss", but I'd probably prefer that it not pop up a "Hi, SoAndSo!" message while I'm in the middle of most game play. If it's the sort of game where the controller tracking thing is relevant it'd leave video processing on and take the hit.

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post #15973 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
My point was that there's no 2% or whatever continuing to be reserved for GPGPU processing of voice. That's an idea that's been bandied about in this discussion.
Ah right, the 2%. Stop the presses!

Quote:
Auto-sign-in while a game is being played is, I suppose, a "loss", but I'd probably prefer that it not pop up a "Hi, SoAndSo!" message while I'm in the middle of most game play. If it's the sort of game where the controller tracking thing is relevant it'd leave video processing on and take the hit.
For those games they can just enable it in the pause screen, character select screen etc....they might lose the ability to track your gestures at every moment, but I don't see why they couldn't just do quick checks every now and then to see if the state of your living room has changed.

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post #15974 of 16816 Old 06-17-2014, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
You left out an important point:




Nothing is reserved if they turn video processing off.

How many games actually use that? Kinect Sports Rivals, of course; I think that Peggle 2 has a gesture mode that I tried briefly and was unimpressed by. Voice commands are much more useful and they can process them without GPGPU.
Forza Motorsport 5 has head tracking. I know I don't use it. But I also don't use an in car view for the race games. Only if I use a steering wheel controller do I use an inside view.

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post #15975 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 08:10 AM - Thread Starter
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At least some good has already come of the freeing up of resources. This is from an IGN article a couple days back:


"While it'll be up to devs to decide how to use the extra resources, Destiny creator Bungie has already confirmed it's been able to increase the fps and resolution of Destiny on Xbox One to match the PS4 version, signalling this long-awaited change could be the move Microsoft needed to make to close the gap in performance between it and Sony's consoles"

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post #15976 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 08:15 AM
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Forza Motorsport 5 has head tracking. I know I don't use it. But I also don't use an in car view for the race games. Only if I use a steering wheel controller do I use an inside view.
Even still, I've never really understood head tracking with a stationary screen. When I look to the side when driving, it's because I want to see a side view of the car right in the center of my vision. I don't want to see the side view in the corner of my eye still on the front screen. That's near useless (in my opinion, of course).
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post #15977 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Even still, I've never really understood head tracking with a stationary screen. When I look to the side when driving, it's because I want to see a side view of the car right in the center of my vision. I don't want to see the side view in the corner of my eye still on the front screen. That's near useless (in my opinion, of course).
If they would just hurry up and get us all our free Oculus Rifts...
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post #15978 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by RemoWilliams84 View Post
At least some good has already come of the freeing up of resources. This is from an IGN article a couple days back:


"While it'll be up to devs to decide how to use the extra resources, Destiny creator Bungie has already confirmed it's been able to increase the fps and resolution of Destiny on Xbox One to match the PS4 version, signalling this long-awaited change could be the move Microsoft needed to make to close the gap in performance between it and Sony's consoles"
Nice job IGN, that's not what Bungie said. Thy said they are running at 1080P, of course the final frame rate is not known (you have to measure it after all) and they did not directly attribute anything to the so called Kinct changes.

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post #15979 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 10:07 AM
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Nice job IGN, that's not what Bungie said. Thy said they are running at 1080P, of course the final frame rate is not known (you have to measure it after all) and they did not directly attribute anything to the so called Kinct changes.

They're setting a low bar at 30fps, so this could be one of those games where they have parity.

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post #15980 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 10:14 AM
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Nice job IGN, that's not what Bungie said. Thy said they are running at 1080P, of course the final frame rate is not known (you have to measure it after all) and they did not directly attribute anything to the so called Kinct changes.
What are you talking about.

IGN is just restating what PHIL SPENCER SAID which is that Destiny and Sunset Overdrive devs has told him that due to the new SDK they have been able to increase resolution on both of those games.

IGN is not just saying this for kicks
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post #15981 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 10:27 AM
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They're setting a low bar at 30fps, so this could be one of those games where they have parity.
I thought they already said it was 1080P/30 on both the XBOne and PS4? I know the Alpha was 1080P30.

Weren't all the Halo games Bungie made also 30fps?

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post #15982 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 10:42 AM
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I thought they already said it was 1080P/30 on both the XBOne and PS4? I know the Alpha was 1080P30.

Weren't all the Halo games Bungie made also 30fps?
Yes, they have already stated 1080p/30 for both consoles. I also came across this little nugget, which I thought was interesting:

“It’s a lot of different things,” explains Jason Sussman who is the senior environment artist at Bungie. “I could get really technical, but I’d bore you to death. A lot has to do with performance. We’re cross-platform, so we had to be very delicate with all four consoles, making sure they have the same experience, that it looks as good as it possibly can on all these consoles. A lot goes into that, from geometry to textures to post effects to particles to how many players you get on the screen. We’re always balancing that out to make sure everyone gets the same experience,” he said in an interview with Venturebeat"

http://gamingbolt.com/bungie-explain...4-and-xbox-one

I wasn't impressed at all with the graphics in the PS4 alpha, and the comments above pretty much confirm that the last-gen versions of the game are holding back the current gen versions. I wish cross-gen games would just die. I'm getting tired of all the lazy ports we've gotten so far.
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post #15983 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 10:58 AM
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I wish cross-gen games would just die. I'm getting tired of all the lazy ports we've gotten so far.
While I agree, there are significantly more last-gen consoles out there...so the money is in making games for last-gen. The new Borderlands is an example of this in action.
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post #15984 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by tsaville View Post
Yes, they have already stated 1080p/30 for both consoles. I also came across this little nugget, which I thought was interesting:

“It’s a lot of different things,” explains Jason Sussman who is the senior environment artist at Bungie. “I could get really technical, but I’d bore you to death. A lot has to do with performance. We’re cross-platform, so we had to be very delicate with all four consoles, making sure they have the same experience, that it looks as good as it possibly can on all these consoles. A lot goes into that, from geometry to textures to post effects to particles to how many players you get on the screen. We’re always balancing that out to make sure everyone gets the same experience,” he said in an interview with Venturebeat"

http://gamingbolt.com/bungie-explain...4-and-xbox-one

I wasn't impressed at all with the graphics in the PS4 alpha, and the comments above pretty much confirm that the last-gen versions of the game are holding back the current gen versions. I wish cross-gen games would just die. I'm getting tired of all the lazy ports we've gotten so far.

So basically they're saying it needs to be 30fps on next gen, because last gen can't handle 60fps? Sigh.

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post #15985 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 11:15 AM
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So basically they're saying it needs to be 30fps on next gen, because last gen can't handle 60fps? Sigh.
Yep, that's my interpretation. Hence the reason I want last-gen to die.
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post #15986 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by tsaville View Post
Yes, they have already stated 1080p/30 for both consoles. I also came across this little nugget, which I thought was interesting:

“It’s a lot of different things,” explains Jason Sussman who is the senior environment artist at Bungie. “I could get really technical, but I’d bore you to death. A lot has to do with performance. We’re cross-platform, so we had to be very delicate with all four consoles, making sure they have the same experience, that it looks as good as it possibly can on all these consoles. A lot goes into that, from geometry to textures to post effects to particles to how many players you get on the screen. We’re always balancing that out to make sure everyone gets the same experience,” he said in an interview with Venturebeat"

http://gamingbolt.com/bungie-explain...4-and-xbox-one

I wasn't impressed at all with the graphics in the PS4 alpha, and the comments above pretty much confirm that the last-gen versions of the game are holding back the current gen versions. I wish cross-gen games would just die. I'm getting tired of all the lazy ports we've gotten so far.
Agreed, it isn't exactly a top notch looking game. It is okay and has some nice sky boxes but that is more artistic design for them that I like. I'd be shocked if the Xbox One version doesn't run and look just as good.
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post #15987 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 12:00 PM
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Yep, that's my interpretation. Hence the reason I want last-gen to die.

Don't hold your breath, it's gonna be a while.

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post #15988 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by tsaville View Post
Yep, that's my interpretation. Hence the reason I want last-gen to die.

When there is such a large install base on last gen, it wouldn't make much sense for a game like Destiny to only come out on current gen. Especially with the amount of money that has supposedly been spent. When a sequel comes out in 2.5 years and the install base of current gen is much, much higher, then I would expect a game like this only on current gen. But for the first game, I would think they need to maximize the amount of money coming in to justify the outrageous price tag.

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post #15989 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 01:47 PM
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^^^I believe someone said this earlier.

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post #15990 of 16816 Old 06-18-2014, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
When there is such a large install base on last gen, it wouldn't make much sense for a game like Destiny to only come out on current gen. Especially with the amount of money that has supposedly been spent. When a sequel comes out in 2.5 years and the install base of current gen is much, much higher, then I would expect a game like this only on current gen. But for the first game, I would think they need to maximize the amount of money coming in to justify the outrageous price tag.

I'm surprised activision isn't putting more pressure on them to allow cross platform and cross gen play. Multiplayer games like this thrive off of people being able to play together. If half of your friends still own 360s, another 1/4 own a PS4, and another 1/4 own an Xbox one....destiny isn't going to be the game for your group. Nothing is, thanks to MS and Sony deliberately preventing it. But if there was a game everyone could play together, regardless of platform, it would sell a ton solely based on that.

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