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post #1591 of 10626 Old 06-11-2008, 06:43 PM
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Does anyone else here get crackling noises when getting mortar attacked in the Battlefield: Bad Company demo?

Is that something wrong with the games sound or a shortcoming of the su-dh1?
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post #1592 of 10626 Old 06-11-2008, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foe-hammer View Post

Bottom end meaning what, bass? Many would argue that the 05 DT880s have some of the best bass (extension, impact, tight), and better then the D2K or D5K.

True. The D5000 are know to have flabby overbearing bass, un modded.. The 880's get crapped on for having 'tiny' bass.. I just don't get it.. It's the only headphone I owned where the bass had a mind of it's own.. Tight, authoritative, full, impactful, with nice slam.. Balanced would make it even better, &more so with a high end balanced amp..

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post #1593 of 10626 Old 06-11-2008, 06:47 PM
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Just got my PS3!! You should get one Foe, if you don't already have one.. Some games support DTS.. & you can listen to LPCM, albeit 2 channels, but should be better then 360 games audio..

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post #1594 of 10626 Old 06-11-2008, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coljj View Post

Does anyone else here get crackling noises when getting mortar attacked in the Battlefield: Bad Company demo?

Is that something wrong with the games sound or a shortcoming of the su-dh1?

It's definitly the games sound. I hear crackling noises in both the 360 and PS3 Battlefield demos. I have a mixamp, but they both work the same way. At first, I thought something was wrong with the game, but without doubt it is the games audio.

I just got done playing my last game of COD4. I'm sending the 360 in to microsoft. The Mixamp is VERY helpful in Search and Destroy. I always get the jump on the enemy if I use dead silence (so as not to hear MY footsteps lol). Now I am gonna hope the Socom beta comes out soon, so I can see how amazing the sound system is. Reports indicate that it is very good. I also played Medal of Honor Airborne a few days ago. It is a lot different than COD4's, and I like it. Its very spacy.

Hopefully this Summer, I will get a DT880 and the Darkvoice 336i amp so I can get even better sound. I can't wait.

Btw, did anyone else get an email from Astro gaming about connecting a PS3 headset to the mixamp?
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post #1595 of 10626 Old 06-11-2008, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by briansemerick View Post

Shure SE530PTH IEM

i have these

I've only had mine for just 1 week and have completely fallen in love with them. They astounded me with their output and for a while I just couldn't believe I was getting this much presence from a set of IEMs. I am now one of the converted...

I will still use my other headphones - I own numbers 1, 3, 8, 9 and 10 from my list. Each will still have their purpose but the SE530 and the DT770 will by far see the most use.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foe-hammer View Post

surprised you'd pick IEM's as your top headphones to go with DH. IEM's are great for detail, but lack severely in soundstage.

And i found the beyer 880s to be better then the your number 2,3 and 4 headphones with DH.

Different strokes, i guess...

Definitely... we all hear things differently due to many factors - ear canal shape/size, how our brains are 'wired', quality of the source, etc. It would take a true blind test with multiple participants to actually get a better idea of which product(s) are the better performers. That said I think you'll agree that most of the cans I tested are among the top regarded units available. I unfortunately didn't have access to any Denon or electrostatic cans so I'll reserve judgement on them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by General Kenobi View Post

The 530's actually have a pretty good soundstage for an IEM but I find that as with vocals are set too far back for my tastes and this goes for gaming dialogue as well.

The 880's have a good soundstage but lack in the bottom end for my tastes (even when properly amped). For a full sized headphone I'd take the Denon D5000 over all the rest.

I agree re: the SE530 soundstage but I certainly never expected it from an IEM. The vocals don't bother me so I guess it's just how my brain interprets it. I also had a response similar to yours with the DT880s - a little lacking in the bass. Which again speaks volumes for the SE530 - how can an IEM have better bass (to me) than the full size DT880s?!? I would guess that sound is only part science and a whole lot of art/black magic...

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post #1596 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 04:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KBI View Post

Just got my PS3!! You should get one Foe, if you don't already have one.. Some games support DTS.. & you can listen to LPCM, albeit 2 channels, but should be better then 360 games audio..

I'll definitely be get a ps3 in the future, mainly for BR movies. Another $100 price drop, and i'm there.

Regarding LPCM...

Being it is 2 channel, i could hook it up to my RCA inputs on my Pioneer DH unit. But since it is only 2 channel analog, i doubt it would sound too good with DH, seeing as it does not separate the channels into 6 separate streams (5.1), and thereby voiding the whole 5.1 surround audio of DH technology. So i doubt it would sound better then compressed DD or DTS for gaming, not being 5.1 and all.

Now if they could send uncompressed 5.1 to a DH receiver, then that would be the way to go.

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post #1597 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foe-hammer View Post

Now if they could send uncompressed 5.1 to a DH receiver, then that would be the way to go.



They can send it... the catch is whether or not DH can process it. My guess is not yet. From DH's website:

Quote:


Can Dolby Headphone technology be used with DVD-Audio?

Yes. Dolby Headphone technology can be used with the 24-bit/96 kHz audio encoded with MLP LosslessTM that is on DVD-Audio discs. One of the most exciting features of DVD-Audio is that it’s bit-for-bit identical to original studio masters.

If DH can process one lossless codec (MLP) - there is little reason to doubt why it couldn't be expanded to accept multi-channel PCM, DD-True HD & DTS HD-MA.

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post #1598 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 08:45 AM
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Indeed different strokes... a simple re-cable cleans the D5k's up a lot. The DT880's are nice and do have good extension and massive soundstage but the bass simply lacks in volume for music and gaming IMO. I feel the same about the K701's and a few of the AT's that seem to pop up in the disagreements about bass. If I was going for an open design I'd probably go with a GS1000 if I could find one that was not defective and as long as we are spending big $$ add a DA10 or Apogee to the mix and maybe a WA5 for good measure

That being said the UE-11's are the IEM's to beat. I'm not sure how similar the triple.fi are but I've owned E4C, E500, UM2, ES2, etc. and the UE-11's are the only other headphones (IEM or full size) that I would say could favorably compete with the PS-1. I ues the UE-11's with a Pico and the D5000 when I want an over ear and it suits my tastes perfect. That's the real trick is fine tuning your sound (speakers, headphones, amps, etc.) to your tastes. People can make recs all day long but it ends up boiling down to a very personal choice. Just my 2 ¢

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post #1599 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foe-hammer View Post

I'll definitely be get a ps3 in the future, mainly for BR movies. Another $100 price drop, and i'm there.

Regarding LPCM...

Being it is 2 channel, i could hook it up to my RCA inputs on my Pioneer DH unit. But since it is only 2 channel analog, i doubt it would sound too good with DH, seeing as it does not separate the channels into 6 separate streams (5.1), and thereby voiding the whole 5.1 surround audio of DH technology. So i doubt it would sound better then compressed DD or DTS for gaming, not being 5.1 and all.

Now if they could send uncompressed 5.1 to a DH receiver, then that would be the way to go.

I use a optical cable & have it set for 48hkz 2.0 PCM.. I know my receiver accepts it cause it displays it. Changing back & forth between DD 5.1 & uncompressed PCM, I noticed the PCM track is louder, & offers a nice improvement over the DD 5.1 mix.. But I will go over it again & match the volumes on both soundtracks just to make sure. & I still notice the DH effects.. I will try again though.. Media wise, the PS3 craps all over the 360. Tons of audio options to choose from..All PS3's have HDMI.. PS3 supports HD codecs.. & upconversion over standard DVDs is stellar.. They also have 3 DNR options that are surprisingly not bad. I like the 360 but MS wants 180 for a 120 gig HD??? I can get a 250 gig for the PS3 for half that price..

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post #1600 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A.C View Post

They can send it... the catch is whether or not DH can process it. My guess is not yet. From DH's website:



If DH can process one lossless codec (MLP) - there is little reason to doubt why it couldn't be expanded to accept multi-channel PCM, DD-True HD & DTS HD-MA.

Ya, that is what i meant. My DH units would not be able too, considering digital toslink is the only option for 5.1. It would need an HDMI port or 6 analog inputs for uncompressed 5.1.

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post #1601 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KBI View Post

I use a optical cable & have it set for 48hkz 2.0 PCM.. I know my receiver accepts it cause it displays it. Changing back & forth between DD 5.1 & uncompressed PCM, I noticed the PCM track is louder, & offers a nice improvement over the DD 5.1 mix.. But I will go over it again & match the volumes on both soundtracks just to make sure. & I still notice the DH effects.. I will try again though.. Media wise, the PS3 craps all over the 360. Tons of audio options to choose from..All PS3's have HDMI.. PS3 supports HD codecs.. & upconversion over standard DVDs is stellar.. They also have 3 DNR options that are surprisingly not bad. I like the 360 but MS wants 180 for a 120 gig HD??? I can get a 250 gig for the PS3 for half that price..

I'm sure the audio quality is better with 2 channel PCM, compared to compressed 5.1 DD or DTS.

What i was meaning to say, was without a 5.1 signal being sent, even if it is compressed, you will not get the 5.1 surround via DH 3D pinpoint sound location with 2.0 pcm DH. I cannot go without the 5.1 surround positioning for games (and arguably for movies), even though the actual audio is better with 2.0 pcm.

I don't use my 360 for my media hub. I use my original modded xbox with XBMC. It offers much more options then even the ps3 offers for media. The only thing it lacks is BR. And it upconverts DVD's better then the 360.

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post #1602 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General Kenobi View Post

Indeed different strokes...

....

That's the real trick is fine tuning your sound (speakers, headphones, amps, etc.) to your tastes. People can make recs all day long but it ends up boiling down to a very personal choice. Just my 2 ¢

Exactly my thoughts and modus-operandi.

I have gleaned reams of information from reading this forum and others. While I can appreciate the nuances that people perceive with different setups, it all comes down to what sounds good to YOU!

Keep playing, listening and enjoying!

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post #1603 of 10626 Old 06-12-2008, 07:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General Kenobi View Post

... The DT880's are nice and do have good extension and massive soundstage but the bass simply lacks in volume for music and gaming IMO...

My 880s must have good "synergy" with my vhp-2 amp, then, because they have some of the best bass (plenty of it, and with impact) that i've experienced in a headphone. Better then the Ultrasone 780s, of which are said to have more bass then the Denon 2ks. The DT880s are the 05's, and not the 03's that are known to lack bass. Shrug...

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post #1604 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 07:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foe-hammer View Post

you will not get the 5.1 surround via DH 3D pinpoint sound location with 2.0 pcm DH. I cannot go without the 5.1 surround positioning for games (and arguably for movies), even though the actual audio is better with 2.0 pcm.


I think it could be argued that DH is hardly "pinpoint" which makes me wonder if "PCM DH PLII" wouldn't be THAT large of a step down from "digital DH 5.1"


Quote:
Q. Why are there two Dolby Headphone technology logos: one saying Dolby Digital and the other Dolby Pro Logic® II?

A. Products with a Dolby Pro Logic II/Dolby Headphone logo use the Dolby Pro Logic II technology to expand stereo content to 5.1-channels, which are then processed through Dolby Headphone. Listeners are able to get a 5.1-channel surround sound experience from a stereo source with any pair of stereo headphones.



Q. Does Dolby Headphone technology work with processors that create a surround effect?

A. Yes. As is the case in a multichannel speaker system, Dolby Headphone technology can be used in conjunction with processors that give stereo material a surround effect.

For example, five- and seven-channel matrix decoders with Dolby Pro Logic II and Dolby Pro Logic IIx, respectively, provide a wider, more enveloping soundfield on many conventional stereo recordings. Dolby Headphone technology (in its multichannel mode) reproduces these expanded soundfields to great effect, making them sound rich and natural.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...phone_faq.html


I'd be interested in some blind A-B testing... b/c it might not be that much of a difference... and the increased fidelity might tip the scales in favor of the uncompressed stereo track. especially re: stereo content (ie, videogames) that is created with PLII matrix decoding in mind.

Just a thought.

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post #1605 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General Kenobi View Post

The 530's actually have a pretty good soundstage for an IEM but I find that as with vocals are set too far back for my tastes and this goes for gaming dialogue as well.

The 880's have a good soundstage but lack in the bottom end for my tastes (even when properly amped). For a full sized headphone I'd take the Denon D5000 over all the rest.

haven't tried the 530's with gaming yet, but for music they are amazing listening to In Rainbows right now.
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post #1606 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale_S View Post

I've only had mine for just 1 week and have completely fallen in love with them. They astounded me with their output and for a while I just couldn't believe I was getting this much presence from a set of IEMs. I am now one of the converted...

agreed. it's the total sealing of the plugs to your ear that does it, plus the two individual woofers and one tweeter per ear.
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post #1607 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foe-hammer View Post

My 880s must have good "synergy" with my vhp-2 amp, then, because they have some of the best bass (plenty of it, and with impact) that i've experienced in a headphone. Better then the Ultrasone 780s, of which are said to have more bass then the Denon 2ks. The DT880s are the 05's, and not the 03's that are known to lack bass. Shrug...

Hmmm, maybe I heard the 03's... I really can't remember but I had them driven by a PPX3 Slam with a pretty nice tube combo... then again maybe I'm just a bit of a bass head

btw - The D2k's do have less bass (among other things) compared to the D5k's. The D5ks can be a bit muddy but they have a great signature and the re-cable job from apuresound really cleans up my complaints with them.

briansemerick - Glad you like them, I know a lot of people that are very happy with those and the E500's too. I'm probably one of the few that didn't care for them. It has a lot to do with how I like music presented and I really enjoy a forward vocal presentation. With the exception of the lean bass I actually liked the E4C better but once you go custom you never go back

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post #1608 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A.C View Post

I think it could be argued that DH is hardly "pinpoint" which makes me wonder if "PCM DH PLII" wouldn't be THAT large of a step down from "digital DH 5.1"




http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...phone_faq.html


I'd be interested in some blind A-B testing... b/c it might not be that much of a difference... and the increased fidelity might tip the scales in favor of the uncompressed stereo track. especially re: stereo content (ie, videogames) that is created with PLII matrix decoding in mind.

Just a thought.

It's not that big a difference..But DD 5.1,DH is still noticeable better in the seperation department.

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post #1609 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 01:21 PM
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i've got my 360 all packed up & in storage right now - but soon i'm going to do some testing setting the console's encode to 16 bit 48 kHz PCM & running my JVC in PLII mode. i have a sneaking suspicion it will be splitting hairs compared to the DD5.1 input.

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post #1610 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A.C View Post

i've got my 360 all packed up & in storage right now - but soon i'm going to do some testing setting the console's encode to 16 bit 48 kHz PCM & running my JVC in PLII mode. i have a sneaking suspicion it will be splitting hairs compared to the DD5.1 input.

I hope so.. I prefer the PCM soundtracks..

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post #1611 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 05:39 PM
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That wood dowel gave me an idea. Why not use the plastic tube from a ball-point pen as a form-factor replacement for a AA battery? I had some nice colors available. For a 360, plain black just wouldn't do.

Stripped, but not tinned, some stranded hookup wire and wrapped it around the '+' and '-' terminals as shown in the close-up. I purposely did not tin the wire because this is a compression fit and I wanted the strands to work around the terminals nicely. Not shown, but I did pull out slightly the '+' terminal and loop the wire through it before putting it back into place.

The length of the tubes are slightly different. The '+' tube runs close to the total length to push against the terminal, while the '-' tube is slightly shorter to allow the wire some room to be pushed against the spring.

I purposely used electrical tape as a temporary cover fix because I wanted to be able to return it in case it fails. I'll wait about 30 days then clean it up. Later, I did put the actual cover on top, held with a strip of black tape for additional protection.

My first experience with Dolby Headphone. How does it sound? The 360 is now permanently relocated from my main 5.1 system (67" DLP + 5.1 mostly Vandersteen) to my Dell 2407WFP PC monitor just so I can use Dolby Headphone. It was that much of a difference.

My ATH-A900s sound a bit diffused and it's not as directional as I thought. However, being able to have a closed audio environment with darn good directional sound is much more preferable than a high-end "open" 5.1 system. Unbelievable. To be fair, I've always preferred headphones so I might be a bit biased. However, it's my system and my ears. Wonder what it's like with better headphones....
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post #1612 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 05:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeekGirl View Post

That wood dowel gave me an idea. Why not use the plastic tube from a ball-point pen as a form-factor replacement for a AA battery? I had some nice colors available. For a 360, plain black just wouldn't do.

Stripped, but not tinned, some stranded hookup wire and wrapped it around the '+' and '-' terminals as shown in the close-up. I purposely did not tin the wire because this is a compression fit and I wanted the strands to work around the terminals nicely. Not shown, but I did pull out slightly the '+' terminal and loop the wire through it before putting it back into place.

The length of the tubes are slightly different. The '+' tube runs close to the total length to push against the terminal, while the '-' tube is slightly shorter to allow the wire some room to be pushed against the spring.

I purposely used electrical tape as a temporary cover fix because I wanted to be able to return it in case it fails. I'll wait about 30 days then clean it up. Later, I did put the actual cover on top, held with a strip of black tape for additional protection.

My first experience with Dolby Headphone. How does it sound? The 360 is now permanently relocated from my main 5.1 system (67" DLP + 5.1 mostly Vandersteen) to my Dell 2407WFP PC monitor just so I can use Dolby Headphone. It was that much of a difference.

My ATH-A900s sound a bit diffused and it's not as directional as I thought. However, being able to have a closed audio environment with darn good directional sound is much more preferable than a high-end "open" 5.1 system. Unbelievable. To be fair, I've always preferred headphones so I might be a bit biased. However, it's my system and my ears. Wonder what it's like with better headphones....

Better headphones/amp/DAC would do wonders. The 900's are entry level audiophile cans to mid range.Of course high end headphones are debatable. To me high end would be the Sen HE60/HE90/Sony R10/Q10/AT L3000/AKG 1000 among others..

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post #1613 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:01 PM
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Better yet. I found this on headfi.com

Tier 1 Headphones:
AKG K1000 1,200
Audio-Technica L3000 2,200
Grado HP-2 (not sure)
Grado PS-1 up to 3,000
Sennheiser HE90 8,000
Sennheiser HE60 6,000
Sony R10 5-6,000
Sony Qualias 2,600
Stax Omega 2 4-6,000
Ultrasone Edition 7 3,000
Ultrasone Edition 9 1,500

Sucks that the best of the best cost a arm & a leg.I added the prices..

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post #1614 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:06 PM
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Jesus, those prices are really nuts. Thats just too much.
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post #1615 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:10 PM
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well some of those prices include (tube) amps, no? still.... i have the insatiable urge to upgrade my 595's....




thanks alot KBI

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post #1616 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by A.C View Post

well some of those prices include (tube) amps, no? still.... i have the insatiable urge to upgrade my 595's....




thanks alot KBI

The AKG1000 are very hard to drive & need expensive gear to get the full benefit.. But the others are fine..

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post #1617 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:22 PM
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well i took a quick peak at the Senn HE90's & they include a pretty nice look'n amp

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post #1618 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dertalix View Post

Jesus, those prices are really nuts. Thats just too much.

I'd spend a grand on headphones.. Funny thing about the Sony R10.. They were sold for 4,000, & Sony was losing money.. They never made a profit on R10's.. & only 300 or so were made.. They are so revered the market value is close to 6,000 for NOS, mint pair..Most of these are statement headphones anyways.. Made by companies going all out when making a headphone. Cost no object. The L3000/HE60/HE90/Q10 are all limited editions & very scarce, which adds to the e lure & the higher prices..

I tried the AKG1000 out of a decent amp, & was very euphoric. Very transparent , like you could see (mental image) through the layers of music, ala X-ray vision, & everything was effortless & very smooth..

If anyone is interested in obtaining a taste of the good stuff.. A entry to mid range Stax electrostas will do the trick.. Electrostats can do things better then any dynamic headphone out there, no matter the cost.. Someone mentioned that a Stax 202 plus the headphones driver was holding it's own against the R10 with a 5,000 amp.. 600 compared to 10,000.. I'm still debating on getting that 202 system with my refunded money or buy a Reciever that supports audio over HDMI..

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post #1619 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 06:32 PM
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well i took a quick peak at the Senn HE90's & they include a pretty nice look'n amp

The complete set up sold for 16,000 in 94 I believe..

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post #1620 of 10626 Old 06-13-2008, 07:17 PM
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So where's the breakpoint on this SU-DH1? IOW, how good can I go on headphones before the built-in amp starts limiting the (perceptible) quality? I've got the volume control about half-way, which seem reasonable as far as drive level is concerned.

One another limitation is that I need good isolation from external sources. That's one of the reasons I'm not using my main speakers. When I want to do some serious listening, there's always something to distract me.
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