PlayStation Meeting 2013 (PS4 unveiling - conference replay in first post) - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 1994 Old 05-10-2012, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by defdog99 View Post

It already supports netflix -- streaming hours of movies to everyone.

And?

Heck, it's not uncommon for a Netflix addict right now to start to encroach on bandwidth caps during the course of a month. Major next generation software will conservatively be over 10 gigs on average for a major release (And I think there's enough current gen evidence to suggest that 20+ gig releases will be far from uncommon).

Just 1 such download equals quite a lot of Netflix viewing for many Netflix users. Regardless if every other piece of the puzzle was in place (Which it most certainly isn't), until ISP's significantly increase their allowances for consumers (Which are increasingly becoming restrictive instead of the other way around), Microsoft's hands are essentially tied.
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post #452 of 1994 Old 05-10-2012, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Big box retail all over is dying, and GS is in the same boat.

I actually agree. I just think that other middlemen will rise up in their place (Steam, iTunes, Amazon, etc). If Sony and MS want to stay afloat as major forces in the gaming industry, they're going to have to figure out how to integrate digital retailers into their future consoles. Trying to limit digital sales to their own proprietary storefronts (PSN, XBLA) is a losing wager. Nintendo's particular approach may be a bit backwards, but it's at least moving in the right direction.

Full DD won't happen anytime soon, but it's now a major part of the industry and continuing to grow. Anything that gets in the way of that growth won't last. The more Sony and MS continue to wall off their digital storefronts, the more the PC and mobile spaces will begin to creep in on their territory.

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post #453 of 1994 Old 05-17-2012, 02:19 PM
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Screens and article HERE

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Epic has unveiled Unreal Engine 4 with stunning screenshots that showcase what will hopefully be possible with the next generation of consoles.

In a Wired article, Epic staff discussed the tech, which was shown behind closed doors and under NDA at the Game Developers Conference earlier this year.

The screenshots above are taken from the 153 second Unreal Engine 4 real-time demo powered by the Nvidia Kepler GTX 680. It shows an armoured demon knight in a mountain fortress. Lava flows as the knight wields a huge hammer as he enters a metal corridor before looking out at mountain peaks. It's designed to show lens flare, distortion, environmental destruction and other fancy graphics techniques.

The engine itself introduces dynamic lighting, which, according to Wired, behaves in response to its own inherent properties rather than programmed effects.

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"There is a huge responsibility on the shoulders of our engine team and our studio to drag this industry into the next generation," said Gears of War design director Cliff Bleszinski. "It is up to Epic, and Tim Sweeney in particular, to motivate Sony and Microsoft not to phone in what these next consoles are going to be. It needs to be a quantum leap. They need to damn near render Avatar in real time, because I want it and gamers want it - even if they don't know they want it."

Sweeney added: "We're much more in sync with the console makers than any other developer is. That means we can give detailed recommendations with a complete understanding of what is going to be commercially possible."

Apparently Epic has seen the specs of the PS4 and next Xbox and is "actively lobbying" for them to be more powerful.

Epic will reveal Unreal Engine 4 to the public at the E3 trade show in June.

Epic is trying to sell their engine. Of course they want the platform to be as modern as possible, so they can sell the max number of licenses for the max number of years. I do like that there is a dev out there that is pushing for more console performance, regardless of the reason.

If the next consoles aren't pushing visual fidelity along with the rest of the specs, then why bother IMO. More RAM is nice for all those extraneous functions, a faster BD drive is great for installs, so there should be a leap in visual performance as well. Graphics don't matter, but yet they really do. High end visuals have value, something that I hope the console makers remember going forward.

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post #454 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 12:11 PM
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Sad to say but I'm with Cliff on this. If it isn't a quantum leap I will be waiting for price drops for the first time ever on new consoles. I'll go back into PC gaming and mine out the last ten years on that platform.


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post #455 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by darthrsg View Post

Sad to say but I'm with Cliff on this. If it isn't a quantum leap I will be waiting for price drops for the first time ever on new consoles. I'll go back into PC gaming and mine out the last ten years on that platform.

I'm thinking the leap will be pretty significant, and I'm betting the PS4 will be the most reasonably priced way to play 3D/1080p/48fps movies (ie. The Hobbit) when it comes out (whether or not TV's are up to the task by then, or how much interest there will be in having to buy a new TV to utilize that feature is an individual concern, but it will at least be a "future-proofing" selling point for some)

They are going to have come up with something pretty extraordinary to go head-to-head with Microsoft though (more than just the 48fps thing mentioned above). They were never able to overcome the year lead Microsoft had on release last time around as the main next-gen feature was the ubiquitous online gameplay. Microsoft had the lead on building a community, and people wanted to buy the console they could play with their friends. That killed Sony in the current gen.

Hopefully the head-on competition brings out some big advances for consumers.

Enjoying BF4 on the PS4, bugs and all.
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post #456 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by darthrsg View Post

Sad to say but I'm with Cliff on this. If it isn't a quantum leap I will be waiting for price drops for the first time ever on new consoles. I'll go back into PC gaming and mine out the last ten years on that platform.

The problem is cost. No console manufacturer is willing to take a risk on high-end tech right now. No one can afford to take a loss (especially Sony), and they see little reason to do so after the Wii's huge success as a profit leading platform. Manufacturers see their biggest possibility for continued profits in non-gaming content, so there's no reason to break the bank in order to push pixels.

This is just Epic trying to strong-arm MS and Sony so that Epic can sell its engine. The more expensive development becomes, the more engine and middleware contracting/licensing becomes. But there's no way we'll see the "quantum leap" next gen. If that's what people expect, it's time to move to PC gaming.

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post #457 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by darthrsg View Post

Sad to say but I'm with Cliff on this. If it isn't a quantum leap I will be waiting for price drops for the first time ever on new consoles. I'll go back into PC gaming and mine out the last ten years on that platform.

I'm going to be waiting 2 or so years anyways. Thats about how long my backlog is this gen. It'll take just about that long for anything interesting to appear on a new system, and I won't be a first adopter and can work around failures.

After spending near $1000 on 3 PS3's this gen due to 2 YLOD failures... never again! I'll be waiting to see how the chips fall, then buying a 5 year 3rd party extended warranty.
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post #458 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Mounta1n View Post


I'm thinking the leap will be pretty significant, and I'm betting the PS4 will be the most reasonably priced way to play 3D/1080p/48fps movies (ie. The Hobbit) when it comes out (whether or not TV's are up to the task by then, or how much interest there will be in having to buy a new TV to utilize that feature is an individual concern, but it will at least be a "future-proofing" selling point for some)

They are going to have come up with something pretty extraordinary to go head-to-head with Microsoft though (more than just the 48fps thing mentioned above). They were never able to overcome the year lead Microsoft had on release last time around as the main next-gen feature was the ubiquitous online gameplay. Microsoft had the lead on building a community, and people wanted to buy the console they could play with their friends. That killed Sony in the current gen.

Hopefully the head-on competition brings out some big advances for consumers.

MS had the lead for four years for online when the PS3 came on. Today with Sony in the position they are in with finances I am not so sure they can take the chance of just throwing in things like you mention as features that most likely a niche group of consumers care for. I mean look at what is going on with Vita now and that should give you an Idea to what Sony has to decide what the final specs will be for the PS4.

The 5.0 is here
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post #459 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

I'm going to be waiting 2 or so years anyways. Thats about how long my backlog is this gen. It'll take just about that long for anything interesting to appear on a new system, and I won't be a first adopter and can work around failures.

After spending near $1000 on 3 PS3's this gen due to 2 YLOD failures... never again! I'll be waiting to see how the chips fall, then buying a 5 year 3rd party extended warranty.

I love new hardware and all it promises, I have both systems but given what is going on with gaming in general I have no big desire to get a launch system this go around.

Seems we are in the same boat.


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post #460 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by confidenceman View Post


This is just Epic trying to strong-arm MS and Sony so that Epic can sell its engine. The more expensive development becomes, the more engine and middleware contracting/licensing becomes. But there's no way we'll see the "quantum leap" next gen. If that's what people expect, it's time to move to PC gaming.

I wouldn't disagree on this.


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post #461 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

I'm going to be waiting 2 or so years anyways. Thats about how long my backlog is this gen. It'll take just about that long for anything interesting to appear on a new system, and I won't be a first adopter and can work around failures.

I'm thinking along similar lines. Unless something radical shifts within the console industry, I'm going to go the PC route. At this point, an inexpensive PC can do everything that a console can, but cheaper and better. And with the streaming media focus of the consoles now coming at a premium (subscriptions, subscriptions, subscriptions), there's no reason not to use an HTPC for the same thing--only, you know, for free.

Console manufacturers are really going to have to get creative about what they offer and how they offer it. For $500+ and a whole bevy of monthly subscription fees, I'd better get more than what they're currently offering. I just don't see it happening. I've been a dedicated console gamer for as long as consoles have existed (with a stint in PC gaming in the '90s), but I'm seeing fewer reasons to stick it out other than a small handful of exclusive games--and even those are moving further into mediocrity and bombast.

Who knows? Maybe the Wii U will convince me otherwise. I'm a sucker for new tech, but this generation was damned expensive. Far more expensive than just sticking with a high-end PC and upgrading it every year or two. The PC is a safer (and cheaper) bet at the moment.

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post #462 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:36 PM
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The only system I am getting at release is the Wii U. If it gets Skyrim or not will determine if I get a gaming PC. (the only release that makes me want a PC for better framerates)

With Sony in the shape it is in, I'm not buying any hardware from them until it has a solid 3 years on the market.

And MS lost my respect years ago and I won't buy their next hardware until that gen is over.

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post #463 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 01:59 PM
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The only system I am getting at release is the Wii U. If it gets Skyrim or not will determine if I get a gaming PC. (the only release that makes me want a PC for better framerates)

Through the '90s, I was purely a Nintendo and PC gamer. Those days may be returning.

A lot is riding on what Sony and MS pull out of their hats in a few weeks...

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post #464 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 02:52 PM
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Through the '90s, I was purely a Nintendo and PC gamer. Those days may be returning.

A lot is riding on what Sony and MS pull out of their hats in a few weeks...

I have a Wii in the closet and I've never used it.


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post #465 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 02:56 PM
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I have a Wii in the closet and I've never used it.

Dig it out and start playing it, I've been playing nothing but the Wii lately and there are a ton of gems on it, if you can get over the 480 output.

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post #466 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 03:03 PM
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Wow. What's so wrong with this gen of consoles that hurts the chances of buying the next? I've had a blast with my PS3, more than with my PS2 (which I wouldn't have thought would happen). What is the hold up for you- launch price? Potential problems? Typical barebones launch lineup?

If Sony comes to market with a slick running box that doesn't break $299, and has some cool software incoming, I would get one early on. Sony has proven their first party can deliver quality software at a steady clip, so the launch of a new machine won't be without games for too long.

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post #467 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 03:04 PM
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I've tried and tried to decied where the playstation 4 is going but it's allways something diffrent, is it suppoes to look the same as the ps3?
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post #468 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 03:07 PM
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Sony as a company is in terrible shape. I'm not buying any system from them until it has an established library of games just incase they go belly up. That way I have plenty of games to play even if they fall.

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post #469 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 03:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Crash44 View Post

Wow. What's so wrong with this gen of consoles that hurts the chances of buying the next? I've had a blast with my PS3, more than with my PS2 (which I wouldn't have thought would happen). What is the hold up for you- launch price? Potential problems? Typical barebones launch lineup?

If Sony comes to market with a slick running box that doesn't break $299, and has some cool software incoming, I would get one early on. Sony has proven their first party can deliver quality software at a steady clip, so the launch of a new machine won't be without games for too long.

Problems and poor launch. $1000 on PS3 hardware isn't my idea of instant support next time around. And if next gen is similar to this gen, there won't be much out the first 12 months anyways.
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post #470 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 04:02 PM
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Wow. What's so wrong with this gen of consoles that hurts the chances of buying the next? I've had a blast with my PS3, more than with my PS2 (which I wouldn't have thought would happen). What is the hold up for you- launch price? Potential problems? Typical barebones launch lineup?

For me, it's expense. More specifically, Sony and MS have grown increasingly hostile to consumers and developers. And the horizon looks even worse. As long as Sony and MS continue to keep a stranglehold on their online marketplaces and media streaming services, they'll continue to overcharge and double-charge for things that can be gotten much cheaper (and more conveniently) elsewhere.

For example, why can Steam have great sales on games that XBLA and PSN can't? Because MS and Sony can monopolize their respective marketplaces. And it's gotten increasingly worse and it will get even worse in the next generation. Sony killed PS3 BC for PS2 in order to charge for re-releases. Sony and their publishers are currently double-charging for Vita ports of PS3 releases (when we know the system is capable of using Remote Play). Sony's media partners charge extra for streaming services. Few digital releases go down in price. And MS is even worse.

Sony and MS have piled on increased services and features at the consumer's expense. This has been a long process over the course of this generation. Consoles are slowly making themselves obsolete and unnecessarily expensive. The difference now in 2012 between a console and a PC is almost nothing--except that consoles are more expensive and overly restrictive to their developers. Consoles used to be the cheap alternative. That's no longer the case.

It's also worth saying that I'm completely console agnostic. Or better, I dislike the entire corporate culture that runs and manages console ecosystems. Instead, I like games. I only have my gaming consoles (all three) in order to play good games. I feel no sense of brand loyalty to a corporation, especially when they do things that make it harder and harder to create and enjoy quality games.

I agree that this generation was a real golden age in a lot of ways. But we've also witnessed the leveling off of the console market, the birth of the mega-blockbuster game, the advent of mobile gaming, and a horrible global financial market. Major console publishers and manufacturers have gotten conservative, restrictive, and risk-averse. They're unwilling to open the gates.

But there's always the possibility that Sony surprises me and gives me a reason to believe. As should be obvious by the fact that I post here on AVS, I'm a tech geek. I'm still a sucker for sexy tech.

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post #471 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 04:28 PM
 
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Launch price and lack of games is why I never buy a console when they first launch. Wait a few months, save a few bucks, and play better games. Really, that's the only way to do it. People that buy stuff like that early are nerds that need some flashy new piece of tech to show off to their nerd friends.

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post #473 of 1994 Old 05-23-2012, 08:24 PM
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Launch price and lack of games is why I never buy a console when they first launch. Wait a few months, save a few bucks, and play better games. Really, that's the only way to do it. People that buy stuff like that early are nerds that need some flashy new piece of tech to show off to their nerd friends.

This is AVS, we need that flashy new tech to show off our AV systems.

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post #474 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Crash44 View Post

Wow. What's so wrong with this gen of consoles that hurts the chances of buying the next? I've had a blast with my PS3, more than with my PS2 (which I wouldn't have thought would happen). What is the hold up for you- launch price? Potential problems? Typical barebones launch lineup?

If Sony comes to market with a slick running box that doesn't break $299, and has some cool software incoming, I would get one early on. Sony has proven their first party can deliver quality software at a steady clip, so the launch of a new machine won't be without games for too long.

For me it's the cut copy paste of games and the only innovation was really HD output. Let's not get into the devs shipping unfinished products. Gears of Duty got old real quick for me. Also having a kid in the house has redirected my time.

If Sony hits $299 it is surely attractive and their first party stuff is always pretty good.


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post #475 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Crash44 View Post

Wow. What's so wrong with this gen of consoles that hurts the chances of buying the next? I've had a blast with my PS3, more than with my PS2 (which I wouldn't have thought would happen). What is the hold up for you- launch price? Potential problems? Typical barebones launch lineup?

If Sony comes to market with a slick running box that doesn't break $299, and has some cool software incoming, I would get one early on. Sony has proven their first party can deliver quality software at a steady clip, so the launch of a new machine won't be without games for too long.

$299 For PS4 ? Never happen, Ill totally eat my words if I'm wrong but current PS3 goes for $250 and you think brand new tech is going to come in at $299. Minimum $399 and its very plausible that it will be more than that.

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post #476 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 09:15 AM
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$299 For PS4 ? Never happen, Ill totally eat my words if I'm wrong but current PS3 goes for $250 and you think brand new tech is going to come in at $299. Minimum $399 and its very plausible that it will be more than that.

No doubt. My guess is Wii U comes in at $350, and the new Sony/MS consoles come in at $400/$500 (multiple sku's).

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post #477 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 09:29 AM
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I'm going to be waiting 2 or so years anyways. Thats about how long my backlog is this gen. It'll take just about that long for anything interesting to appear on a new system, and I won't be a first adopter and can work around failures.

After spending near $1000 on 3 PS3's this gen due to 2 YLOD failures... never again! I'll be waiting to see how the chips fall, then buying a 5 year 3rd party extended warranty.

See, I got my 80GB Motorstorm PS3 for $400 (SonyStyle online store deal) right when they came out. It was a year or two after launch, so there was a good deal of games to play. It's still going strong to this day. I had gotten my PS2 at launch. Good games took a while longer to come out, but I played the hell out of SSX and the few others. Both times I took advantage of the new tech it offered, DVD in the case of PS2 and Blu-ray in the case of PS3, and was very happy with the results. I've never even owned a stand-alone DVD player or Blu-ray player, so I think the value I've gotten out of both of them has been exceptional. For goodness sake, they even upgraded it for free to play 3D Blu-rays! The only thing I had to buy was a $100 adapter (and the glasses...) and my 2007 PS3 and 2008 DLP TV were putting out better quality (no ghosting/crosstalk) 3D than the over-hyped first-gen 3DTV's.

If I had had a YLOD my opinion might vary, but I've had a great experience with the PS3 (hope I'm not jinxing myself.) btw, my PS2 still works as well, although I've had to take it apart a few times to clean off the laser, and clean the drive mechanism for the disk tray.

My biggest problem lately has been more with the quality of the games, or perhaps my waning lack of interest in them...

Enjoying BF4 on the PS4, bugs and all.
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post #478 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Mounta1n View Post

If I had had a YLOD my opinion might vary

It would. I experienced both YLOD and RROD. One was covered and the other wasn't, but both were unacceptable.

The reason I replaced each was because I'd already invested in the consoles by buying a ton of games. Not replacing them would mean I had stacks of physical and digital software that would be useless. Was that my choice? Sure. But if consoles are going to continue to be so expensive, they need to make a lot of changes for the next round.

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post #479 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 10:53 AM
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I've had 3 rrod and one PS3 power supply failure (power surge that also killed my battery backup surge protector) so I am more against MS (also had several other problems with Live which is why I am in no hurry to buy their next buggy system) Nintendo systems remain the only hardware that I have never had an issue with (knocks on wood)

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post #480 of 1994 Old 05-24-2012, 11:08 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Mounta1n View Post

If I had had a YLOD my opinion might vary, but I've had a great experience with the PS3 (hope I'm not jinxing myself.) btw, my PS2 still works as well, although I've had to take it apart a few times to clean off the laser, and clean the drive mechanism for the disk tray.

My biggest problem lately has been more with the quality of the games, or perhaps my waning lack of interest in them...

Yeah try 2 and having to purchase an almost full price slim. I didn't "have to", but with the investment I have in PSN and hard titles, it seemed like I did. $1000 on one system in a gen is unacceptable, and so is the way Sony is handling and obvious major issue with their old units.

I do game quite a bit, but it's a gaming system isn't it?

As for lack of titles, can't say I have that problem. Sonys first party stuff is probably the only thing tieing me to them.
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