House of the Dead 3 & 4: in HD and with Move support - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 07:50 AM - Thread Starter
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My oldest daughter doesn't play many games, but the arcade version of HotD 3 is her all-time favorite. Finally a home version of both House of the Dead 3 & 4 are coming to the PS3 as dloads on February 7 for the first title and in the Spring for the second.

These intensely fun light gun shooters will get some HD polishing, as well as trophy and Move support. I'm only slightly disappointed that they didn't just go ahead and publish all four games to easily increase their sales:

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I’m going to just jump right into this one: The House of the Dead 3 is coming to PlayStation Network on February 7th, to be followed by The House of the Dead 4 in Spring 2012. Both titles have been updated with HD graphics, trophies, and complete PlayStation Move support to give you a full arcade HOTD experience in your living room. Boom. Yes. Awesome.


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post #2 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 08:52 AM
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Too bad the Move sucks as a light gun replacement. I had all the Virtua Cop and House Of The Dead games on the Saturn and Dreamcast, so I'm the target market for this, but I'll probably wind up passing on it after the disappointment of trying to use a Move to play Dead Space: Extraction...

- Jer
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post #3 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 09:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Actually, the Move is in fact an amazing light gun replicator. It has merely one-half of a single frame of lag more than the DualShock 3 controller, and has 1:1 accuracy. Plenty of people who use it for light gun games have had an awesome time and praise how close it replicates the experience.

Deadstorm Pirates is a particular favorite of mine in the genre, and a fun little under-rated gem that shows off the Move's precision is the Prison Break sub-game of the Time Crisis compilation. And for FPS titles like SOCOM 4, my instant-aim headshot ratio is off the charts.

The Move isn't plug an play right out the box however. For one, you have to disable the magnetic sensor in the XMB menu or it might randomly drift in games (there's no game play penalty for turning it off). Much trickier to deal with however is the fact that many modern HDTVs are add up to four full frames of lag, which really throws off the precision feel of motion aiming where you see the cursor delay in moving when your hand moves in front of the screen.

My cousin had this experience when he tried to play a Move shooter at home that he enjoyed at my house and found out that his TV was laggier than he thought. Using pads, your eyes aren't matching up movements with your thumb and the cursor on screen like you do with the Move.

Even with the best HDTV it won't be the perfection that is a light gun in the arcade, but since the Move is literally only 1/120th of a second slower than the Dual Shock 3, it is comfortably close.

BTW, I haven't played DS Extraction. Maybe that game has some issues in its programming if it aims as bad as you say. Time Crisis 3 aiming doesn't feel as smooth as Deadstorm Pirates for example, so perhaps there are some other tech problems going on.

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post #4 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 10:14 AM
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I agree about the Move not being the same as a light gun. I spent too many hours on a Dreamcast (and on NES before that) with various light gun games and the accuracy in those was amazing. You could actually use the sights on the gun and blaze through with little practice. The Move shooters are having to use a cursor because of the camera, and it does not feel like a light gun. It feels like a controller that moves the cursor around, and does it fast and accurate, but it's not a light gun. Play enough light gun games and you'll understand.

That being said, I've been playing Overkill with Move and I've enjoyed it even though the controls aren't quite like a light gun. It does take practice, and depending on how the camera is placed the aiming can be weird, so keeping the camera central is important. HotD 3+4 upgraded sounds like a winner, I never played 4, and I'm not going back to a blurry crt TV so bring 'em on! If this gets a release on disc for PAL I might even import, but the dloads are fine, too.

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post #5 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 10:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Both you and I played those light gun shooters for the Dreamcast, NES (and for me, Sega Genesis and Master System as well) on a CRT TV set. Unlike 99.9% of the HDTV sets today, CRTs were completely lag free.

~~~

I've played it and the cool thing about HotD 4 is that it is already an HD game. If they can get HotD 3 to look close to it we'll be in for a treat. My concern is that HotD 4 is a natively widescreen game and HotD 3 is wide screen. I'm not sure if Sega plans to make some adjustments to make #3 widescreen as well.

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post #6 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash44 View Post

I agree about the Move not being the same as a light gun. I spent too many hours on a Dreamcast (and on NES before that) with various light gun games and the accuracy in those was amazing. You could actually use the sights on the gun and blaze through with little practice. The Move shooters are having to use a cursor because of the camera, and it does not feel like a light gun.

And this is exactly it. Light gun games are about immersion -- reacting quickly, looking down the sights and aiming accurately under pressure. Using a cursor-based, indirect-aim pointing device instead of a light gun adds a layer of abstraction between you and the game that breaks the immersion and changes things from a battle of reflexes and muscle control to "did I aim sort of near my target in a way that made the cursor go to the right place instead". The challenge should come from reacting to the in-game events, not fighting the imprecise controls.

I don't doubt that people can enjoy a Move-based rail shooter, but they are not and never will be an equivalent experience to using a light gun, and for me that's a dealbreaker.

- Jer
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post #7 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhaines View Post

And this is exactly it. Light gun games are about immersion -- reacting quickly, looking down the sights and aiming accurately under pressure. Using a cursor-based, indirect-aim pointing device instead of a light gun adds a layer of abstraction between you and the game that breaks the immersion and changes things from a battle of reflexes and muscle control to "did I aim sort of near my target in a way that made the cursor go to the right place instead". The challenge should come from reacting to the in-game events, not fighting the imprecise controls.

I don't doubt that people can enjoy a Move-based rail shooter, but they are not and never will be an equivalent experience to using a light gun, and for me that's a dealbreaker.

- Jer

It was a choice between keeping up all that old hardware or adapting so I chose to adapt. Loved the Dreamcast but I gave it to my young nephew a few years ago (he's an avid gamer now so mission accomplished ), though I don't miss it so much because all these games are making it out on PSN. Yes I am paying for convenience, and some I'm buying again, but the fun per hour is worth it. HotD is a great series that I don't want to miss, and these sequels are new (to me) so it's a double bonus I want to experience. I figure nothing is ever like it used to be so close enough will have to be good enough.

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post #8 of 43 Old 01-05-2012, 06:51 PM
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Enjoyed House of the Dead 3 on the Xbox and Wii. Worried that might be the last true installment we'd ever get of this series at home after that awful detour called Overkill.

Very glad to see #4 finally getting a home release.
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post #9 of 43 Old 02-21-2012, 05:59 PM
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I purchased HOTD 3 yesterday and the move controller works better with that game than any light gun game I've tried it on. It's rock solid and doesn't drift at all.
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post #10 of 43 Old 02-21-2012, 06:34 PM
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Joe low, could you elaborate on the magnetic sensor? Are there games that need it?
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post #11 of 43 Old 02-21-2012, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TornadoTJ View Post

Joe low, could you elaborate on the magnetic sensor? Are there games that need it?

I'm guessing but I think the mag sensor helps to determine controller angle. Seems logical since the calibration for the sensor makes you turn the wand in all three dimensions. Most of the Move games I have work better with the magnetic sensor turned off, as in the shooters like Overkill. No More Heroes wants the mag sensor on though. When it's off you have trouble with the menus and certain actions. There should be a recommendation in the software for this IMO.

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post #12 of 43 Old 02-22-2012, 04:30 AM
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Wish there would have been more support for the Guncon3.

I bought all the MOVE gun gear and after spending hours tweaking it just never felt right or impressed me with any shooters.

Jason
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post #13 of 43 Old 02-22-2012, 06:45 AM
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Me and a buddy played House of the Dead 2 a couple weeks ago,

and our calibrations ended up ruining the game.

The cursor would go off screen, so we'd wave our hands around for 20 secs until a cursor would visibly show. Seems the gun has to be in one exact spot and you rotate the gun an inch or two.
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post #14 of 43 Old 02-22-2012, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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~~~ Eliminating Cursor Drift for Move Games ~~~

To disable the magnetic sensor, go to the XMB menu and look under the accessory settings and calibrate the Move. Press Triangle for the option. It completely eliminates the cursor drift in Move games.

I've had it set up this way for well over a year and they all work perfectly now. The post above is the first one I've seen that says a game (No More Heroes) uses that feature, so unless you have it you should have no problem as well.

~~~

House of the Dead 3 is a great translation of the arcade, but I only wish it had a full widescreen option. Co-op mode is where you have the most fun. We are using the ray-gun shells for extra immersion. The aiming is quick and precise, and the action is a full 60 fps. While a play through can be a bit short, the branching paths help keep things interesting.

Can't wait for HotD 4 with the improved graphic engine to come out next month.

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post #15 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 07:53 AM
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Anyone hear any word on other light gun ports or new light gun games?
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post #16 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 10:01 AM - Thread Starter
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We usually don't get new announcements before trades shows. Hopefully E3 gives us a few more. I want a Point Blank compilation!

In the meantime, I highly recommend the Time Crisis compilation if you don't already have it. Deadstorm Pirates is a gem, and the Prison Break sub-mode of TC4 is one of of the most fun and unique light gun experiences available. For myself, since I finished Dead Space I recently, I think I'll try out their light gun game next since I hear it is pretty good.

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post #17 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 10:11 AM
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Thanks JB. At one time light gun games were dead in the water but the move addition has given it new life. I'd like to get ahold of Raw Thrills arcade LGGs "Aliens" as well as "Paradise Lost" and "Terminator Salvation."

On another note I would ridiculous to have their driving games H2Overdrive and Dirty Driving on the PS3. Both have insane graphics and are a lot of fun.
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post #18 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Unfortunately (except for Paradise Lost) my guess is that it would be difficult to get licensed titles made for the consoles since the genre is already pretty niche to justify the added expense. I like Terminator Salvation a lot (as well as the old Midway Terminator 2 LGG) and would buy them day one if they ever popped up.

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post #19 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 10:27 AM
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Yep, they said something about the licensing when I contacted them last year. The driving games would be nice though since they are unique to Raw Thrills.
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post #20 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 01:32 PM
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My son and I play Time Crisis but the aim always seemed off. I would put the cursor on a guy but I'd be aiming about 5 inches to the right of him.

Even when turning off the magnetic sensor. We are only 8 or9 feet from the tv. Is that a problem? I would think the move would work better the farther away you are. I want to bring home my work projector again and try it with a bigger screen and farther away.

Any good tutorials out there for proper set up?
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post #21 of 43 Old 02-24-2012, 04:52 PM
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They said when it was released that they wanted H20verdrive to remain an arcade exclusive (Fearing that a console port would make it less attractive to arcade operators and customers, I suppose). Too bad since it looks more like what I expected from a Hydro Thunder sequel than what we actually got. Hopefully a couple of years of arcade exclusivity might see that attitude change soon as they try to find a new way to take advantage of that asset.

Some licensed games thought to be in limbo in years gone by have seen new life in today's digital age. Nobody thought Konami would ever resurrect their arcade X-Men and Simpsons games, for instance. So you never know what might be around the corner (I'm hoping Pinball Arcade gets lots of licensed tables, for one example of where I'm optimistic of seeing licensed material get a second life).
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post #22 of 43 Old 02-26-2012, 11:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeypuck25 View Post

My son and I play Time Crisis but the aim always seemed off. I would put the cursor on a guy but I'd be aiming about 5 inches to the right of him.

Even when turning off the magnetic sensor. We are only 8 or9 feet from the tv. Is that a problem? I would think the move would work better the farther away you are. I want to bring home my work projector again and try it with a bigger screen and farther away.

Any good tutorials out there for proper set up?

The problem sounds like the angle and position of the camera in relation to the Move controllers. Try sliding or swiveling your PSEye on the XMB menu camera settings menu so that it is centered for best results.

Also try to see if it improves by placing the PSEye in the opposite position than you have it now (i.e., if it is on top of the HDTV, put it at the bottom).

If that isn't working, then you can overcompensate by aiming to an exaggerated left or right of the in-game calibration targets before hitting the trigger -or- slide the PSEye left or right off-center before calibrating in a game.

I had your issue for a bit until I was able to set it up right by playing around with the tips above. My PSEye is now at the bottom of my set (I had more issues with it up high) and it is in the center. I sit within a 60 degree radius in co op games and it aims perfectly.

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post #23 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post

They said when it was released that they wanted H20verdrive to remain an arcade exclusive (Fearing that a console port would make it less attractive to arcade operators and customers, I suppose). Too bad since it looks more like what I expected from a Hydro Thunder sequel than what we actually got. Hopefully a couple of years of arcade exclusivity might see that attitude change soon as they try to find a new way to take advantage of that asset.

Some licensed games thought to be in limbo in years gone by have seen new life in today's digital age. Nobody thought Konami would ever resurrect their arcade X-Men and Simpsons games, for instance. So you never know what might be around the corner (I'm hoping Pinball Arcade gets lots of licensed tables, for instance).

Thanks Leo. Sounds like you like those arcade games also. X Box 360 owners got a Hydro Thunder game but it got bad reviews from what I saw. Every time I see those Raw Thrill racing games in an arcade, I just shake my head. Their too expensive to buy but those are the most interesting racing games I've ever seen. Oh well, like you say perhaps it might be around the corner. If they want their games to be exclusive to arcades (I don't blame them) then why don't they just produce a new racing game exclusively for home consoles for Raw Thrill fans? Makes sense to me.
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post #24 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 09:55 AM
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Anyone use move capable shooters on a projector?

I want to pull the trigger on a move setup so I can play Time Crisis, HOD, KZ3, Socom4, etc on my 120" projector, but I'm worried about aiming. I will be able to set up the EYE cam ~12' from the player, and a little lower than shoulder height if players remain seated.
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post #25 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Unlike light gun tech (which requires CRT displays to work), the Move doesn't directly interact with the display/monitor/screen at all, so it should work just fine depending on how your PSEye is set up.

The only potential problem to be aware of is true for any display - how much inherent lag does your projector exhibit? Since the Move has only a half of one frame (out of 60 frames per second) more lag than the DualShock 3, any significant lag inherently built into your display set up will be very obvious as you play motion games moreso than non motion games.

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post #26 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

Unlike light gun tech, the Move doesn't directly interact with the display/monitor/screen at all, so it should work just fine depending on how your PSEye is set up.

The only potential problem to be aware of is true for any display - how much inherent lag does your projector exhibit? Since the Move has only a half of one frame (out of 60 frames per second) more lag than the DualShock 3, any significant lag inherently built into your display set up will be very obvious as you play motion games moreso than non motion games.

There's a few videos of KZ3 being played with a sharpshooter on youtube, and it seems to work pretty well. Also, a nice video of Time Crisis 4 being played with guncon3, which is what led me to investigate the move in the first place. I guess I'll investigate the lag tonight, but I haven't noticed any yet. Projector gets used for wheel + gran turismo 5 (which is awesome), and occasional game of FIFA.. I could hook wii up, but that's always a little laggy anyway.

I know it will work, and probably be pretty fun, but I'm just hesitant to drop $150+ on something that's only a gimmick and won't give any lasting entertainment value.. which I can see happening if aiming is slow and inexact.
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post #27 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 10:18 AM
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eh looks like enough people are happy with their move + projector setups, so I think I'm just going to pull the trigger and deal with any negatives later.. this tax return isn't going to spend itself

edit: just bought move mayhem bundle (move, sharpshooter, KZ3, Resistance3) and Time Crisis Razing Storm.. will report tomorrow night thanks to Prime overnight shipping
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post #28 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by temeone View Post

eh looks like enough people are happy with their move + projector setups, so I think I'm just going to pull the trigger and deal with any negatives later.. this tax return isn't going to spend itself

edit: just bought move mayhem bundle (move, sharpshooter, KZ3, Resistance3) and Time Crisis Razing Storm.. will report tomorrow night thanks to Prime overnight shipping

That bundle is a pretty sweet deal. Wish they had it back when I bought. Damn me for being an early adopter lol

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post #29 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 10:29 AM
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Wish I got on this earlier in the month when that bundle was $80 from bestbuy.. crazy deal.
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post #30 of 43 Old 02-27-2012, 01:13 PM
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I got that bundle when it was 59.00. I sold everything cept for the sharp shooter, move navigater and move controller. I made my money back and had the things I reall wanted.
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