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post #991 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

All this tech talk has me very interested. Sony has captured the attention of the tech junkies, but I have to wonder what their strategy to get the average gamer's attention will be. You can only get so many sales from people like us and the fans of your brand. (Look at the Wii U and Vita struggling to get people to buy them) hopefully Sony has something ready to go to get them interested.
More importantly than capturing the attention of tech junkies, Sony has captured the attention of developers. And where developers go, so too will "average gamers." Sony can count on third-party publishers to do a lot of the marketing for them. At this point, MS is now fighting an uphill PR battle before they've even left the gates.

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post #992 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 04:04 PM
 
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More importantly than capturing the attention of tech junkies, Sony has captured the attention of developers. And where developers go, so too will "average gamers." Sony can count on third-party publishers to do a lot of the marketing for them. At this point, MS is now fighting an uphill PR battle before they've even left the gates.

Developers and publishers are very excited.

Meanwhile EA has announced they have no plans to developer for the WiiU.

Content matters, and Sony is going full steam ahead to make sure the people that develop that content are as happy as possible with the platform. I think their new view that having great hardware isn't enough anymore is going to help them quite a bit next gen. Gamers follow the games and follow their friends, and publishers provide that.
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post #993 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 04:28 PM
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Developers and publishers are very excited.

Meanwhile EA has announced they have no plans to developer for the WiiU.

Content matters, and Sony is going full steam ahead to make sure the people that develop that content are as happy as possible with the platform. I think their new view that having great hardware isn't enough anymore is going to help them quite a bit next gen. Gamers follow the games and follow their friends, and publishers provide that.
Yup. This is the lesson of the Wii U (and the PSP and Vita). It looks like Sony finally started listening to the right voices within the company and have turned the ship around in a big way. Damned impressive IMO.

Of course, it still hasn't convinced me to buy a PS4 within the launch window, but they definitely got my attention. wink.gif

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post #994 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 05:00 PM
 
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Of course, it still hasn't convinced me to buy a PS4 within the launch window, but they definitely got my attention. wink.gif

PS3 design problems convinced me others, but I'm sure with people like Cerny heading up hardware, they're ready this time around. Right off the bat the PS4 should be using quite a bit less wattage than the launch PS3 did. Hopefully they have come up with a more elegant cooling design then a jet engine turbine and relying on the aluminum chassis to do all the cooling.
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post #995 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 05:16 PM
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Sony is the underdog now. They're hungry....they're determined not to mess this up, they know how much is on the line. I can barely believe this is the same Sony from just a few years ago.....they're nailing it on every front right now.

On the other hand, Nintendo's arrogance and poor showing was predictable. Unfortunately for them, their complacency led them to phone it in with the Wii U, whereas Sony's arrogance manifested in aiming too high. Time caught up with Sony, and the PS3 remains relevant, if not outright successful. Whether or not it made them any money, the PS3 was at least a platform they could be proud of in the end.

But it won't be the story for the Wii U. That system is basically circling the drain right in front of us...it always had an earlier expiration date than the true next gen, and now its accelerating. If EA doesn't have any Wii U games in development now, they're done with it for good. The Wii U is basically on life support, it's going to need nothing short of a miracle to pull through, but I think they'll pull the plug within 2 years.

Microsoft is somewhere in between. I think they're coming into the console space thinking they're the top dog and can get away with anything, but Windows 8 isn't doing great, and Win Phone 8 is also on life support, with 3% of the market. So I think they've still got some fire left in them, because whether or not its profitable, the nextbox is a flagship product for their consumer division. I can see a future where their ecosystem really comes together, even Windows Phone....but they're going to have to fight for it, and I think they're going to take a few blows to the head before they realize it. Tuesday will be the day we find out how prepared they really are.

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post #996 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 05:44 PM
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Everyone said the 3DS would be dead by now as well. Vita and mobile would kill it. The 3DS is now the fastest selling game hardware in history. Nintendo is doomed with each new console since the SNES, it is nothing new.

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post #997 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 05:44 PM
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Sony is the underdog now.
Not at all. They had a very strong showing this gen. They're just not the front-runner like they were with the PS2. And Sony has had a very strong response since their PS4 announcement. If anything, they've put the other platform holders on the defensive.

Overall, Sony's larger corporate strategy is leaner and meaner; they've shaved off all the corporate flab and are entering the ring in top fighting shape. Far from an underdog.
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Everyone said the 3DS would be dead by now as well. Vita and mobile would kill it. The 3DS is now the fastest selling game hardware in history. Nintendo is doomed with each new console since the SNES, it is nothing new.
I don't think many said that about the 3DS. It's doing fine, but not "fine" enough to bring Nintendo into the clear. The bigger concern is for Wii U.

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post #998 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 05:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Everyone said the 3DS would be dead by now as well. Vita and mobile would kill it. The 3DS is now the fastest selling game hardware in history. Nintendo is doomed with each new console since the SNES, it is nothing new.

There's a market there, and while the 3DS was dead at the premium price point they thought they could get away with after their handheld success, it was never an out of the gate failure. It was never a faulty product, and honestly I think it parallels Sony's hubris followed by their retooling of the PS3. They just needed to bring their price and expectations down a bit towards consumers.

The WiiU has major problems that a simple price cut isn't going to fix.
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post #999 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 06:17 PM
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Do you guys think Microsoft has an ace up their sleeves and will shock everyone in the next few days? If so, what do you think it'll be? Or will the console reveal only confirm the very disappointing way Microsoft are handling their next gen console so far.

I'm hoping for once to be interested in buying a Microsoft console along with the Sony since they didn't offer anything that's worthy enough to me so far, free online play and some nice exclusives will catch my attention for sure.

p.s: I'm aware this is not a Microsoft thread, but what they reveal is very important to Sony obviously, so just interested what Sony fans (non-boys of course) think how things will turn out.

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post #1000 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Rather than go off topic in this thread, why not simply create a MS thread instead?

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post #1001 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 06:55 PM
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Well, Microsoft could have had deals with some service providers to offer a 720 as a premium cable/satellite box. They'll probably get exclusive content in some key third party games or maybe even have them be timed exclusive. And then theirs the possibility of being full backwards compatibility.

Some people like certain systems better than others because of certain features or games and it has nothing to do with being fans of a certain company. You wont find many true "fans" of Sony.
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post #1002 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

There's a market there, and while the 3DS was dead at the premium price point they thought they could get away with after their handheld success, it was never an out of the gate failure. It was never a faulty product, and honestly I think it parallels Sony's hubris followed by their retooling of the PS3. They just needed to bring their price and expectations down a bit towards consumers.

The WiiU has major problems that a simple price cut isn't going to fix.

Actually, before release Nintendo had devs singing the Wii U's praises, even EA was championing them. The Wii U launched to near record breaking numbers, much like the 3DS, then they both stalled. The 3DS sales didn't pick up until Super Mario 3D Land released, even the price drop barely boosted sales. The gaming media declared it dead for months and are doing the same with the Wii U now. This is why I ignore all the Nintendoom in the media, it has been going on since the Genesis launched, that is a long time for a company to be circling the drain.

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post #1003 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 07:03 PM
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Do you guys think Microsoft has an ace up their sleeves and will shock everyone in the next few days? If so, what do you think it'll be? Or will the console reveal only confirm the very disappointing way Microsoft are handling their next gen console so far.

I'm hoping for once to be interested in buying a Microsoft console along with the Sony since they didn't offer anything that's worthy enough to me so far, free online play and some nice exclusives will catch my attention for sure.

p.s: I'm aware this is not a Microsoft thread, but what they reveal is very important to Sony obviously, so just interested what Sony fans (non-boys of course) think how things will turn out.

Given their laser focus on it, I think from a purely gaming perspective....Sony clearly has them beat on that front. The only real surprise at the Sony reveal was the 8GB of ram....I think the vast, vast majority of the rumors about the nextbox are going to be confirmed. The only ace up their sleeve I can think of that can draw dedicated gamers in is cross compatibility with PC.

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post #1004 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 09:59 PM
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Given their laser focus on it, I think from a purely gaming perspective....Sony clearly has them beat on that front. The only real surprise at the Sony reveal was the 8GB of ram....I think the vast, vast majority of the rumors about the nextbox are going to be confirmed. The only ace up their sleeve I can think of that can draw dedicated gamers in is cross compatibility with PC.
The "ace up their sleeve" is going to be media partnerships and delivery methods. This really isn't what Sony is doing. Sony has gone squarely after major publishers and important game developers. With Nintendo's performance faltering badly and MS aiming for the media box audience, Sony has found themselves in a totally uncontested middle ground.

Perfect strategy with perfect timing.

Sony did much more than just bowl everyone over with the 8GB. It was the streamlined development tools and accessible hardware architecture, the push to support indies, and a memory architecture that is both incredibly versatile as well as fast. It was the right way to play the hardware and the right way to play the platform and the right way to push games over media. Smart all around. Now it just comes down to price and execution.
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Actually, before release Nintendo had devs singing the Wii U's praises, even EA was championing them. The Wii U launched to near record breaking numbers, much like the 3DS, then they both stalled. The 3DS sales didn't pick up until Super Mario 3D Land released, even the price drop barely boosted sales. The gaming media declared it dead for months and are doing the same with the Wii U now. This is why I ignore all the Nintendoom in the media, it has been going on since the Genesis launched, that is a long time for a company to be circling the drain.
This really is not the same doom and gloom as before. It's bad. The 3DS will stick around, but the Wii U's future is far from certain.

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post #1005 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 10:16 PM
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Yea, the 3DS doom and gloom was a little worse than what the Wii U is enduring right now.

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post #1006 of 18351 Old 05-17-2013, 11:28 PM
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The "ace up their sleeve" is going to be media partnerships and delivery methods. This really isn't what Sony is doing. Sony has gone squarely after major publishers and important game developers. With Nintendo's performance faltering badly and MS aiming for the media box audience, Sony has found themselves in a totally uncontested middle ground.

Perfect strategy with perfect timing.

Sony did much more than just bowl everyone over with the 8GB. It was the streamlined development tools and accessible hardware architecture, the push to support indies, and a memory architecture that is both incredibly versatile as well as fast. It was the right way to play the hardware and the right way to play the platform and the right way to push games over media. Smart all around. Now it just comes down to price and execution.

Agreed. The nextbox looks to be great at media, and good at games. PS4 great at games, good at media. But gaming is going to drive initial sales - thats what the early adopters are looking for. I just cant see people lining up outside at midnight for a cable box.....games, and games alone will set the pace of growth. Unless the price for the PS4 is significantly higher, it's going to build more momentum with that early crowd...and momentum is absolutely paramount. It doesnt matter how many consoles you sell in the first 2 months - all of the major players are guaranteed to sell millions to the faithful. What matters is if you continue to sell throughout the year, and build an audience and faith with developers. The system with the higher userbase gets more attention, better ports....it's a snowball effect and they need to get the ball rolling. They need to build a virtuous cycle, not get caught in a death spiral, like you know who. I think the nextbox will do just fine, maybe by financial measures it'll eventually come out ahead by appealing to a broader audience...but I think when it comes to quality and quantity of games, the only measure that gamers should care about....Sony clearly has the edge. I just can't identify any weaknesses in their hardware, their software, their outreach, strategy, etc....I dont think I ever recall a console that seemed so definitely positioned for greatness from day zero. I'd love to be critical of them, I could tear apart the PS3 on every level....but they're bringing their A game in every way with the PS4.

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post #1007 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 12:28 AM
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I just cant see people lining up outside at midnight for a cable box.....games, and games alone will set the pace of growth.
Tough to say for sure. Most people don't have a decent PC hooked up to their living room displays, so for that crowd the MS box could be a real hit. In contrast, PS4 will probably be the bleeding-edge gaming console. Each has their audience.

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post #1008 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 08:47 AM
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Tough to say for sure. Most people don't have a decent PC hooked up to their living room displays, so for that crowd the MS box could be a real hit. In contrast, PS4 will probably be the bleeding-edge gaming console. Each has their audience.

Most of that stuff is already available on the 360 though. It's not like a movie will look any better or music will sound better on a nextbox. The major advancements on the media front that won't come to the 360 are bluray, cable/DVR, and better integration with games/UI. If anyone cares about cable and bluray, they already have a solution for that. If you care about better integration with games, that means you care about games....so it comes right back around. Long term, maybe they crush Sony on media, but the first few years are all about games. I'm sure they'll have a few exclusives ready, and god knows what deal they made with activision over call of duty. Maybe the respawn rumors were true, I definitely don't think they're coming empty handed. But if we end up with a situation where 3rd party games look and run better on the PS4, if its crystal clear which is the better games consoles, I think that's going to b a real problem for them....and I think we're headed exactly for that.

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post #1009 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 10:45 AM
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Most of that stuff is already available on the 360 though. It's not like a movie will look any better or music will sound better on a nextbox. The major advancements on the media front that won't come to the 360 are bluray, cable/DVR, and better integration with games/UI. If anyone cares about cable and bluray, they already have a solution for that. If you care about better integration with games, that means you care about games....so it comes right back around. Long term, maybe they crush Sony on media, but the first few years are all about games. I'm sure they'll have a few exclusives ready, and god knows what deal they made with activision over call of duty. Maybe the respawn rumors were true, I definitely don't think they're coming empty handed. But if we end up with a situation where 3rd party games look and run better on the PS4, if its crystal clear which is the better games consoles, I think that's going to b a real problem for them....and I think we're headed exactly for that.
We'll have to see come next week, but it sounds like MS is going all in on media. And if they can get exclusive deals with content providers (cable networks, streaming providers, communications companies, music/movies/game publishers, etc), then that will be more than enough to get the mainstream consumers without having to emphasize games. But for folks who already have an HTPC (a small minority), it's totally redundant.

In contrast, Sony is focusing on games first. Everything else will be a bonus. It sounds like each company has staked out their respective niche, so there's plenty of room for both to succeed.

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post #1010 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 01:20 PM
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This E3 will be absolute madness. This generation being so long will have console gamers begging to see both of the new successors. Sony seems to have learned from PS3's mistakes so I'm happy so far. Just want to see the box smile.gif

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post #1011 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 04:33 PM
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BD, how do you know that the ps4 will be great with games and the Xbox will only be good at it? People keep acting like they know that exactly what either one has planned.

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post #1012 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 04:50 PM
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He really doesn't and I really doubt that the Xbox 720 will be very far behind the Playstation 4 when it comes to videogaming. But the rumors seem to place a lot of focus on Microsoft's part in taking a large jump with the Xbox 720 to get closer to their original vision for the Xbox where it would be at the center of your living room entertainment center. So I imagine the prediction of Microsoft putting a lot of effort into the non-videogaming uses of their new console is likely correct. I rather doubt it comes at the expense of the gaming side though.

I suspect that Sony won't be too far behind in that area also. The days of new game consoles having virtually all of their focus on videogaming died out with the Nintendo Wii being the last gasp of it. It may not have every last bell & whistle but multimedia playback, online and local video streaming, and other facets will surely be of continued importance for Sony as well.

I think the Xbox fans that think the Xbox 720 will be the box that allows them to cut their cable or satellite cord will be disappointed though. I expect growth in on-demand video streaming and such but the visions some have over on the Xbox board of being able to pick and choose what networks they want access to and having that streamed through the internet through their console to their HDTV while saving money compared to their present bill are in for disappointments I think .

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post #1013 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 04:52 PM
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I think most people were surprised with the PS4 capabilities. Xbox has nothing but horrible rumors so far. This is, I'm sure, what he bases his comment on.

I expect nothing amazing out of xbox, but I'll be happy if I'm wrong.

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post #1014 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 05:04 PM
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SuperDAE leaked a lot of stuff, including how powerful each system was going to be. Since it was verrified just how extensive his access was, it is hard to imagine it changing too drastically.

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post #1015 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 05:04 PM
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They both seem to receiving their fair share of disappointing rumors and promising ones. Really much too early to be judging too much on rumors that flip flop every week.
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post #1016 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 06:42 PM
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BD, how do you know that the ps4 will be great with games and the Xbox will only be good at it? People keep acting like they know that exactly what either one has planned.

I'm speaking mainly of the technical quality. The PS4 hardware is clearly superior. The architecture is simpler and easier to program. They have more first party studios producing games, and indies are lining up behind them. The quality of third party games will be superior, and there will be a larger quantity of first party games.

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post #1017 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 06:49 PM
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Unless you're privy to details that the general public isn't, there's no way you can claim that at this point with any degree of certainty.
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post #1018 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post

Unless you're privy to details that the general public isn't, there's no way you can claim that at this point with any degree of certainty.

SuperDAE hacked into several major gaming companies, including Microsoft and was providing a lot of leaks on the tech going inside both systems, he even ordered a 720 dev kit. When his house was raided all the major leaks just stopped and quite a few have proven to be true so far. This is where the info on system power came from, which clearly showed the 720 with a 50% weaker GPU than what Sony was using.

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post #1019 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post

Unless you're privy to details that the general public isn't, there's no way you can claim that at this point with any degree of certainty.

I genuinely don't mean this in a disrespectful way, but unless you haven't been following the leaks/rumors, or dont understand the tech stuff, it takes willful ignorance to deny the validity of what we've been hearing up until this point. The sources have been absolutely consistent for months now. The nextbox will be a solid system, but purely on a technical level, the PS4 beats it on every front, hands down.

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post #1020 of 18351 Old 05-18-2013, 07:15 PM
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Now we just have to see if that will matter in the end. I know people have been gushing over the ps4, but developers haven't been allowed to say what they like about the Xbox because it isn't announced.

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